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Groups > alt.folklore.computers > #215646 > unrolled thread
| Started by | gareth evans <headstone255@yahoo.com> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2020-12-28 16:19 +0000 |
| Last post | 2020-12-29 13:06 -0600 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 577 — 38 participants |
Back to article view | Back to alt.folklore.computers
Adobe oddity? gareth evans <headstone255@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-28 16:19 +0000
Re: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2020-12-28 10:42 -0600
Re: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2020-12-28 12:50 -0500
Re: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-28 11:16 -0700
Re: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2020-12-28 18:43 +0000
Re: Adobe oddity? Chris <xxx.syseng.yyy@gfsys.co.uk> - 2020-12-28 19:34 +0000
Re: Adobe oddity? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-12-28 23:48 +0100
Re: Adobe oddity? Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2020-12-29 02:44 -0500
Re: Adobe oddity? Bob Eager <news0073@eager.cx> - 2020-12-29 13:04 +0000
Re: Adobe oddity? Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2020-12-29 13:08 +0000
Re: Adobe oddity? Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2020-12-30 20:25 -0500
Re: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-29 07:36 -0700
Re: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2020-12-29 10:08 -0500
Re: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-29 12:58 -0500
Re: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2020-12-29 14:22 -0500
Re: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-29 15:10 -0500
Re: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2020-12-29 16:07 -0500
Re: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-29 17:15 -0500
Re: Adobe oddity? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-12-30 12:50 +0100
Re: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2020-12-29 21:48 +0000
Re: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2020-12-29 17:05 +0000
car charging, was: Adobe oddity? danny burstein <dannyb@panix.com> - 2020-12-29 17:43 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2020-12-29 13:00 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2020-12-29 20:05 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2020-12-29 16:01 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-29 17:24 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2020-12-29 23:36 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-31 13:04 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-31 16:58 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2020-12-31 22:45 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2020-12-31 18:38 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-01 11:12 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-01 13:28 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-02 06:02 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-02 08:50 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-02 13:14 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-02 13:40 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-02 13:43 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-02 19:15 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-02 14:43 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-02 14:56 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-02 15:17 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-02 18:16 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-02 19:46 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-02 19:54 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-03 19:34 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-04 17:33 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-04 12:06 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-03 19:34 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-03 11:09 -0600
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-03 19:34 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-05 09:46 -0600
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Leo <leoblaisdell@sbcglobal.net> - 2021-01-06 17:38 -0800
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2021-01-07 16:32 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Kerr-Mudd,John" <notsaying@127.0.0.1> - 2021-01-07 21:24 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2021-01-02 20:25 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2021-01-02 21:40 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-03 19:34 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-03 03:14 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-02 23:11 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-02 23:49 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-03 19:34 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-03 23:52 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-04 17:33 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-05 09:48 -0600
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-03 08:07 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-03 13:12 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2021-01-04 15:10 +0000
Re: the power and the screwups, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-04 18:13 +0000
Re: the power and the screwups, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-04 13:21 -0500
Re: the power and the screwups, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-04 19:22 +0000
Re: the power and the screwups, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2021-01-05 00:01 +0000
Re: the power and the screwups, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2021-01-04 18:57 +0000
Re: the power and the screwups, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-04 14:28 -0500
Re: the power and the screwups, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2021-01-04 19:55 +0000
Re: the power and the screwups, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-04 21:11 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-04 12:06 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-02 20:20 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-02 15:51 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-02 19:29 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dave Garland <dave.garland@wizinfo.com> - 2021-01-03 14:48 -0600
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-04 21:22 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-04 22:47 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-04 23:07 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-04 20:26 -0500
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-05 18:15 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-05 20:12 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-05 17:15 -0500
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-07 01:41 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-07 07:04 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-08 21:39 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-09 01:16 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-09 12:54 -0600
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Niklas Karlsson <anksil@yahoo.se> - 2021-01-10 09:36 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-10 13:29 -0600
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-09 05:46 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-10 11:28 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-07 12:02 -0700
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-08 21:39 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-09 05:47 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-09 17:18 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-09 17:51 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-09 19:19 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-09 21:02 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-11 21:55 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-11 22:22 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-13 13:15 -0700
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-13 16:24 -0500
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-14 21:56 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-14 21:56 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-10 11:29 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Andy Leighton <andyl@azaal.plus.com> - 2021-01-10 06:31 -0600
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dave Garland <dave.garland@wizinfo.com> - 2021-01-10 13:25 -0600
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-11 00:20 +0000
Re: autonomous car directing, was charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-11 00:38 +0000
Re: autonomous car directing, was charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-11 00:51 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2021-01-11 15:46 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-10 13:30 -0600
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Radey Shouman <shouman@comcast.net> - 2021-01-10 19:45 -0500
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-10 21:27 -0500
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-11 10:18 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-11 18:23 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-11 21:56 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? maus <maus@dmaus.org> - 2021-01-11 08:31 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-11 12:16 -0700
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? maus <maus@dmaus.org> - 2021-01-11 20:15 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-11 20:39 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-11 21:04 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-11 22:04 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-11 21:56 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-10 09:13 -0500
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-10 12:31 -0500
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-10 13:31 -0500
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-10 15:41 -0500
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2021-01-10 20:59 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-11 21:57 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Kerr-Mudd,John" <notsaying@127.0.0.1> - 2021-01-12 12:06 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-12 21:42 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-12 09:31 -0600
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-10 21:20 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-11 21:58 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-11 22:06 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Radey Shouman <shouman@comcast.net> - 2021-01-11 21:47 -0500
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-12 21:43 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-11 22:37 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Radey Shouman <shouman@comcast.net> - 2021-01-11 21:45 -0500
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-12 03:32 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2021-01-10 20:57 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-11 12:15 -0700
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-11 21:57 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-11 22:42 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-12 09:36 -0600
