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Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN]

From John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com>
Newsgroups alt.folklore.computers, comp.os.linux.misc
Subject Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN]
Date 2024-09-30 13:52 -0700
Organization A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID <20240930135208.00004170@gmail.com> (permalink)
References (10 earlier) <oJ-cnQSrLZDYdGX7nZ2dnZfqnPWdnZ2d@earthlink.com> <vdatb6$1l4ch$8@dont-email.me> <vdauah$1lq1u$1@dont-email.me> <20240930110933.00002ec1@gmail.com> <appeal-20240930203239@ram.dialup.fu-berlin.de>

Cross-posted to 2 groups.

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On 30 Sep 2024 19:32:56 GMT
ram@zedat.fu-berlin.de (Stefan Ram) wrote:

> John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> wrote or quoted:
> >This bears repeating. As someone whose initial exposure to OOP
> >concepts was via C++ (and then Java,) I spent *years* never
> >understanding what the appeal was. Wasn't until I encountered
> >Smalltalk, way on down the line, that I finally *got* it.  
> 
>   Can you explain what the that appeal was?

I must confess that I haven't made enough use of it myself to say how
well it holds up in real-world usage (it certainly has its proponents,
but so does basically anything,) but ST at its core* has a beautifully
consistent, coherent approach to OOP design compared to C++ (where the
OOP elements are clearly a bolt-on to something else which never feels
entirely natural or particularly necessary - how many C++ programs are
really just C programs with a different file extension, or at best use
iostream because it's easier than reconfiguring printf format strings
every time you change what debug info you're logging to stderr?)

* (I say this because it seems to have accreted a substantial layer of
  other-stuff - ST people are really, really into model-view-controller
  design, f'rexample, and the GUI has evolved on a parallel track to
  basically everything else in the world since the '70s, so it's not
  terribly intuitive for anybody accustomed to Mac/Windows/X/* - that
  may or may not be a natural fit with its way of doing things, but
  isn't strictly essential to what I'm describing.)

With ST, it's "objects all the way down" (at least 'til you hit that
magic ignore-the-man-behind-the-curtain barrier that every HLL has at
some point, which is still admirably low compared to most "friendly"
languages,) and the underlying design makes it possible to examine and
modify even a substantial portion of the runtime itself.

This gives it a kind of self-similar quality that reminds me of Lisp -
nothing is magic, even the "magic" bits (the primitives generally have
a "reference" version in pure ST, when possible,) and everything's made
from the same kind of stuff. That's what I find appealing about it; I
haven't worked with it enough to say whether it's truly *useful,* but
in its own way it *is* beautiful.

