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can't get LibreOffice to run on XP Pro SP3

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  can't get LibreOffice to run on XP Pro SP3 James Wobanwu <jwob@none.net> - 2021-03-30 18:18 -0400
    Re: can't get LibreOffice to run on XP Pro SP3 VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> - 2021-03-30 21:45 -0500
      Re: can't get LibreOffice to run on XP Pro SP3 James Wobanwu <jwob@none.net> - 2021-03-31 11:53 -0400
    Re: can't get LibreOffice to run on XP Pro SP3 Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2021-03-31 00:29 -0400
      Re: can't get LibreOffice to run on XP Pro SP3 VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> - 2021-03-31 00:41 -0500
        Re: can't get LibreOffice to run on XP Pro SP3 VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> - 2021-03-31 00:52 -0500
        Re: can't get LibreOffice to run on XP Pro SP3 Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2021-03-31 15:28 -0400
          Re: can't get LibreOffice to run on XP Pro SP3 James Wobanwu <jwob@none.net> - 2021-04-01 12:18 -0400

#12076 — can't get LibreOffice to run on XP Pro SP3

I have an old Toshiba Pentium II with XP Pro SP3 and I am trying to get 
LibreOffice to run on it.  I have downloaded the last versions of LO, 
which appears to be 5.4, that will run on XP.  I have tried both 
portable and non-portable versions.  No error messages, just when I 
click on LO, the hard drive starts to churn and then stops after a while 
and the program doesn't open.  I even tried a 5.3.X version but same 
behavior.   Any help here would be welcome and thanks.

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#12077

James Wobanwu <jwob@none.net> wrote:

> I have an old Toshiba Pentium II with XP Pro SP3 and I am trying to get 
> LibreOffice to run on it.  I have downloaded the last versions of LO, 
> which appears to be 5.4, that will run on XP.  I have tried both 
> portable and non-portable versions.  No error messages, just when I 
> click on LO, the hard drive starts to churn and then stops after a while 
> and the program doesn't open.  I even tried a 5.3.X version but same 
> behavior.   Any help here would be welcome and thanks.

If the program started to load but crashed, there might be an entry in
Event Viewer's logs about the program's crash.

At https://downloadarchive.documentfoundation.org/libreoffice/old/, on
which hyperlink did you click?  There is no 5.4 version in the archive,
but there are many 5.4.x versions.  Under which one did you go?  If you
went under:

https://downloadarchive.documentfoundation.org/libreoffice/old/5.4.7.2/

and then under the win subfolder, which bitwidth did you choose for the
download?  There is no 64-bit version of Windows XP.  (*)

(*) What was called Windows XP x64 was a crippled version of Windows 
    Server 2003 with a Windows XP desktop GUI.  If not designed to run 
    under a server version of Windows, a program may not run.  Windows 
    XP x64 is bogus, and Microsoft's attempt to glom onto the burgeoning 
    64-bit consumer demand along with a shammed attempt to catch up with 
    other 64-bit operating systems.  A program that won't run under a 
    server edition of Windows may also not run under the sham named 
    Windows XP x64.

Ouch, a really old Pentium 2 (launched back in 1997).  That's a painful
struggle.  Is that the one with Slot2 processors?  Those slid into a
slot, not socket, had tangs to hold it into the motherboard slot, and
put a lot of stress on the slot and mobo due to its weight; see
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slot_2.  Are you prepping it for donation
to the Smithsonian museum?  

SSE extensions weren't available until the Pentium 3.  Because of SSE,
you sure LO 5.4.x doesn't have a minimum hardware requirement of a
Pentium 3 CPU?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streaming_SIMD_Extensions

Version 5.4.x required the Microsoft Visual C++ 2015 runtime libs.  LO
doesn't include those.  Do you have them?

https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/topic/the-latest-supported-visual-c-downloads-2647da03-1eea-4433-9aff-95f26a218cc0

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#12081

On 3/30/21 10:45 PM, VanguardLH wrote:
> James Wobanwu <jwob@none.net> wrote:
> 
>> I have an old Toshiba Pentium II with XP Pro SP3 and I am trying to get
>> LibreOffice to run on it.  I have downloaded the last versions of LO,
>> which appears to be 5.4, that will run on XP.  I have tried both
>> portable and non-portable versions.  No error messages, just when I
>> click on LO, the hard drive starts to churn and then stops after a while
>> and the program doesn't open.  I even tried a 5.3.X version but same
>> behavior.   Any help here would be welcome and thanks.
> 
> If the program started to load but crashed, there might be an entry in
> Event Viewer's logs about the program's crash.

