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Groups > alt.comp.os.windows-10 > #181812 > unrolled thread
| Started by | Marion <marion@facts.com> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2025-01-31 17:48 +0000 |
| Last post | 2025-02-02 22:54 +0000 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 166 — 15 participants |
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Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Marion <marion@facts.com> - 2025-01-31 17:48 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2025-01-31 19:09 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2025-01-31 19:26 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Marion <marion@facts.com> - 2025-01-31 21:18 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-01-31 23:19 +0100
The "label" command (Was: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows &) Android editors gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2025-01-31 22:24 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2025-01-31 22:25 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2025-01-31 22:38 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-01-31 23:39 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2025-01-31 22:48 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Quincy the fifth <quincythefifth@telekom.net> - 2025-02-01 00:22 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Marion <marion@facts.com> - 2025-02-01 06:03 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2025-02-01 10:15 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Marion <marion@facts.com> - 2025-02-01 18:45 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Marion <marion@facts.com> - 2025-02-01 18:51 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Daniel70 <daniel47@eternal-september.org> - 2025-04-27 00:07 +1000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Marion <marion@facts.com> - 2025-04-26 21:37 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Daniel70 <daniel47@eternal-september.org> - 2025-04-27 20:23 +1000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Marion <marion@facts.com> - 2025-04-27 14:15 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-02-01 14:55 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Marion <marion@facts.com> - 2025-02-01 19:16 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-02-01 20:54 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-02 03:21 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-02-02 14:43 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-03 00:01 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-02-03 01:59 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-03 03:06 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2025-02-03 13:28 +0100
What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2025-02-03 13:09 +0000
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-02-03 14:34 +0100
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors knuttle <keith_nuttle@yahoo.com> - 2025-02-03 10:47 -0500
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Daniel70 <daniel47@eternal-september.org> - 2025-04-27 20:30 +1000
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-02-03 15:15 -0500
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2025-02-05 10:25 +0100
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> - 2025-02-05 09:32 -0500
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-02-05 20:46 +0100
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Daniel70 <daniel47@eternal-september.org> - 2025-04-27 20:39 +1000
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2025-02-03 15:42 -0500
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-06 22:40 +0000
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2025-02-07 21:45 +0100
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2025-02-04 15:41 +0000
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2025-02-05 10:18 +0100
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-06 00:05 +0000
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2025-02-05 20:04 -0500
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2025-02-06 20:17 +0100
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-06 21:02 +0000
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2025-02-07 21:47 +0100
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-08 03:28 +0000
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2025-02-08 10:18 +0100
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-08 23:35 +0000
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2025-02-10 08:47 +0100
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2025-02-10 10:55 +0000
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-11 01:00 +0000
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2025-02-13 19:59 +0100
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-13 22:15 +0000
[OT] Storage technology "back then" (was Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? [...]) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2025-02-14 02:10 +0100
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2025-02-18 11:56 +0100
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-18 21:55 +0000
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2025-02-21 09:12 +0100
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-21 23:35 +0000
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2025-02-25 18:27 +0100
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2025-02-25 18:25 +0000
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2025-02-26 08:53 +0100
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2025-02-26 13:10 +0100
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2025-02-26 15:02 +0000
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-25 20:28 +0000
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2025-02-26 08:54 +0100
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2025-02-26 08:49 +0100
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2025-02-21 14:12 +0000
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors Daniel70 <daniel47@eternal-september.org> - 2025-04-27 20:27 +1000
Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2025-04-27 10:29 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Marion <marion@facts.com> - 2025-02-02 04:16 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Marion <marion@facts.com> - 2025-02-02 05:40 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-02 06:05 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Marion <marion@facts.com> - 2025-02-02 21:34 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-03 00:01 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Marion <marion@facts.com> - 2025-02-03 09:42 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-06 20:54 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Marion <marion@facts.com> - 2025-02-08 04:22 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-02-02 15:07 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Marion <marion@facts.com> - 2025-02-02 23:42 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-02-03 02:21 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-03 03:05 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Marion <marion@facts.com> - 2025-02-03 09:59 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-03 03:01 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Marion <marion@facts.com> - 2025-02-03 19:12 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2025-02-05 10:30 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-02-05 11:31 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2025-02-05 14:27 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-02-05 14:35 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2025-02-06 20:21 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-06 20:57 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-02-06 23:58 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-07 05:57 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-02-07 10:30 +0100
