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Touch screens in cars

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  Touch screens in cars Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-20 05:46 -0700
    Re: Touch screens in cars "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2021-01-20 14:24 +0100
      Re: Touch screens in cars Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-22 17:10 -0700
        Re: Touch screens in cars J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-22 19:55 -0500
        Re: Touch screens in cars scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2021-01-23 00:55 +0000
    Re: Touch screens in cars Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-20 13:10 +0000
      Re: Touch screens in cars "Kerr-Mudd,John" <notsaying@127.0.0.1> - 2021-01-20 16:16 +0000
        Re: Touch screens in cars Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-20 16:51 +0000
          Re: Touch screens in cars J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-20 12:52 -0500
            Re: Touch screens in cars Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-20 19:37 +0000
              Re: Touch screens in cars Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-20 18:00 -0500
              Re: Touch screens in cars Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-01-22 17:10 -0700
                Re: Touch screens in cars Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-22 20:34 -0500
                  Re: Touch screens in cars J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-22 20:45 -0500
              Re: Touch screens in cars dave@661.org (David Griffith) - 2021-02-09 02:04 +0000
            Re: Touch screens in cars Niklas Karlsson <anksil@yahoo.se> - 2021-01-21 13:03 +0000
              Re: Touch screens in cars Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-21 18:10 +0000
                Re: Touch screens in cars J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-21 17:01 -0500
        Re: Touch screens in cars Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-20 13:21 -0500
          Re: Touch screens in cars J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-01-20 14:22 -0500
            Re: Touch screens in cars Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-20 14:48 -0500
              Re: Touch screens in cars Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-20 20:23 +0000
                Re: Touch screens in cars "Kerr-Mudd,John" <notsaying@127.0.0.1> - 2021-01-20 21:31 +0000
                  Re: Touch screens in cars Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-20 22:01 +0000
                    Re: Touch screens in cars Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-20 18:14 -0500
                    Re: Touch screens in cars Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2021-01-21 09:19 +0000
                    Re: Touch screens in cars "Kerr-Mudd,John" <notsaying@127.0.0.1> - 2021-01-21 10:06 +0000
                    Re: Touch screens in cars Niklas Karlsson <anksil@yahoo.se> - 2021-01-22 07:37 +0000
                      Re: Touch screens in cars Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2021-01-22 07:53 +0000
                        Re: Touch screens in cars Niklas Karlsson <anksil@yahoo.se> - 2021-01-22 12:02 +0000
                      Re: lotsa RAM, Touch screens in cars John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-01-22 20:06 +0000
                Re: Touch screens in cars Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-20 18:08 -0500
                  Re: Touch screens in cars Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-21 00:48 +0000
    Re: Touch screens in cars Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-01-20 08:44 -0500
    Re: Touch screens in cars scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2021-01-20 15:45 +0000
      Re: Touch screens in cars Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-20 16:28 +0000
        Re: Touch screens in cars Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-20 16:51 +0000
    Re: Touch screens in cars JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> - 2021-01-20 09:55 -0600
      Re: Touch screens in cars "Kerr-Mudd,John" <notsaying@127.0.0.1> - 2021-01-20 16:22 +0000
        Re: Touch screens in cars Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-20 16:51 +0000
          Re: Touch screens in cars Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> - 2021-01-20 15:29 -0400
          Re: Touch screens in cars "Kerr-Mudd,John" <notsaying@127.0.0.1> - 2021-01-20 21:33 +0000
        Re: Touch screens in cars Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-01-20 16:39 +0000
          Re: Touch screens in cars "Kerr-Mudd,John" <notsaying@127.0.0.1> - 2021-01-20 21:34 +0000
    Re: Touch screens in cars Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2021-01-20 22:35 -0500
      Re: Touch screens in cars Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-21 06:18 +0000
      Re: Touch screens in cars Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-01-21 06:18 +0000

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#216414 — Touch screens in cars

I was thinking about my perennial rant about drivers having to take their
eyes iff the road to use touchscreen controls, and have thought of a
(probably not original solution). Fabricate the screen with a slightly
raised grid that the driver can feel, and then lay out the controls
relative to the grid. For a given set of controls  the driver might know,
for example, that to turn up the A/C the button is second column from the
right, third row, It should be possible to perform frequently used
operations without taking his eyes off the road, just like pre touch-screen
operation.

