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Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter

From Athel Cornish-Bowden <acornish@imm.cnrs.fr>
Newsgroups alt.usage.english
Subject Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter
Date 2015-12-28 17:47 +0100
Message-ID <ded7cmFd1ocU1@mid.individual.net> (permalink)
References <7n6s7bd728s05sdgrpt3ehchju5f4lijtj@4ax.com> <fp728bda4ari1rrjeauf65njfipajj7rpo@4ax.com>

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On 2015-12-28 11:45:27 +0000, Peter Duncanson [BrE] said:

> On Sun, 27 Dec 2015 23:37:14 -0800, Snidely <snidely.too@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> 
>> On Sunday, Athel Cornish-Bowden pointed out that ...
>>> On 2015-12-27 16:27:40 +0000, Lewis said:
>> 
>>>> No. For many people first cousins are considered too close,
>>> 
>>> Not if you've been brought up in the bosom of the Church of England they
>>> aren't. Charles Darwin's wife Emma was his first cousin.
>> 
>> Which appears to have contributed to their offspring's ill health.  "Of
>> the ten Darwin children, most were sickly.  Three proved infertile as
>> adults, and three died young, roughly double the child mortality rate
>> in England."  Kean, _The Violinist's Thumb_, pg 251
>> 
>> "While most children born to first cousins are healthy (well north of
>> 90 percent), they do have higher risks for birth defects and medical
>> problems, and the numbers can creep higher still in unlucky families."
>> (ibid)
>> 
> It's a miracle that humans exist considering that our shared ancestor,
> Adam, produced children with Eve who wasn't a cousin or sister but was
> made from his own body. He reproduced using a separated part of himself,
> allegedly.
> 
> That's extreme consanguinity.

Yes, but before they sinned there were no harmful mutations.

More seriously, the Pharoahs seemed to have gone through quite a few 
generations of brother-sister unions while still producing viable 
offspring.

Highly inbred strains of animals like rats are very widely used in 
laboratories, and although they wouldn't survive in the wild they can 
be quite healthy in laboratory conditions.