Editing binary data with editors - or is there no difference of text and binary? Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2025-02-07 10:57 +0100
Re: Editing binary data with editors - or is there no difference of text and binary? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-02-07 11:44 +0100
Re: Editing binary data with editors - or is there no difference of text and binary? Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2025-02-07 14:39 +0100
Re: Editing binary data with editors - or is there no difference of text and binary? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-02-07 19:39 +0100
Re: Editing binary data with editors - or is there no difference of text and binary? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-08 03:26 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2025-02-05 18:12 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-05 23:14 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2025-02-06 20:22 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-06 20:57 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2025-02-07 21:50 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-08 03:27 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-02 03:21 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-02-02 15:07 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-02 03:20 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Marion <marion@facts.com> - 2025-02-01 05:40 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2025-02-01 16:34 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2025-02-01 16:29 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Marion <marion@facts.com> - 2025-02-01 18:10 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2025-02-02 15:44 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Marion <marion@facts.com> - 2025-02-03 10:40 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-02-03 15:14 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Marion <marion@facts.com> - 2025-02-04 10:01 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-02-04 13:22 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Marion <marion@facts.com> - 2025-02-04 19:51 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-02-04 23:12 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2025-02-02 15:24 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-02-02 15:50 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2025-02-02 16:04 +0100
[meta] posting mistake Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2025-02-02 16:26 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2025-02-02 16:29 +0000
ext4 on Android (Was: blah, blah, blah...) gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2025-02-02 16:37 +0000
Re: ext4 on Android (Was: blah, blah, blah...) Jeff Layman <Jeff@invalid.invalid> - 2025-02-03 09:14 +0000
ext4 on Android (Was: blah, blah, blah...) "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-02-03 15:16 +0100
Re: ext4 on Android (Was: blah, blah, blah...) Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-03 21:59 +0000
Re: ext4 on Android Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2025-02-04 10:23 +0000
Re: ext4 on Android (Was: blah, blah, blah...) Marion <marion@facts.com> - 2025-02-04 22:48 +0000
Re: ext4 on Android (Was: blah, blah, blah...) "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-02-25 23:16 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-03 21:57 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors candycanearter07 <candycanearter07@candycanearter07.nomail.afraid> - 2025-02-03 19:00 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-03 22:01 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors candycanearter07 <candycanearter07@candycanearter07.nomail.afraid> - 2025-02-05 18:50 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2025-02-05 14:26 -0500
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-06 00:16 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors candycanearter07 <candycanearter07@candycanearter07.nomail.afraid> - 2025-02-06 20:50 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2025-02-03 19:58 -0500
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-04 01:15 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2025-02-04 00:24 -0500
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-04 21:40 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2025-02-04 22:11 +0000
External media file systems (was Re: ...) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2025-02-05 02:24 +0100
Re: External media file systems (was Re: ...) Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2025-02-04 22:06 -0500
Re: External media file systems (was Re: ...) Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-05 04:41 +0000
Re: External media file systems (was Re: ...) Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-05 04:43 +0000
Re: External media file systems (was Re: ...) Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2025-02-05 02:10 -0500
Re: External media file systems (was Re: ...) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2025-02-05 17:40 +0100
Re: External media file systems (was Re: ...) candycanearter07 <candycanearter07@candycanearter07.nomail.afraid> - 2025-02-05 18:50 +0000
Re: External media file systems (was Re: ...) Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-06 00:11 +0000
Re: External media file systems (was Re: ...) Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2025-02-05 20:59 -0500
Re: External media file systems (was Re: ...) Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-06 03:04 +0000
Re: External media file systems (was Re: ...) Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2025-02-05 22:48 -0500
Re: External media file systems (was Re: ...) Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-06 21:00 +0000
Re: External media file systems (was Re: ...) Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2025-02-06 16:20 -0500
Re: External media file systems (was Re: ...) Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-06 22:42 +0000
Re: External media file systems (was Re: ...) Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2025-02-07 00:44 -0500
Re: External media file systems (was Re: ...) Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-07 06:00 +0000
Re: External media file systems (was Re: ...) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2025-02-05 17:38 +0100
Re: External media file systems (was Re: ...) Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-06 00:06 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-02-03 21:56 +0000
A little bit of discussion between Janis and me (Was: Stupid suggestion(s) for "portable" "memory" using Windows & Android "editors") gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2025-02-02 14:53 +0000
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-02-01 20:59 +0100
Re: Clever helpful suggestion for portable memory using Windows & Android editors Marion <marion@facts.com> - 2025-02-02 22:54 +0000
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| From | Marion <marion@facts.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-01 19:16 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <vnlru3$2ren$1@nnrp.usenet.blueworldhosting.com> |
| In reply to | #181857 |
On Sat, 1 Feb 2025 14:55:50 +0100, Carlos E.R. wrote :
>> SD card terminology confuses people because there are at least 3 terms:
>> 1. Volume ID (CID)
>> 2. Volume Serial Number
>> 3. Volume Name (aka Volume Label)
>
> You can change them in Linux.