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-13 13:15 -0700
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-14 12:29 -0600
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dave Garland <dave.garland@wizinfo.com> - 2021-01-14 09:47 -0600
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-14 12:36 -0600
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2021-01-14 19:53 +0000
Re: bad predictions, was autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-14 21:23 +0000
Re: bad predictions, was autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-14 18:58 -0500
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-15 13:10 -0600
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2021-01-15 12:05 -0500
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-12 21:43 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-12 23:47 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-13 13:15 -0700
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Radey Shouman <shouman@comcast.net> - 2021-01-13 16:49 -0500
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Alfred Falk <aefalk@telus.net> - 2021-01-15 16:21 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-14 12:30 -0600
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2021-01-14 21:51 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2021-01-15 11:52 -0500
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-15 13:13 -0600
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2021-01-15 19:40 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-15 21:49 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-15 18:18 -0500
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-15 23:14 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2021-01-16 09:03 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2021-01-16 09:29 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-10 18:32 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-11 21:59 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? mjb@signal11.invalid (Mike) - 2021-01-12 21:36 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-13 20:20 +0000
Re: autonomous car tricks, was charging John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-13 22:11 +0000
Re: autonomous car tricks, was charging usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-14 21:55 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-10 18:32 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> - 2021-01-10 18:26 -0400
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-10 11:28 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Joy Beeson <jbeeson@invalid.net.invalid> - 2021-01-10 20:00 -0500
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-11 12:16 -0700
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? maus <maus@dmaus.org> - 2021-01-11 20:35 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-11 21:55 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-13 13:15 -0700
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-13 16:41 -0500
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-14 21:56 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-15 13:19 -0600
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Vir Campestris <vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> - 2021-01-15 21:21 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-15 18:35 -0600
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-16 20:00 -0700
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? gareth evans <headstone255@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-17 11:49 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-17 17:59 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Vir Campestris <vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> - 2021-01-17 21:43 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-19 11:32 -0700
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-15 21:35 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-14 22:52 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-11 22:17 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-11 18:58 -0500
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-12 19:52 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-12 16:27 -0500
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-13 13:15 -0700
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-13 16:46 -0500
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-14 22:52 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Radey Shouman <shouman@comcast.net> - 2021-01-13 16:48 -0500
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-13 23:00 -0500
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-14 22:52 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-14 21:57 +0000
Re: autonomous car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-05 18:14 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-04 16:54 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-05 18:14 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-03 19:34 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-05 18:14 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-05 19:46 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-07 01:41 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-07 07:27 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-10 11:28 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-10 09:07 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-10 12:29 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-10 13:29 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-10 18:51 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-10 15:40 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2021-01-10 20:54 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-11 00:45 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-11 21:55 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-10 16:51 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-11 21:54 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-11 22:18 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-11 23:26 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-11 18:50 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-12 21:41 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-12 15:48 -0600
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-10 18:13 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-10 13:35 -0600
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-10 20:25 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-10 17:19 -0600
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-11 00:40 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-10 21:25 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-11 12:51 -0600
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-11 21:00 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-12 09:24 -0600
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2021-01-10 20:56 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-10 17:21 -0600
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-11 12:15 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-11 18:52 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-11 21:54 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-13 13:15 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Vir Campestris <vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> - 2021-01-07 22:14 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-07 17:36 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-08 21:40 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Niklas Karlsson <anksil@yahoo.se> - 2021-01-09 13:31 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Kerr-Mudd,John" <notsaying@127.0.0.1> - 2021-01-11 21:13 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-05 14:06 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Vir Campestris <vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> - 2021-01-05 21:21 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-05 17:13 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-07 01:41 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-07 07:28 +0000
Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-07 12:24 +0000
Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-07 12:40 +0000
Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-07 19:29 +0000
Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-08 21:38 +0000
Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-08 18:12 -0700
Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Fred Smith <fred@thejanitor.corp> - 2021-01-09 02:56 +0000
Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-08 22:02 -0500
Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-10 11:28 +0000
Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-10 06:40 -0700
Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? maus <maus@dmaus.org> - 2021-01-11 08:41 +0000
Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2021-01-11 15:56 +0000
Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Kerr-Mudd,John" <notsaying@127.0.0.1> - 2021-01-11 21:16 +0000
Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? maus <maus@dmaus.org> - 2021-01-09 08:56 +0000
Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-07 11:46 -0500
Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-07 19:29 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-07 01:41 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-07 07:32 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-02 14:06 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-03 08:07 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-03 11:51 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-03 13:43 -0500
Re: dim bulbs, not car charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-03 22:35 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-03 19:34 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-03 13:16 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-03 19:34 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-03 23:55 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-04 12:06 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-04 15:55 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> - 2021-01-06 02:25 -0400
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-06 07:31 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? maus <maus@dmaus.org> - 2021-01-06 17:04 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Jorgen Grahn <grahn+nntp@snipabacken.se> - 2021-01-07 21:32 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-07 17:37 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-07 17:59 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-07 22:24 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-07 22:37 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-07 23:05 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Jorgen Grahn <grahn+nntp@snipabacken.se> - 2021-01-08 20:05 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-08 16:01 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-08 17:09 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-08 14:34 -0600
