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Groups > alt.usage.english > #577268 > unrolled thread
| Started by | David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2015-12-26 12:18 -0800 |
| Last post | 2015-12-28 20:10 +1100 |
| Articles | 4 on this page of 164 — 34 participants |
Back to article view | Back to alt.usage.english
White Privilege David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2015-12-26 12:18 -0800
Re: White Privilege Horace LaBadie <hlabadie@nospam.com> - 2015-12-26 15:46 -0500
Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-26 17:58 -0330
Re: White Privilege Harrison Hill <harrisonhill2345@gmail.com> - 2015-12-26 14:12 -0800
Re: White Privilege Helen Lacedaemonian <helenofsunnyvale@gmail.com> - 2015-12-26 23:50 -0800
Re: White Privilege Helen Lacedaemonian <helenofsunnyvale@gmail.com> - 2015-12-26 23:48 -0800
Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-27 06:58 -0330
Re: White Privilege "Don Phillipson" <e925@SPAMBLOCK.ncf.ca> - 2015-12-27 08:46 -0500
Re: White Privilege Jerry Friedman <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-27 08:32 -0800
Re: White Privilege Jerry Friedman <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-27 08:49 -0800
Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-27 10:40 -0800
Re: White Privilege Jerry Friedman <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-27 10:57 -0800
Re: White Privilege Rich Ulrich <rich.ulrich@comcast.net> - 2015-12-27 20:20 -0500
Re: White Privilege spuorgelgoog@gowanhill.com - 2015-12-27 12:16 -0800
Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-27 13:19 -0800
Re: White Privilege charles <charles@candehope.me.uk> - 2015-12-27 21:49 +0000
Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-27 14:06 -0800
Re: White Privilege James Hogg <Jas.Hogg@gOUTmail.com> - 2015-12-27 23:15 +0100
Re: White Privilege charles <charles@candehope.me.uk> - 2015-12-27 22:20 +0000
Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-27 20:34 -0800
Re: White Privilege Janet <nobody@home.org> - 2015-12-28 12:27 +0000
Re: White Privilege richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Richard Tobin) - 2015-12-28 19:29 +0000
Re: White Privilege "Peter Duncanson [BrE]" <mail@peterduncanson.net> - 2015-12-28 22:15 +0000
Re: White Privilege charles <charles@candehope.me.uk> - 2015-12-27 22:26 +0000
Re: White Privilege Tony Cooper <tonycooper214@gmail.com> - 2015-12-27 20:06 -0500
Re: White Privilege wollman@bimajority.org (Garrett Wollman) - 2015-12-28 01:34 +0000
Re: White Privilege John Dawkins <artfldodgr@aol.com> - 2015-12-28 10:26 -0800
Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-27 20:40 -0800
Re: White Privilege Horace LaBadie <hlabadie@nospam.com> - 2015-12-28 01:54 -0500
Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-28 04:18 -0800
Re: White Privilege Horace LaBadie <hlabadie@nospam.com> - 2015-12-28 09:05 -0500
Re: White Privilege Horace LaBadie <hlabadie@nospam.com> - 2015-12-28 11:59 -0500
Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-28 11:39 -0800
Re: White Privilege Horace LaBadie <hlabadie@nospam.com> - 2015-12-28 15:42 -0500
Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-28 13:23 -0800
Re: White Privilege charles <charles@candehope.me.uk> - 2015-12-28 09:27 +0000
Re: White Privilege Janet <nobody@home.org> - 2015-12-28 12:30 +0000
Re: White Privilege "Don Phillipson" <e925@SPAMBLOCK.ncf.ca> - 2015-12-28 11:44 -0500
Re: White Privilege James Hogg <Jas.Hogg@gOUTmail.com> - 2015-12-27 23:15 +0100
Re: White Privilege charles <charles@candehope.me.uk> - 2015-12-27 22:22 +0000
Re: White Privilege "Peter Duncanson [BrE]" <mail@peterduncanson.net> - 2015-12-28 13:57 +0000
Re: White Privilege Tony Cooper <tonycooper214@gmail.com> - 2015-12-28 09:23 -0500
Re: White Privilege "Don Phillipson" <e925@SPAMBLOCK.ncf.ca> - 2015-12-28 11:37 -0500
Re: White Privilege Jerry Friedman <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-28 15:12 -0800
Re: White Privilege Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2015-12-29 15:38 +1100
Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2015-12-28 22:53 -0700
Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-28 06:41 -0800
Re: White Privilege Tony Cooper <tonycooper214@gmail.com> - 2015-12-28 09:52 -0500
Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-28 08:38 -0800
Re: White Privilege Tony Cooper <tonycooper214@gmail.com> - 2015-12-28 13:26 -0500
Re: White Privilege "Peter Duncanson [BrE]" <mail@peterduncanson.net> - 2015-12-28 22:19 +0000
Re: White Privilege Tony Cooper <tonycooper214@gmail.com> - 2015-12-28 17:47 -0500
Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-28 19:58 -0800
Re: White Privilege "Peter Duncanson [BrE]" <mail@peterduncanson.net> - 2015-12-27 22:26 +0000
Re: White Privilege Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2015-12-28 20:23 +1100
Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-28 08:45 -0330
Re: White Privilege HVS <usenet@REMOVETHISwhhvs.co.uk> - 2015-12-28 14:31 +0000
Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-28 11:53 -0330
Re: White Privilege David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2015-12-28 10:18 -0800
Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-28 15:52 -0330
Re: White Privilege Oliver Cromm <lispamateur@crommatograph.info> - 2015-12-28 14:54 -0500
Re: White Privilege David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2015-12-28 14:14 -0800
Re: White Privilege Philip Lantz <prl@canterey.us> - 2015-12-31 01:24 -0800
Re: White Privilege David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2015-12-31 09:38 -0800
Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-31 11:16 -0800
Re: White Privilege David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2015-12-31 12:31 -0800
Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2016-01-01 06:03 -0800
Re: White Privilege Oliver Cromm <lispamateur@crommatograph.info> - 2016-01-04 09:12 -0500
Re: White Privilege Jerry Friedman <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> - 2016-01-04 07:26 -0800
Re: White Privilege Oliver Cromm <lispamateur@crommatograph.info> - 2015-12-28 15:09 -0500
Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-28 16:55 -0330
Re: White Privilege Oliver Cromm <lispamateur@crommatograph.info> - 2016-01-04 12:56 -0500
Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2016-01-04 14:07 -0700
Re: White Privilege Mike Barnes <mikebarnes333@gmail.com> - 2016-01-04 22:07 +0000
Re: White Privilege wollman@bimajority.org (Garrett Wollman) - 2016-01-04 21:57 +0000
Re: White Privilege Oliver Cromm <lispamateur@crommatograph.info> - 2016-01-04 17:36 -0500
Re: White Privilege wollman@bimajority.org (Garrett Wollman) - 2016-01-05 01:24 +0000
Re: White Privilege Rich Ulrich <rich.ulrich@comcast.net> - 2016-01-04 21:14 -0500
Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2015-12-28 15:59 -0700
Re: White Privilege msb@vex.net (Mark Brader) - 2015-12-28 18:20 -0600
Re: White Privilege Tony Cooper <tonycooper214@gmail.com> - 2015-12-28 19:45 -0500
Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2015-12-28 17:53 -0700
Re: White Privilege msb@vex.net (Mark Brader) - 2015-12-28 22:53 -0600
Re: White Privilege Richard Yates <richard@yatesguitar.com> - 2015-12-28 21:08 -0800
Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2015-12-28 22:54 -0700
Re: White Privilege msb@vex.net (Mark Brader) - 2015-12-29 06:23 -0600
Re: White Privilege Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2015-12-30 11:51 +1100
Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2015-12-29 18:58 -0700
Re: White Privilege msb@vex.net (Mark Brader) - 2015-12-29 22:19 -0600
Re: White Privilege bill van <billvan@delete.shaw.ca> - 2015-12-29 21:04 -0800
Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-30 07:01 -0800
Re: White Privilege Horace LaBadie <hlabadie@nospam.com> - 2015-12-30 11:47 -0500
Re: White Privilege Philip Lantz <prl@canterey.us> - 2015-12-31 01:30 -0800
Re: White Privilege Philip Lantz <prl@canterey.us> - 2015-12-31 01:37 -0800
Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-28 20:02 -0800
Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2015-12-28 22:55 -0700
Re: White Privilege Athel Cornish-Bowden <acornish@imm.cnrs.fr> - 2015-12-29 11:08 +0100