>
> Going from memory, one of them you change in the partitioner (fdisk).
> This one was crucial with Windows 7 because M$ would use it to detect
> machine change or pirated copy.
>
> All these changes can be done without formatting and losing the content.
Hi Carlos,
You bring up a good point that I did a bad job of explaining the problem
set (& hence, in your appreciation of the sheer elegance of the solution).
Mea culpa.
I apologize.
It's (almost certainly) my fault that you & Andy (& perhaps many others)
are (apparently) confused about sd card use & terminology; specifically,
the reason why one would benefit by changing the Volume Name (aka Label).
For sdcards, portable memory is not the same thing as portable storage.
Hence, from this moment, I'll STOP using the word "memory" in terms of sd
card terminology as I will use the more apt term of "storage" for sd cards.
That is, portable memory is not at all the same thing as portable storage.
And it's MY FAULT for muddying up the waters on that distinction.
Hopefully my prior response to Andy will clear up that I am only discussing
here how to *seamlessly* double (or triple or quadruple or whatever) your
Android portable mem... ah, er, um "storage" (for only about ten bucks).
Note: I get all my sd cards for free off of Amazon Vine; but most people
have to pay for their stuff on Amazon, so I'm assuming it costs them $10.
Please be acutely aware of the fact that the elegance isn't in doubling or
tripling your storage. The elegance is in the word "*seamless*".
The editor has no clue that you just swapped out the sd card to a new one!
But, of course, the editor has to prior be aware of storage on the sd card.
That is, all your modern editors (which is why I stressed the word "modern"
in the original post) "should" be able to find their files on your portable
memory sd card where, if you use this insightful trick, they won't even
know that you just doubled the sd storage space that the editors have
access to.
I feel sorry for people who don't have Android phones with sd card slots.
Because if they want to double their portable storage, they can't.
It's impossible (without adding hardware that sticks out of the phone).
Hence, I already explained to Andy (where lurkers can benefit) that there
is no way (that I know of) for *him* to double his portable memory (for ten
bucks anyway). But most Android phones still have sd card slots (AFAIK).
Now that we have the concept of "portable storage" clarified, let's look at
what people are confused about in the three typical sd card identifiers.
Why would we want to control the value of *any* of these?
1. Volume ID (CID)
2. Volume Serial Number
3. Volume Name (aka Volume Label)
Ignoring that the Volume ID is not changeable by the user, and hence has no
value to us in controlling how Android editors find their sd card files...
To your point of being easily able to change the other two using Windows
(or Linux), why would you want to change the Volume Serial Number?
Is there some value that you see in doing that which I don't yet comprehend
which makes doing so of value in terms of controlling Android file editors?
Remember, the whole point is that a simple elegant trick on Windows (or
Linux) done years ahead of time, makes it seamless to double (or triple)
the sd portable storage that is available to your modern Android editors.
If a symlink will work on non-root Android, then that's the Holy Grail.
CHANGE FROM: /storage/sdcard1/ABCD-ABCD/{my editor's folders & files)
CHANGE TO: /storage/sdcard1/symlink/{my editor's folders & files)
or perhaps...
CHANGE TO: /storage/symlink/{my editor's folders & files)
I have never been able to accomplish that illustrious glorious task.
Can you?
How?
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-01 20:54 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <boa27lxloi.ln2@Telcontar.valinor> |
| In reply to | #181867 |
On 2025-02-01 20:16, Marion wrote:
> On Sat, 1 Feb 2025 14:55:50 +0100, Carlos E.R. wrote :
>
>
>>> SD card terminology confuses people because there are at least 3 terms:
>>> 1. Volume ID (CID)
>>> 2. Volume Serial Number
>>> 3. Volume Name (aka Volume Label)
>>
>> You can change them in Linux.
>>
>> Going from memory, one of them you change in the partitioner (fdisk).
>> This one was crucial with Windows 7 because M$ would use it to detect
>> machine change or pirated copy.
>>
>> All these changes can be done without formatting and losing the content.
>
> Hi Carlos,
>
> You bring up a good point that I did a bad job of explaining the problem
> set (& hence, in your appreciation of the sheer elegance of the solution).
