Groups | Search | Server Info | Keyboard shortcuts | Login | Register [http] [https] [nntp] [nntps]


Groups > comp.arch > #116526 > unrolled thread

Concertina IV Has Arrived

Started byquadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid>
First post2026-05-19 20:14 +0000
Last post2026-05-30 19:03 +0000
Articles 20 on this page of 582 — 32 participants

Back to article view | Back to comp.arch


Contents

  Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-19 20:14 +0000
    Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-20 00:03 +0000
      Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-20 00:34 +0000
      Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-20 01:35 +0000
        Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-20 02:09 +0000
          Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-20 02:26 +0000
          Byte order and BCD (was: Concertina IV Has Arrived) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-05-20 05:38 +0000
            Re: Byte order and BCD (was: Concertina IV Has Arrived) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-05-20 08:10 +0000
              Re: Byte order and BCD (was: Concertina IV Has Arrived) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-05-20 08:36 +0000
                Re: Byte order and BCD (was: Concertina IV Has Arrived) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-05-20 10:37 +0000
                  Re: Byte order and BCD (was: Concertina IV Has Arrived) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-05-20 11:04 +0000
                    Re: Byte order and BCD (was: Concertina IV Has Arrived) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-05-20 17:01 +0000
                      Re: Byte order and BCD (was: Concertina IV Has Arrived) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-05-20 17:30 +0000
            Re: Byte order and BCD (was: Concertina IV Has Arrived) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-05-20 15:03 +0000
              Re: Byte order and BCD (was: Concertina IV Has Arrived) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-05-20 18:07 +0000
                Re: Byte order and BCD (was: Concertina IV Has Arrived) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-05-20 19:03 +0000
                  Re: Byte order and BCD Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-05-20 21:45 +0200
                    Re: Byte order and BCD scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-05-21 14:36 +0000
                Re: Byte order and BCD (was: Concertina IV Has Arrived) quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-20 22:50 +0000
                  Re: Byte order and BCD (was: Concertina IV Has Arrived) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-05-21 00:37 +0000
                    Re: Byte order and BCD (was: Concertina IV Has Arrived) quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-21 02:18 +0000
                      Re: Byte order and BCD (was: Concertina IV Has Arrived) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-05-21 06:29 +0000
                      Re: ancient virtual memory, Byte order and BCD (was: Concertina IV Has Arrived) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-05-21 15:41 +0000
            Re: Byte order and BCD (was: Concertina IV Has Arrived) quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-20 15:28 +0000
              Re: Byte order and BCD (was: Concertina IV Has Arrived) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-05-20 15:42 +0000
                Re: Byte order and BCD (was: Concertina IV Has Arrived) quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-20 17:25 +0000
                  Re: Byte order and BCD (was: Concertina IV Has Arrived) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-05-21 11:52 +0000
                Re: Byte order and BCD Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-05-20 21:33 +0200
                  Re: Byte order and BCD anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-05-21 10:29 +0000
                    Re: Byte order and BCD anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-05-21 12:04 +0000
            Re: Byte order and BCD (was: Concertina IV Has Arrived) quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-06-03 00:41 +0000
              Re: Byte order and BCD (was: Concertina IV Has Arrived) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-06-03 17:13 +0000
          Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived Bernd Linsel <bl1-thispartdoesnotbelonghere@gmx.com> - 2026-05-20 10:42 +0200
            Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-05-20 15:32 +0000
            Re: BCD, was Concertina IV Has Arrived John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-05-20 17:47 +0000
              Re: BCD, was Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-06-01 01:14 +0000
                Re: BCD, was Concertina IV Has Arrived John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-06-01 02:20 +0000
                  2s-complement and byte order (was: BCD) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-06-01 07:47 +0000
                    Re: 2s-complement and byte order (was: BCD) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-06-01 16:04 +0000
                      Re: 2s-complement and byte order (was: BCD) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-06-01 18:01 +0000
                        Re: 2s-complement and byte order (was: BCD) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-06-01 18:26 +0000
                          Re: 2s-complement and byte order (was: BCD) MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-06-02 01:22 +0000
                            Re: 2s-complement and byte order (was: BCD) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-06-02 01:57 +0000
                              Re: 2s-complement and byte order (was: BCD) MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-06-02 17:04 +0000
                    Re: 2s-complement and byte order (was: BCD) quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-06-01 18:08 +0000
                    Re: 2s-complement and byte order (was: BCD) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-06-01 18:13 +0000
                  Re: BCD, was Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-06-01 17:59 +0000
                    Re: BCD, was Concertina IV Has Arrived John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-06-01 20:00 +0000
                      Re: BCD, was Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-06-01 21:57 +0000
                byte order (was: BCD) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-06-01 08:36 +0000
              Re: BCD, was Concertina IV Has Arrived jgd@cix.co.uk (John Dallman) - 2026-06-02 14:00 +0100
                Re: BCD, was Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-06-02 14:54 +0000
                  Re: BCD, was Concertina IV Has Arrived scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-06-02 16:13 +0000
                  Re: BCD, was Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-06-02 17:13 +0000
                    Re: BCD, was Concertina IV Has Arrived Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-06-02 18:25 +0000
                      Re: BCD, was Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-06-02 19:07 +0000
                    Re: BCD, was Concertina IV Has Arrived Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-06-02 11:44 -0700
                      Re: BCD, was Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-06-02 19:37 +0000
                    Re: BCD, was Concertina IV Has Arrived EricP <ThatWouldBeTelling@thevillage.com> - 2026-06-03 08:29 -0400
                Re: BCD, was Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-06-02 17:09 +0000
                bit order and byte order (was: BCD) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-06-02 15:59 +0000
                  Re: bit order and byte order (was: BCD) quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-06-03 00:37 +0000
                    Re: bit order and byte order (was: BCD) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-06-03 17:44 +0000
                  Re: bit order and byte order (was: BCD) George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2026-06-03 19:05 -0400
                    Re: bit order and byte order (was: BCD) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-06-04 12:45 +0000
                Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-06-02 22:00 +0000
                  Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-06-03 00:21 +0000
                    Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-06-03 01:03 +0000
                      Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-06-03 01:52 +0000
                    Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-06-03 13:54 +0000
                      Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-06-03 15:33 +0000
                        Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-06-03 17:36 +0000
                          Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina "Brian G. Lucas" <bagel99@gmail.com> - 2026-06-04 11:53 -0500
                        Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-06-03 19:22 +0000
                          Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina jgd@cix.co.uk (John Dallman) - 2026-09-05 22:10 +0100
                            Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-09-06 09:20 +0000
                              Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-06 11:47 +0200
                                Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-09-06 12:17 +0000
                                  Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-06 15:24 +0200
                                    Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-09-06 14:41 +0000
                                      Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-06 19:20 +0200
                                        Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-09-06 23:51 +0000
                                          Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-07 10:10 +0200
                                            Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-09-07 18:22 +0000
                                              Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-07 23:24 +0200
                                                Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-09-07 22:00 +0000
                                                  Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-08 11:25 +0200
                                          Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-09-08 16:02 +0000
                                            Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-08 20:32 +0200
                                            Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-09-08 19:03 +0000
                                              Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-09-08 20:59 +0000
                                      Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-07 02:40 +0000
                              Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina jgd@cix.co.uk (John Dallman) - 2026-09-06 19:33 +0100
                              Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-09-07 15:57 +0000
                                Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-09-07 17:00 +0000
                                  Re: endian history, was BCD, was Concertina John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-09-08 13:24 +0000
                        Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-05 08:17 +0000
                          Re: endian history quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-09-05 13:52 +0000
                            Re: endian history Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-09-05 15:58 +0200
                              Re: endian history Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-09-05 14:55 +0000
                                Re: endian history Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-09-05 17:24 +0200
                                  Re: endian history MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-09-05 16:57 +0000
                                    Re: endian history quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-09-06 02:06 +0000
                                      Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-06 07:04 +0000
                                        Re: endian history quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-09-06 18:38 +0000
                                          Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-06 21:50 +0000
                                            Re: endian history quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-09-08 02:33 +0000
                                              Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-08 03:46 +0000
                                                Re: endian history quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-09-08 17:31 +0000
                                                  Re: endian history MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-09-08 20:13 +0000
                                                  Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-09 00:22 +0000
                                                    Re: endian history quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-09-09 01:10 +0000
                                                      Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-09 01:33 +0000
                                                      Re: endian history David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-09 11:06 +0200
                                                  Re: endian history Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2026-09-08 23:57 -0400
                                          Re: endian history MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-09-06 23:57 +0000
                                            Re: endian history Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-09-06 17:31 -0700
                                              Re: endian history Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-09-06 21:46 -0700
                                                Re: endian history Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-09-07 13:57 +0800
                                                Re: endian history Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-09-07 15:23 -0700
                                                  OT writing direction Re: endian history Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-09-07 20:15 -0700
                                                    Re: OT writing direction Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-08 03:44 +0000
                                                    Re: OT writing direction Re: endian history MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-09-08 17:23 +0000
                                                    Re: OT writing direction Re: endian history Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-09-15 07:49 -0700
                                                      Re: OT writing direction Re: endian history Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-09-15 10:09 -0700
                                                        Re: OT writing direction Re: endian history Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-09-20 07:14 -0700
                                                  Re: endian history MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-09-08 17:16 +0000
                                                  Re: endian history George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2026-09-09 20:22 -0400
                                                    Re: endian history MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-09-10 01:25 +0000
                                                      Re: endian history Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-09-10 12:09 +0200
                                                    Re: endian history Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-09-15 09:19 -0700
                                            Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-07 02:35 +0000
                                              Re: endian history MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-09-07 18:14 +0000
                                            Re: endian history Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-09-07 05:05 +0000
                                            Re: endian history David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-07 10:32 +0200
                                            Re: endian history quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-09-08 02:36 +0000
                                              Re: endian history Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-09-07 20:21 -0700
                                                Re: endian history David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-08 11:32 +0200
                                                  Re: endian history Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-09-08 08:31 -0700
                                            Re: endian history Andreas Eder <a_eder_muc@web.de> - 2026-09-17 10:23 +0200
                                        Re: endian history Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-09-07 15:25 -0700
                                    Re: endian history scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-09-06 13:57 +0000
                                      Re: endian history BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2026-09-06 12:41 -0500
                                        Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-06 21:53 +0000
                                          Re: endian history MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-09-07 00:12 +0000
                                            Re: endian history BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2026-09-06 23:34 -0500
                                            Re: endian history anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-09-08 10:29 +0000
                                      Re: endian history Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-09-07 13:56 +0200
                                        Re: endian history Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-09-07 23:54 +0300
                                          Re: endian history Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-09-08 05:07 +0000
                                          Re: endian history Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-09-08 21:14 +0200
                                Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-05 21:16 +0000
                                  Re: endian history quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-09-06 01:55 +0000
                                    Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-06 02:09 +0000
                                      Re: endian history quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-09-06 18:28 +0000
                                        Re: endian history MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-09-06 23:54 +0000
                                        Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-07 02:44 +0000
                                    Re: endian history MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-09-06 15:39 +0000
                            Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-06 07:07 +0000
                              Re: endian history scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-09-06 14:00 +0000
                              Re: endian history antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-09-07 20:24 +0000
                                Re: endian history Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-09-07 16:58 -0700
