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Groups > comp.lang.c > #157514

Re: A defer mechanism for C

Subject Re: A defer mechanism for C
Newsgroups comp.lang.c
References (19 earlier) <rrll1h$t1b$2@dont-email.me> <xWsDH.161578$Cp69.59447@fx19.ams4> <rrnhrd$p1k$1@dont-email.me> <H%JDH.178562$oqF7.162236@fx32.ams4> <rrnv8v$k6p$1@dont-email.me>
From Bart <bc@freeuk.com>
Message-ID <HKLDH.253233$J736.180439@fx42.ams4> (permalink)
Organization virginmedia.com
Date 2020-12-20 17:21 +0000

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On 20/12/2020 16:48, David Brown wrote:
> On 20/12/2020 16:23, Bart wrote:
>> On 20/12/2020 12:59, David Brown wrote:
>>> On 19/12/2020 20:57, Bart wrote:
>>
>>>> If I run the binary trees benchmark:
>>>>
>>>> https://benchmarksgame-team.pages.debian.net/benchmarksgame/performance/binarytrees.html
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> then a version using normal malloc/free, compiled with gcc-O3, runs at
>>>> half the speed of my version using my own allocator.
>>>>
>>>> I don't know what malloc version gcc on Windows happens to use, but for
>>>> this purpose, mine is faster.
>>>>
>>>> (Mine is a small-object allocator implemented on top of larger memory
>>>> blocks obtained with any other allocator including malloc. It doesn't
>>>> need to store the block size, which helps.)
>>>>
>>>
>>> As seems to be the case so regularly, you don't know what you are doing
>>> when compiling and linking (you are often even unsure what your own
>>> home-made tools are doing), and yet you feel qualified to give opinions.
>>>
>>> There are many different ways to handle memory allocation, with
>>> different pros and cons, strengths and weaknesses.  There are many
>>> different gcc builds for Windows, and many different C libraries that
>>> can be used with them.
>>>
>>> So all you actually know from your benchmarking is that some things are
>>> faster than others.  Marvellous.
>>
>>
>>
>> That's usually the point of benchmarking...
> 
> If you don't know what you are comparing, then no - it is useless.
> 
> So, what library are you using with gcc?  If you don't know, you are
> wasting your time and everyone else's.

How is that information supposed to help?

Don't forget I use multiple different C implementations. Anyone building 
my programs could be doing so with myriad C implementations.

What exactly am I supposed to do about that? I really don't care and 
don't want to care about what's going on on the other side of a C compiler.

I just ensure my applications don't have such a dependency.

All the tests I've done on implementations available to me, show that 
malloc is slower FOR MY PURPOSES than my own library.

==================

But here is a version of the BINARY benchmark that you can try for 
yourself, or BM can try it with 'mimalloc' plugged in.

With USEMALLOC defined as 1, it will use normal malloc/free.

With USEMALLOC defined as 0, it will use a dedicated local allocator 
(since it knows that every allocation will be of exactly the same size).

For the N used here (16), it will normally do about 30M mallocs and 30M 
frees. With USEMALLOC set to 0, it will only do about 250K mallocs and 
no frees.

I get runtimes with gcc-O3 of 3.2 seconds with normal malloc; and 0.8 
seconds with the dedicated allocator. That's about 4:1. With other C 
compilers, it goes down to roughly 2:1 (they have trouble matching gcc's 
0.8 seconds).

I would be interested if knowing the exact version of your library lets 
you get a closer ratio than the 2:1.

Remember my own more general purpose allocator managed 1.0 seconds, 
about 1.25:1.