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Niklas Karlsson <anksil@yahoo.se> - 2021-01-08 20:41 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Kerr-Mudd,John" <notsaying@127.0.0.1> - 2021-01-11 21:19 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-08 18:12 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-08 20:45 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-08 18:12 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-08 20:42 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-10 06:40 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-02 13:09 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-03 08:07 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-03 13:30 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2021-01-03 21:35 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Elliott Roper <nospam@yrl.co.uk> - 2021-01-03 22:13 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-03 20:07 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-03 19:34 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-05 09:41 -0600
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2021-01-02 20:47 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-01 17:37 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2021-01-01 19:24 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? danny burstein <dannyb@panix.com> - 2021-01-02 00:36 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-01 21:24 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? danny burstein <dannyb@panix.com> - 2021-01-02 03:55 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-01 23:29 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-12-30 12:53 +0100
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2020-12-30 12:06 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-12-30 14:38 +0100
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Bud Spencer <bud@campo.verano.it> - 2020-12-30 15:02 +0200
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-30 11:22 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Bud Spencer <bud@campo.verano.it> - 2020-12-31 02:12 +0200
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2020-12-31 01:34 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Kerr-Mudd,John" <notsaying@127.0.0.1> - 2020-12-31 11:53 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2020-12-31 10:13 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Bud Spencer <bud@campo.verano.it> - 2021-01-02 17:20 +0200
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-02 13:23 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-30 20:42 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Bud Spencer <bud@campo.verano.it> - 2021-01-02 17:26 +0200
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-02 13:39 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? maus <maus@dmaus.org> - 2020-12-31 18:29 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Bud Spencer <bud@campo.verano.it> - 2021-01-02 17:35 +0200
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2020-12-31 12:35 -0600
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-31 13:04 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-31 16:59 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-31 15:23 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-31 18:05 -0500
Re: thar she blows, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-01 02:26 +0000
Re: thar she blows, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-31 23:12 -0500
Re: thar she blows, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? danny burstein <dannyb@panix.com> - 2021-01-01 04:41 +0000
Re: thar she blows, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-01 11:12 -0700
Re: thar she blows, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-01 15:17 -0600
Re: thar she blows, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-01 21:46 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-01 11:12 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Kerr-Mudd,John" <notsaying@127.0.0.1> - 2021-01-01 13:29 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-01 08:54 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Niklas Karlsson <anksil@yahoo.se> - 2021-01-05 17:35 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-06 11:38 -0600
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-01 11:26 -0600
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Bud Spencer <bud@campo.verano.it> - 2021-01-02 17:38 +0200
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Joy Beeson <jbeeson@invalid.net.invalid> - 2021-01-02 23:25 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-03 11:12 -0600
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2020-12-31 12:34 -0600
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? maus <maus@dmaus.org> - 2020-12-31 18:47 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2020-12-31 14:03 -0600
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? maus <maus@dmaus.org> - 2020-12-31 22:16 +0000
Re: polish enigmas, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-01 02:33 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-01 11:32 -0600
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? antispam@math.uni.wroc.pl - 2021-01-01 19:22 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? maus <maus@dmaus.org> - 2021-01-02 11:26 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-02 09:44 -0600
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? maus <maus@dmaus.org> - 2021-01-02 16:50 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-03 08:07 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Robert Swindells <rjs@fdy2.co.uk> - 2021-01-02 19:00 +0000
Re: bombes, was car charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-02 19:13 +0000
Re: bombes, was car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-02 14:53 -0500
Re: Enigma and early computers antispam@math.uni.wroc.pl - 2021-01-03 19:44 +0000
Re: Enigma and early computers Dave Garland <dave.garland@wizinfo.com> - 2021-01-03 16:03 -0600
Re: Enigma and early computers antispam@math.uni.wroc.pl - 2021-01-04 01:06 +0000
Re: memories of Enigma and early computers John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-03 22:46 +0000
Re: memories of Enigma and early computers Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2021-01-04 10:07 +0000
Re: memories of Enigma and early computers John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-04 18:57 +0000
Re: Enigma and early computers Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2021-01-04 21:07 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Bud Spencer <bud@campo.verano.it> - 2021-01-02 17:36 +0200
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-31 13:04 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-31 17:07 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-02 20:20 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? maus <maus@dmaus.org> - 2021-01-03 11:50 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2020-12-30 11:08 +0000
Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Vir Campestris <vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> - 2020-12-29 21:35 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-12-29 22:51 +0100
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2020-12-30 11:31 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-12-30 12:56 +0100
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2020-12-30 13:12 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-12-30 14:41 +0100
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2020-12-30 18:15 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? danny burstein <dannyb@panix.com> - 2020-12-30 13:58 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2020-12-30 15:10 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Elliott Roper <nospam@yrl.co.uk> - 2020-12-30 15:42 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Elliott Roper <nospam@yrl.co.uk> - 2020-12-30 16:21 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2020-12-30 12:13 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-12-30 14:43 +0100
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2020-12-30 19:00 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? gareth evans <headstone255@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-30 19:11 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2020-12-30 20:08 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? gareth evans <headstone255@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-30 21:54 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? gareth evans <headstone255@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-30 21:55 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2020-12-31 12:50 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-31 13:04 -0700
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-31 16:50 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-01 20:44 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-01 21:44 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-12-30 20:22 +0100
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2020-12-30 20:31 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-30 15:48 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2020-12-30 19:27 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Niklas Karlsson <anksil@yahoo.se> - 2021-01-06 05:59 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-06 06:37 -0700
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-06 12:03 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Niklas Karlsson <anksil@yahoo.se> - 2021-01-07 17:58 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-31 13:04 -0700
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2020-12-31 21:25 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-31 14:54 -0700
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-31 17:15 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2020-12-31 17:07 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2020-12-31 22:58 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2020-12-31 18:13 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-01 11:27 -0600
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2020-12-31 18:40 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2021-01-01 11:05 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Bud Spencer <bud@campo.verano.it> - 2020-12-30 15:19 +0200
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-12-30 14:44 +0100
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Niklas Karlsson <anksil@yahoo.se> - 2020-12-30 14:06 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-12-30 15:13 +0100
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Niklas Karlsson <anksil@yahoo.se> - 2020-12-30 14:29 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2020-12-30 10:14 -0600
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2020-12-30 16:41 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-31 13:04 -0700
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2020-12-31 15:34 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Niklas Karlsson <anksil@yahoo.se> - 2021-01-06 05:42 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-12-30 20:07 +0100
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2020-12-30 20:31 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-12-30 21:44 +0100
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-31 13:04 -0700
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-12-31 21:35 +0100
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-30 16:08 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-12-30 23:16 +0100
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2020-12-30 15:25 -0600
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-30 11:27 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2020-12-30 17:00 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2020-12-30 15:20 -0600