                                  Re: endian history quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-09-08 02:47 +0000
                                    Re: endian history Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-09-07 20:23 -0700
                                    Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-08 03:49 +0000
                                  Re: endian history scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-09-08 16:00 +0000
                                Re: endian history quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-09-08 02:45 +0000
                                  Re: endian history John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-09-08 08:38 +0000
                                    Re: endian history quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-09-09 01:12 +0000
                                  Re: endian history anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-09-08 10:56 +0000
                                    Re: endian history John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-09-08 13:34 +0000
                                      Re: endian history Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-09-08 21:23 +0200
                                      Re: endian history anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-09-09 08:04 +0000
                                        Re: endian history Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-09-09 23:21 +0200
                                          Base64 ISA (was: endian history) Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2026-09-14 12:39 -0400
                                            Re: Base64 ISA Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-09-15 11:26 +0200
                                    Re: endian history Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-09-08 19:30 +0000
                                      Re: endian history anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-09-09 08:22 +0000
                                      Re: endian history Paul Clayton <paaronclayton@gmail.com> - 2026-09-13 14:55 -0400
                                        Re: endian history Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-09-14 10:29 -0700
                                          Re: endian history Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-09-15 11:32 +0200
                                          Re: endian history Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-09-15 08:53 -0700
                                        Re: endian history Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-09-14 17:32 +0000
                                          Re: endian history Paul Clayton <paaronclayton@gmail.com> - 2026-09-23 21:09 -0400
                                            Re: endian history scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-09-28 15:09 +0000
                                        Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-14 23:29 +0000
                                          Re: endian history Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-09-15 12:49 +0200
                                            Re: endian history anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-09-15 13:01 +0000
                                              Re: endian history Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-09-15 16:51 +0200
                                        Re: endian history antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-09-16 04:41 +0000
                                          Re: endian history Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-09-16 05:53 +0000
                                            Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-16 07:52 +0000
                                              Re: endian history Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-09-16 07:29 -0700
                                                Re: endian history scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-09-16 15:49 +0000
                                          Re: endian history Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> - 2026-09-16 10:48 +0200
                                            Re: endian history Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-09-16 16:21 +0200
                                              Re: endian history Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-09-18 00:38 -0700
                                                Re: endian history Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-09-18 17:29 +0300
                                                  Re: endian history Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-09-18 16:48 +0200
                                                Re: endian history Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-09-18 16:47 +0200
                                                  Re: endian history Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-09-18 15:36 -0700
                                                    Re: endian history Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-09-22 19:51 +0200
                                                      Re: endian history Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-09-23 08:28 -0700
                                                        Re: endian history Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-09-23 18:01 +0200
                                                          Re: endian history Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-09-23 10:47 -0700
                                                        Re: endian history MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-09-23 18:41 +0000
                                                          Re: endian history Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-09-23 13:15 -0700
                                                            Re: endian history Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-09-24 15:09 +0200
                                                              Re: endian history Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-09-25 02:47 -0700
                                                            Re: endian history MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-09-24 17:00 +0000
                                                              Re: endian history scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-09-24 18:35 +0000
                                                              Re: endian history Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-09-25 03:19 -0700
                                                              Re: endian history Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-09-26 07:41 +0000
                                                                Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-27 02:48 +0000
                                                                  Re: endian history Robert Finch <robfi680@gmail.com> - 2026-09-26 23:49 -0400
                                                                    Re: endian history Niklas Holsti <niklas.holsti@tidorum.invalid> - 2026-09-27 12:06 +0300
                                                                      Re: endian history Robert Finch <robfi680@gmail.com> - 2026-09-27 06:14 -0400
                                                                        Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-27 23:57 +0000
                                                                          Re: endian history Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-09-28 14:33 +0200
                                                                        Re: endian history David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-28 10:38 +0200
                                                                          Re: endian history anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-09-28 08:50 +0000
                                                                            Re: endian history David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-28 11:23 +0200
                                                                            Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-28 22:50 +0000
                                                                              Re: endian history anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-09-29 06:11 +0000
                                                                    Re: endian history MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-09-27 17:47 +0000
                                                                      Re: endian history John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-09-27 18:21 +0000
                                                                        Re: endian history scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-09-28 15:13 +0000
                                                                    Re: endian history Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-09-28 13:05 -0700
                                                                  Re: endian history David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-27 16:56 +0200
                                                                  Re: endian history Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-09-27 20:01 -0700
                                                                    Re: endian history Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-09-28 06:14 +0000
                                                                      Re: arithmetic and endian history John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-09-28 14:08 +0000
                                                                        Re: arithmetic and endian history anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-09-28 16:54 +0000
                                                                          Re: arithmetic and endian history John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-09-28 21:46 +0000
                                                                            Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-09-29 08:01 +0000
                                                                              Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-09-29 14:26 +0000
                                                                              Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-09-29 17:21 +0000
                                                                                Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-09-29 17:28 +0000
                                                                                Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-09-29 20:16 +0000
                                                                                  Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-10-01 09:00 +0000
                                                                                    Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-10-01 09:30 +0000
                                                                                    Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-10-01 06:49 -0700
                                                                                      Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-10-01 15:05 +0000
                                                                                        Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-10-01 16:04 +0000
                                                                                          Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-10-02 01:30 +0000
                                                                                            Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-10-01 19:27 -0700
                                                                                              Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-10-02 02:45 +0000
                                                                                                Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-10-02 09:53 +0000
                                                                                                  Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-10-02 19:10 +0000
                                                                                                    Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-10-03 17:18 +0000
                                                                                                      Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-10-03 19:54 +0000
                                                                                                        Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-10-03 20:49 +0000
                                                                                                          Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-10-03 22:05 +0000
                                                                                                            Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-10-04 08:09 +0000
                                                                                                              Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-10-04 15:14 +0000
                                                                                                              Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-10-04 18:29 +0000
                                                                                                              Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-06 08:29 +0000
                                                                                                        Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-10-06 03:20 -0700
                                                                                                          Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-10-06 17:24 +0000
                                                                                                            Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-10-12 01:46 -0700
                                                                                                              Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-10-12 17:37 +0000
                                                                                                                Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-10-13 21:57 +0000
                                                                                                                  Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-10-14 07:50 +0000
                                                                                                                    Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-14 23:08 +0000
                                                                                                      Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-10-03 19:55 +0000
                                                                                                        Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-10-04 06:50 +0000
                                                                                                          Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-10-04 15:11 +0000
                                                                                                          Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-10-04 19:38 +0000
                                                                                                            Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-10-06 07:30 +0000
                                                                                                              Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-10-06 18:07 +0000
                                                                                                                Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-10-06 21:17 +0000
                                                                                                                Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-10-06 23:30 +0200
                                                                                                                  Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-10-07 10:16 +0000
                                                                                                                    Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-10-07 19:53 +0000
                                                                                                      Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-10-03 23:49 +0000
                                                                                                        Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-10-04 01:04 +0000
                                                                                                        Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-10-04 07:47 +0000
                                                                                                          Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-10-04 18:02 +0000
                                                                                                        Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-11-02 09:45 -0800
                                                                                                          Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-11-02 10:12 -0800
                                                                                                          Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-02 18:43 +0000
                                                                                                            Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-11-02 20:00 +0000
                                                                                                              Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-11-02 20:28 +0000
                                                                                                                Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-11-03 01:34 +0000
                                                                                                                  Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-11-03 08:35 +0100
                                                                                                            Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-11-02 20:25 +0000
                                                                                                              Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-11-05 23:36 +0000
                                                                                                              Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-06 03:22 +0000
                                                                                                                Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-11-06 06:24 +0000
                                                                                                                  Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-11-06 12:08 +0100
                                                                                                                    Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-11-06 15:08 +0000
                                                                                                                      Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-11-06 20:50 +0100
                                                                                                                  Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> - 2026-11-06 16:50 +0100