-------------------------------------------
#include <stdio.h>
#include <stdlib.h>

#define USEMALLOC 1
//#define USEMALLOC 0

void** freelist;

typedef struct _node {
     struct _node *left;
     struct _node *right;
     int item;
} treenode;

#if USEMALLOC
     void* localalloc(void) {
         return malloc(sizeof(treenode));
     }

     void localfree(void* p){
         free(p);
     }

#else

     void* localalloc(void) {
         void* p;
         if (freelist) {
             p=freelist;
             freelist=(void**)*freelist;
             return p;
         }
         return malloc(sizeof(treenode));
     }

     void localfree(void* p){
         *(void**)p = freelist;
         freelist=(void**)p;
     }
#endif

treenode* newtreenode(treenode* left, treenode* right, int item) {
     treenode* t;

     t=localalloc();

     t->left=left;
     t->right=right;
     t->item=item;
     return t;
}

int itemcheck(treenode* tree) {
     if (tree->left==NULL)
         return tree->item;
     else
         return tree->item+itemcheck(tree->left)-itemcheck(tree->right);
}

treenode* bottomuptree(int item, int depth) {
     if (depth>0)
         return newtreenode(bottomuptree(2*item-1,depth-1),
                 bottomuptree(2*item,depth-1),item);
     else
         return newtreenode(NULL,NULL,item);
}

void deletetree(treenode* tree) {
     if (tree->left) {
         deletetree(tree->left);
         deletetree(tree->right);
     }
     localfree(tree);
}

int main(void) {
     treenode *stretchtree, *longlivedtree, *temptree;
     int n,depth,mindepth,maxdepth,stretchdepth,check,iterations,i;

     n=16;
     mindepth=4;
     if ((mindepth+2)>n)
         maxdepth=mindepth+1;
     else
         maxdepth=n;

     stretchdepth=maxdepth+1;

     stretchtree=bottomuptree(0,stretchdepth);
     printf("Stretch tree of depth %d    check: %d\n", stretchdepth, 
itemcheck(stretchtree));

     deletetree(stretchtree);
     longlivedtree=bottomuptree(0,maxdepth);

     depth=mindepth;
     while (depth<=maxdepth) {
         iterations=1<<(maxdepth-depth+mindepth);
         check=0;
         for (i=1; i<=iterations; ++i) {
             temptree=bottomuptree(i,depth);
             check=check+itemcheck(temptree);
             deletetree(temptree);

             temptree=bottomuptree(-i,depth);
             check=check+itemcheck(temptree);
             deletetree(temptree);
         }
         printf("%d  Trees of depth %d check: %d\n", iterations*2, 
depth, check);
         depth=depth+2;
     }
     printf("%s %d %s %d\n", "long lived tree of depth", maxdepth, 
"\tcheck:", itemcheck(longlivedtree));
}
-------------------------------------------