No crash, it just won't start.

> 
> At https://downloadarchive.documentfoundation.org/libreoffice/old/, on
> which hyperlink did you click?  There is no 5.4 version in the archive,
> but there are many 5.4.x versions.  Under which one did you go?  If you
> went under:
> 
> https://downloadarchive.documentfoundation.org/libreoffice/old/5.4.7.2/
> 
> and then under the win subfolder, which bitwidth did you choose for the
> download?  There is no 64-bit version of Windows XP.  (*)
> 
> (*) What was called Windows XP x64 was a crippled version of Windows
>      Server 2003 with a Windows XP desktop GUI.  If not designed to run
>      under a server version of Windows, a program may not run.  Windows
>      XP x64 is bogus, and Microsoft's attempt to glom onto the burgeoning
>      64-bit consumer demand along with a shammed attempt to catch up with
>      other 64-bit operating systems.  A program that won't run under a
>      server edition of Windows may also not run under the sham named
>      Windows XP x64.

32 bit.

> 
> Ouch, a really old Pentium 2 (launched back in 1997).  That's a painful
> struggle.  Is that the one with Slot2 processors?  Those slid into a
> slot, not socket, had tangs to hold it into the motherboard slot, and
> put a lot of stress on the slot and mobo due to its weight; see
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slot_2.  Are you prepping it for donation
> to the Smithsonian museum?

No, using as a simple data logger.  Had been running Win ME on it until 
wanting to try out a program that needed XP or higher, so installed XP 
recently.  Doesn't do well with XP having only 64 MB Ram.  No need to 
spend on a new one when all I'm doing is logging and *perhaps* graphing 
with LO.  If I can't get LO to work so I can graph, I will use one of my 
other, much newer PC's.

> 
> SSE extensions weren't available until the Pentium 3.  Because of SSE,
> you sure LO 5.4.x doesn't have a minimum hardware requirement of a
> Pentium 3 CPU?
> 
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streaming_SIMD_Extensions
> 
> Version 5.4.x required the Microsoft Visual C++ 2015 runtime libs.  LO
> doesn't include those.  Do you have them?
> 
> https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/topic/the-latest-supported-visual-c-downloads-2647da03-1eea-4433-9aff-95f26a218cc0

Tried to install MV C++ 2015 and it wouldn't install, got some sort of 
error message.

> 

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#12078

James Wobanwu wrote:
> I have an old Toshiba Pentium II with XP Pro SP3 and I am trying to get 
> LibreOffice to run on it.  I have downloaded the last versions of LO, 
> which appears to be 5.4, that will run on XP.  I have tried both 
> portable and non-portable versions.  No error messages, just when I 
> click on LO, the hard drive starts to churn and then stops after a while 
> and the program doesn't open.  I even tried a 5.3.X version but same 
> behavior.   Any help here would be welcome and thanks.

IDK.

Dial the knob back to 3.6.7.2 ?

https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Documentation/System_Requirements#Windows.2C_Mac.2C_Linux.2C_and_Android

   "Windows 2000   2010-07-13   3.6.7.2   x86
    Windows XP     2014-04-08   5.4.7.2   32-bit, 64-bit
    ...
   "

Worth a try, if it's an SSE2 problem.

If you want to determine your hardware support, then the
Intel PIU is one tool (Processor Identification Utility?).
But CoreInfo is another way. It's less work to get this going.