                                                                                                                  Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-06 19:22 +0000
                                                                                                                    carry-in (was: two's complement and Flags) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-11-07 07:41 +0000
                                                                                                                      Re: carry-in (was: two's complement and Flags) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-11-07 12:09 +0000
                                                                                                                        Re: carry-in (was: two's complement and Flags) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-11-07 16:19 +0000
                                                                                                                          Re: carry-in (was: two's complement and Flags) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-11-07 18:20 +0000
                                                                                                                            6502 vs Z80 (was: carry-in) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-11-07 18:35 +0000
                                                                                                                            Re: carry-in (was: two's complement and Flags) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-07 22:38 +0000
                                                                                                                            Re: carry-in antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-11-08 18:52 +0000
                                                                                                                      Re: carry-in Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-11-07 10:17 -0800
                                                                                                                        Re: carry-in in history John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-07 19:00 +0000
                                                                                                                        Re: carry-in Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-07 22:37 +0000
                                                                                                                      Re: carry-in (was: two's complement and Flags) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-07 18:44 +0000
                                                                                                                      Re: carry-in (was: two's complement and Flags) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-07 22:33 +0000
                                                                                                                        Re: carry-in (was: two's complement and Flags) George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2026-11-08 02:55 -0500
                                                                                                                          Re: carry-in Robert Finch <robfi680@gmail.com> - 2026-11-08 07:50 -0500
                                                                                                                      Re: carry-in (was: two's complement and Flags) quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-11-09 02:09 +0000
                                                                                                                Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-06 15:28 +0000
                                                                                                                  Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-07 02:36 +0000
                                                                                                                Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-11-07 13:52 +0000
                                                                                                            Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-11-06 10:51 -0800
                                                                                                          Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-11-02 19:14 +0000
                                                                                                            Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-11-02 20:37 +0000
                                                                                                              Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-11-03 01:36 +0000
                                                                                                                Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-03 15:09 +0000
                                                                                                              Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-11-03 06:59 +0000
                                                                                                                Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-11-04 03:01 +0000
                                                                                                                  Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-04 03:36 +0000
                                                                                                          Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 02:39 +0000
                                                                                                          Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-11-04 18:06 +0000
                                                                                                            Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-04 18:20 +0000
                                                                                                            Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-11-04 21:53 +0000
                                                                                                              Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-11-04 23:08 +0100
                                                                                                              Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-11-05 08:14 -0800
                                                                                                                Re: bad floating point, two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-05 17:26 +0000
                                                                                                      Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-06 08:28 +0000
                                                                                                    Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-10-04 07:57 +0000
                                                                                                      Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-10-04 08:14 +0000
                                                                                                        Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-10-04 09:49 +0000
                                                                                                        Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-10-04 11:22 +0000
                                                                                                Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-10-02 10:01 +0000
                                                                                                Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-10-02 21:19 -0700
                                                                                                  Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-10-03 19:40 +0000
                                                                                              Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-10-02 05:45 +0000
                                                                                                Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-10-02 07:54 +0000
                                                                                                  Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-10-02 19:07 +0000
                                                                                                    Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-10-02 20:33 +0000
                                                                                        Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-10-01 09:17 -0700
                                                                                          Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-10-01 16:45 +0000
                                                                                            Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-10-01 18:42 +0000
                                                                                        Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) moi <findlaybill@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2026-10-03 02:30 +0100
                                                                                          Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-10-03 17:43 +0000
                                                                                            Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) moi <findlaybill@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2026-10-04 23:44 +0100
                                                                              Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-10-01 07:45 +0000
                                                                                Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-10-01 07:51 +0000
                                                                                  Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-10-02 01:31 +0000
                                                                                    Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-10-02 02:29 +0000
                                                                                      Re: Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-10-02 02:46 +0000
                                                                      Re: endian history Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-09-28 08:45 -0700
                                                                      Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-29 03:15 +0000
                                                                    Re: endian history scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-09-28 15:19 +0000
                                                              Re: endian history Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2026-09-28 14:37 -0400
                                                                Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-29 22:47 +0000
                                                                  Re: endian history David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-30 08:39 +0200
                                                                  Re: endian history aph@littlepinkcloud.invalid - 2026-09-30 08:52 +0000
                                                                    Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-30 22:26 +0000
                                                                      Re: endian history aph@littlepinkcloud.invalid - 2026-10-01 10:44 +0000
                                                                        Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-01 21:53 +0000
                                                                          Re: endian history David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-10-02 11:11 +0200
                                                                            Re: endian history BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2026-10-02 16:17 -0500
                                                                          Re: endian history aph@littlepinkcloud.invalid - 2026-10-02 14:25 +0000
                                                                            Re: endian history BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2026-10-02 16:46 -0500
                                                                              Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-03 02:43 +0000
                                                                                Re: endian history BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2026-10-03 00:54 -0500
                                                                                  Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-03 06:15 +0000
                                                                                    Re: endian history BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2026-10-03 18:51 -0500
                                                                                      Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-04 02:35 +0000
                                                                                  Re: endian history Robert Finch <robfi680@gmail.com> - 2026-10-03 10:25 -0400
                                                                                    Re: endian history BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2026-10-03 16:59 -0500
                                                                                Re: endian history George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2026-10-03 15:04 -0400
                                                                            Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-02 21:53 +0000
                                                                    Re: endian history anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-10-01 07:34 +0000
                                                                    Re: endian history Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-10-01 07:00 -0700
                                                                      Re: endian history anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-10-01 15:20 +0000
                                                                        Re: endian history Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-10-01 09:15 -0700
                                                                          Re: endian history Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-10-01 19:23 +0300
                                                                            Re: endian history Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-10-02 21:31 -0700
                                                                              Re: endian history anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-10-03 10:25 +0000
                                                                          Re: endian history anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-10-01 16:36 +0000
                                                                            Re: endian history scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-10-01 18:38 +0000
                                                                              Re: endian history George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2026-10-01 15:17 -0400
                                                                              Re: endian history anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-10-01 21:20 +0000
                                                                            Re: endian history MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-10-01 19:55 +0000
                                                                              Re: endian history David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-10-02 11:21 +0200
                                                                                Re: endian history Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-10-02 12:47 +0300
                                                                                  Re: endian history David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-10-02 12:57 +0200
                                                                                    Re: endian history Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-10-02 14:44 +0300
                                                                                      Re: endian history David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-10-02 15:28 +0200
                                                                                  Re: endian history Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-10-03 05:29 -0700
                                                                        Re: endian history EricP <ThatWouldBeTelling@thevillage.com> - 2026-10-01 13:12 -0400
                                                                          Re: endian history anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-10-01 17:41 +0000
                                                                            Re: endian history BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2026-10-01 18:07 -0500
                                                                              Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-02 02:44 +0000
                                                                                Re: endian history BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2026-10-01 22:06 -0500
                                                                                Re: endian history MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-10-02 18:05 +0000
                                                                              Re: endian history MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-10-02 18:00 +0000
                                                                                Re: endian history BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2026-10-02 13:51 -0500
                                                                                Re: endian history scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-10-03 14:14 +0000
                                                                              Re: endian history EricP <ThatWouldBeTelling@thevillage.com> - 2026-10-04 14:19 -0400
                                                                            Re: endian history EricP <ThatWouldBeTelling@thevillage.com> - 2026-10-04 13:59 -0400
                                                                      Re: endian history aph@littlepinkcloud.invalid - 2026-10-02 15:18 +0000
                                                                        Re: endian history BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2026-10-02 14:57 -0500
                                                                          Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-03 02:30 +0000
                                                                            Re: endian history BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2026-10-03 05:26 -0500
                                                                          Re: endian history Andy Valencia <vandys@vsta.org> - 2026-10-05 15:53 -0700
                                                                            Re: endian history Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-06 08:18 +0000
                                                                            Re: endian history George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2026-10-06 13:40 -0400
                                                                            Re: endian history Andy Valencia <vandys@vsta.org> - 2026-10-06 10:49 -0700