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Thread

A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-15 13:57 -0800
  Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-16 02:11 +0300
    Re: A defer mechanism for C Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2020-12-16 01:05 +0000
      Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-16 10:48 +0100
        Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-16 04:16 -0800
          Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-16 17:04 +0100
        Re: A defer mechanism for C Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2020-12-16 16:06 +0000
          Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-17 15:26 +0100
            Re: A defer mechanism for C Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2020-12-17 19:32 +0000
              Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-17 21:12 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2020-12-17 13:10 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-18 11:35 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 06:05 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-18 15:28 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 08:49 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-18 18:24 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 10:31 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-19 16:53 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 19:33 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 11:06 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 20:45 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 11:55 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 21:08 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 21:09 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2020-12-18 15:39 -0500
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 21:55 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-19 17:05 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 17:12 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-19 18:41 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 10:13 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-20 13:28 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2020-12-19 11:35 -0500
                Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-19 18:45 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2020-12-19 13:26 -0500
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 11:31 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 20:41 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-19 19:57 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 21:05 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-19 20:26 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-20 13:59 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-20 15:23 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-20 17:48 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-20 17:21 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-20 18:48 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-20 20:13 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-20 17:37 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2020-12-24 16:26 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-25 00:55 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 12:10 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-20 13:56 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-20 14:01 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-20 16:32 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2020-12-20 07:42 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-20 16:07 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-20 18:38 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-20 17:25 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Christian Hanné <the.hanne@gmail.com> - 2020-12-20 17:46 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2020-12-20 09:07 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-20 18:43 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-20 18:45 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2020-12-20 10:11 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-20 14:58 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-21 08:58 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-20 18:41 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-20 18:45 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-20 20:25 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-20 22:34 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-20 20:52 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2020-12-20 12:37 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-21 08:42 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2020-12-21 09:19 -0500
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2020-12-21 10:18 -0500
                Re: A defer mechanism for C James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2020-12-21 11:06 -0500
                Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-21 17:31 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2020-12-21 13:09 -0500
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 17:13 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-21 17:31 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2020-12-21 13:18 -0500
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> - 2020-12-23 17:26 -0700
                Re: A defer mechanism for C James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2020-12-24 00:47 -0500
                Re: A defer mechanism for C James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2020-12-24 00:59 -0500
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> - 2020-12-23 17:25 -0700
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 14:23 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-22 09:58 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2020-12-27 04:57 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2020-12-27 04:19 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2020-12-27 11:24 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2020-12-28 22:45 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2020-12-29 00:33 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2020-12-29 11:31 -0500
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Kaz Kylheku <563-365-8930@kylheku.com> - 2020-12-29 17:24 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-29 18:43 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2020-12-29 11:32 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2020-12-31 03:34 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2020-12-29 21:06 -0500
                Re: A defer mechanism for C "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2020-12-29 20:40 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2020-12-31 02:56 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> - 2020-12-23 17:22 -0700
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Kaz Kylheku <563-365-8930@kylheku.com> - 2020-12-24 02:13 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-24 06:49 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2020-12-24 03:16 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-24 13:38 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2020-12-24 14:37 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2020-12-25 11:39 -0500
                Re: A defer mechanism for C "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2020-12-26 22:34 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2020-12-26 22:48 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2020-12-27 08:51 -0500
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Kaz Kylheku <563-365-8930@kylheku.com> - 2020-12-24 22:50 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-25 09:52 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 09:18 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 09:32 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-19 18:55 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2020-12-24 14:16 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2020-12-17 22:05 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-18 11:42 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 05:53 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2020-12-18 19:40 +0000
      Re: A defer mechanism for C Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2020-12-27 05:19 -0800
  Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-16 11:01 +0100
    Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-16 03:45 -0800
      Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-16 13:25 +0100
        Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-16 06:26 -0800
          Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-16 15:40 +0100
            Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-16 07:05 -0800
              Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-16 16:13 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-16 16:21 +0100
      Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-16 17:06 +0100
        Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-16 08:57 -0800
          Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-16 19:43 +0100
  Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-16 12:05 +0000
    Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-16 14:26 +0100
    Re: A defer mechanism for C Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2020-12-16 15:57 +0000
      Re: A defer mechanism for C David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-12-16 19:49 +0100
        Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-16 11:33 -0800
          Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-16 13:05 -0800
          Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-17 01:52 +0300
            Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-17 10:59 -0800
              Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-17 20:47 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Kaz Kylheku <563-365-8930@kylheku.com> - 2020-12-17 19:58 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-17 21:56 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Kaz Kylheku <563-365-8930@kylheku.com> - 2020-12-18 18:03 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-17 12:30 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-17 22:16 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-17 22:39 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-17 13:44 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-17 22:51 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 01:33 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 06:54 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-18 13:28 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 15:14 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 15:16 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-18 16:19 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 17:26 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-18 17:07 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 18:18 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-18 18:34 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 20:40 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-18 21:16 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 22:24 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Kaz Kylheku <563-365-8930@kylheku.com> - 2020-12-18 21:50 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 23:25 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-19 01:01 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 11:47 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Kaz Kylheku <563-365-8930@kylheku.com> - 2020-12-19 02:45 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 11:48 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-19 12:13 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 13:33 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Kaz Kylheku <563-365-8930@kylheku.com> - 2020-12-19 20:24 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 17:28 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 16:05 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2020-12-24 21:55 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-25 05:26 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-25 14:28 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-25 05:38 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-25 14:51 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Kaz Kylheku <563-365-8930@kylheku.com> - 2020-12-25 20:00 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-26 12:19 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2020-12-26 19:10 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-27 05:28 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2020-12-25 05:42 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-25 14:52 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2020-12-26 02:29 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-26 12:11 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2020-12-26 09:33 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-26 18:50 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2020-12-26 07:40 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 15:36 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 17:49 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 15:39 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-18 16:25 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 01:55 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 23:58 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 17:16 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 16:05 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 18:33 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 16:55 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2020-12-18 19:10 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 16:47 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 15:22 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 07:09 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 07:25 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 08:02 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-17 22:55 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-17 21:58 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-17 23:05 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 01:40 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-17 22:59 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 01:10 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-17 22:46 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 01:46 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 01:00 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 10:59 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 11:12 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 02:18 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 16:25 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 19:24 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 09:07 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 22:36 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2020-12-19 15:54 -0500
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-20 01:21 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-20 15:22 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 11:53 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 11:55 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 12:07 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 03:38 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-19 01:40 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 04:00 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 15:02 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 04:22 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 16:43 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-19 12:34 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 17:11 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-19 17:22 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 15:08 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 15:26 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 04:36 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 16:54 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 22:12 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 15:13 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-21 12:45 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 16:25 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-21 13:38 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2020-12-21 09:26 -0500
        Re: A defer mechanism for C Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2020-12-16 20:30 +0000
          Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-16 21:41 +0100
            Re: A defer mechanism for C Kaz Kylheku <563-365-8930@kylheku.com> - 2020-12-16 21:02 +0000
              Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-17 07:24 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Kaz Kylheku <563-365-8930@kylheku.com> - 2020-12-18 18:14 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 19:25 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Kaz Kylheku <563-365-8930@kylheku.com> - 2020-12-18 18:38 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-18 20:44 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 02:07 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 00:51 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 16:51 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 06:15 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 06:25 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 15:58 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 18:43 +0300
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 16:56 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 15:55 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 15:52 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Kaz Kylheku <563-365-8930@kylheku.com> - 2020-12-19 00:40 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 11:46 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Kaz Kylheku <563-365-8930@kylheku.com> - 2020-12-19 20:22 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-19 21:31 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Kaz Kylheku <563-365-8930@kylheku.com> - 2020-12-19 22:27 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-20 09:36 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Kaz Kylheku <563-365-8930@kylheku.com> - 2020-12-21 21:02 +0000
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 22:24 +0100
            Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-16 13:07 -0800
              Re: A defer mechanism for C Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2020-12-16 18:35 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Kaz Kylheku <563-365-8930@kylheku.com> - 2020-12-17 04:08 +0000
            Re: A defer mechanism for C Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2020-12-16 23:13 +0000
              Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-17 07:24 +0100
  Re: A defer mechanism for C Kaz Kylheku <563-365-8930@kylheku.com> - 2020-12-16 20:29 +0000
  Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-17 01:26 +0300
  Re: A defer mechanism for C fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 05:02 -0800
    Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 15:03 +0100
      Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 06:36 -0800
        Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 16:51 +0100
          Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 08:17 -0800
            Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 17:22 +0100
              Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 08:36 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 17:40 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 08:46 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 18:04 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 10:57 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 20:10 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 11:39 -0800
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 20:48 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 21:08 +0100
                Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 21:34 +0100
        Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 19:15 +0300
          Re: A defer mechanism for C Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 08:26 -0800
            Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 19:45 +0300
          Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 17:31 +0100
            Re: A defer mechanism for C Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 20:15 +0300
              Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 18:28 +0100
            Re: A defer mechanism for C Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2020-12-21 20:49 +0000
              Re: A defer mechanism for C Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2020-12-21 22:17 +0100

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