Re: White Privilege Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2015-12-29 15:57 +1100
Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-28 08:44 -0800
Re: White Privilege "Dr. HotSalt" <alien8752@gmail.com> - 2015-12-28 18:09 -0800
Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2015-12-28 20:50 -0700
Re: White Privilege Jerry Friedman <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-28 20:44 -0800
Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-29 06:49 -0800
Re: White Privilege rcpj@panix.com (Pierre Jelenc) - 2015-12-29 17:18 +0000
Re: White Privilege Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2015-12-29 15:48 +1100
Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2015-12-28 22:57 -0700
Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-29 08:42 -0330
Re: White Privilege Oliver Cromm <lispamateur@crommatograph.info> - 2016-01-04 12:56 -0500
Re: White Privilege Will Parsons <varro@nodomain.invalid> - 2016-01-04 18:38 +0000
Re: White Privilege David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2016-01-04 12:03 -0800
Re: White Privilege Oliver Cromm <lispamateur@crommatograph.info> - 2016-01-04 17:36 -0500
Re: White Privilege Tony Cooper <tonycooper214@gmail.com> - 2016-01-04 18:03 -0500
Re: White Privilege David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2016-01-04 16:11 -0800
Re: White Privilege Oliver Cromm <lispamateur@crommatograph.info> - 2016-01-04 17:36 -0500
Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2016-01-04 19:14 -0330
Re: White Privilege richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Richard Tobin) - 2016-01-04 22:52 +0000
Re: White Privilege wollman@bimajority.org (Garrett Wollman) - 2016-01-05 01:34 +0000
Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2016-01-04 19:55 -0700
Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2016-01-05 06:24 -0330
Re: White Privilege Oliver Cromm <lispamateur@crommatograph.info> - 2016-01-05 13:32 -0500
Re: White Privilege Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2016-01-05 15:20 +1100
Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2016-01-04 19:02 -0330
Re: White Privilege Oliver Cromm <lispamateur@crommatograph.info> - 2016-01-05 13:32 -0500
Re: White Privilege "Dr. HotSalt" <alien8752@gmail.com> - 2016-01-04 18:49 -0800
Re: White Privilege "Peter Duncanson [BrE]" <mail@peterduncanson.net> - 2016-01-05 12:02 +0000
Re: White Privilege msb@vex.net (Mark Brader) - 2015-12-29 06:24 -0600
Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2015-12-29 06:01 -0700
Re: White Privilege msb@vex.net (Mark Brader) - 2015-12-29 22:15 -0600
Re: White Privilege Jerry Friedman <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-29 08:30 -0800
Re: White Privilege Tony Cooper <tonycooper214@gmail.com> - 2015-12-29 12:28 -0500
Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-29 14:11 -0330
Re: White Privilege Jerry Friedman <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-29 10:29 -0800
Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-29 16:16 -0330
Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-29 16:20 -0330
Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2015-12-29 14:05 -0700
Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-29 17:58 -0330
Re: White Privilege Snidely <snidely.too@gmail.com> - 2016-01-05 23:25 -0800
Re: White Privilege "Dr. HotSalt" <alien8752@gmail.com> - 2015-12-29 17:58 -0800
Re: White Privilege Athel Cornish-Bowden <acornish@imm.cnrs.fr> - 2015-12-30 10:27 +0100
Re: White Privilege Ross <benlizro@ihug.co.nz> - 2015-12-30 01:57 -0800
Re: White Privilege Jack Campin <bogus@purr.demon.co.uk> - 2015-12-30 10:04 +0000
Re: White Privilege HVS <usenet@REMOVETHISwhhvs.co.uk> - 2015-12-30 12:01 +0000
Re: White Privilege Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2015-12-30 11:57 +1100
Re: White Privilege Will Parsons <varro@nodomain.invalid> - 2015-12-30 01:24 +0000
Re: White Privilege Snidely <snidely.too@gmail.com> - 2016-01-05 23:32 -0800
Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-28 04:20 -0800