                                                                              Re: endian history Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2026-10-07 08:54 -0400
                                                                                Re: endian history Jim Jackson <jj@franjam.org.uk> - 2026-10-08 18:33 +0000
                                                                        Re: endian history Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-10-03 04:44 -0700
                                                    Re: endian history MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-09-22 18:16 +0000
                                                      Re: endian history Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-09-22 20:27 +0200
                                                      Re: endian history Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-09-22 16:55 -0700
                                            Re: endian history Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-09-16 16:17 +0000
                                  Re: endian history scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-09-08 16:01 +0000
                                  Re: endian history Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-09-08 21:17 +0200
                                    Re: endian history MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-09-08 20:15 +0000
                                      Re: endian history David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-09 11:08 +0200
          Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-20 18:13 +0000
        Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-20 07:21 +0000
          Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-21 00:06 +0000
            Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-21 07:03 +0000
              Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-21 13:42 +0000
              Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-21 18:32 +0000
                Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-21 22:21 +0000
                  Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-05-22 07:35 +0000
                    Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-22 15:48 +0000
                      Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-22 21:22 +0000
                        Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-05-23 09:28 +0000
                          Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-23 17:01 +0000
                            Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-05-23 18:37 +0000
                          Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived Robert Finch <robfi680@gmail.com> - 2026-05-23 14:15 -0400
                            Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-23 20:01 +0000
                        Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-23 16:19 +0000
                          Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-05-23 16:38 +0000
                      Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-05-23 08:36 +0000
                        Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-05-23 16:46 +0000
                        Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-05-23 19:33 +0000
                          Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-23 20:03 +0000
                            Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-05-23 20:09 +0000
                              Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-23 22:15 +0000
                                Re: base+displacement, condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-05-24 01:43 +0000
                                  Re: base+displacement, condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-24 03:10 +0000
                                    Re: base+displacement, condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-05-24 17:06 +0000
                                  Re: base+displacement, condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-24 13:57 +0000
                                    Re: base+displacement, condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-05-24 15:12 +0000
                                      Re: base+displacement, condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-24 16:44 +0000
                              Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-24 13:30 +0000
                                Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-05-24 15:24 +0000
                                  Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-24 16:39 +0000
                                    Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-26 15:13 +0000
                            Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-24 13:32 +0000
                              Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-24 13:49 +0000
                                Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-24 14:14 +0000
                          Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-05-24 09:32 +0000
                            Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-24 17:16 +0000
                              Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-24 17:32 +0000
                                Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-24 21:39 +0000
                                  Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-24 22:07 +0000
                                    Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2026-05-24 15:22 -0700
                                  Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-05-25 10:23 +0200
                                    Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-05-25 14:28 +0000
                                      Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-05-25 17:18 +0200
                                        Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-05-25 16:43 +0000
                                          Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-25 19:20 +0000
                                            Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-25 20:32 +0000
                                              Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-25 22:51 +0000
                                            Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-05-25 20:32 +0000
                                              Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-25 23:00 +0000
                                                Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-05-26 08:27 +0200
                                                  Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-05-26 22:09 +0200
                                                    Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-26 20:54 +0000
                                                      Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2026-05-27 10:59 -0400
                                                        Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-27 18:19 +0000
                                                          Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2026-06-01 14:51 -0400
                                                            Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-06-02 06:19 +0000
                                                              Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-06-02 07:47 +0000
                                                            Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-06-02 17:50 +0200
                                                              Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-06-02 19:10 +0000
                                                                Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-06-03 00:55 +0000
                                                                  Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2026-06-03 10:42 -0400
                                                                    Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-06-03 18:36 +0000
                                                                      Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2026-06-04 23:46 -0400
                                                                        Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-06-05 08:36 +0000
                                                                        Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-06-07 15:05 -0700
                                                                          Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-06-08 01:19 +0000
                                                                            Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-06-08 09:25 +0300
                                                                              Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-06-08 11:45 +0200
                                                                                Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2026-06-08 17:44 -0400
                                                                                  Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-06-11 15:14 +0000
                                                                                  Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2026-06-11 13:43 -0400
                                                                                    Re: public domain, condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-06-13 03:01 +0000
                                                                                      Re: public domain, condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2026-06-13 05:49 -0400
                                                                                        Re: public domain, condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-06-13 10:52 +0000
                                                                                          Re: public domain, condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-06-13 14:20 +0000
                                                                                      Re: public domain, condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-06-13 15:07 +0000
                                                                                        Re: public domain, condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-06-13 17:25 +0000
                                                                                          Re: public domain, condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-06-15 16:32 +0000
                                                                                        Re: public domain, condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived quadibloc@invalid.com (John Savard) - 2026-06-14 19:14 +0000
                                                                              Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-06-08 17:11 +0000
                                                                          Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-06-08 06:05 +0000
                                                                            Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-06-08 07:30 -0700
                                                                              Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-06-08 15:19 +0000
                                                                                Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-06-08 22:51 +0300
                                                                              Free software (was: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-06-08 16:18 +0000
                                                                                Re: Free software Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-06-08 10:40 -0700
                                                                                Re: Free software (was: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived) Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-06-08 22:43 +0300
                                                                                  Re: Free software (was: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-06-09 17:24 +0000
                                                                                    Re: Free software Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> - 2026-06-09 21:15 +0200
                                                                                      Re: Free software Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-06-09 16:29 -0700
                                                                                    Re: Free software (was: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-06-10 06:01 +0000
                                                                                Re: Free software Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2026-06-08 18:03 -0400
                                                                                  Re: Free software David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-06-09 10:06 +0200
                                                                                    Re: Free software Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2026-06-11 15:21 -0400
                                                                                      Re: Free software David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-06-12 13:02 +0200
                                                                          Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2026-06-08 09:18 -0400
                                                                    Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-06-03 21:24 +0000
                                                                  Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2026-06-05 15:07 -0400
                                                                    Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-06-06 08:57 +0000
                                                                    Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-06-07 16:42 +0000
                                              Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-06-06 01:37 +0000
                                                Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-06-06 07:57 +0000
                                                  Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-06-12 01:57 +0000
                                          Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-05-26 08:18 +0200
                                          Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-06-12 01:04 +0000
                                        Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2026-05-25 15:27 -0400
                                      Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-25 16:49 +0000
                                        Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-25 20:34 +0000
                                          Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2026-05-25 20:02 -0500
                                            Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-26 18:02 +0000
                                              Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2026-05-26 14:28 -0500
                                      Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2026-05-25 16:34 -0500
                                        Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-25 23:05 +0000
                                          Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2026-05-26 15:29 -0400
                                            Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2026-05-26 19:13 -0500
                                    Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-25 20:26 +0000
                                      Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-25 22:49 +0000
                                      Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-05-26 05:39 +0000
                                    Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-05-25 20:32 +0000
                                      Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-25 22:59 +0000
                                        Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2026-05-27 15:24 -0500
                            Re: condition bits, Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-24 17:30 +0000
                    Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-22 15:48 +0000
              Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-21 22:14 +0000
                Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-21 23:46 +0000
                  Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-22 02:20 +0000
              Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-05-22 07:22 +0000
        Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-21 02:33 +0000
          Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-21 06:12 +0000
            Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-21 13:13 +0000
              Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-21 13:22 +0000
          Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-21 18:26 +0000
            Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-21 23:44 +0000
        Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-25 01:04 +0000
          Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-25 01:29 +0000
          Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-25 16:45 +0000
            Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-25 20:45 +0000
              Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-25 23:03 +0000
                Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-30 04:02 +0000
                  Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-30 15:47 +0000
                    Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-30 19:15 +0000
                      Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-05-31 11:05 -0700
                        Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-31 18:40 +0000
                          Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-06-01 19:56 +0000
                            Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-06-01 23:40 +0000
                            Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-06-02 06:20 +0000
                            Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-06-04 04:06 +0000
                              Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-06-04 04:44 +0000
                        Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-06-01 01:40 +0000
                          Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-06-01 05:36 +0000
                            Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-06-01 18:10 +0000
                      Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived Paul Clayton <paaronclayton@gmail.com> - 2026-05-31 18:38 -0400
                        Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-06-02 01:52 +0000
                    Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-31 01:22 +0000
                      Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-31 12:05 +0000
                        Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-31 17:26 +0000
                    Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-31 02:57 +0000
                Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-05-30 04:06 +0000
                  Re: Concertina IV Has Arrived MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-05-30 19:03 +0000