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/downloads/coreinfo

    SSE             *       Supports Streaming SIMD Extensions
    SSE2            *       Supports Streaming SIMD Extensions 2
    SSE3            *       Supports Streaming SIMD Extensions 3
    SSSE3           *       Supports Supplemental SIMD Extensions 3
    SSE4.1          *       Supports Streaming SIMD Extensions 4.1
    SSE4.2          *       Supports Streaming SIMD Extensions 4.2

One of the reasons SSE was used years ago, is the Intel processor
was missing a good block move instruction, while the 68K had
"MOVEM" or Move Multiple. In retaliation, first the programmers
abused FP (Floating Point) registers as garbage bins. Then they
started attacking SSE (which I think has its own wide registers).
Then there was some stink about "having to support a sea of macros
to do conversions", to stuff things in various size holes. Well,
that's bread and butter stuff, and only lazy individuals start
moaning like that. I had guys at work that made a bunch of those,
and once one genius does the work, the rest of the team swims
in the glory. But eventually (without me understanding all
the details), SSE2 began to become "essential", which resulted
in some older processors getting kicked in the nuts, when
lots of stuff would no longer run.

I think LO also uses OpenGL. The first times I tried LO,
I was getting crashes due to OpenGL... on a "modern" machine too.
And it's because the call that returns available remaining
OpenGL memory, was missing in action. The video card companies
had complained Microsoft kept changing stuff and they
couldn't keep up. That is fixed today, in some version
of WDDM x.y , which is not something WinXP uses. It was fixed
around the time Windows 10 got a GPU tab in Task Manager, and in
Linux, NVidia got an NVidia SMI ncurses thing, to show Linux
users how their GPU was being used.

There are other things LO can use, but they're optional. LO
can use Java... but I'm not interested in the hair loss
to install/add something like that to LO. LO has enough
problems without going overboard. Java would be like putting
lipstick on a pig.

Good software uses Dyn DLL loaders, the main program loads
first, and then it tries to load DLLs one at a time. If a
DLL is missing, it prints an error message on the screen

    ABC.DLL is missing

And if you toss an ABC.DLL file into the program folder...

    DEF.DLL is missing

it tells you what the next one that is missing happens to be.

Now, I really like that concept, but not many developers do that
for you. I mean, users can Google "ABC.DLL is missing" and then
find hints about what to do. That's preferable to turning over
rocks hoping to find hints.

    Paul

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#12079

Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

> James Wobanwu wrote:
>
>> I have an old Toshiba Pentium II with XP Pro SP3 and I am trying to get 
>> LibreOffice to run on it.  ...
> 
> Worth a try, if it's an SSE2 problem.

Can't be an SSEv2 problem.  SSEv1 wasn't available until Pentium 3.  The
OP said he has Pentium 2.

No SSE in Pentium 2 which launched in 1997.
SSEv1 introduced to Pentium 3 which launched in 1999.
SSEv2 introduced to Pentuim 4 which launched in 2000.

The OP has a Pentium 2.  No SSE for Pentium 2.  In trying to find if LO
had/has an SSE requirement, I found:

https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/LOWN/5#LibreOffice_4.3_is_not_usable_on_.3C_SSE2_CPU
 
and

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=82430
  LO 4.3.0 for Windows crashes on CPUs that do not support SSE2: 
  Application Error soffice.bin, version 4.3.0.4, module sal3.dll, 
  version 4.3.0.4, address 0x000268d5.

That spurred me to go to their Bugzilla ticket site, and did a search on
"SSE2", which only gave me the above ticket.  A search on "SSE" (with
and without double quotes) yielded over 500 hits.  Bugzilla's search
sucks.  No word search (i.e., no whitepaced string search, no word
search, no /b for word boundary search, no selection of search range,
like just in Subject and NOT in body).

Once LO started using Microsoft's Visual Studio, SSE became required.
From:

https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Development/BuildingOnWindows#Install_Visual_Studio

Visual Studio was used starting in LO v4.4 which confirms the above
articles.  LO also does not include the C++ runtimes in its installs, so
the OP will have to install Visual C++ 2015 runtime lib.