-- 
Pete

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#216415

On 20/01/2021 13.46, Peter Flass wrote:
> I was thinking about my perennial rant about drivers having to take their
> eyes iff the road to use touchscreen controls, and have thought of a
> (probably not original solution). Fabricate the screen with a slightly
> raised grid that the driver can feel, and then lay out the controls
> relative to the grid. For a given set of controls  the driver might know,
> for example, that to turn up the A/C the button is second column from the
> right, third row, It should be possible to perform frequently used
> operations without taking his eyes off the road, just like pre touch-screen
> operation.
> 

I thought of that.

Problem would be, beside the software redesign, whether the grid would
impact visibility of the screen, distort it. And would also impact
features like touching on maps.

Another solution would be a physical row of buttons below or besides the
screen, possible with labels that can be changed instantly, by the software.

-- 
Cheers, Carlos.

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#216471

Carlos E.R. <robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:
> On 20/01/2021 13.46, Peter Flass wrote:
>> I was thinking about my perennial rant about drivers having to take their
>> eyes iff the road to use touchscreen controls, and have thought of a
>> (probably not original solution). Fabricate the screen with a slightly
>> raised grid that the driver can feel, and then lay out the controls
>> relative to the grid. For a given set of controls  the driver might know,
>> for example, that to turn up the A/C the button is second column from the
>> right, third row, It should be possible to perform frequently used
>> operations without taking his eyes off the road, just like pre touch-screen
>> operation.
>> 
> 
> I thought of that.
> 
> Problem would be, beside the software redesign, whether the grid would
> impact visibility of the screen, distort it. And would also impact
> features like touching on maps.
> 
> Another solution would be a physical row of buttons below or besides the
> screen, possible with labels that can be changed instantly, by the software.
> 

That’s good too.

-- 
Pete

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#216475

On Fri, 22 Jan 2021 17:10:37 -0700, Peter Flass
<peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:

>Carlos E.R. <robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:
>> On 20/01/2021 13.46, Peter Flass wrote:
>>> I was thinking about my perennial rant about drivers having to take their
>>> eyes iff the road to use touchscreen controls, and have thought of a
>>> (probably not original solution). Fabricate the screen with a slightly
>>> raised grid that the driver can feel, and then lay out the controls
>>> relative to the grid. For a given set of controls  the driver might know,
>>> for example, that to turn up the A/C the button is second column from the
>>> right, third row, It should be possible to perform frequently used
>>> operations without taking his eyes off the road, just like pre touch-screen
>>> operation.
>>> 
>> 
>> I thought of that.
>> 
>> Problem would be, beside the software redesign, whether the grid would
>> impact visibility of the screen, distort it. And would also impact
>> features like touching on maps.
>> 
>> Another solution would be a physical row of buttons below or besides the
>> screen, possible with labels that can be changed instantly, by the software.
>> 
>
>That’s good too.

Or just use old fashioned mechanical controls in a carefully designed
ergonomic layout and make the touch screen an alternative.

But a lot of software people are idiots.  MIL-SPEC for any ordnance
says that the safe-arm system must physically interrupt the
pyrotechnic chain.  So we have a rocket big enough to stop a falling
tank (literally--we were supposed to be dropping the tank out of an
airplane at something like 300 feet altitude).  I'm the parachute guy.
The rocket guy has a kid who's describing the control system.  He's
going to do the safe-arm entirely in software.  I'm the only one in
the room who has a problem with this.  My manager doesn't get it.  His
manager doesn't get it.  I finally got it across--"If this thing fires
inside the airplane, it tears the airplane apart and everybody dies.
Now, are _you_ willing to ride with it?"  His manager looked at him.
My manager looked at him.  He thought about it for a while and allowed
as to how he'd reconsider his design.