>
> Mea culpa.
> I apologize.
>
> It's (almost certainly) my fault that you & Andy (& perhaps many others)
> are (apparently) confused about sd card use & terminology; specifically,
> the reason why one would benefit by changing the Volume Name (aka Label).
>
> For sdcards, portable memory is not the same thing as portable storage.
>
> Hence, from this moment, I'll STOP using the word "memory" in terms of sd
> card terminology as I will use the more apt term of "storage" for sd cards.
>
> That is, portable memory is not at all the same thing as portable storage.
> And it's MY FAULT for muddying up the waters on that distinction.
>
> Hopefully my prior response to Andy will clear up that I am only discussing
> here how to *seamlessly* double (or triple or quadruple or whatever) your
> Android portable mem... ah, er, um "storage" (for only about ten bucks).
>
> Note: I get all my sd cards for free off of Amazon Vine; but most people
> have to pay for their stuff on Amazon, so I'm assuming it costs them $10.
>
> Please be acutely aware of the fact that the elegance isn't in doubling or
> tripling your storage. The elegance is in the word "*seamless*".
>
> The editor has no clue that you just swapped out the sd card to a new one!
> But, of course, the editor has to prior be aware of storage on the sd card.
I don't use editors on phone nor tablet.
And, my editor by default inserts photos inside the document file. I can
link to external photos, but then, as I use Linux, I would use relative
paths or symlinks.
Also I *never* edit a file residing in flash storage. I edit in main
storage in the computer, then copy the result over to flash media if needed.
>
> That is, all your modern editors (which is why I stressed the word "modern"
> in the original post) "should" be able to find their files on your portable
> memory sd card where, if you use this insightful trick, they won't even
> know that you just doubled the sd storage space that the editors have
> access to.
>
> I feel sorry for people who don't have Android phones with sd card slots.
> Because if they want to double their portable storage, they can't.
I haven't had that need in over a decade.
>
> It's impossible (without adding hardware that sticks out of the phone).
>
> Hence, I already explained to Andy (where lurkers can benefit) that there
> is no way (that I know of) for *him* to double his portable memory (for ten
> bucks anyway). But most Android phones still have sd card slots (AFAIK).
>
> Now that we have the concept of "portable storage" clarified, let's look at
> what people are confused about in the three typical sd card identifiers.
>
> Why would we want to control the value of *any* of these?
> 1. Volume ID (CID)
> 2. Volume Serial Number
> 3. Volume Name (aka Volume Label)
>
> Ignoring that the Volume ID is not changeable by the user, and hence has no
> value to us in controlling how Android editors find their sd card files...
> To your point of being easily able to change the other two using Windows
> (or Linux), why would you want to change the Volume Serial Number?
> Is there some value that you see in doing that which I don't yet comprehend
> which makes doing so of value in terms of controlling Android file editors?
Fooling Windows into thinking you have not changed computer. Windows
used that value for finding pirated copies.
Also you need to write those values when cloning hard disks (or flash
media).
Storage cards are formatted the same as a hard disk. They contain
partition tables, and all the identifiers of a hard disk and the
partitions inside. And all the tools Windows or Linux have available for
hard disks will work on them.
>
> Remember, the whole point is that a simple elegant trick on Windows (or
> Linux) done years ahead of time, makes it seamless to double (or triple)
> the sd portable storage that is available to your modern Android editors.
>
> If a symlink will work on non-root Android, then that's the Holy Grail.
> CHANGE FROM: /storage/sdcard1/ABCD-ABCD/{my editor's folders & files)
>
> CHANGE TO: /storage/sdcard1/symlink/{my editor's folders & files)
> or perhaps... CHANGE TO: /storage/symlink/{my editor's folders & files)
>
> I have never been able to accomplish that illustrious glorious task.
> Can you?
> How?
--
Cheers, Carlos.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-02 03:21 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <vnmoc5$d90b$4@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #181869 |
On Sat, 1 Feb 2025 20:54:19 +0100, Carlos E.R. wrote: > Also I *never* edit a file residing in flash storage. Does your system not have an SSD?