Re: White Privilege "Don Phillipson" <e925@SPAMBLOCK.ncf.ca> - 2015-12-27 14:08 -0500
Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-27 13:23 -0800
Re: White Privilege Tony Cooper <tonycooper214@gmail.com> - 2015-12-27 16:49 -0500
Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-27 14:07 -0800
Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2015-12-27 19:08 -0700
Re: White Privilege Jerry Friedman <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-27 19:14 -0800
Re: White Privilege Jerry Friedman <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-27 19:19 -0800
Re: White Privilege "Dr. HotSalt" <alien8752@gmail.com> - 2015-12-27 11:25 -0800
Re: White Privilege "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-27 13:27 -0800
Re: White Privilege Snidely <snidely.too@gmail.com> - 2016-01-05 23:37 -0800
Re: White Privilege RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2016-01-06 03:15 -0700
Re: White Privilege Helen Lacedaemonian <helenofsunnyvale@gmail.com> - 2016-01-06 21:16 -0800
Re: White Privilege bill van <billvan@delete.shaw.ca> - 2016-01-06 22:51 -0800
Re: White Privilege Helen Lacedaemonian <helenofsunnyvale@gmail.com> - 2015-12-27 12:19 -0800
Re: White Privilege Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-27 17:26 -0330
Re: White Privilege David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2015-12-27 10:36 -0800
Re: White Privilege Athel Cornish-Bowden <acornish@imm.cnrs.fr> - 2015-12-28 10:12 +0100
Re: White Privilege Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2015-12-28 20:10 +1100
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| From | Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-12-27 17:26 -0330 |
| Message-ID | <deb1jfFr4fdU1@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #577442 |
On 2015-12-27 1:19 PM, Jerry Friedman wrote: > > I don't think it implies that either. It's completely obvious that > position in society depends on many factors other than race. > > Do you have a suggestion for better ways to talk about this subject? There are probably any number of ways of making the point that some people are treated unequally in society without resorting to an excessive degree on generalizations based on group membership, causing people to miss the obvious. I think that analysis of social problems based on group membership is so popular that alternatives aren't likely to be used. -- Cheryl --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus
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| From | David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-12-27 10:36 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <35bb9f27-b01d-4f73-9053-d477851c4d81@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #577377 |
On Saturday, December 26, 2015 at 11:48:11 PM UTC-8, Helen Lacedaemonian wrote: > On Saturday, December 26, 2015 at 12:18:46 PM UTC-8, David Kleinecke wrote: > > At > > http://www.patheos.com/blogs/andygill/white-privilege-is-a-myth/ > > the blogger uses "white privilege" is a way I do not understand. > > > > To me "white privilege" is a sarcastic reference to assumed "white" > > superiority. It is, semantically, a condemning phrase. > > > > What does "white privilege" mean to you? > > The term "white privilege" refers to the unfortunate fact that in our society, white > people have a leg up in many walks of life (still no fines for excess puns), simply > by virtue of being white. Peggy McIntosh, an anti-racism activist, refers to the > whiteness advantage as "an invisible package of unearned assets." > > It seems to me that the blogger who wrote this post felt, erroneously, that the term > itself implied that whites were somehow deserving of this privilege. > > Perhaps the difficulty is the word "privilege"? Which means "a special benefit > available only to a particular person or class," but which is sometimes confused > with "an advantage conferred upon those especially deserving," or even... a right. That "whites" somehow merited "white privilege" seems so preposterous to me that I didn't imagine the blogger thought that's what it meant. But re-reading I think you're right. Amazing.