Page 14 of 30 — ← Prev page 1 … 12 13 [14] 15 16 … 30  Next page →


#118563 — Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)

FromJohn Levine <johnl@taugh.com>
Date2026-10-12 17:37 +0000
SubjectRe: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)
Message-ID<11aj5su$29p$1@gal.iecc.com>
In reply to#118554
According to Tim Rentsch  <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com>:
>>> I think this proposed explanation is consistent with the example
>>> given on page 10 (which doesn't talk about looping) and with the
>>> description of the "Transfer on Index" instruction give on page 25
>>> (which clearly is meant to be used with looping). ...
>>
>> That's certainly one of the more common guesses people have made.
>> On the other hand, the TIX instruction adds its decrement field
>> to an index register, but since the decrement is the same size as
>> the index, if you want to count down you just make the decrement
>> two's comp -1. [...]
>
>Did you misread the description of the TIX instruction?

Oh, whoops, I confused it with TXI.

Either way, the fact that Fortran stored its arrays backwards
suggests that whatever they had in mind turned out not to be useful.

I sure wish SOMEONE had written down what the motivation was.  The
mixture of sign-magnitude arithmetic in most places and two's
complement subtraction for indexing is quite peculiar.


-- 
Regards,
John Levine, johnl@taugh.com, Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies",
Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#118595 — Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)

FromThomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de>
Date2026-10-13 21:57 +0000
SubjectRe: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)
Message-ID<11am9g1$uql2$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#118563
John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> schrieb:
> According to Tim Rentsch  <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com>:
>>>> I think this proposed explanation is consistent with the example
>>>> given on page 10 (which doesn't talk about looping) and with the
>>>> description of the "Transfer on Index" instruction give on page 25
>>>> (which clearly is meant to be used with looping). ...
>>>
>>> That's certainly one of the more common guesses people have made.
>>> On the other hand, the TIX instruction adds its decrement field
>>> to an index register, but since the decrement is the same size as
>>> the index, if you want to count down you just make the decrement
>>> two's comp -1. [...]
>>
>>Did you misread the description of the TIX instruction?
>
> Oh, whoops, I confused it with TXI.
>
> Either way, the fact that Fortran stored its arrays backwards
> suggests that whatever they had in mind turned out not to be useful.

It certainly makes sense for a language like Fortran to store the
arrays on the order for the indexing.  Putting in the arrays in
ascending order, with code like

      DO 10 I=1,10
        A(I) = B(I) + C(I)
 10   CONTINUE

would have required negating the index registers for the array
indices.

Whatever they had in mind for the negative indexing was something
aimed at assembler or machine code programmers (assemblers still
were considered a luxury in those days).  The 704 was introduced
in 1954, and Backus wrote his famous FORTRAN memo late in 1953,
when an optimizing compiler was still a wild idea.

This makes the usual explanation quite likely but, as you
correctly pointed out, that is not proof.

> I sure wish SOMEONE had written down what the motivation was.  The
> mixture of sign-magnitude arithmetic in most places and two's
> complement subtraction for indexing is quite peculiar.

The 704 was the successor of the 701, which was also sign-magnitude,
There, the 36-bit adder (despite ripple carry, compounded by
end-around carry) could do its job in 5 microseconds.  Using the
same number representation made a lot of sense, both from the
engineering and the customer standpoint.  So, quite possibly a
legacy issue.

For the index register, they chose a solution that was simple.
The "Architecture of the IBM System/ 360" article by Amdahl,
Blaauw and Brooks notes that two's complement is better
for addressing modes.  They wrote

"For the fixed-point arithmetic
system, which is binary,the two’s complement representa-
tion for negative numbers was selected. The well-known
virtues of this system are the unique representation
of zero and the absence of recomplementation.These
substantial advantages are augmented by several properties
especially useful in address arithmetic, particularly in the
large models, where address arithmetic has its own hard-
ware. With two’s complement notation, this indexing
hardware requires no true/complement gates and thus
works faster. In the smaller, serial models, the fact that
high-order bits of address arithmetic can be elided with-
out changing the low-order bits also permits a gain in
speed."

(One thing that they did not mention was that, for machines which
did the addition piecewise like the 360/30 did, an end-around carry
would have required a second carry propagation trip by microcode.)

This was later, but Amdahl was also involved with the
704, and two's complement subtraction *is* cheaper.

Some things cannot be explained logically, only chronologically.

-- 
This USENET posting was made without artificial intelligence,
artificial impertinence, artificial arrogance, artificial stupidity,
artificial flavorings or artificial colorants.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#118606 — Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)

Fromanton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl)
Date2026-10-14 07:50 +0000
SubjectRe: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)
Message-ID<2026Oct14.095054@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at>
In reply to#118595
Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> writes:
>John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> schrieb:
>> Either way, the fact that Fortran stored its arrays backwards
>> suggests that whatever they had in mind turned out not to be useful.
>
>It certainly makes sense for a language like Fortran to store the
>arrays on the order for the indexing.  Putting in the arrays in
>ascending order, with code like
>
>      DO 10 I=1,10
>        A(I) = B(I) + C(I)
> 10   CONTINUE
>
>would have required negating the index registers for the array
>indices.

Given that FORTRAN was developed for the IBM 704, it's interesting
that they did not design their loops to count down.

Although, thinking about it some more, storing the arrays backwards is
easier than storing them forwards, using and incrementing
implementation for a counter that semantically decrements, and
indexing the arrays with that counter, and converting the counter to
the semantic value when using it in a non-indexing context.

Another more hardware-centric way would have been to actually specify
the arrays to have indexes from -N to 0 or so and to let A(I) access
the element with index -I.  But I guess that that would have run
counter to the intention of "Formula translator", and storing the
arrays backwards is actually easier than explaining these semantics in
the manual, and letting the prorgammers work around it.

- anton
-- 
'Anyone trying for "industrial quality" ISA should avoid undefined behavior.'
  Mitch Alsup, <c17fcd89-f024-40e7-a594-88a85ac10d20o@googlegroups.com>

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#118628 — Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)

FromLawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid>
Date2026-10-14 23:08 +0000
SubjectRe: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)
Message-ID<11ap20r$1tsnt$3@dont-email.me>
In reply to#118606
On Wed, 14 Oct 2026 07:50:54 GMT, Anton Ertl wrote:

> Given that FORTRAN was developed for the IBM 704, it's interesting
> that they did not design their loops to count down.

That’s what made it a “high-level language”.

;)

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#118438 — Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)

FromThomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de>
Date2026-10-03 19:55 +0000
SubjectRe: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)
Message-ID<119rmkc$39ob8$2@dont-email.me>
In reply to#118429
Anton Ertl <anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at> schrieb:

> The idea of interpreting numbers with set MSB as negative numbers by
> subtracting 2^n from their unsigned value, and relying on the
> properties of modular arithmetic to make this work with the same
> addition, subtraction, multiplication, and shift-left operations that
> were also used for unsigned arithmetic was apparently only becoming
> widespread in the early 1960s.  It's not an obvious idea.

According to
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Draft_of_a_Report_on_the_EDVAC ,
John von Neumann suggested this in 1945.  But Konrad Zuse had
used aready used this in the Z1, which was built between 1936
and 1938: https://arxiv.org/pdf/1406.1886 

-- 
This USENET posting was made without artificial intelligence,
artificial impertinence, artificial arrogance, artificial stupidity,
artificial flavorings or artificial colorants.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#118452 — Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)

Fromanton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl)
Date2026-10-04 06:50 +0000
SubjectRe: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)
Message-ID<2026Oct4.085015@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at>
In reply to#118438
Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> writes:
>Anton Ertl <anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at> schrieb:
>
>> The idea of interpreting numbers with set MSB as negative numbers by
>> subtracting 2^n from their unsigned value, and relying on the
>> properties of modular arithmetic to make this work with the same
>> addition, subtraction, multiplication, and shift-left operations that
>> were also used for unsigned arithmetic was apparently only becoming
>> widespread in the early 1960s.  It's not an obvious idea.
>
>According to
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Draft_of_a_Report_on_the_EDVAC ,
>John von Neumann suggested this in 1945.