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-02 14:43 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <ec947lxv2k.ln2@Telcontar.valinor> |
| In reply to | #181881 |
On 2025-02-02 04:21, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote: > On Sat, 1 Feb 2025 20:54:19 +0100, Carlos E.R. wrote: > >> Also I *never* edit a file residing in flash storage. > > Does your system not have an SSD? Mmm. Certainly, but it is another kind, designed for intensive use. -- Cheers, Carlos.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-03 00:01 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <vnp10s$tt74$2@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #181888 |
On Sun, 2 Feb 2025 14:43:10 +0100, Carlos E.R. wrote: > On 2025-02-02 04:21, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote: > >> On Sat, 1 Feb 2025 20:54:19 +0100, Carlos E.R. wrote: >> >>> Also I *never* edit a file residing in flash storage. >> >> Does your system not have an SSD? > > Mmm. Certainly, but it is another kind, designed for intensive use. You didn’t say which kind.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-03 01:59 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <r0h57lxcrc.ln2@Telcontar.valinor> |
| In reply to | #181908 |
On 2025-02-03 01:01, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote: > On Sun, 2 Feb 2025 14:43:10 +0100, Carlos E.R. wrote: > >> On 2025-02-02 04:21, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote: >> >>> On Sat, 1 Feb 2025 20:54:19 +0100, Carlos E.R. wrote: >>> >>>> Also I *never* edit a file residing in flash storage. >>> >>> Does your system not have an SSD? >> >> Mmm. Certainly, but it is another kind, designed for intensive use. > > You didn’t say which kind. I don't call an SSD a flash media. -- Cheers, Carlos.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-03 03:06 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <vnpbrh$va40$7@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #181911 |
On Mon, 3 Feb 2025 01:59:39 +0100, Carlos E.R. wrote: > On 2025-02-03 01:01, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote: > >> On Sun, 2 Feb 2025 14:43:10 +0100, Carlos E.R. wrote: >> >>> On 2025-02-02 04:21, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote: >>> >>>> On Sat, 1 Feb 2025 20:54:19 +0100, Carlos E.R. wrote: >>>> >>>>> Also I *never* edit a file residing in flash storage. >>>> >>>> Does your system not have an SSD? >>> >>> Mmm. Certainly, but it is another kind, designed for intensive use. >> >> You didn’t say which kind. > > I don't call an SSD a flash media. What would you call it, then?
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-03 13:28 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <m0br40Ff8v9U2@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #181911 |
Carlos E.R., 2025-02-03 01:59: > On 2025-02-03 01:01, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote: >> On Sun, 2 Feb 2025 14:43:10 +0100, Carlos E.R. wrote: >> >>> On 2025-02-02 04:21, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote: >>> >>>> On Sat, 1 Feb 2025 20:54:19 +0100, Carlos E.R. wrote: >>>> >>>>> Also I *never* edit a file residing in flash storage. >>>> >>>> Does your system not have an SSD? >>> >>> Mmm. Certainly, but it is another kind, designed for intensive use. >> >> You didn’t say which kind. > > I don't call an SSD a flash media. Why not? SSD *is* flash storage. Just because there is a controller which takes care of wear leveling, the storage technology itself is not different to that of SD cards. -- Arno Welzel https://arnowelzel.de
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| From | gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-03 13:09 +0000 |
| Subject | What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors |
| Message-ID | <vnqf6t$3pvrg$1@news.xmission.com> |
| In reply to | #181923 |
In article <m0br40Ff8v9U2@mid.individual.net>, Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> wrote: ... >> I don't call an SSD a flash media. > >Why not? SSD *is* flash storage. Just because there is a controller >which takes care of wear leveling, the storage technology itself is not >different to that of SD cards. Chill out, man. People often use terminology in idiosyncratic ways. That doesn't make them wrong. I understand Carlo's frame of reference, and I accept it. You should do likewise. Just for one example: In some circles, unless it is a 4 footed mammal, it is not an "animal". I assume Carlo's use of terminology is similar. -- To be evangelical is to spend every waking moment hovering around two emotional states: fear and rage. Evangelicals are seriously the angriest and most vicious bunch of self-pitying, constantly-moaning whinybutts I've ever encountered.