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#216476

Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> writes:
>Carlos E.R. <robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:
>> On 20/01/2021 13.46, Peter Flass wrote:
>>> I was thinking about my perennial rant about drivers having to take their
>>> eyes iff the road to use touchscreen controls, and have thought of a
>>> (probably not original solution). Fabricate the screen with a slightly
>>> raised grid that the driver can feel, and then lay out the controls
>>> relative to the grid. For a given set of controls  the driver might know,
>>> for example, that to turn up the A/C the button is second column from the
>>> right, third row, It should be possible to perform frequently used
>>> operations without taking his eyes off the road, just like pre touch-screen
>>> operation.
>>> 
>> 
>> I thought of that.
>> 
>> Problem would be, beside the software redesign, whether the grid would
>> impact visibility of the screen, distort it. And would also impact
>> features like touching on maps.
>> 
>> Another solution would be a physical row of buttons below or besides the
>> screen, possible with labels that can be changed instantly, by the software.
>> 
>
>That’s good too.

Better would be buttons on the steering wheel, like my car, or on the turn signal
lever like my truck.  scroll & select.

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#216416

On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 05:46:19 -0700
Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:

> I was thinking about my perennial rant about drivers having to take their
> eyes iff the road to use touchscreen controls, and have thought of a
> (probably not original solution). Fabricate the screen with a slightly
> raised grid that the driver can feel, and then lay out the controls
> relative to the grid. For a given set of controls  the driver might know,
> for example, that to turn up the A/C the button is second column from the
> right, third row, It should be possible to perform frequently used
> operations without taking his eyes off the road, just like pre
> touch-screen operation.

	I like that a lot provided the manufacturers refrain from
rearranging things every update. It should even be easy enough to retrofit
using something like PCB layout tape (who else remembers using that ?).

-- 
Steve O'Hara-Smith                          |   Directable Mirror Arrays
C:\>WIN                                     | A better way to focus the sun
The computer obeys and wins.                |    licences available see
You lose and Bill collects.                 |    http://www.sohara.org/

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#216420

On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 13:10:43 GMT, Ahem A Rivet's Shot
<steveo@eircom.net> wrote: 

> On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 05:46:19 -0700
> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
> 
>> I was thinking about my perennial rant about drivers having to take
>> their eyes iff the road to use touchscreen controls, and have thought
>> of a (probably not original solution). Fabricate the screen with a
>> slightly raised grid that the driver can feel, and then lay out the
>> controls relative to the grid. For a given set of controls  the
>> driver might know, for example, that to turn up the A/C the button is
>> second column from the right, third row, It should be possible to
>> perform frequently used operations without taking his eyes off the
>> road, just like pre touch-screen operation.

I trust that the James Bond Eject button isn't next to it.
> 
>      I like that a lot provided the manufacturers refrain from
> rearranging things every update. It should even be easy enough to
> retrofit using something like PCB layout tape (who else remembers
> using that ?). 
> 

Pah, I recall when "all" headlights were round & 6" diameter, so 
interchangeable. 

As recently (20 years? that's OK here) encountered with phone charging 
socket/plugs.



-- 
Bah, and indeed, Humbug.

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#216425

On 2021-01-20, Kerr-Mudd,John <notsaying@127.0.0.1> wrote:

> On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 13:10:43 GMT, Ahem A Rivet's Shot
> <steveo@eircom.net> wrote: 
>
>> On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 05:46:19 -0700
>> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> 
>>> I was thinking about my perennial rant about drivers having to take
>>> their eyes iff the road to use touchscreen controls, and have thought
>>> of a (probably not original solution). Fabricate the screen with a
>>> slightly raised grid that the driver can feel, and then lay out the
>>> controls relative to the grid. For a given set of controls  the
>>> driver might know, for example, that to turn up the A/C the button is
>>> second column from the right, third row, It should be possible to
>>> perform frequently used operations without taking his eyes off the
>>> road, just like pre touch-screen operation.
>
> I trust that the James Bond Eject button isn't next to it.
>> 
>>      I like that a lot provided the manufacturers refrain from
>> rearranging things every update.

Oh well, it was a nice thought.  Watch out for that eject button
next year.

>> It should even be easy enough to retrofit using something like
>> PCB layout tape (who else remembers using that ?). 
>
> Pah, I recall when "all" headlights were round & 6" diameter, so 
> interchangeable. 

Yeah, thank God the threat of standardization was once again averted.

> As recently (20 years? that's OK here) encountered with phone charging 
> socket/plugs.