Von Neumann describes 2s-complement signed representation for
fixed-point numbers scaled for the range -1<=x<1.

Von Neumann's paper seems to have made quite a splash, so it's not
clear why the computer architects of the 1950s went for sign/magnitude
and 1s-complement representation of signed integers rather than
2's-complement representation.

>But Konrad Zuse had
>used aready used this in the Z1, which was built between 1936
>and 1938: https://arxiv.org/pdf/1406.1886

This description is not entirely clear to me.  On the one hand it says
early in Section 2 something about 2's-complement signed
representation.

On the other hand, in the rest of the paper I see a description of FP
arithmetic rather similar to what IEEE has standardized: a separate
sign bit at the beginning, then the exponent, then the mantissa with
hidden bit.  Figure 3 shows a box called "sign computation", which
indicates a sign/magnitude representation like standardized FP.

We may see 2's-complement signed numbers in the handling of the
exponent, which is described as having a range of "-64 to +63" (IEEE
FP uses an excess-N representation rather than plain twos-complement;
I am too lazy to look up the IBM 704).  The Z1 could not represent 0
(hidden bit for all exponents), and in the Z3 he turned -64 into an
exponent indicating zero.

The details of Zuse's work were probably not well-known until much
later because much of his work was destroyed by bombing, and from
reading the paper, also seems that he was more interested in building
than in documenting.

- anton
-- 
'Anyone trying for "industrial quality" ISA should avoid undefined behavior.'
  Mitch Alsup, <c17fcd89-f024-40e7-a594-88a85ac10d20o@googlegroups.com>

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#118462 — Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)

Fromscott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal)
Date2026-10-04 15:11 +0000
SubjectRe: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)
Message-ID<21uwS.618$zRPb.443@fx06.iad>
In reply to#118452
anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) writes:
>Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> writes:
>>Anton Ertl <anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at> schrieb:
>>
>>> The idea of interpreting numbers with set MSB as negative numbers by
>>> subtracting 2^n from their unsigned value, and relying on the
>>> properties of modular arithmetic to make this work with the same
>>> addition, subtraction, multiplication, and shift-left operations that
>>> were also used for unsigned arithmetic was apparently only becoming
>>> widespread in the early 1960s.  It's not an obvious idea.
>>
>>According to
>>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Draft_of_a_Report_on_the_EDVAC ,
>>John von Neumann suggested this in 1945.
>
>Von Neumann describes 2s-complement signed representation for
>fixed-point numbers scaled for the range -1<=x<1.

Dr. Atanasoff's ABC computer (1939) used two-complement 50-bit fixed
point integers.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#118471 — Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)

FromJohn Levine <johnl@taugh.com>
Date2026-10-04 19:38 +0000
SubjectRe: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)
Message-ID<119ua0i$1oil$1@gal.iecc.com>
In reply to#118452
It appears that Anton Ertl <anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at> said:
>Von Neumann's paper seems to have made quite a splash, so it's not
>clear why the computer architects of the 1950s went for sign/magnitude
>and 1s-complement representation of signed integers rather than
>2's-complement representation.

IBM's computers came out of their punchcard business, and I think that
deeply affected their thinking.  Punchcard equipment was all sign-magnitude
so that's what they did.

> [ Zuse machine ]
>We may see 2's-complement signed numbers in the handling of the
>exponent, which is described as having a range of "-64 to +63" (IEEE
>FP uses an excess-N representation rather than plain twos-complement;
>I am too lazy to look up the IBM 704).  The Z1 could not represent 0
>(hidden bit for all exponents), and in the Z3 he turned -64 into an
>exponent indicating zero.

704 float had an 8bit excess 128 exponent, sign magnitude, no hidden bit even
though they noted that the high fraction bit of a normalized number was always
1 other than 0.0 which was all zeros.

I think it's notable that even though we all know about two's complement, IEEE
floating point is sign-magnitude with special cases for zero and denormals. 

The PDP-6 and -10 had two's complement floating point in a format otherwise
similar to the 704's. It had the advantage that you could use fixed point
comparison instructions to compare normalized floats, but there was no hidden
bit which lost precision, and there was no way to do denormals.
-- 
Regards,
John Levine, johnl@taugh.com, Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies",
Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#118490 — Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)

Fromanton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl)
Date2026-10-06 07:30 +0000
SubjectRe: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)
Message-ID<2026Oct6.093013@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at>
In reply to#118471
John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> writes:
>It appears that Anton Ertl <anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at> said:
>>Von Neumann's paper seems to have made quite a splash, so it's not
>>clear why the computer architects of the 1950s went for sign/magnitude
>>and 1s-complement representation of signed integers rather than
>>2's-complement representation.
>
>IBM's computers came out of their punchcard business, and I think that
>deeply affected their thinking.  Punchcard equipment was all sign-magnitude
>so that's what they did.

Yes, for the commercial-computing lines I can believe that, and maybe
there was a spillover to the scientific-computing designers inside
IBM, and maybe similar things happened at the other companies.  But
this explanation does not work out for the CDC-6600, with its design
team separated from the rest of CDC, and their designers willing to go
new ways (and roughly at the same time when IBM was already working on
its 2s-complement architecture).

>I think it's notable that even though we all know about two's complement, IEEE
>floating point is sign-magnitude with special cases for zero and denormals. 
>
>The PDP-6 and -10 had two's complement floating point in a format otherwise
>similar to the 704's. It had the advantage that you could use fixed point
>comparison instructions to compare normalized floats, but there was no hidden
>bit which lost precision, and there was no way to do denormals.

There is a description at
<http://pdp10.nocrew.org/docs/instruction-set/Floating-Point.html>, which says:

|If S is one the sign is negative and the word is in twos complement format.

If the whole word is in 2's-complement format, then the exponent is
2's-complemented, too, and using 2s-complement integer comparison
works.

But then can the exponent and the mantissa be separated?  Can't there
a carry from the mantissa to the exponent when negating the word?
Actually, the carry only happens when the original mantissa is 0.
Without hidden bit this only happens if the whole number is 0
(mantissa 0, exponent 0, and sign 0), in which case the negation by
forming 2s-complement will produce 0, as it should be.

One cost of this representation is that the exponent of negative
numbers has to be 2's-complemented for processing, but the benefits
might be worth that; in particular, one can just implement addition
and subtraction of the sign-extended mantissa by doing the
corresponding 2's complement operations after the alignment step,
rather than deciding between addition and subtraction based on the
signs of the operands and the operation (which is not that expensive
in hardware, however).

Concerning denormal numbers, without hidden bit there should be no
problem in having denormal numbers in such a format.

Once we want to hide the top mantissa bit for normalized numbers, some
complications appear: Now there are non-0 numbers (representing
various powers of 2 and their negations) with all mantissa bits clear
where forming the 2s-complement would produce a carry into the
exponent, making it more work to separate mantissa and exponent.  I
can see why the PDP-6 designers did not want to go there and why the
designers of other FP formats (including the IEEE 754 committee)
preferred the hidden bit over 2s-complement FP.

OTOH, for formats without hidden bit, such as the 8087 80-bit format,
the case is less clear.  For the 8087, the reason probably was that it
should be compatible with the upcoming IEEE FP formats, which included
-0.

But maybe there is some solution that I don't see.  About a decade ago
someone (I forgot, who, sorry) wrote a posting here about
2s-complement FP, but I did not quite get it.  Maybe he has a solution
for the hidden bit.

- anton
-- 
'Anyone trying for "industrial quality" ISA should avoid undefined behavior.'
  Mitch Alsup, <c17fcd89-f024-40e7-a594-88a85ac10d20o@googlegroups.com>

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#118500 — Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)

FromJohn Levine <johnl@taugh.com>
Date2026-10-06 18:07 +0000
SubjectRe: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)
Message-ID<11a3ddi$1jl8$1@gal.iecc.com>
In reply to#118490
According to Anton Ertl <anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at>:
>>The PDP-6 and -10 had two's complement floating point in a format otherwise
>>similar to the 704's. It had the advantage that you could use fixed point
>>comparison instructions to compare normalized floats, but there was no hidden
>>bit which lost precision, and there was no way to do denormals.
>
>There is a description at

Here's the DEC manual: https://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/dec/pdp10/1982_ProcRefMan.pdf

>If the whole word is in 2's-complement format, then the exponent is
>2's-complemented, too, and using 2s-complement integer comparison
>works.
>
>But then can the exponent and the mantissa be separated?  Can't there
>a carry from the mantissa to the exponent when negating the word?