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| From | "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-03 14:34 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors |
| Message-ID | <28t67lx9sl.ln2@Telcontar.valinor> |
| In reply to | #181924 |
On 2025-02-03 14:09, Kenny McCormack wrote: > In article <m0br40Ff8v9U2@mid.individual.net>, > Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> wrote: > ... >>> I don't call an SSD a flash media. >> >> Why not? SSD *is* flash storage. Just because there is a controller >> which takes care of wear leveling, the storage technology itself is not >> different to that of SD cards. > > Chill out, man. > > People often use terminology in idiosyncratic ways. That doesn't make them > wrong. I understand Carlo's frame of reference, and I accept it. You > should do likewise. > > Just for one example: > In some circles, unless it is a 4 footed mammal, it is not an "animal". > > I assume Carlo's use of terminology is similar. > This minute, I do not know how to name SSDs. I'm confused. -- Cheers, Carlos.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | knuttle <keith_nuttle@yahoo.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-03 10:47 -0500 |
| Subject | Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors |
| Message-ID | <vnqofe$1b83j$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #181925 |
On 02/03/2025 8:34 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote: > On 2025-02-03 14:09, Kenny McCormack wrote: >> In article <m0br40Ff8v9U2@mid.individual.net>, >> Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> wrote: >> ... >>>> I don't call an SSD a flash media. >>> >>> Why not? SSD *is* flash storage. Just because there is a controller >>> which takes care of wear leveling, the storage technology itself is not >>> different to that of SD cards. >> >> Chill out, man. >> >> People often use terminology in idiosyncratic ways. That doesn't make >> them >> wrong. I understand Carlo's frame of reference, and I accept it. You >> should do likewise. >> >> Just for one example: >> In some circles, unless it is a 4 footed mammal, it is not an "animal". >> >> I assume Carlo's use of terminology is similar. >> > > This minute, I do not know how to name SSDs. I'm confused. > > A rose is a rose, as long as it does the job you want what does it matter what it is called. I have many useful devices called Thingamajig.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Daniel70 <daniel47@eternal-september.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-04-27 20:30 +1000 |
| Subject | Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors |
| Message-ID | <vul0vs$jn41$3@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #181929 |
On 4/02/2025 2:47 am, knuttle wrote: > On 02/03/2025 8:34 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote: >> On 2025-02-03 14:09, Kenny McCormack wrote: >>> In article <m0br40Ff8v9U2@mid.individual.net>, Arno Welzel >>> <usenet@arnowelzel.de> wrote: ... >>>>> I don't call an SSD a flash media. >>>> >>>> Why not? SSD *is* flash storage. Just because there is a >>>> controller which takes care of wear leveling, the storage >>>> technology itself is not different to that of SD cards. >>> >>> Chill out, man. >>> >>> People often use terminology in idiosyncratic ways. That doesn't >>> make them wrong. I understand Carlo's frame of reference, and I >>> accept it. You should do likewise. >>> >>> Just for one example: In some circles, unless it is a 4 footed >>> mammal, it is not an "animal". >>> >>> I assume Carlo's use of terminology is similar. >> >> This minute, I do not know how to name SSDs. I'm confused. >> > A rose is a rose, as long as it does the job you want what does it > matter what it is called. I have many useful devices called > Thingamajig. And how many "What's'its" do you have?? ;-P -- Daniel70
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| From | Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-03 15:15 -0500 |
| Subject | Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors |
| Message-ID | <vnr83r$1ekmp$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #181925 |
On 2/3/2025 8:34 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
>
> This minute, I do not know how to name SSDs. I'm confused.
>
Lawrence just spends his days trying to one-up other people,
especially with tech trivia. Why do you let him?
SSD is unambiguous. Like you, I
don't call it a flash drive. I don't call anything flash. There
are USB sticks, SSDs and SD cards. The type of data strorage
they use is not a practical concern. Those terms are specific
in terms of IDing the item.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-05 10:25 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors |
| Message-ID | <m0gp4oFaa5cU2@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #181933 |
Newyana2, 2025-02-03 21:15: > On 2/3/2025 8:34 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote: > >> >> This minute, I do not know how to name SSDs. I'm confused. >> > > Lawrence just spends his days trying to one-up other people, > especially with tech trivia. Why do you let him? > > SSD is unambiguous. Like you, I > don't call it a flash drive. I don't call anything flash. There > are USB sticks, SSDs and SD cards. The type of data strorage > they use is not a practical concern. Those terms are specific > in terms of IDing the item. Well - it was not about not calling SSD "flash media". The origin of this discussion was this sentence by Carlos: "Also I *never* edit a file residing in flash storage." And "flash storage" or "flash memory" is the name for a storage technology. SSD is "flash storage" as well as USB sticks or SD cards, because all these media use the same basic technology, just with different detail implementations like wear leveling etc.. Also see: <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flash_memory> and the sources referred there. Of course you can always decide to only call an SD card "flash media" and anything else working with the same technology "SSD" and "USB stick" depending on what you use exactly. But using technical terms this way makes any discussion about technology quite difficoult - because then you always need to know, that a person understands as "flash media". One might see only SD cards as "flash media" while another one would call a USB stick as "flash media". -- Arno Welzel https://arnowelzel.de
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Newyana2 <newyana@invalid.nospam> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-05 09:32 -0500 |
| Subject | Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors |
| Message-ID | <vnvso4$2dugo$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #181990 |
On 2/5/2025 4:25 AM, Arno Welzel wrote: > > Well - it was not about not calling SSD "flash media". The origin of > this discussion was this sentence by Carlos: > > "Also I *never* edit a file residing in flash storage." > And you didn't know he was talking about an external stick or card? Lawrence was just trying to catch him in "I know and you don't. Ha ha!" It's getting to be ridiculous how many posts here are just bickering that's kept going by compulsive arguers.
