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Groups > comp.arch.embedded > #30035 > unrolled thread
| Started by | Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2020-10-29 20:17 -0700 |
| Last post | 2020-11-18 03:20 -0800 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 81 — 23 participants |
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Good Hardware Tools Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-10-29 20:17 -0700
Re: Good Hardware Tools Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2020-10-29 23:52 -0700
Re: Good Hardware Tools Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2020-10-30 10:19 +0000
Re: Good Hardware Tools Chris <xxx.syseng.yyy@gfsys.co.uk> - 2020-10-31 00:21 +0000
Re: Good Hardware Tools Dave Nadler <drn@nadler.com> - 2020-10-30 17:56 -0700
Re: Good Hardware Tools Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-10-30 20:40 -0700
Re: Good Hardware Tools Philip Martel <pmartel@alum.mit.edu> - 2020-10-31 14:54 -0400
Re: Good Hardware Tools Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-11-04 20:13 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools kegs@provalid.com (Kent Dickey) - 2020-11-13 17:10 -0600
Re: Good Hardware Tools Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-11-15 19:43 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools Brett <ggtgp@yahoo.com> - 2020-11-16 19:31 +0000
Re: Good Hardware Tools Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-11-17 01:50 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools Stef <stef33d@yahooI-N-V-A-L-I-D.com.invalid> - 2020-11-17 11:14 +0100
Re: Good Hardware Tools Brett <ggtgp@yahoo.com> - 2020-11-18 04:14 +0000
Re: Good Hardware Tools George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2020-11-17 12:05 -0500
Re: Good Hardware Tools Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2020-11-17 10:06 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2020-11-17 16:02 -0500
Re: Good Hardware Tools Jim Jackson <jj@franjam.org.uk> - 2020-11-17 22:28 +0000
Re: Good Hardware Tools David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-11-18 11:11 +0100
Re: Good Hardware Tools Tauno Voipio <tauno.voipio@notused.fi.invalid> - 2020-11-18 12:40 +0200
Re: Good Hardware Tools Niklas Holsti <niklas.holsti@tidorum.invalid> - 2020-11-18 14:51 +0200
Re: Good Hardware Tools Hans-Bernhard Bröker <HBBroeker@t-online.de> - 2020-11-18 21:46 +0100
Re: Good Hardware Tools David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-11-18 22:29 +0100
Re: Good Hardware Tools Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2020-11-18 12:45 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools Tom Gardner <spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2020-11-18 21:08 +0000
Re: Good Hardware Tools Hans-Bernhard Bröker <HBBroeker@t-online.de> - 2020-11-19 00:35 +0100
Re: Good Hardware Tools Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> - 2020-11-18 16:12 -0500
Re: Good Hardware Tools Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-11-18 17:30 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2020-11-18 23:36 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools Jim Jackson <jj@franjam.org.uk> - 2020-11-19 22:31 +0000
Re: Good Hardware Tools Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2020-11-19 14:43 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools Jim Jackson <jj@franjam.org.uk> - 2020-11-20 22:13 +0000
Re: Good Hardware Tools Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2020-11-20 18:01 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools James Brakefield <jim.brakefield@ieee.org> - 2020-11-21 11:39 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-11-18 03:15 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-11-17 22:25 +0100
Re: Good Hardware Tools Dave Nadler <drn@nadler.com> - 2020-11-17 16:30 -0500
Re: Good Hardware Tools Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2020-11-17 14:18 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools "Mat Nieuwenhoven" <mnieuw@zap.a2000.nl> - 2020-11-23 13:39 +0100
Re: Good Hardware Tools Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-11-23 07:49 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools "Mat Nieuwenhoven" <mnieuw@zap.a2000.nl> - 2020-11-24 08:53 +0100
Re: Good Hardware Tools Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-11-24 10:46 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2020-11-24 13:46 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools "Mat Nieuwenhoven" <mnieuw@zap.a2000.nl> - 2020-11-27 08:11 +0100
Re: Good Hardware Tools Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-11-27 06:58 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2020-11-27 10:17 -0500
Re: Good Hardware Tools Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-11-27 08:04 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools "Mat Nieuwenhoven" <mnieuw@zap.a2000.nl> - 2020-11-28 17:04 +0100
Re: Good Hardware Tools Don Y <blockedofcourse@foo.invalid> - 2020-11-28 09:54 -0700
Re: Good Hardware Tools Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-11-28 09:05 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools "Mat Nieuwenhoven" <mnieuw@zap.a2000.nl> - 2020-11-29 17:30 +0100