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| From | Athel Cornish-Bowden <acornish@imm.cnrs.fr> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-12-28 10:12 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <deccntF66leU1@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #577456 |
On 2015-12-27 18:36:42 +0000, David Kleinecke said: > On Saturday, December 26, 2015 at 11:48:11 PM UTC-8, Helen Lacedaemonian wrote: >> On Saturday, December 26, 2015 at 12:18:46 PM UTC-8, David Kleinecke wrote: >>> At >>> http://www.patheos.com/blogs/andygill/white-privilege-is-a-myth/ >>> the blogger uses "white privilege" is a way I do not understand. >>> >>> To me "white privilege" is a sarcastic reference to assumed "white" >>> superiority. It is, semantically, a condemning phrase. >>> >>> What does "white privilege" mean to you? >> >> The term "white privilege" refers to the unfortunate fact that in our >> society, white >> people have a leg up in many walks of life (still no fines for excess >> puns), simply >> by virtue of being white. Peggy McIntosh, an anti-racism activist, >> refers to the >> whiteness advantage as "an invisible package of unearned assets." >> >> It seems to me that the blogger who wrote this post felt, erroneously, >> that the term >> itself implied that whites were somehow deserving of this privilege. >> >> Perhaps the difficulty is the word "privilege"? Which means "a special benefit >> available only to a particular person or class," but which is sometimes >> confused >> with "an advantage conferred upon those especially deserving," or >> even... a right. > > That "whites" somehow merited "white privilege" seems so preposterous > to me that I didn't imagine the blogger thought that's what it meant. > But re-reading I think you're right. Amazing. Probably. However, I found the blogger's writing style opaque to the point that I didn't struggle through the whole article trying to decode it. -- athel
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| From | Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-12-28 20:10 +1100 |
| Message-ID | <n5qu5t$e21$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #577377 |
On 2015-Dec-27 18:48, Helen Lacedaemonian wrote:
> On Saturday, December 26, 2015 at 12:18:46 PM UTC-8, David Kleinecke wrote:
>> At
>> http://www.patheos.com/blogs/andygill/white-privilege-is-a-myth/
>> the blogger uses "white privilege" is a way I do not understand.
>>
>> To me "white privilege" is a sarcastic reference to assumed "white"
>> superiority. It is, semantically, a condemning phrase.
>>
>> What does "white privilege" mean to you?
>
> The term "white privilege" refers to the unfortunate fact that in our society, white
> people have a leg up in many walks of life (still no fines for excess puns), simply
> by virtue of being white. Peggy McIntosh, an anti-racism activist, refers to the
> whiteness advantage as "an invisible package of unearned assets."
>
> It seems to me that the blogger who wrote this post felt, erroneously, that the term
> itself implied that whites were somehow deserving of this privilege.
>
> Perhaps the difficulty is the word "privilege"? Which means "a special benefit
> available only to a particular person or class," but which is sometimes confused
> with "an advantage conferred upon those especially deserving," or even... a right.
Not long ago we heard that some people apply the description "entitled"
to people who believe, possibly erroneously, that they are entitled to
something. They appear to have extended the meaning by the steps
He has a sense of entitlement => He feels entitled
=> He _is_ entitled
where the last step is illogical, but still plausible to some minds.
Perhaps this is the same confusion extended to a related word.
--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW, Australia
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