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| From | "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-05 20:46 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors |
| Message-ID | <0qrc7lxe51.ln2@Telcontar.valinor> |
| In reply to | #182003 |
On 2025-02-05 15:32, Newyana2 wrote: > On 2/5/2025 4:25 AM, Arno Welzel wrote: > >> >> Well - it was not about not calling SSD "flash media". The origin of >> this discussion was this sentence by Carlos: >> >> "Also I *never* edit a file residing in flash storage." >> > > And you didn't know he was talking about an external > stick or card? Lawrence was just trying to catch him in > "I know and you don't. Ha ha!" Yes, that's what I wanted to mean. > > It's getting to be ridiculous how many posts here are just > bickering that's kept going by compulsive arguers. > -- Cheers, Carlos.
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| From | Daniel70 <daniel47@eternal-september.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-04-27 20:39 +1000 |
| Subject | Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors |
| Message-ID | <vul1gh$kgep$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #181990 |
On 5/02/2025 8:25 pm, Arno Welzel wrote: > Newyana2, 2025-02-03 21:15: <Snip> >> Lawrence just spends his days trying to one-up other people, >> especially with tech trivia. Why do you let him? >> >> SSD is unambiguous. Like you, I don't call it a flash drive. I >> don't call anything flash. There are USB sticks, SSDs and SD >> cards. The type of data strorage they use is not a practical >> concern. Those terms are specific in terms of IDing the item. > > Well - it was not about not calling SSD "flash media". The origin of > this discussion was this sentence by Carlos: > > "Also I *never* edit a file residing in flash storage." > > And "flash storage" or "flash memory" is the name for a storage > technology. SSD is "flash storage" as well as USB sticks or SD cards, > because all these media use the same basic technology, just with > different detail implementations like wear leveling etc.. > > Also see: <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flash_memory> and the > sources referred there. > > Of course you can always decide to only call an SD card "flash media" > and anything else working with the same technology "SSD" and "USB > stick" depending on what you use exactly. But using technical terms > this way makes any discussion about technology quite difficoult - > because then you always need to know, that a person understands as > "flash media". One might see only SD cards as "flash media" while > another one would call a USB stick as "flash media". In a similar feign, might one include a Floppy Disk (remember them??) as a form of "flash media"?? ;-P -- Daniel70
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| From | Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-03 15:42 -0500 |
| Subject | Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors |
| Message-ID | <vnr9od$1f028$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #181925 |
On Mon, 2/3/2025 8:34 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
> On 2025-02-03 14:09, Kenny McCormack wrote:
>> In article <m0br40Ff8v9U2@mid.individual.net>,
>> Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> wrote:
>> ...
>>>> I don't call an SSD a flash media.
>>>
>>> Why not? SSD *is* flash storage. Just because there is a controller
>>> which takes care of wear leveling, the storage technology itself is not
>>> different to that of SD cards.
>>
>> Chill out, man.
>>
>> People often use terminology in idiosyncratic ways. That doesn't make them
>> wrong. I understand Carlo's frame of reference, and I accept it. You
>> should do likewise.
>>
>> Just for one example:
>> In some circles, unless it is a 4 footed mammal, it is not an "animal".
>>
>> I assume Carlo's use of terminology is similar.
>>
>
> This minute, I do not know how to name SSDs. I'm confused.
>
>
This could be a USB flash stick, a Solid State Drive (SSD). The SSD
uses Host Based Memory ("cheap" SSD), or the SSD can have its own
1GB DRAM chip to hold the virtual to physical mapping table. USB flash
sticks don't do that, and the interface speed on USB flash makes that
sort of idea impractical.
PHY and protocol
-------------------- controller ------- Toggle Flash TLC/QLC
This could be an SD or an eMMC chip.
PHY and protocol
-------------------- controller ------- Toggle Flash TLC/QLC
\________ same plastic package _______/
The controller ranges from an 8085, to a quad core ARM. The SSD
would have static and dynamic wear leveling, the USB stick, not.