Re: Good Hardware Tools Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-11-29 11:10 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools "Mat Nieuwenhoven" <mnieuw@zap.a2000.nl> - 2020-11-30 08:19 +0100
Re: Good Hardware Tools Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-11-30 07:46 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools "Mat Nieuwenhoven" <mnieuw@zap.a2000.nl> - 2020-12-06 17:55 +0100
Re: Good Hardware Tools Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-12-06 15:04 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools Mat Nieuwenhoven <mnieuw@zap.a2000.nl> - 2021-01-03 11:03 +0000
Re: Good Hardware Tools Brett <ggtgp@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-04 09:03 +0000
Re: Good Hardware Tools Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2021-01-04 04:09 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools Mat Nieuwenhoven <mnieuw@zap.a2000.nl> - 2021-01-04 21:57 +0000
Re: Good Hardware Tools Don Y <blockedofcourse@foo.invalid> - 2021-01-04 02:55 -0700
Re: Good Hardware Tools Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2020-11-28 20:53 +0000
Re: Good Hardware Tools Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-11-28 15:16 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2020-11-28 20:57 -0500
Re: Good Hardware Tools Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-11-28 18:07 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools Tauno Voipio <tauno.voipio@notused.fi.invalid> - 2020-11-29 10:43 +0200
Re: Good Hardware Tools Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-11-29 11:00 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools "Mat Nieuwenhoven" <mnieuw@zap.a2000.nl> - 2020-11-30 08:01 +0100
Re: Good Hardware Tools Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-11-30 07:40 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools Chris <xxx.syseng.yyy@gfsys.co.uk> - 2020-11-30 15:41 +0000
Re: Good Hardware Tools "Mat Nieuwenhoven" <mnieuw@zap.a2000.nl> - 2020-11-29 15:22 +0100
Re: Good Hardware Tools Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-11-29 11:04 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools Don Y <blockedofcourse@foo.invalid> - 2020-11-29 14:46 -0700
Re: Good Hardware Tools "Mat Nieuwenhoven" <mnieuw@zap.a2000.nl> - 2020-11-29 15:11 +0100
Re: Good Hardware Tools Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2020-11-29 23:24 +0000
Re: Good Hardware Tools Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-11-29 17:57 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools "Mat Nieuwenhoven" <mnieuw@zap.a2000.nl> - 2020-11-30 08:32 +0100
Re: Good Hardware Tools Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-11-30 08:03 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2020-11-16 13:13 -0800
Re: Good Hardware Tools kegs@provalid.com (Kent Dickey) - 2020-11-17 22:56 -0600
Re: Good Hardware Tools Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-11-18 03:20 -0800
Page 2 of 5 — ← Prev page 1 [2] 3 4 5 Next page →
| From | Niklas Holsti <niklas.holsti@tidorum.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2020-11-18 14:51 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <i1kjn7Fk1kbU1@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #30085 |
On 2020-11-18 12:40, Tauno Voipio wrote:
> On 18.11.20 12.11, David Brown wrote:
...
>>
>> But AFAIK only the USA has Fahrenheit (and other non-metric units) as
>> standard.
>
>
> The US Congress decided in 1866 to go metric - a little
> sluggish implementation.
Sometimes described by saying that the "US is inching its way towards
the metric system."
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| From | Hans-Bernhard Bröker <HBBroeker@t-online.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2020-11-18 21:46 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <3ec91532-81f3-ef40-2925-f2fcf0920006@t-online.de> |
| In reply to | #30088 |
Am 18.11.2020 um 13:51 schrieb Niklas Holsti: > Sometimes described by saying that the "US is inching its way towards > the metric system." The term "inching" may no longer really doing it justice. Let's do some (metric) math on this. The total of the borders and coastlines of the mainland USA is roughly twenty thousand miles, or 32 thousand kilometers. And it has been 154 years since that decision. So to travel around the entire mainland US since then, the average speed would have been, roughly: 208 km per year, 570 meters per day, or 24 meters per hour For comparison a turtle is reported to be going 330 m/h. It could thus have run circles around the mainland U.S. Like: literally 15 times around. Or, speaking of "sluggish": an actual slug (i.e. a garden-variety snail) can clock in at around 3 m/h. That's fast enough for it to have "run" the entire U.S.-Mexico border in that time faster than the U.S.A. took to cross from the silly to the sane side of same. It's a paradox: a country that was founded on the very principle of abolishing, with prejudice, everything British is now just about the last one on earth still sticking to these fundamentally British Imperial(!) units --- except Great Britain itself. Who in turn just won't agree with the French on anything if they can possibly help it.