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2020-12-31 19:03 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-31 13:04 -0700
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2020-12-31 15:38 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-01 20:44 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2020-12-31 21:30 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Niklas Karlsson <anksil@yahoo.se> - 2021-01-06 06:06 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Bud Spencer <bud@campo.verano.it> - 2020-12-30 16:41 +0200
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Niklas Karlsson <anksil@yahoo.se> - 2020-12-30 14:46 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-12-30 20:10 +0100
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Niklas Karlsson <anksil@yahoo.se> - 2021-01-06 05:56 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-06 07:37 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2021-01-06 13:12 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-06 12:09 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2021-01-06 18:41 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-06 13:29 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-06 12:11 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-06 18:01 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-06 15:11 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-06 20:38 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-06 16:45 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-06 22:28 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-30 11:33 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2020-12-30 17:26 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? gareth evans <headstone255@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-30 19:08 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2020-12-30 20:20 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? David Lesher <wb8foz@panix.com> - 2021-02-02 02:50 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2020-12-30 10:13 -0600
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-12-30 20:12 +0100
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2020-12-30 15:27 -0600
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-12-30 22:57 +0100
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2020-12-30 22:27 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? maus <maus@dmaus.org> - 2020-12-30 18:33 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-30 14:19 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Vir Campestris <vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> - 2021-01-03 21:27 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-03 21:55 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-03 19:57 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2021-01-04 03:00 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Elliott Roper <nospam@yrl.co.uk> - 2021-01-04 13:58 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-04 17:33 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-04 13:00 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-04 14:35 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-04 21:29 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-04 17:46 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-04 23:11 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-04 12:06 -0700
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-04 20:00 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Andreas Eder <a_eder_muc@web.de> - 2021-01-04 22:15 +0100
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-04 21:29 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> - 2021-01-06 03:10 -0400
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-05 09:57 -0600
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? maus <maus@dmaus.org> - 2021-01-05 11:59 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-05 20:12 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Kerr-Mudd,John" <notsaying@127.0.0.1> - 2021-01-07 21:48 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Vir Campestris <vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> - 2021-01-04 10:44 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-04 07:23 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Vir Campestris <vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> - 2021-01-04 22:11 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2020-12-30 19:27 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> - 2020-12-30 16:46 -0400
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2020-12-30 22:16 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-12-30 21:45 +0100
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2020-12-30 14:51 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-12-30 20:14 +0100
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Bud Spencer <bud@campo.verano.it> - 2020-12-31 01:54 +0200
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-30 20:24 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Bud Spencer <bud@campo.verano.it> - 2021-01-02 17:17 +0200
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-02 15:55 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? danny burstein <dannyb@panix.com> - 2021-01-02 16:29 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-02 17:08 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? danny burstein <dannyb@panix.com> - 2021-01-02 19:42 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-02 20:05 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? David Lesher <wb8foz@panix.com> - 2021-02-02 03:20 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-03 19:34 -0700
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-04 03:25 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-01-08 21:40 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? maus <maus@dmaus.org> - 2021-01-09 08:51 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Niklas Karlsson <anksil@yahoo.se> - 2021-01-07 16:33 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-02 12:46 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-02 12:44 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-31 13:04 -0700
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-31 16:55 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? maus <maus@dmaus.org> - 2020-12-31 22:23 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Dave Garland <dave.garland@wizinfo.com> - 2020-12-31 21:43 -0600
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Niklas Karlsson <anksil@yahoo.se> - 2021-01-06 06:04 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-06 07:39 -0500
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-06 13:31 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-06 21:41 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2021-01-07 09:18 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-07 19:29 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-06 06:37 -0700
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2020-12-31 21:44 +0000
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Anssi Saari <as@sci.fi> - 2021-01-01 15:35 +0200
Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-29 17:30 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-29 14:18 -0700
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-29 17:26 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2020-12-29 18:18 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2020-12-29 19:50 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-29 14:59 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2020-12-29 21:50 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2020-12-30 16:52 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2020-12-30 06:48 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-30 11:16 -0500
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2020-12-30 16:54 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2020-12-30 19:27 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2020-12-30 17:18 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-12-30 20:25 +0100
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2020-12-30 20:54 +0000
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-12-30 23:08 +0100
Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2020-12-30 23:01 +0000
Re: Adobe oddity? Dave Garland <dave.garland@wizinfo.com> - 2020-12-29 19:28 -0600
Re: Adobe oddity? gareth evans <headstone255@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-28 19:37 +0000
Re: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-28 15:00 -0500
Re: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-28 15:53 -0700
Re: Adobe oddity? J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2020-12-28 19:00 -0500
Re: Adobe oddity? Jorgen Grahn <grahn+nntp@snipabacken.se> - 2020-12-29 09:40 +0000
Re: Adobe oddity? Bud Spencer <bud@campo.verano.it> - 2020-12-29 15:01 +0200
Re: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-29 07:36 -0700
Re: Adobe oddity? Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2020-12-29 10:10 -0500
Re: Adobe oddity? Bud Spencer <bud@campo.verano.it> - 2020-12-29 18:11 +0200
Re: Adobe oddity? Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2020-12-29 13:18 +0000
Re: Adobe oddity? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2020-12-29 19:50 +0000
Re: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2020-12-29 17:16 -0600
Re: Adobe oddity? Vir Campestris <vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> - 2020-12-28 21:43 +0000
Re: Flash is dead, Adobe oddity? John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2020-12-28 22:18 +0000
Re: Flash is dead, Adobe oddity? danny burstein <dannyb@panix.com> - 2020-12-28 22:30 +0000
Re: Adobe oddity? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-12-28 20:24 +0100
Re: Adobe oddity? Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-28 15:52 -0700
Re: Adobe oddity? JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2020-12-29 13:06 -0600
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| From | usenet@only.tnx (Questor) |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-01-07 01:41 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? |
| Message-ID | <5ff666cf.3712768@news.dslextreme.com> |
| In reply to | #216062 |
On Tue, 05 Jan 2021 17:13:41 -0500, J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote: >On Tue, 5 Jan 2021 21:21:33 +0000, Vir Campestris ><vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> wrote: > >>On 05/01/2021 18:14, Questor wrote: >>> That's a very weak justification. You're saying that it's okay for self-driving >>> cars to kill and maim people in accidents, as long as it can be statistically >>> shown that they do so less frequently than humans. Would you care to explain >>> that argument to someone who just lost a loved one in an accident with a >>> self-driving vehicle? >> >>Let's turn that on its head. >> >>You're saying that it'll be OK for humans to drive cars even though it >>can be statistically shown that they kill more humans than self-driving >>cars. >> >>The self drivers will be a lot better. Just because the manufacturers >>have to be able to survive the lawsuits from the unlucky few. > >Uh, "will be" implies that they don't exist now, which is not the >case. It can also mean, as I think it does in this case, that while they exist, they're not very good. The "will be" applies to their quality, not their existance.