The OP only considered the system requirements for LO regarding
supported operating systems.  He didn't check the hardware requirements.
His old Pentium 2 laptop won't run a *LOT* of programs because SSEv1
became a requirement by many, and that dictates having a Pentium 3 at a
minimum, and many jumped quickly when SSEv2 showed up a year later, and
that dictates having a Pentium 4 at a minimum.  The OP's old Pentium 2
doesn't have the instruction set required by a lot of software that came
out after 2000.  LibreOffice didn't fork from OpenOffice until 2010, so
it is highly likely that LO always had the SSE hardware requirement on
the Windows platform.

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#12080

People donate computers to the Goodwill and Salvation Army/Thrift
donation centers.  There are lots of salvagers that sell old computers,
but newer than yours.  You might find a used one for cheap that has a
Pentium 4, or later, processor.  Put your old Pentium 2 laptop in your
garage in the pile of discards that eventually you amass enough to take
to the hazardous recycling center.

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#12082

VanguardLH wrote:
> Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:
> 
>> James Wobanwu wrote:
>>
>>> I have an old Toshiba Pentium II with XP Pro SP3 and I am trying to get 
>>> LibreOffice to run on it.  ...
>> Worth a try, if it's an SSE2 problem.
> 
> Can't be an SSEv2 problem.  SSEv1 wasn't available until Pentium 3.  The
> OP said he has Pentium 2.
> 
> No SSE in Pentium 2 which launched in 1997.
> SSEv1 introduced to Pentium 3 which launched in 1999.
> SSEv2 introduced to Pentuim 4 which launched in 2000.
> 
> The OP has a Pentium 2.  No SSE for Pentium 2.  In trying to find if LO
> had/has an SSE requirement, I found:
> 
> https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/LOWN/5#LibreOffice_4.3_is_not_usable_on_.3C_SSE2_CPU
>  
> and
> 
> https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=82430
>   LO 4.3.0 for Windows crashes on CPUs that do not support SSE2: 
>   Application Error soffice.bin, version 4.3.0.4, module sal3.dll, 
>   version 4.3.0.4, address 0x000268d5.
> 
> That spurred me to go to their Bugzilla ticket site, and did a search on
> "SSE2", which only gave me the above ticket.  A search on "SSE" (with
> and without double quotes) yielded over 500 hits.  Bugzilla's search
> sucks.  No word search (i.e., no whitepaced string search, no word
> search, no /b for word boundary search, no selection of search range,
> like just in Subject and NOT in body).
> 
> Once LO started using Microsoft's Visual Studio, SSE became required.
> From:
> 
> https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Development/BuildingOnWindows#Install_Visual_Studio
> 
> Visual Studio was used starting in LO v4.4 which confirms the above
> articles.  LO also does not include the C++ runtimes in its installs, so
> the OP will have to install Visual C++ 2015 runtime lib.
> 
> The OP only considered the system requirements for LO regarding
> supported operating systems.  He didn't check the hardware requirements.
> His old Pentium 2 laptop won't run a *LOT* of programs because SSEv1
> became a requirement by many, and that dictates having a Pentium 3 at a
> minimum, and many jumped quickly when SSEv2 showed up a year later, and
> that dictates having a Pentium 4 at a minimum.  The OP's old Pentium 2
> doesn't have the instruction set required by a lot of software that came
> out after 2000.  LibreOffice didn't fork from OpenOffice until 2010, so
> it is highly likely that LO always had the SSE hardware requirement on
> the Windows platform.

I wouldn't think there'd be enough RAM on the machine for LO.

I would open Task Manager and watch the memory graph.

LO also likes OpenGL, rather than DirectX.

I tried a copy of StarOffice, but it appears to be nagware.

*******

There's always something like Gnuplot.

https://ctan.org/tex-archive/graphics/gnuplot/5.2.6

    gp526-win32-mingw_2.exe    26 MB    2019-01-26
    gnuplot.pdf                 2 MB    2019-01-02

*******

My first PC, shipped with 64MB. But, it would also
accept 256MB sticks. I wouldn't want to be shopping
for RAM today though, because you'd be left with
used stuff. Maybe a local computer recycler would have
a bucket of SODIMMs from the era.