But Apple keeps on trying.  That's why our car has cables with
micro-USB connectors for my gadgets and Lightning connectors
for my wife's gadgets.

-- 
/~\  Charlie Gibbs                  |  "Some of you may die,
\ /  <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid>      |  but it's a sacrifice
 X   I'm really at ac.dekanfrus     |  I'm willing to make."
/ \  if you read it the right way.  |    -- Lord Farquaad (Shrek)

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#216428

On 20 Jan 2021 16:51:14 GMT, Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid>
wrote:

>On 2021-01-20, Kerr-Mudd,John <notsaying@127.0.0.1> wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 13:10:43 GMT, Ahem A Rivet's Shot
>> <steveo@eircom.net> wrote: 
>>
>>> On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 05:46:19 -0700
>>> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> I was thinking about my perennial rant about drivers having to take
>>>> their eyes iff the road to use touchscreen controls, and have thought
>>>> of a (probably not original solution). Fabricate the screen with a
>>>> slightly raised grid that the driver can feel, and then lay out the
>>>> controls relative to the grid. For a given set of controls  the
>>>> driver might know, for example, that to turn up the A/C the button is
>>>> second column from the right, third row, It should be possible to
>>>> perform frequently used operations without taking his eyes off the
>>>> road, just like pre touch-screen operation.
>>
>> I trust that the James Bond Eject button isn't next to it.
>>> 
>>>      I like that a lot provided the manufacturers refrain from
>>> rearranging things every update.
>
>Oh well, it was a nice thought.  Watch out for that eject button
>next year.
>
>>> It should even be easy enough to retrofit using something like
>>> PCB layout tape (who else remembers using that ?). 
>>
>> Pah, I recall when "all" headlights were round & 6" diameter, so 
>> interchangeable. 
>
>Yeah, thank God the threat of standardization was once again averted.

Would be nice if they would come up with a standard bulb.  The sealed
beam is dead, which I view as a good thing, but there is no reason why
there have to be a dozen different varieties of bulb to go in the back
of the things.

>> As recently (20 years? that's OK here) encountered with phone charging 
>> socket/plugs.
>
>But Apple keeps on trying.  That's why our car has cables with
>micro-USB connectors for my gadgets and Lightning connectors
>for my wife's gadgets.

Micro-USB is a "standard" that needs to die the death though.  The
things are almost unbelievably fragile.

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#216435

On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 12:52:39 -0500
J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:

> Micro-USB is a "standard" that needs to die the death though.  The
> things are almost unbelievably fragile.

	USB-C is a great improvement, at least it doesn't take three
attempts to get it the right way round (yes I know there are only two ways
but ...).

-- 
Steve O'Hara-Smith                          |   Directable Mirror Arrays
C:\>WIN                                     | A better way to focus the sun
The computer obeys and wins.                |    licences available see
You lose and Bill collects.                 |    http://www.sohara.org/

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#216443

Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> writes:

> On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 12:52:39 -0500
> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Micro-USB is a "standard" that needs to die the death though.  The
>> things are almost unbelievably fragile.
>
> 	USB-C is a great improvement, at least it doesn't take three
> attempts to get it the right way round (yes I know there are only two ways
> but ...).

I've done 3 attempts and sometimes 4.

-- 
Dan Espen

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#216472

Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
> On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 12:52:39 -0500
> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> Micro-USB is a "standard" that needs to die the death though.  The
>> things are almost unbelievably fragile.
> 
> 	USB-C is a great improvement, at least it doesn't take three
> attempts to get it the right way round (yes I know there are only two ways
> but ...).
> 

None of those cables seem to have a long lifespan for me. As someone who’s
used to cords and connectors lasting virtually forever, they’re a big
disappointment.

-- 
Pete

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#216477

Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> writes:

> Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>> On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 12:52:39 -0500
>> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>>> Micro-USB is a "standard" that needs to die the death though.  The
>>> things are almost unbelievably fragile.
>> 
>> 	USB-C is a great improvement, at least it doesn't take three
>> attempts to get it the right way round (yes I know there are only two ways
>> but ...).
>
> None of those cables seem to have a long lifespan for me. As someone who’s
> used to cords and connectors lasting virtually forever, they’re a big
> disappointment.