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| From | Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-01-07 07:28 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? |
| Message-ID | <20210107072855.f388412f6797973018a76d21@eircom.net> |
| In reply to | #216062 |
On Tue, 05 Jan 2021 17:13:41 -0500 J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote: > Uh, "will be" implies that they don't exist now, which is not the > case. It is the case, there are no autonomous vehicles on the roads today only sophisticated driver assist systems that are nearly good enough to treat as autonomous. -- Steve O'Hara-Smith | Directable Mirror Arrays C:\>WIN | A better way to focus the sun The computer obeys and wins. | licences available see You lose and Bill collects. | http://www.sohara.org/
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-01-07 12:24 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? |
| Message-ID | <rt6uhh$mr$1@gal.iecc.com> |
| In reply to | #216117 |
In article <20210107072855.f388412f6797973018a76d21@eircom.net>, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote: >> Uh, "will be" implies that they don't exist now, which is not the >> case. > > It is the case, there are no autonomous vehicles on the roads today >only sophisticated driver assist systems that are nearly good enough to >treat as autonomous. That turns out to be fairly pessimal. The car drives itself 95% of the time, while the driver watches a movie or falls asleep. Then the car runs into a situtation it can't handle itself, the driver isn't paying attention, and uh oh. This was what happened when the Uber car killed someone in Arizona. The very bored driver was apparently playing games on her phone. Commercial airplanes have the same problem with autopilots that can handle all but a few situtations. I gather there are proposals to run flight simulators in the cockpit to keep the crew's skills up. -- Regards, John Levine, johnl@taugh.com, Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies", Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly
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| From | Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-01-07 12:40 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? |
| Message-ID | <20210107124013.3b8163370ebcdd87a01e2aef@eircom.net> |
| In reply to | #216120 |
On Thu, 7 Jan 2021 12:24:17 -0000 (UTC) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> wrote: > In article <20210107072855.f388412f6797973018a76d21@eircom.net>, > Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote: > >> Uh, "will be" implies that they don't exist now, which is not the > >> case. > > > > It is the case, there are no autonomous vehicles on the roads > > today > >only sophisticated driver assist systems that are nearly good enough to > >treat as autonomous. > > That turns out to be fairly pessimal. The car drives itself 95% of the > time, while the driver watches a movie or falls asleep. Hence the requirement for systems that detect this and do something about it - which seems not to be as well thought out or reliable as we might hope. > Then the car > runs into a situtation it can't handle itself, the driver isn't paying > attention, and uh oh. Yep and that last 5% is the hard 5% which won't get there without the 95% getting a lot of road testing. Still if Musk isn't shading the truth (granted that's a significant if) even with that effect the overall result is an improvement in safety. > This was what happened when the Uber car killed someone in Arizona. > The very bored driver was apparently playing games on her phone. This is indeed a big problem - two solutions give up on autonomous vehicles or work hard to handle that last 5% while trying hard to stop people being idiots. -- Steve O'Hara-Smith | Directable Mirror Arrays C:\>WIN | A better way to focus the sun The computer obeys and wins. | licences available see You lose and Bill collects. | http://www.sohara.org/
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| From | Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-01-07 19:29 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? |
| Message-ID | <rt7ndt01khi@news2.newsguy.com> |
| In reply to | #216121 |
On 2021-01-07, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
> On Thu, 7 Jan 2021 12:24:17 -0000 (UTC)
> John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> wrote:
>
>> In article <20210107072855.f388412f6797973018a76d21@eircom.net>,
>> Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>
>>>> Uh, "will be" implies that they don't exist now, which is not the
>>>> case.
>>>
>>> It is the case, there are no autonomous vehicles on the roads
>>> today
>>> only sophisticated driver assist systems that are nearly good enough to
>>> treat as autonomous.
>>
>> That turns out to be fairly pessimal. The car drives itself 95% of the
>> time, while the driver watches a movie or falls asleep.
>
> Hence the requirement for systems that detect this and do something
> about it - which seems not to be as well thought out or reliable as we
> might hope.