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| From | David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2020-11-18 22:29 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <rp43od$47l$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #30090 |
On 18/11/2020 21:46, Hans-Bernhard Bröker wrote: > Am 18.11.2020 um 13:51 schrieb Niklas Holsti: > >> Sometimes described by saying that the "US is inching its way towards >> the metric system." > > The term "inching" may no longer really doing it justice. Let's do some > (metric) math on this. The total of the borders and coastlines of the > mainland USA is roughly twenty thousand miles, or 32 thousand > kilometers. And it has been 154 years since that decision. > > So to travel around the entire mainland US since then, the average speed > would have been, roughly: > > 208 km per year, > 570 meters per day, or > 24 meters per hour > > For comparison a turtle is reported to be going 330 m/h. It could thus > have run circles around the mainland U.S. Like: literally 15 times around. > > Or, speaking of "sluggish": an actual slug (i.e. a garden-variety snail) > can clock in at around 3 m/h. That's fast enough for it to have "run" > the entire U.S.-Mexico border in that time faster than the U.S.A. took > to cross from the silly to the sane side of same. > > It's a paradox: a country that was founded on the very principle of > abolishing, with prejudice, everything British is now just about the > last one on earth still sticking to these fundamentally British > Imperial(!) units --- except Great Britain itself. Who in turn just > won't agree with the French on anything if they can possibly help it. That's not /quite/ accurate. Amongst the things that the Americans disagreed on was spelling - but it wasn't the Americans that changed words like "colour" and "neighbour". It was the British who changed them - by adding some unnecessary extra vowels to make the words look more French-like. And the UK has long ago given up on imperial units for anything where accuracy is relevant.
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| From | Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2020-11-18 12:45 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <87lfeyo0lh.fsf@nightsong.com> |
| In reply to | #30084 |
David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> writes: > But AFAIK only the USA has Fahrenheit (and other non-metric units) as > standard. Automotive speed limits in every country I've visited are posted in miles per hour or kilometers per hour. Metric units would of course be meters per second (100 km/hour is about 28 m/sec). Me, I support switching to the FFF (Furlong-Firkin-Fortnight) system. For example, the speed of light is about 1.8e12 furlongs per fortnight. ;-)
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| From | Tom Gardner <spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2020-11-18 21:08 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <h3gtH.41177$b5kb.20590@fx15.ams4> |
| In reply to | #30089 |
On 18/11/20 20:45, Paul Rubin wrote: > David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> writes: >> But AFAIK only the USA has Fahrenheit (and other non-metric units) as >> standard. > > Automotive speed limits in every country I've visited are posted in > miles per hour or kilometers per hour. Metric units would of course be > meters per second (100 km/hour is about 28 m/sec). > > Me, I support switching to the FFF (Furlong-Firkin-Fortnight) system. > For example, the speed of light is about 1.8e12 furlongs per fortnight. > > ;-) > I rather like pi seconds = 1 nanocentury, to about 0.4%. "I'll just be a few nanocenturies, dear".
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| From | Hans-Bernhard Bröker <HBBroeker@t-online.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2020-11-19 00:35 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <i1lpebFrb39U1@mid.dfncis.de> |
| In reply to | #30091 |
Am 18.11.2020 um 22:08 schrieb Tom Gardner: > I rather like pi seconds = 1 nanocentury, to about 0.4%. And the speed of about one nano-lightyear per month is what you need to complete a 3-hour Marathon.