-- 
athel

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Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2015-12-26 07:07 +0200
  Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Snidely <snidely.too@gmail.com> - 2015-12-25 22:36 -0800
    Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2015-12-26 11:53 +0200
      Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Athel Cornish-Bowden <acornish@imm.cnrs.fr> - 2015-12-26 15:21 +0100
        Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Tony Cooper <tonycooper214@gmail.com> - 2015-12-26 09:41 -0500
          Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-12-26 14:53 +0000
            Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Snidely <snidely.too@gmail.com> - 2015-12-26 11:16 -0800
              Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-12-26 20:38 +0000
            Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-26 12:07 -0800
            Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2015-12-29 14:30 +1100
              Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-28 20:28 -0800
              Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2015-12-28 22:17 -0800
              Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Richard Tobin) - 2015-12-29 11:24 +0000
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Athel Cornish-Bowden <acornish@imm.cnrs.fr> - 2015-12-29 12:35 +0100
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Richard Tobin) - 2015-12-29 11:51 +0000
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Athel Cornish-Bowden <acornish@imm.cnrs.fr> - 2015-12-31 18:10 +0100
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-31 11:23 -0800
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-29 06:28 -0800
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Richard Tobin) - 2015-12-29 14:58 +0000
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-29 08:42 -0800
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Richard Tobin) - 2015-12-29 20:33 +0000
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter snidely.too@gmail.com - 2015-12-29 12:38 -0800
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-29 14:30 -0800
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Richard Tobin) - 2015-12-29 22:37 +0000
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter snidely.too@gmail.com - 2015-12-29 14:41 -0800
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Richard Tobin) - 2015-12-29 23:12 +0000
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2015-12-30 11:47 +1100
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter snidely.too@gmail.com - 2015-12-29 17:26 -0800
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-29 20:19 -0800
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Will Parsons <varro@nodomain.invalid> - 2015-12-30 02:03 +0000
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-29 20:23 -0800
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Athel Cornish-Bowden <acornish@imm.cnrs.fr> - 2015-12-31 18:24 +0100
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2015-12-31 10:12 -0800
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Athel Cornish-Bowden <acornish@imm.cnrs.fr> - 2015-12-31 18:15 +0100
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-12-29 16:50 +0000
        Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-26 06:49 -0800
      Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Snidely <snidely.too@gmail.com> - 2015-12-26 11:38 -0800
        Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Snidely <snidely.too@gmail.com> - 2015-12-26 11:40 -0800
        Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter "Joe Roberts" <shoreheritage@att.net> - 2015-12-26 17:10 -0500
          Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-12-26 22:37 +0000
            Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Athel Cornish-Bowden <acornish@imm.cnrs.fr> - 2015-12-27 12:02 +0100
              Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2015-12-27 04:59 -0700
              Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Charles Bishop <ctbishop@earthlink.net> - 2015-12-27 07:11 -0800
              Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-12-27 16:27 +0000
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Athel Cornish-Bowden <acornish@imm.cnrs.fr> - 2015-12-27 18:01 +0100
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Janet <nobody@home.org> - 2015-12-27 18:51 +0000
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-27 17:16 -0330
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Janet <nobody@home.org> - 2015-12-27 21:03 +0000
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-27 19:46 -0330
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2015-12-27 15:32 -0800
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter richard@cogsci.ed.ac.uk (Richard Tobin) - 2015-12-28 20:20 +0000
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter msb@vex.net (Mark Brader) - 2015-12-27 19:00 -0600
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-27 20:10 -0800
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-28 08:52 -0330
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter msb@vex.net (Mark Brader) - 2015-12-28 18:09 -0600
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Snidely <snidely.too@gmail.com> - 2015-12-27 23:37 -0800
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter "Peter Duncanson [BrE]" <mail@peterduncanson.net> - 2015-12-28 11:45 +0000
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Athel Cornish-Bowden <acornish@imm.cnrs.fr> - 2015-12-28 17:47 +0100
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter snidely.too@gmail.com - 2015-12-28 12:31 -0800
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Athel Cornish-Bowden <acornish@imm.cnrs.fr> - 2015-12-28 22:26 +0100
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2015-12-29 14:52 +1100
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-12-28 19:42 +0000
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter snidely.too@gmail.com - 2015-12-28 12:06 -0800
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-12-28 21:13 +0000
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter snidely.too@gmail.com - 2015-12-28 12:20 -0800
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-12-28 21:16 +0000
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Athel Cornish-Bowden <acornish@imm.cnrs.fr> - 2015-12-28 22:41 +0100
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2015-12-28 14:25 -0800
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Jerry Friedman <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-28 15:17 -0800
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter snidely.too@gmail.com - 2015-12-28 19:14 -0800
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Athel Cornish-Bowden <acornish@imm.cnrs.fr> - 2015-12-29 08:13 +0100
                Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2015-12-29 14:49 +1100
        Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2015-12-27 02:38 +0200
      Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter John Dawkins <artfldodgr@aol.com> - 2015-12-26 12:45 -0800
  Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-12-26 12:06 +0000
    Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2015-12-26 20:05 +0200
    Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter "Peter Duncanson [BrE]" <mail@peterduncanson.net> - 2015-12-26 21:22 +0000
      Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Athel Cornish-Bowden <acornish@imm.cnrs.fr> - 2015-12-27 12:11 +0100
  Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-26 05:29 -0800
  Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Doug Chadduck <dchadduck@comcast.net> - 2015-12-26 08:03 -0800
    Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2015-12-26 20:09 +0200
  Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter "Joe Roberts" <shoreheritage@att.net> - 2015-12-26 12:02 -0500
    Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2015-12-26 19:27 +0200
    Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@verizon.net> - 2015-12-26 12:09 -0800
      Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2015-12-26 12:23 -0800
    Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter CDB <bellemarecd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-27 09:04 -0500
      Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2015-12-27 16:56 +0200
        Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Jerry Friedman <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-27 08:18 -0800
      Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter "Joe Roberts" <shoreheritage@att.net> - 2015-12-27 10:54 -0500
        Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter CDB <bellemarecd@gmail.com> - 2015-12-27 12:32 -0500
          Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter "Joe Roberts" <shoreheritage@att.net> - 2015-12-27 16:16 -0500
        Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2015-12-28 03:22 +0200
          Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Janet <nobody@home.org> - 2015-12-28 12:40 +0000
            Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Rich Ulrich <rich.ulrich@comcast.net> - 2015-12-28 13:04 -0500
              Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Cheryl <cperkins@mun.ca> - 2015-12-28 15:49 -0330
            Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2015-12-29 06:09 +0200
              Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter RH Draney <dadoctah@cox.net> - 2015-12-28 22:51 -0700
          Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2015-12-29 15:14 +1100
  Re: Shirttail cousins -- blogging's bertter Jerry Friedman <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-27 08:17 -0800

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