>
>> Then the car
>> runs into a situtation it can't handle itself, the driver isn't paying
>> attention, and uh oh.
>
> Yep and that last 5% is the hard 5% which won't get there without
> the 95% getting a lot of road testing. Still if Musk isn't shading the
> truth (granted that's a significant if) even with that effect the overall
> result is an improvement in safety.
>
>> This was what happened when the Uber car killed someone in Arizona.
>> The very bored driver was apparently playing games on her phone.
>
> This is indeed a big problem - two solutions give up on autonomous
> vehicles or work hard to handle that last 5% while trying hard to stop
> people being idiots.
Programming today is a race between software engineers
striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs,
and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots.
So far, the Universe is winning.
-- Rich Cook
--
/~\ Charlie Gibbs | "Some of you may die,
\ / <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> | but it's a sacrifice
X I'm really at ac.dekanfrus | I'm willing to make."
/ \ if you read it the right way. | -- Lord Farquaad (Shrek)
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| From | usenet@only.tnx (Questor) |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-01-08 21:38 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? |
| Message-ID | <5ff8d0be.8867010@news.dslextreme.com> |
| In reply to | #216121 |
On Thu, 7 Jan 2021 12:40:13 +0000, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote: >On Thu, 7 Jan 2021 12:24:17 -0000 (UTC) >John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> wrote: >>In article <20210107072855.f388412f6797973018a76d21@eircom.net>, >>Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote: >>>>Uh, "will be" implies that they don't exist now, which is not the >>>>case. >>> >>> It is the case, there are no autonomous vehicles on the roads >>> today >>>only sophisticated driver assist systems that are nearly good enough to >>>treat as autonomous. >> >>That turns out to be fairly pessimal. The car drives itself 95% of the >>time, while the driver watches a movie or falls asleep. It's nowhere near the fantasy that advocates are spinning. > Hence the requirement for systems that detect this and do something >about it - which seems not to be as well thought out or reliable as we >might hope. > >>Then the car >>runs into a situtation it can't handle itself, the driver isn't paying >>attention, and uh oh. > > Yep and that last 5% is the hard 5% which won't get there without >the 95% getting a lot of road testing. Still if Musk isn't shading the >truth (granted that's a significant if) even with that effect the overall >result is an improvement in safety. It's a lot more than 5%. Self-driving cars perform poorly at night and in any kind of inclement weather -- fog, rain, snow. Even in good weather, they don't always correctly identify objects; one car failed to recognize a man carrying a box on his shoulder as a pedestrian. Waymo cars depend on an extensively detailed map. Every pole, sign, tree, etc. near the road is known. The car doesn't do as well when it gets off its map. There are lots of edge cases. As one example, every year millions of people attend fairs and festivals where they park in grass fields. They park in mostly orderly rows, but they have to avoid rocks, ditches, posts, etc. Often an attendant will direct incoming traffic to the next space. How will self-driving cars handle this? As I pointed out, these are problems in the technical realm. What about the social aspects? How will self-driving cars respond to a police officer directing traffic, such as at a busy intersection when the signal is knocked out? How about when that signal is working, but the police are directing traffic to ignore it? I've got lots more of these kind of problem issues. I'm keeping a list... >>This was what happened when the Uber car killed someone in Arizona. >>The very bored driver was apparently playing games on her phone. > > This is indeed a big problem - two solutions give up on autonomous >vehicles or work hard to handle that last 5% while trying hard to stop >people being idiots. There are two parts to the solution: eliminate the edge cases and eliminate the humans. That's why I say enormous infrastructure changes will be required. I'm not in favor of eliminating humans, as I generally enjoy driving. But I don't think the fantasy of fully self-driving cars will happen at such a point in my life that it will make any difference, if indeed it can be achieved at all. In the medium term, autonomous vehicles will see use mostly as shuttles in closed environments: airport parking lots, retirement communities, corporate and college campuses, amusement parks, etc.
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| From | Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-01-08 18:12 -0700 |
| Subject | Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? |
| Message-ID | <1465591094.631847223.308007.peter_flass-yahoo.com@news.eternal-september.org> |
| In reply to | #216147 |
Questor <usenet@only.tnx> wrote: > There are two parts to the solution: eliminate the edge cases and eliminate the > humans. That's why I say enormous infrastructure changes will be required. > I'm not in favor of eliminating humans, as I generally enjoy driving. But, if you eliminated the humans you’d have the road to yourself, and driving would be even more fun. -- Pete
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| From | Fred Smith <fred@thejanitor.corp> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-01-09 02:56 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? |
| Message-ID | <rtb604$1mdk$1@gioia.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #216156 |
On 2021-01-09, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote: > Questor <usenet@only.tnx> wrote: >> There are two parts to the solution: eliminate the edge cases and eliminate the >> humans. That's why I say enormous infrastructure changes will be required. >> I'm not in favor of eliminating humans, as I generally enjoy driving. > > But, if you eliminated the humans you???d have the road to yourself, and > driving would be even more fun. > So whatever happened to alt.pave-the-world?
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| From | J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-01-08 22:02 -0500 |
| Subject | Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? |
| Message-ID | <i26ivfdtssi98dbirj3ub15bd37ofp19us@4ax.com> |
| In reply to | #216156 |
On Fri, 8 Jan 2021 18:12:33 -0700, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote: >Questor <usenet@only.tnx> wrote: >> There are two parts to the solution: eliminate the edge cases and eliminate the >> humans. That's why I say enormous infrastructure changes will be required. >> I'm not in favor of eliminating humans, as I generally enjoy driving. > >But, if you eliminated the humans you’d have the road to yourself, and >driving would be even more fun. Yup. I think that the skeptics though are thinking in terms of programmers trying to write code to deal with every contingency. Tesla seems to be using big data and pattern recognition instead--they've got a million cars giving them all sorts of data from all sorts of sensors, as well as the actions of the human drivers. The more Teslas on the road, the more data coming in. Eventually either the AI goes insane or gets pretty good.