Not if it's normalized. The high fraction bit is always 1 unless the entire
number is zero, so when you negate it, the most that can happen is a carry into
that bit but not out of it. They note that the exponent of negative numbers is
one's complement but the hardware handles it for you. They warn that results of
arithmetic on numbers with a zero fraction and non-zero exponent may be wrong.
The largest negative number, the one with no positive equivalent, is an
unnormalized version of -1.0 so don't do that.

Dunno whether they did arithmetic by complementing negative inputs, doing
whatever, then if the result was negative, complemented it back, or if they 
had logic for the one's comp exponent and two's comp fractions.

>Concerning denormal numbers, without hidden bit there should be no
>problem in having denormal numbers in such a format.

You can represent unnormalized numbers, but comparisons using integer
instructions don't work. The manual makes it clear that if you try to do
floating arithmetic on unnormalized numbers, you'll be sorry unless you
really really know what you're doing.

>Once we want to hide the top mantissa bit for normalized numbers, some
>complications appear: Now there are non-0 numbers (representing
>various powers of 2 and their negations) with all mantissa bits clear
>where forming the 2s-complement would produce a carry into the
>exponent, making it more work to separate mantissa and exponent.   I
>can see why the PDP-6 designers did not want to go there and why the
>designers of other FP formats (including the IEEE 754 committee)
>preferred the hidden bit over 2s-complement FP.

Two's complement FP was a clever hack but a dead end for those reasons.
I don't see a plausible way to have a hidden bit, and the cost of
separate fixed and float comparisons seems low, particularly on
machines that have separate fix and float registers like x86 and 360.

-- 
Regards,
John Levine, johnl@taugh.com, Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies",
Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#118502 — Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)

Fromanton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl)
Date2026-10-06 21:17 +0000
SubjectRe: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)
Message-ID<2026Oct6.231726@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at>
In reply to#118500
John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> writes:
>According to Anton Ertl <anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at>:
>>But then can the exponent and the mantissa be separated?  Can't there
>>a carry from the mantissa to the exponent when negating the word?
>
>Not if it's normalized.

Actually not for any non-zero number, even denormal: It will have a 1
bit in the mantissa, and when forming the 2's complement, the carry
chain stops there.

>Dunno whether they did arithmetic by complementing negative inputs, doing
>whatever, then if the result was negative, complemented it back, or if they 
>had logic for the one's comp exponent and two's comp fractions.

In software, I would ones-complement the exponent of negative numbers,
align the mantissae, with appropriate sign extension, and then perform
the operation using 2s-complement arithmetic, finally normalize and
put the exponent back in.

In hardware, doing the sign-magnitude thing is probably not any
harder.

>You can represent unnormalized numbers, but comparisons using integer
>instructions don't work.

As long as all denormal numbers have the lowest exponent, like with
IEEE FP, it should work.

>I don't see a plausible way to have a hidden bit, and the cost of
>separate fixed and float comparisons seems low, particularly on
>machines that have separate fix and float registers like x86 and 360.

Negation of these FP numbers and of integers are also the same
operation.  But yes, the benefit is small.

- anton
-- 
'Anyone trying for "industrial quality" ISA should avoid undefined behavior.'
  Mitch Alsup, <c17fcd89-f024-40e7-a594-88a85ac10d20o@googlegroups.com>

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#118503 — Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)

FromTerje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no>
Date2026-10-06 23:30 +0200
SubjectRe: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)
Message-ID<11a3paf$2auvm$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#118500
John Levine wrote:
> According to Anton Ertl <anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at>:
>>> The PDP-6 and -10 had two's complement floating point in a format otherwise
>>> similar to the 704's. It had the advantage that you could use fixed point
>>> comparison instructions to compare normalized floats, but there was no hidden
>>> bit which lost precision, and there was no way to do denormals.
>>
>> There is a description at
> 
> Here's the DEC manual: https://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/dec/pdp10/1982_ProcRefMan.pdf
> 
>> If the whole word is in 2's-complement format, then the exponent is
>> 2's-complemented, too, and using 2s-complement integer comparison
>> works.
>>
>> But then can the exponent and the mantissa be separated?  Can't there
>> a carry from the mantissa to the exponent when negating the word?
> 
> Not if it's normalized. The high fraction bit is always 1 unless the entire
> number is zero, so when you negate it, the most that can happen is a carry into
> that bit but not out of it. They note that the exponent of negative numbers is
> one's complement but the hardware handles it for you. They warn that results of
> arithmetic on numbers with a zero fraction and non-zero exponent may be wrong.
> The largest negative number, the one with no positive equivalent, is an
> unnormalized version of -1.0 so don't do that.
> 
> Dunno whether they did arithmetic by complementing negative inputs, doing
> whatever, then if the result was negative, complemented it back, or if they
> had logic for the one's comp exponent and two's comp fractions.
> 
>> Concerning denormal numbers, without hidden bit there should be no
>> problem in having denormal numbers in such a format.
> 
> You can represent unnormalized numbers, but comparisons using integer
> instructions don't work. The manual makes it clear that if you try to do
> floating arithmetic on unnormalized numbers, you'll be sorry unless you
> really really know what you're doing.
> 
>> Once we want to hide the top mantissa bit for normalized numbers, some
>> complications appear: Now there are non-0 numbers (representing
>> various powers of 2 and their negations) with all mantissa bits clear
>> where forming the 2s-complement would produce a carry into the
>> exponent, making it more work to separate mantissa and exponent.   I
>> can see why the PDP-6 designers did not want to go there and why the
>> designers of other FP formats (including the IEEE 754 committee)
>> preferred the hidden bit over 2s-complement FP.
> 
> Two's complement FP was a clever hack but a dead end for those reasons.
> I don't see a plausible way to have a hidden bit, and the cost of
> separate fixed and float comparisons seems low, particularly on
> machines that have separate fix and float registers like x86 and 360.
> 
The cost of fp comparisons is _really_ minuscule, since (by design) if 
you start with an all-zero bitfield and keep incrementing it, you will 
(when viewed as an ieee 754 fp number) start at +0.0, then step over to 
the smallest possible subnormal number, iterate over all of those then 
pass transparently into normal numbers before finally hitting Infinity.

After Infinity you get a whole bunch of Not A Number (NAN) values, the 
key here is that all these define a total order.

In the same way, if you start by setting the top/sign bit before 
incrmenting, you will start at -0.0 and go all the way to -Infinity.

I.e the only difference between a fp and integer comparator lies in the 
need to detect any NaNs, all the rest can reuse all but the top bit of 
the integer comparator.

Terje

-- 
- <Terje.Mathisen at tmsw.no>
"almost all programming can be viewed as an exercise in caching"

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#118508 — Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)

FromThomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de>
Date2026-10-07 10:16 +0000
SubjectRe: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)
Message-ID<11a5652$2okl5$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#118503
Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> schrieb:

> I.e the only difference between a fp and integer comparator lies in the 
> need to detect any NaNs, all the rest can reuse all but the top bit of 
> the integer comparator.

#ifdef NITPICK

A one's complement integer comparator, +0.0 is equal to -0.0.

#endif

-- 
This USENET posting was made without artificial intelligence,
artificial impertinence, artificial arrogance, artificial stupidity,
artificial flavorings or artificial colorants.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#118516 — Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)

FromJohn Levine <johnl@taugh.com>
Date2026-10-07 19:53 +0000
SubjectRe: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)
Message-ID<11a67vp$4s0$1@gal.iecc.com>
In reply to#118508
According to Thomas Koenig  <tkoenig@netcologne.de>:
>Terje Mathisen <terje.mathisen@tmsw.no> schrieb:
>
>> I.e the only difference between a fp and integer comparator lies in the 
>> need to detect any NaNs, all the rest can reuse all but the top bit of 
>> the integer comparator.
>
>#ifdef NITPICK
>
>A one's complement integer comparator, +0.0 is equal to -0.0.
>
>#endif

You would think so, but you'd often be disappointed.

-- 
Regards,
John Levine, johnl@taugh.com, Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies",
Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#118445 — Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)

FromMitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid>
Date2026-10-03 23:49 +0000
SubjectRe: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)
Message-ID<1791071365-5857@newsgrouper.org>
In reply to#118429
anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) posted:

> John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> writes:
> >Even though the 704's regualar arithmetic was sign-magnitude, its
> >index arithmetic was two's complement subtraction.  People certainly
> >knew about two's complement, dunno why they stuck with one's comp so long.
> 
> My current theory is that 2's complement was known as a technique for
> subtracting unsigned numbers (and earlier using 10's complement for
> mechanical computing machines), and that was used just for unsigned
> numbers for quite a while on many computers, e.g., on the IBM 704 or
> the PDP-4.
> 
> The idea of interpreting numbers with set MSB as negative numbers by
> subtracting 2^n from their unsigned value, and relying on the
> properties of modular arithmetic to make this work with the same
> addition, subtraction, multiplication, and shift-left operations that
> were also used for unsigned arithmetic was apparently only becoming
> widespread in the early 1960s.  It's not an obvious idea.
> 
> Once that idea was widespread, people designed their new product lines
> with 2s-complement representation of signed numbers.
> 
> However, ones-complement is not obvious, either.  How did that become
> widespread?