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| From | Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2020-11-18 16:12 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <9927a449-88b0-c087-24e0-a241fc20c656@electrooptical.net> |
| In reply to | #30089 |
On 11/18/20 3:45 PM, Paul Rubin wrote: > David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> writes: >> But AFAIK only the USA has Fahrenheit (and other non-metric units) as >> standard. > > Automotive speed limits in every country I've visited are posted in > miles per hour or kilometers per hour. Metric units would of course be > meters per second (100 km/hour is about 28 m/sec). > > Me, I support switching to the FFF (Furlong-Firkin-Fortnight) system. > For example, the speed of light is about 1.8e12 furlongs per fortnight. > > ;-) > And one attoparsec equals one decifoot to engineering accuracy, proving once again (if any more were needed) that God is an Englishman. The original definition of the metre was 10**-7 of the distance from the Equator to North Pole measured along the meridian of Paris. Both ends of that line are at sea, of course, like so many other French initiatives. ;) Cheers Phil Hobbs -- Dr Philip C D Hobbs Principal Consultant ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics Briarcliff Manor NY 10510 http://electrooptical.net http://hobbs-eo.com
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| From | Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2020-11-18 17:30 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <704bef5b-b198-4c7d-bfa9-02e2d6855816n@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #30089 |
On Wednesday, November 18, 2020 at 3:45:52 PM UTC-5, Paul Rubin wrote: > David Brown <david...@hesbynett.no> writes: > > But AFAIK only the USA has Fahrenheit (and other non-metric units) as > > standard. > Automotive speed limits in every country I've visited are posted in > miles per hour or kilometers per hour. Metric units would of course be > meters per second (100 km/hour is about 28 m/sec). > > Me, I support switching to the FFF (Furlong-Firkin-Fortnight) system. > For example, the speed of light is about 1.8e12 furlongs per fortnight. I c. -- Rick C. --+ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging --+ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209
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| From | Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2020-11-18 23:36 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <87h7plol1e.fsf@nightsong.com> |
| In reply to | #30095 |
Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> writes: > I c. I'm sorry, the number you have dialed is an imaginary number. If you think you have received this recording in error, please rotate your phone by 90 degrees and try your call again.
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| From | Jim Jackson <jj@franjam.org.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2020-11-19 22:31 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <slrnrrdsha.fif.jj@iridium.wf32df> |
| In reply to | #30089 |
On 2020-11-18, Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> wrote: > David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> writes: >> But AFAIK only the USA has Fahrenheit (and other non-metric units) as >> standard. > > Automotive speed limits in every country I've visited are posted in > miles per hour or kilometers per hour. Metric units would of course be > meters per second (100 km/hour is about 28 m/sec). > Actually not true. Kilometres are metric. Perhaps you are getting confused with the measurements in MKS system?
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| From | Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2020-11-19 14:43 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <87d009nf1k.fsf@nightsong.com> |
| In reply to | #30097 |
Jim Jackson <jj@franjam.org.uk> writes: > Actually not true. Kilometres are metric. Perhaps you are getting > confused with the measurements in MKS system? Hours are not metric, or at least are not SI. I can go with kilometers per second but those numbers would inconveniently small. MKS and CGS have been obsolete for decades.
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| From | Jim Jackson <jj@franjam.org.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2020-11-20 22:13 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <slrnrrgfsf.e28.jj@iridium.wf32df> |
| In reply to | #30098 |
On 2020-11-19, Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> wrote: > Jim Jackson <jj@franjam.org.uk> writes: >> Actually not true. Kilometres are metric. Perhaps you are getting >> confused with the measurements in MKS system? > > Hours are not metric, or at least are not SI. As we do not use Kiloseconds or Megaseconds, Hours as the accepted and understood multiple of seconds is a suitable standin, if not SI. Kilometres / Hour is the metric equivalent of Miles / Hour. Or are just being a pretty boring pedant, and probably wrong at that? Or am I missing a joke?
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| From | Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2020-11-20 18:01 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <878savo4dd.fsf@nightsong.com> |
| In reply to | #30111 |
Jim Jackson <jj@franjam.org.uk> writes: > As we do not use Kiloseconds or Megaseconds, Hours as the accepted and > understood multiple of seconds is a suitable standin, if not SI. > Kilometres / Hour is the metric equivalent of Miles / Hour. > Or are just being a pretty boring pedant, and probably wrong at that? > Or am I missing a joke? It's partly a joke and partly pointing out the silliness of those who ridicule the US for not using metric. Kiloseconds and megaseconds are metric units of time, hours are not. Yet people (even in supposedly metric countries) use hours because they are comfortable human units. Those countries use meters and hours, so they are only partially metric. In the US we do the same thing, but even further. We also use hours (3.6 kiloseconds), but it also uses feet and inches (inch = 2.54 centimeters). People from other countries who act superior about this should get their own house in order (i.e. switch from hours, days, years to kiloseconds, megaseconds, etc.) before complaining about ours. 1 year = 31.5 megaseconds, 1 century = 3.15 gigaseconds. Let me know when you have updated all your history books to use those units.