    Paul

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#12083

On 3/31/21 3:28 PM, Paul wrote:
> VanguardLH wrote:
>> Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> James Wobanwu wrote:
>>>
>>>> I have an old Toshiba Pentium II with XP Pro SP3 and I am trying to 
>>>> get LibreOffice to run on it.  ...
>>> Worth a try, if it's an SSE2 problem.
>>
>> Can't be an SSEv2 problem.  SSEv1 wasn't available until Pentium 3.  The
>> OP said he has Pentium 2.
>>
>> No SSE in Pentium 2 which launched in 1997.
>> SSEv1 introduced to Pentium 3 which launched in 1999.
>> SSEv2 introduced to Pentuim 4 which launched in 2000.
>>
>> The OP has a Pentium 2.  No SSE for Pentium 2.  In trying to find if LO
>> had/has an SSE requirement, I found:
>>
>> https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/LOWN/5#LibreOffice_4.3_is_not_usable_on_.3C_SSE2_CPU 
>>
>>
>> and
>>
>> https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=82430
>>   LO 4.3.0 for Windows crashes on CPUs that do not support SSE2:   
>> Application Error soffice.bin, version 4.3.0.4, module sal3.dll,   
>> version 4.3.0.4, address 0x000268d5.
>>
>> That spurred me to go to their Bugzilla ticket site, and did a search on
>> "SSE2", which only gave me the above ticket.  A search on "SSE" (with
>> and without double quotes) yielded over 500 hits.  Bugzilla's search
>> sucks.  No word search (i.e., no whitepaced string search, no word
>> search, no /b for word boundary search, no selection of search range,
>> like just in Subject and NOT in body).
>>
>> Once LO started using Microsoft's Visual Studio, SSE became required.
>> From:
>>
>> https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Development/BuildingOnWindows#Install_Visual_Studio 
>>
>>
>> Visual Studio was used starting in LO v4.4 which confirms the above
>> articles.  LO also does not include the C++ runtimes in its installs, so
>> the OP will have to install Visual C++ 2015 runtime lib.
>>
>> The OP only considered the system requirements for LO regarding
>> supported operating systems.  He didn't check the hardware requirements.
>> His old Pentium 2 laptop won't run a *LOT* of programs because SSEv1
>> became a requirement by many, and that dictates having a Pentium 3 at a
>> minimum, and many jumped quickly when SSEv2 showed up a year later, and
>> that dictates having a Pentium 4 at a minimum.  The OP's old Pentium 2
>> doesn't have the instruction set required by a lot of software that came
>> out after 2000.  LibreOffice didn't fork from OpenOffice until 2010, so
>> it is highly likely that LO always had the SSE hardware requirement on
>> the Windows platform.
> 
> I wouldn't think there'd be enough RAM on the machine for LO.
> 
> I would open Task Manager and watch the memory graph.
> 
> LO also likes OpenGL, rather than DirectX.
> 
> I tried a copy of StarOffice, but it appears to be nagware.
> 
> *******
> 
> There's always something like Gnuplot.
> 
> https://ctan.org/tex-archive/graphics/gnuplot/5.2.6
> 
>     gp526-win32-mingw_2.exe    26 MB    2019-01-26
>     gnuplot.pdf                 2 MB    2019-01-02
> 
> *******
> 
> My first PC, shipped with 64MB. But, it would also
> accept 256MB sticks. I wouldn't want to be shopping
> for RAM today though, because you'd be left with
> used stuff. Maybe a local computer recycler would have
> a bucket of SODIMMs from the era.
> 
>     Paul

I gave up trying to get LO running.  Oddly enough, OpenOffice would with 
no problems, but I wanted LO because it's on my Ubuntu PC's so there'd 
be compatibility.  However, since I'm only using that slow PII for 
logging to a text file, I can always just copy that file to a thumb 
drive and process the CSV in LO on one of my other laptops. For all that 
the laptop is doing at the current time, it was pointless even thinking 
about replacing it or upgrading memory.  And it only has 64MB Ram too.

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