The flash chip could be consumer grade, or the Enterprise flash
with the 6x write cycles that Micron makes.
Flash could last forever... if we could anneal it to repair
defects in the cells. But we're not there yet, and might never make
it there.
The toggle flash could be replaced with Optane, but that's discontinued
and has higher power dissipation.
A single flash die, can have vertical lines of storage bits, arranged
in up to 232 layers.
https://www.mdpi.com/computers/computers-06-00027/article_deploy/html/images/computers-06-00027-g010-550.jpg
The die can be stacked, with thru substrate vias. Sixteen die inside
one IC package. This is why a USB flash stick can be 32GB in a single
die, and an SSD can use 1TB chips (two chips) to make a 2TB SSD drive.
In the larger flash chips, it's even possible there are multiple
toggle channels in the same package (the controller might have eight
channels, to get the bandwidth, and with the limited number of chips
in the SSD, the chip needs more channels to flesh out the controller).
Raising the speed of a toggle channel too high, would lead to
local heating problems. The dies being fastened together are paper
thin (maybe 500u), and for some of the tech we've got today, they actually
put a piece of dummy silicon up against the thin ones, for support.
While the advert says the devices can take 1000G shock, don't
push your luck :-) Things like this are only possible, because
the thermal coefficient of expansion (TCE) of all the layers, is the same.
https://www.electronicspecifier.com/cms/images/TSV.jpg
Today, SSD drives are hardly ever full any more. The SSD in the other
machine, a Lexar NS100, it's likely a controller chip, and one stacked die flash,
and the PCB is much shorter than the 2.5" drive package. There is a lot
of air in there. And if you're thinking of opening one up, you can,
but some of them use thermal tape, and you'll rip the tape.
Bottom to top: Controller, DRAM, Flash chip
https://images.anandtech.com/galleries/2930/DSC_1058_575px.jpg
Secondary side: Flash chip over top of other flash chip (clam shell),
two electrical loads per toggle channel.
https://images.anandtech.com/galleries/2930/DSC_1059_575px.jpg
This one has some tapes. The tape that is doing something, is
over top of the controller. The controller with the ARM cores.
https://images.anandtech.com/doci/12263/imgp0157.jpg
1TB drive on the left, 4TB drive on the right.
https://images.anandtech.com/doci/16480/IMGP9045_575px.jpg
We were promised 16TB SSDs, but they were yanked before reaching retail.
Highest capacity controller chip currently is 100TB, but no device
has been built yet that uses all the addressing capability.
You couldn't afford to buy it, anyway. That's part of the reason
they don't make retail high capacity drives, pricing and market
uptake. 100TB drives continue to cost as much as a small car
(3.5" drive, modular internal construction, price never given in adverts).
Paul
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| From | Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-06 22:40 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors |
| Message-ID | <vo3dp0$35e4t$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #181934 |
On Mon, 3 Feb 2025 15:42:50 -0500, Paul wrote: > Flash could last forever... if we could anneal it to repair defects in > the cells. But we're not there yet, and might never make it there. Certainly the vendors of flash storage have no financial incentive to take us there.
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| From | Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-07 21:45 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: What is an animal or an SSD drive? (Was: blah, blah, blah) Android editors |
| Message-ID | <m0n9o2Fc0mmU5@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #182053 |
Lawrence D'Oliveiro, 2025-02-06 23:40: > On Mon, 3 Feb 2025 15:42:50 -0500, Paul wrote: > >> Flash could last forever... if we could anneal it to repair defects in >> the cells. But we're not there yet, and might never make it there. > > Certainly the vendors of flash storage have no financial incentive to take > us there. And I don't think there is need for that. In the last 20 years I had only few cases where SD cards or SSDs stopped working properly. But I never lost data, since this was always backup up or stored redundant on multiple media or locations. So I don't have any use for flash storage which lasts "forever". I also never experienced any failure of internal flash storage in smartphones or my smartwatch - and the smartwatch (Samsung Gear S3) is now about 7 years in constant use and I use smartphones usually for at least 5 years. On the other hand: for an old "pocket" computer in my collection, a Sharp PC-E500S [1] I got an FRAM module - this keep data "forever" (more than 10 years of data retention time and 10^10 to 10^15 write cycles), but this kind of storage is way too expensive for more than just a few megabytes of memory. [1] <https://arnowelzel.de/en/projects/technology-museum/pocket-computers/sharp-pc-e500s> -- Arno Welzel https://arnowelzel.de
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