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| From | James Brakefield <jim.brakefield@ieee.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2020-11-21 11:39 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <c31b2945-a554-4c99-bdc9-000dd9208dd3n@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #30113 |
On Friday, November 20, 2020 at 8:01:07 PM UTC-6, Paul Rubin wrote: > Jim Jackson <j...@franjam.org.uk> writes: > > As we do not use Kiloseconds or Megaseconds, Hours as the accepted and > > understood multiple of seconds is a suitable standin, if not SI. > > Kilometres / Hour is the metric equivalent of Miles / Hour. > > Or are just being a pretty boring pedant, and probably wrong at that? > > Or am I missing a joke? > It's partly a joke and partly pointing out the silliness of those who > ridicule the US for not using metric. Kiloseconds and megaseconds are > metric units of time, hours are not. Yet people (even in supposedly > metric countries) use hours because they are comfortable human units. > Those countries use meters and hours, so they are only partially metric. > > In the US we do the same thing, but even further. We also use hours > (3.6 kiloseconds), but it also uses feet and inches (inch = 2.54 > centimeters). People from other countries who act superior about this > should get their own house in order (i.e. switch from hours, days, years > to kiloseconds, megaseconds, etc.) before complaining about ours. 1 > year = 31.5 megaseconds, 1 century = 3.15 gigaseconds. Let me know when > you have updated all your history books to use those units. Given that the computers which operate our banks, do GPS positioning and coordinate time zones all use binary, expect some day for AI to impose: 2**20 meters between the north pole and the equator, 32 inches per meter, 32 millimetres per per inch. 2**16 seconds per day with 64 seconds/minute and 64 minutes per hour ... E.g. the English got it somewhat right: pints, quarts, gallons. The French went decimal and now decimal is not cool.
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| From | Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2020-11-18 03:15 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <b2b9a612-91a6-4a21-96c2-6f9e8154b346n@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #30081 |
On Tuesday, November 17, 2020 at 5:28:23 PM UTC-5, Jim Jackson wrote: > > And they maintain -5..+5 degrees Fahrenheit - not exactly "sub zero" > > as the name implies, but way below freezing. > Funny, to me "sub-zero" just means below freezing. I have to really > try and remember what temperature, Fahrenheit, water freezes at! > > Anybody know of any other countries than the USA that habitually use > Fahrenheit? I'm just curious. The UK used to, and no doubt there are > many "older" UK people who still use it - but all weather reports etc > give temp. in centigrade. We don't use Fahrenheit in the US, we abuse it. -- Rick C. ++ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging ++ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209
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| From | David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2020-11-17 22:25 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <rp1f41$45h$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #30076 |
On 17/11/2020 19:06, Paul Rubin wrote: > George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> writes: >> That's the scam: energy efficient appliances often have critical >> components that are under specified for the load ... > > That's an interesting point. However, regarding fridges and > particularly freezers, there's another avenue to energy efficiency: > apparently the chest type units are way more efficient than the type > with a front door, even if the door stays closed most of the time. They > do a better job of keeping heat out, so the motor doesn't have to run > nearly as much. I don't know whether more insulation could do the same > thing for a front loading design. > I believe it's basically a case of hot air rising, cold air falling - it means the cold air stays in better. And this is particularly true when the door is opened - with a standard fridge, cold air starts falling out rather quickly. I read somewhere that a Japanese manufacturer had invented a fridge (with standard door and size) used about a quarter of the energy on average, measured in real use in a home over a period of time. The breakthrough was to have a transparent door, so that people don't open the fridge to see what is inside. I thought that was a fine example of thinking outside the box!
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| From | Dave Nadler <drn@nadler.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2020-11-17 16:30 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <ac81b703-0785-d6b8-5516-b7800cbeb3f1@nadler.com> |
| In reply to | #30078 |
On 11/17/2020 4:25 PM, David Brown wrote: > I thought that was a fine example of thinking outside the box! Nah, inside the box was just too cold.