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| From | usenet@only.tnx (Questor) |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-01-10 11:28 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? |
| Message-ID | <5ffae4db.2908221@news.dslextreme.com> |
| In reply to | #216162 |
On Fri, 08 Jan 2021 22:02:05 -0500, J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote: >On Fri, 8 Jan 2021 18:12:33 -0700, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> >wrote: >>Questor <usenet@only.tnx> wrote: >>>There are two parts to the solution: eliminate the edge cases and eliminate the >>>humans. That's why I say enormous infrastructure changes will be required. >>>I'm not in favor of eliminating humans, as I generally enjoy driving. >> >>But, if you eliminated the humans you’d have the road to yourself, and >>driving would be even more fun. > >Yup. > >I think that the skeptics though are thinking in terms of programmers >trying to write code to deal with every contingency. Tesla seems to >be using big data and pattern recognition instead--they've got a >million cars giving them all sorts of data from all sorts of sensors, >as well as the actions of the human drivers. The more Teslas on the >road, the more data coming in. That's great after it learns; maybe not so great for anyone involved in a Tesla's first-time encounter with a new situation.
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| From | Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-01-10 06:40 -0700 |
| Subject | Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? |
| Message-ID | <1708663633.631978214.573221.peter_flass-yahoo.com@news.eternal-september.org> |
| In reply to | #216162 |
J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote: > On Fri, 8 Jan 2021 18:12:33 -0700, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> > wrote: > >> Questor <usenet@only.tnx> wrote: >>> There are two parts to the solution: eliminate the edge cases and eliminate the >>> humans. That's why I say enormous infrastructure changes will be required. >>> I'm not in favor of eliminating humans, as I generally enjoy driving. >> >> But, if you eliminated the humans you’d have the road to yourself, and >> driving would be even more fun. > > Yup. > > I think that the skeptics though are thinking in terms of programmers > trying to write code to deal with every contingency. Tesla seems to > be using big data and pattern recognition instead--they've got a > million cars giving them all sorts of data from all sorts of sensors, > as well as the actions of the human drivers. The more Teslas on the > road, the more data coming in. > > Eventually either the AI goes insane or gets pretty good. > Driving in some cities, I think insane. -- Pete
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| From | maus <maus@dmaus.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-01-11 08:41 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? |
| Message-ID | <slrnrvo3p8.875.maus@dmaus.org> |
| In reply to | #216183 |
On 2021-01-10, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote: > J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote: >> On Fri, 8 Jan 2021 18:12:33 -0700, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> >> wrote: >> >>> Questor <usenet@only.tnx> wrote: >>>> There are two parts to the solution: eliminate the edge cases and eliminate the >>>> humans. That's why I say enormous infrastructure changes will be required. >>>> I'm not in favor of eliminating humans, as I generally enjoy driving. >>> >>> But, if you eliminated the humans you’d have the road to yourself, and >>> driving would be even more fun. >> >> Yup. >> >> I think that the skeptics though are thinking in terms of programmers >> trying to write code to deal with every contingency. Tesla seems to >> be using big data and pattern recognition instead--they've got a >> million cars giving them all sorts of data from all sorts of sensors, >> as well as the actions of the human drivers. The more Teslas on the >> road, the more data coming in. >> >> Eventually either the AI goes insane or gets pretty good. >> > > Driving in some cities, I think insane. Everyone should go to Rome, Italy for to see mad traffic. Do not bring your own car. -- greymausg@mail.com
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| From | Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-01-11 15:56 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? |
| Message-ID | <rthsft$ojg$1@newsreader4.netcologne.de> |
| In reply to | #216221 |
maus <maus@dmaus.org> schrieb: > Everyone should go to Rome, Italy for to see mad traffic. Do not bring > your own car. A few decades ago, I visited Rome on a school trip. There was one dangerous traffic situation. A friend and I were crossing a green pedestrian traffic light, when a police car (no lights flashing, no siren, high speed) almost ran us down. On the other hand, you could cross a busy street (with n lanes, cars were using approximately 1.5*n of them), and as long as you walked purposefully so motorists could see where you were going, you were quite safe. I haven't been to Rome in quite some time, so things may have changed.
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| From | "Kerr-Mudd,John" <notsaying@127.0.0.1> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-01-11 21:16 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? |
| Message-ID | <XnsACAFD626968E3admin127001@144.76.35.252> |
| In reply to | #216225 |
On Mon, 11 Jan 2021 15:56:45 GMT, Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> wrote: > maus <maus@dmaus.org> schrieb: > >> Everyone should go to Rome, Italy for to see mad traffic. Do not bring >> your own car. > > A few decades ago, I visited Rome on a school trip. > > There was one dangerous traffic situation. > > A friend and I were crossing a green pedestrian traffic light, > when a police car (no lights flashing, no siren, high speed) > almost ran us down. > > On the other hand, you could cross a busy street (with n lanes, > cars were using approximately 1.5*n of them), and as long as you > walked purposefully so motorists could see where you were going, > you were quite safe. > > I haven't been to Rome in quite some time, so things may have > changed. > The chariot-drivers are still as keen as ever. Coffee & wine, what a combo! -- Bah, and indeed, Humbug.