I've had more than one mini-usb cable go bad.
The ones attached to my tablet especially.
They break right at the cable/plug interface.

For USB-C to USB I just got some of these:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B085M781SW/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_image_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

They have nyylon wrapped around the cable.  They feel like they'll
last longer.

-- 
Dan Espen

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#216478

On Fri, 22 Jan 2021 20:34:32 -0500, Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com>
wrote:

>Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> writes:
>
>> Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>> On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 12:52:39 -0500
>>> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Micro-USB is a "standard" that needs to die the death though.  The
>>>> things are almost unbelievably fragile.
>>> 
>>> 	USB-C is a great improvement, at least it doesn't take three
>>> attempts to get it the right way round (yes I know there are only two ways
>>> but ...).
>>
>> None of those cables seem to have a long lifespan for me. As someone who’s
>> used to cords and connectors lasting virtually forever, they’re a big
>> disappointment.
>
>I've had more than one mini-usb cable go bad.
>The ones attached to my tablet especially.
>They break right at the cable/plug interface.
>
>For USB-C to USB I just got some of these:
>
>https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B085M781SW/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_image_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
>
>They have nyylon wrapped around the cable.  They feel like they'll
>last longer.

The one that's annoying me right now is the dock for my Surface.  It's
a proprietary connector and the cable is hard-wired to the dock.
Apparently the cable has gone bust.  Why Microsoft can't just use a
USB-C connector like the rest of the world is a mystery (well, it's
not really, they want to sell you the proprietary dock).

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#216920

Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
> On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 12:52:39 -0500
> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:

>> Micro-USB is a "standard" that needs to die the death though.  The
>> things are almost unbelievably fragile.

>         USB-C is a great improvement, at least it doesn't take three
> attempts to get it the right way round (yes I know there are only two ways
> but ...).

I've had annoying trouble with USB-C when trying to add such connectors 
to a circuit board design.

-- 
David Griffith
dave@661.org

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#216456

On 2021-01-20, J  Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Micro-USB is a "standard" that needs to die the death though.  The
> things are almost unbelievably fragile.

Really? I guess I've just been lucky, never had issues with my micro-USB
devices. Now, the Lightning connector on iPhones tends to wear out after
a couple of years. My current iPhone charges wirelessly, at least when
I'm at home, so that should mitigate the issue.

USB C definitely is an improvement, though, no question.

Niklas
-- 
"Once packets are in, who cares where they go out? That's not my department,"
says Wernher von Route.

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#216457

On 2021-01-21, Niklas Karlsson <anksil@yahoo.se> wrote:

> On 2021-01-20, J  Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Micro-USB is a "standard" that needs to die the death though.  The
>> things are almost unbelievably fragile.
>
> Really? I guess I've just been lucky, never had issues with my micro-USB
> devices.

Me too, although I try to be careful with them.

> Now, the Lightning connector on iPhones tends to wear out after
> a couple of years.

You're expected to get a new phone by then anyway.

On the other hand, the micro-USB connector on my LG A-341 flip phone
has been holding out for a lot longer than that.

> My current iPhone charges wirelessly, at least when
> I'm at home, so that should mitigate the issue.

At least until _that_ standard changes.

Recommended reading: _Unauthorized Bread_ by Cory Doctorow
(part of a collection titled _Radicalized_).

> USB C definitely is an improvement, though, no question.

Haven't gotten into that one yet.

-- 
/~\  Charlie Gibbs                  |  "Some of you may die,
\ /  <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid>      |  but it's a sacrifice
 X   I'm really at ac.dekanfrus     |  I'm willing to make."
/ \  if you read it the right way.  |    -- Lord Farquaad (Shrek)

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#216462

On 21 Jan 2021 18:10:55 GMT, Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid>
wrote:

>On 2021-01-21, Niklas Karlsson <anksil@yahoo.se> wrote:
>
>> On 2021-01-20, J  Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Micro-USB is a "standard" that needs to die the death though.  The
>>> things are almost unbelievably fragile.
>>
>> Really? I guess I've just been lucky, never had issues with my micro-USB
>> devices.
>
>Me too, although I try to be careful with them.