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| From | Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2020-11-17 14:18 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <87k0ujaaq8.fsf@nightsong.com> |
| In reply to | #30078 |
David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> writes: > I believe it's basically a case of hot air rising, cold air falling - it > means the cold air stays in better. And this is particularly true when > the door is opened - with a standard fridge, cold air starts falling out > rather quickly. The interior volume of the freezer part of a standard fridge might be around 50L, which would make the air mass inside around 60 grams. So even if all the cold air escapes instantly, that's fairly little heat getting in, compared to the heat capacity of the other stuff in the freezer, i.e. around 4 kg of ice in the case of my experiment with the pot full of water. The fridge part might be more like 200L so I'd agree that the heat entering from opening the door several times a day could be substantial. It still seems to me that better insulation around the freezer would help. When I did the thing with the pot of water, I checked on it maybe 1x-2x day, not so much in the scheme of things. The heat was getting in through the insulation, not from opening the door.
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| From | "Mat Nieuwenhoven" <mnieuw@zap.a2000.nl> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2020-11-23 13:39 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <zavrhjmncnay.qk9ihu0.pminews@nntp.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #30071 |
On Mon, 16 Nov 2020 19:31:28 -0000 (UTC), Brett wrote: <snip> >> In the winter I might have to turn off the HP during my electricity peak >> billing time and in the summer I'd have to chill the house in the AM to >> keep the temperatures down in the afternoon. lol, just kidding of >> course, but they do use a lot of power which gets turned into heat. At >> this moment, the laptop is the highest power drain that's running. I'd >> like to keep it that way. Heck, I'm considering replacing my fridge >> because the web says buying a new one will save enough electricity to pay >> for itself in five years or less. It's 30 years old too. >> > >The new fridge will fail in 5 years, planned obsolescence. >And the cost to run for your old fridge is a lie to get you to buy a new >one. It can really save money. My 21 year old 210/85L cool/freeze Bosch fridge failed, and it used 270 kWh/a (measured with an energy meter). And that one was for its time very efficient, 6 cm think walls of the cooling section. It needed one electronic repair on those 21 years. The replacement Liebherr, slightly larger inside, saves about 130 kWh/a . I fully expect it to last 20 years. Depending on your electricity price, it might not be a good idea to keep an old fridge running. Mat Nieuwenhoven
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| From | Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2020-11-23 07:49 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <8f7f64c7-4ae9-406a-822d-10f707580456n@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #30127 |
On Monday, November 23, 2020 at 7:39:35 AM UTC-5, Mat Nieuwenhoven wrote: > On Mon, 16 Nov 2020 19:31:28 -0000 (UTC), Brett wrote: > > <snip> > >> In the winter I might have to turn off the HP during my electricity peak > >> billing time and in the summer I'd have to chill the house in the AM to > >> keep the temperatures down in the afternoon. lol, just kidding of > >> course, but they do use a lot of power which gets turned into heat. At > >> this moment, the laptop is the highest power drain that's running. I'd > >> like to keep it that way. Heck, I'm considering replacing my fridge > >> because the web says buying a new one will save enough electricity to pay > >> for itself in five years or less. It's 30 years old too. > >> > > > >The new fridge will fail in 5 years, planned obsolescence. > >And the cost to run for your old fridge is a lie to get you to buy a new > >one. > > It can really save money. My 21 year old 210/85L cool/freeze Bosch > fridge failed, and it used 270 kWh/a (measured with an energy meter). > And that one was for its time very efficient, 6 cm think walls of the > cooling section. It needed one electronic repair on those 21 years. > The replacement Liebherr, slightly larger inside, saves about 130 > kWh/a . I fully expect it to last 20 years. > > Depending on your electricity price, it might not be a good idea to > keep an old fridge running. > > Mat Nieuwenhoven What is kWh/a? Is that per year? The marginal cost of 130 kWh to me is hard to estimate as I'm on ToU metering so it varies from $0.08 per kWh to $0.33 per kWh. The lower bound for the electricity savings would be $10.40 per year. That's not very much. An average cost considering the time duration of the peak charges would be about twice that amount. If I could find a reliable timing device I would have the fridge not run during the expensive peak times. The longest peak time is 4 hours and I fully expect the temperature to not increase significantly in that time. When the AC turns off the house warms up by 2-3°F. I expect the fridge would rise a lesser amount given the very good insulation they now have. -- Rick C. -+- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging -+- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209
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