When an integer adder was spread over several plug in logic boards,
the end-around carry of 1s-complement was no hinderance to ADD perf
(as it became when the whole data path was in one die).

1s-complment had MUL & DIV 2^n for free, and symmetrical ± ranges.
 
> - anton

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#118447 — Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)

FromJohn Levine <johnl@taugh.com>
Date2026-10-04 01:04 +0000
SubjectRe: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)
Message-ID<119s8mo$sl2$1@gal.iecc.com>
In reply to#118445
According to MitchAlsup  <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid>:
>> Once that idea was widespread, people designed their new product lines
>> with 2s-complement representation of signed numbers.
>> 
>> However, ones-complement is not obvious, either.  How did that become
>> widespread?
>
>When an integer adder was spread over several plug in logic boards,
>the end-around carry of 1s-complement was no hinderance to ADD perf
>(as it became when the whole data path was in one die).
>
>1s-complment had MUL & DIV 2^n for free, and symmetrical ± ranges.

Indeed, but it has two representations of zero, which is a pain to
program around.  I guess in that era extra code to save a flip-flop
was considered reasonable.

-- 
Regards,
John Levine, johnl@taugh.com, Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies",
Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#118451 — Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)

FromThomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de>
Date2026-10-04 07:47 +0000
SubjectRe: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)
Message-ID<119t0bc$3n1po$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#118445
MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> schrieb:

> When an integer adder was spread over several plug in logic boards,
> the end-around carry of 1s-complement was no hinderance to ADD perf
> (as it became when the whole data path was in one die).

I think that end-arround carry has to be propagated.  Wouldn't this
have a significant impact on performance?

-- 
This USENET posting was made without artificial intelligence,
artificial impertinence, artificial arrogance, artificial stupidity,
artificial flavorings or artificial colorants.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#118467 — Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)

FromMitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid>
Date2026-10-04 18:02 +0000
SubjectRe: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)
Message-ID<1791136946-5857@newsgrouper.org>
In reply to#118451
Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> posted:

> MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> schrieb:
> 
> > When an integer adder was spread over several plug in logic boards,
> > the end-around carry of 1s-complement was no hinderance to ADD perf
> > (as it became when the whole data path was in one die).
> 
> I think that end-arround carry has to be propagated.  Wouldn't this
> have a significant impact on performance?

In multi-board design, there is no gate-delay difference between {1's
and 2's}-complement add time.

In single die design, getting carry out from the top of the adder and
back into the bottom has visible wire delay -- where visible means it
hurts in a significant way. So, 1's complement suffers compared to 2's
complement.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#119009 — Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)

FromStephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid>
Date2026-11-02 09:45 -0800
SubjectRe: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)
Message-ID<11cai8f$32ue7$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#118445
On 10/3/2026 4:49 PM, MitchAlsup wrote:
> 
> anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) posted:
> 
>> John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> writes:
>>> Even though the 704's regualar arithmetic was sign-magnitude, its
>>> index arithmetic was two's complement subtraction.  People certainly
>>> knew about two's complement, dunno why they stuck with one's comp so long.
>>
>> My current theory is that 2's complement was known as a technique for
>> subtracting unsigned numbers (and earlier using 10's complement for
>> mechanical computing machines), and that was used just for unsigned
>> numbers for quite a while on many computers, e.g., on the IBM 704 or
>> the PDP-4.
>>
>> The idea of interpreting numbers with set MSB as negative numbers by
>> subtracting 2^n from their unsigned value, and relying on the
>> properties of modular arithmetic to make this work with the same
>> addition, subtraction, multiplication, and shift-left operations that
>> were also used for unsigned arithmetic was apparently only becoming
>> widespread in the early 1960s.  It's not an obvious idea.
>>
>> Once that idea was widespread, people designed their new product lines
>> with 2s-complement representation of signed numbers.
>>
>> However, ones-complement is not obvious, either.  How did that become
>> widespread?
> 
> When an integer adder was spread over several plug in logic boards,
> the end-around carry of 1s-complement was no hinderance to ADD perf
> (as it became when the whole data path was in one die).
> 
> 1s-complment had MUL & DIV 2^n for free, and symmetrical ± ranges.
I remembered someone telling me that, in the technology of the day 
(individual transistors on plug in logic cards) that for the Univac 
1107, ones complement was faster, but I couldn't find a reference for 
that.  I was talking about this with another Univac "old timer", and he 
sent me a paper copy of a talk given at the 25th anniversary USE 
conference (the Univac user's group) titled "Why it is the way it is", 
by Ron Q Smith, then a long time and well respected Univac employee.  It 
goes through the requirement by the military for 36 bit words, due to 
needing eight digits of floating point precision, rather than the 6 
digits that 32 bits would provide and mentions that other computers of 
the day such as the IBM 7090 and 7094, GE systems and PDP 10 that used 
36 bits. It then goes on to make an argument that I hadn't heard before.

"Scientists and engineers demanded both precision and mathematical 
consistency."  The result was both the 36 bit word and the use of 
mathematical representation that provided complete symmetry of positive 
and negative numbers. All of these machines used a numeric 
representation that had an equal number of positive and negative numbers 
and had both plus and minus zeros.  These requirements are still present 
today in the form of the IEEE floating point standard.  The IBM , GE and 
DEC machines used a signed-magnitude representation in which the sign 
bit was just that/  The Sperry Rand Univac systems used a 
ones-complement representation because it permitted faster addition and 
subtraction with less hardware.  A complement cycle was not needed for 
most operations."

Of course, the paper doesn't explain why the requirement for symmetry 
seemed to go away and two's complement became acceptable.



-- 
  - Stephen Fuld
(e-mail address disguised to prevent spam)

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#119010 — Re: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)

FromStephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid>
Date2026-11-02 10:12 -0800
SubjectRe: two's complement and Flags (Re: arithmetic and endian history)
Message-ID<11cajr1$33lba$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#119009
On 11/2/2026 9:45 AM, Stephen Fuld wrote:
> On 10/3/2026 4:49 PM, MitchAlsup wrote:
>>
>> anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) posted:
>>
>>> John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> writes:
>>>> Even though the 704's regualar arithmetic was sign-magnitude, its
>>>> index arithmetic was two's complement subtraction.  People certainly
>>>> knew about two's complement, dunno why they stuck with one's comp so 
>>>> long.
>>>
>>> My current theory is that 2's complement was known as a technique for
>>> subtracting unsigned numbers (and earlier using 10's complement for
>>> mechanical computing machines), and that was used just for unsigned
>>> numbers for quite a while on many computers, e.g., on the IBM 704 or
>>> the PDP-4.
>>>
>>> The idea of interpreting numbers with set MSB as negative numbers by
>>> subtracting 2^n from their unsigned value, and relying on the
>>> properties of modular arithmetic to make this work with the same
>>> addition, subtraction, multiplication, and shift-left operations that
>>> were also used for unsigned arithmetic was apparently only becoming
>>> widespread in the early 1960s.  It's not an obvious idea.
>>>
>>> Once that idea was widespread, people designed their new product lines
>>> with 2s-complement representation of signed numbers.
>>>
>>> However, ones-complement is not obvious, either.  How did that become
>>> widespread?
>>
>> When an integer adder was spread over several plug in logic boards,
>> the end-around carry of 1s-complement was no hinderance to ADD perf
>> (as it became when the whole data path was in one die).
>>
>> 1s-complment had MUL & DIV 2^n for free, and symmetrical ± ranges.
> I remembered someone telling me that, in the technology of the day 
> (individual transistors on plug in logic cards) that for the Univac 
> 1107, ones complement was faster, but I couldn't find a reference for 
> that.  I was talking about this with another Univac "old timer", and he 
> sent me a paper copy of a talk given at the 25th anniversary USE 
> conference (the Univac user's group)

Again, I apologize for the self follow-up, but it was the 35th (not 
25th) anniversary conference Nov 5-9 1990.


-- 
  - Stephen Fuld
(e-mail address disguised to prevent spam)

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


Page 14 of 30 — ← Prev page 1 … 12 13 [14] 15 16 … 30  Next page →

Back to top | Article view | comp.arch


csiph-web