Seems to be the connector on the cable that goes.  I need to get a new
one to charge my keyboard--the one I'm using is chancy.

>> Now, the Lightning connector on iPhones tends to wear out after
>> a couple of years.
>
>You're expected to get a new phone by then anyway.
>
>On the other hand, the micro-USB connector on my LG A-341 flip phone
>has been holding out for a lot longer than that.
>
>> My current iPhone charges wirelessly, at least when
>> I'm at home, so that should mitigate the issue.
>
>At least until _that_ standard changes.
>
>Recommended reading: _Unauthorized Bread_ by Cory Doctorow
>(part of a collection titled _Radicalized_).
>
>> USB C definitely is an improvement, though, no question.
>
>Haven't gotten into that one yet.

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#216430

"Kerr-Mudd,John" <notsaying@127.0.0.1> writes:

> On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 13:10:43 GMT, Ahem A Rivet's Shot
> <steveo@eircom.net> wrote: 
>
>> On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 05:46:19 -0700
>> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> 
>>> I was thinking about my perennial rant about drivers having to take
>>> their eyes iff the road to use touchscreen controls, and have thought
>>> of a (probably not original solution). Fabricate the screen with a
>>> slightly raised grid that the driver can feel, and then lay out the
>>> controls relative to the grid. For a given set of controls  the
>>> driver might know, for example, that to turn up the A/C the button is
>>> second column from the right, third row, It should be possible to
>>> perform frequently used operations without taking his eyes off the
>>> road, just like pre touch-screen operation.
>
> I trust that the James Bond Eject button isn't next to it.
>> 
>>      I like that a lot provided the manufacturers refrain from
>> rearranging things every update. It should even be easy enough to
>> retrofit using something like PCB layout tape (who else remembers
>> using that ?). 
>
> Pah, I recall when "all" headlights were round & 6" diameter, so 
> interchangeable. 

Yep, and they would burn out pretty quickly.
I'm not sure what they are using now, but if they go the LED route
changing them shouldn't be much of an issue.

> As recently (20 years? that's OK here) encountered with phone charging 
> socket/plugs.

My latest phone (S10E) uses usb-c.
Now I can just use a generic cable.
Yay!

-- 
Dan Espen

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#216431

On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 13:21:44 -0500, Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com>
wrote:

>"Kerr-Mudd,John" <notsaying@127.0.0.1> writes:
>
>> On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 13:10:43 GMT, Ahem A Rivet's Shot
>> <steveo@eircom.net> wrote: 
>>
>>> On Wed, 20 Jan 2021 05:46:19 -0700
>>> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> I was thinking about my perennial rant about drivers having to take
>>>> their eyes iff the road to use touchscreen controls, and have thought
>>>> of a (probably not original solution). Fabricate the screen with a
>>>> slightly raised grid that the driver can feel, and then lay out the
>>>> controls relative to the grid. For a given set of controls  the
>>>> driver might know, for example, that to turn up the A/C the button is
>>>> second column from the right, third row, It should be possible to
>>>> perform frequently used operations without taking his eyes off the
>>>> road, just like pre touch-screen operation.
>>
>> I trust that the James Bond Eject button isn't next to it.
>>> 
>>>      I like that a lot provided the manufacturers refrain from
>>> rearranging things every update. It should even be easy enough to
>>> retrofit using something like PCB layout tape (who else remembers
>>> using that ?). 
>>
>> Pah, I recall when "all" headlights were round & 6" diameter, so 
>> interchangeable. 
>
>Yep, and they would burn out pretty quickly.
>I'm not sure what they are using now, but if they go the LED route
>changing them shouldn't be much of an issue.

They were using halogens for a while--IIRC the H3 and H4 were pretty
much the Euro standard (H3 for hi- or lo- only, H4 for hi-lo) but
there are a bunch of other similar ones.  LED headlights aren't really
designed for bulb replacement--replace the whole assembly if it ever
needs it, but they should last the life of the vehicle.

>> As recently (20 years? that's OK here) encountered with phone charging 
>> socket/plugs.
>
>My latest phone (S10E) uses usb-c.
>Now I can just use a generic cable.
>Yay!

And it can actually carry a decent current.

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