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| From | maus <maus@dmaus.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-01-09 08:56 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? |
| Message-ID | <slrnrvirtv.3md.maus@dmaus.org> |
| In reply to | #216156 |
On 2021-01-09, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote: > Questor <usenet@only.tnx> wrote: >> There are two parts to the solution: eliminate the edge cases and eliminate the >> humans. That's why I say enormous infrastructure changes will be required. >> I'm not in favor of eliminating humans, as I generally enjoy driving. > > But, if you eliminated the humans you’d have the road to yourself, and > driving would be even more fun. > > Are you not human :) I know a dection of goood road around here which has been replaced by motorway. The old road is now very dangerous,, as it is now used a racetrack by what we call `boy drivers'. -- greymausg@mail.com
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| From | J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-01-07 11:46 -0500 |
| Subject | Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? |
| Message-ID | <pkeevf1ea8f7vg908lcof6b9supv0u6i3e@4ax.com> |
| In reply to | #216120 |
On Thu, 7 Jan 2021 12:24:17 -0000 (UTC), John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> wrote: >In article <20210107072855.f388412f6797973018a76d21@eircom.net>, >Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote: >>> Uh, "will be" implies that they don't exist now, which is not the >>> case. >> >> It is the case, there are no autonomous vehicles on the roads today >>only sophisticated driver assist systems that are nearly good enough to >>treat as autonomous. > >That turns out to be fairly pessimal. The car drives itself 95% of the >time, while the driver watches a movie or falls asleep. Then the car >runs into a situtation it can't handle itself, the driver isn't paying >attention, and uh oh. > >This was what happened when the Uber car killed someone in Arizona. >The very bored driver was apparently playing games on her phone. > >Commercial airplanes have the same problem with autopilots that can >handle all but a few situtations. I gather there are proposals to run >flight simulators in the cockpit to keep the crew's skills up. Skills isn't the issue, being "behind the airplan" is the issue--when something goes wrong people have been struggling to stay awake with nothing to do but watch the robot fly suddenly have to catch up with what the robot is doing.
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| From | Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-01-07 19:29 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: how not do self-drive, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? |
| Message-ID | <rt7ndu21khi@news2.newsguy.com> |
| In reply to | #216124 |
On 2021-01-07, J Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote: > On Thu, 7 Jan 2021 12:24:17 -0000 (UTC), John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> > wrote: > >> Commercial airplanes have the same problem with autopilots that can >> handle all but a few situtations. I gather there are proposals to run >> flight simulators in the cockpit to keep the crew's skills up. > > Skills isn't the issue, being "behind the airplan" is the issue--when > something goes wrong people have been struggling to stay awake with > nothing to do but watch the robot fly suddenly have to catch up with > what the robot is doing. Yes, being "behind the airplane" is a big problem - but deterioration of basic flying skills and airmanship has been identified as a rising cause for concern in today's highly-automated aircraft. -- /~\ Charlie Gibbs | "Some of you may die, \ / <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> | but it's a sacrifice X I'm really at ac.dekanfrus | I'm willing to make." / \ if you read it the right way. | -- Lord Farquaad (Shrek)
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| From | usenet@only.tnx (Questor) |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-01-07 01:41 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? |
| Message-ID | <5ff666c8.3706509@news.dslextreme.com> |
| In reply to | #216059 |
On Tue, 5 Jan 2021 21:21:33 +0000, Vir Campestris <vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> wrote: >On 05/01/2021 18:14, Questor wrote: >> That's a very weak justification. You're saying that it's okay for self-driving >> cars to kill and maim people in accidents, as long as it can be statistically >> shown that they do so less frequently than humans. Would you care to explain >> that argument to someone who just lost a loved one in an accident with a >> self-driving vehicle? > >Let's turn that on its head. > >You're saying that it'll be OK for humans to drive cars even though it >can be statistically shown that they kill more humans than self-driving >cars. We permit people to engage in many activities that are dangerous. >The self drivers will be a lot better. Just because the manufacturers >have to be able to survive the lawsuits from the unlucky few. It could be decided, through court cases and/or legislation, to indemnify manufacturers. Many, many issues regarding autonomous vehicles have not been settled yet.
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| From | Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-01-07 07:32 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? |
| Message-ID | <20210107073255.17c1cc031ae501b266be62bb@eircom.net> |
| In reply to | #216112 |
On Thu, 07 Jan 2021 01:41:31 GMT usenet@only.tnx (Questor) wrote: > On Tue, 5 Jan 2021 21:21:33 +0000, Vir Campestris > >You're saying that it'll be OK for humans to drive cars even though it > >can be statistically shown that they kill more humans than self-driving > >cars. > > We permit people to engage in many activities that are dangerous. We discourage (often to the point of imprisonment) people from engaging in activities that are dangerous to others. Driving is far more dangerous to others (especially pedestrians and cyclists) than it is to the driver. -- Steve O'Hara-Smith | Directable Mirror Arrays C:\>WIN | A better way to focus the sun The computer obeys and wins. | licences available see You lose and Bill collects. | http://www.sohara.org/
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| From | Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-01-02 14:06 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? |
| Message-ID | <20210102140629.53b3534e5ba6ee8fe2d229d0@eircom.net> |
| In reply to | #215854 |
On Sat, 2 Jan 2021 06:02:37 -0700 Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote: > Government’s part should be to develop a plan that takes into account all > aspects of a conversion to mostly EVs. Maybe I’m just not up on the Perhaps, but this is likely to be a lengthy process and technology is not going to stand still in the meantime. > literature, but someone should figure out how many charging stations are > needed, where they’re needed, and how they are going to be powered, and > how they’re hoing to be indtalled and paid for. I think it more prudent to take an approach that takes into account the limited availability of EVs and the rate of uptake (which will no doubt be an accelerating one) and tries to stay just a little ahead of the curve with infrastructure support so as not to be caught flat footed if someone develops something unexpected (think CFL rollout punctuated by LEDs suddenly getting good). -- Steve O'Hara-Smith | Directable Mirror Arrays C:\>WIN | A better way to focus the sun The computer obeys and wins. | licences available see You lose and Bill collects. | http://www.sohara.org/
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