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Thread

The joy of FORTRAN Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2024-09-24 05:26 -0700
  Re: The joy of FORTRAN snipeco.2@gmail.com (Sn!pe) - 2024-09-24 14:11 +0100
    Re: The joy of FORTRAN The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-24 15:28 +0100
      Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-24 18:24 +0000
        Re: The joy of FORTRAN scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-09-24 19:13 +0000
          Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-24 15:37 -0700
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-09-24 23:06 +0000
        Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-24 21:14 +0000
          Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-24 23:45 +0000
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-09-25 06:52 +0000
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-25 07:06 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-09-25 08:51 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-26 17:52 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-27 17:43 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Niklas Karlsson <nikke.karlsson@gmail.com> - 2024-09-27 17:55 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN R Daneel Olivaw <Danny@hyperspace.vogon.gov> - 2024-09-27 19:58 +0200
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-27 20:38 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Gordon Henderson <gordon+usenet@drogon.net> - 2024-09-28 11:35 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-28 10:54 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-09-28 20:13 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-28 10:54 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2024-09-28 11:34 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-09-27 20:56 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-27 23:18 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN "Kurt Weiske" <kurt.weiske@realitycheckbbs.org.remove-bi5-this> - 2024-09-28 08:13 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-28 10:54 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2024-09-30 16:26 -0400
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2024-09-25 07:17 -1000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN "Kerr-Mudd, John" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2024-09-25 21:10 +0100
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2024-09-25 08:00 -0400
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-09-25 15:12 +0000
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-26 17:51 -0700
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN moi <findlaybill@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2024-09-27 02:29 +0100
          Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-25 00:52 +0000
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2024-09-25 08:03 -0400
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN "Kerr-Mudd, John" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2024-09-25 17:29 +0100
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-25 19:11 +0000
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-26 17:52 -0700
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN drb@ihatespam.msu.edu (Dennis Boone) - 2024-09-27 04:23 +0000
          Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2024-09-24 16:05 -1000
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-25 02:40 +0000
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN Bozo User <anthk@disroot.org> - 2024-10-11 14:49 +0000
          Re: The joy of FORTRAN Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2024-09-25 07:58 -0400
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-26 17:52 -0700
          Re: The joy of FORTRAN Andy Walker <anw@cuboid.co.uk> - 2024-09-27 19:29 +0100
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-27 23:25 +0000
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-28 10:54 -0700
        Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-24 15:37 -0700
        Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-24 23:42 +0000
        Re: The joy of FORTRAN John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2024-09-25 17:22 +0000
          Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-25 21:23 +0000
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2024-09-25 21:40 +0000
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-09-25 21:50 +0000
      Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-24 15:36 -0700
        Re: The joy of FORTRAN Louis Krupp <lkrupp@invalid.pssw.com.invalid> - 2024-09-25 02:45 -0600
        Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-25 21:24 +0000
      Re: The joy of FORTRAN Woozy Song <suzyw0ng@outlook.com> - 2024-09-25 11:03 +0800
        Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-25 04:38 +0000
          Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-25 05:31 +0000
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-26 17:52 -0700
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2024-09-30 10:58 +0000
          Re: The joy of FORTRAN Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2024-09-25 08:06 -0400
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN R Daneel Olivaw <Danny@hyperspace.vogon.gov> - 2024-09-25 17:01 +0200
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN "Kerr-Mudd, John" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2024-09-25 17:45 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-25 19:11 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN R Daneel Olivaw <Danny@hyperspace.vogon.gov> - 2024-09-25 21:30 +0200
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-09-25 15:03 +0000
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2024-09-25 07:31 -1000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Bob Martin <bob.martin@excite.com> - 2024-09-26 06:04 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-26 06:39 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Pancho <Pancho.Jones@proton.me> - 2024-09-26 08:47 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2024-09-26 07:49 -1000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-26 20:48 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-26 22:36 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-26 23:07 +0000
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-26 01:32 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-09-26 08:21 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN "Kurt Weiske" <kurt.weiske@realitycheckbbs.org.remove-nnv-this> - 2024-09-27 07:40 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-26 20:52 +0000
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN Pancho <Pancho.Jones@proton.me> - 2024-09-26 08:42 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-26 10:10 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Pancho <Pancho.Jones@proton.me> - 2024-09-26 11:49 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-26 20:43 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2024-09-26 18:01 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-27 01:36 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Pancho <Pancho.Jones@proton.me> - 2024-09-27 10:43 +0100
                Re: The joy of VAX Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-27 23:29 +0000
                Re: The joy of VAX Pancho <Pancho.Jones@proton.me> - 2024-09-28 19:05 +0100
                Re: The joy of VAX Robert Marshall <spam@capuchin.co.uk> - 2024-09-29 08:35 +0100
                Re: The joy of VAX Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-09-29 07:56 +0000
                Re: The joy of VAX Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-29 13:15 -0700
                The joy of VAX C Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2024-09-28 12:27 -0700
                Re: The joy of VAX C The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-28 22:03 +0100
                Re: The joy of VAX C rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-29 02:53 +0000
                Re: The joy of VAX C Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-29 13:15 -0700
                Re: The joy of VAX C Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-29 23:10 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-26 17:52 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-27 01:39 +0000
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-26 17:52 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-09-27 14:18 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-28 10:29 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2024-09-27 09:55 -1000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2024-09-27 11:13 -1000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2024-09-28 12:30 -0700
          Re: The joy of FORTRAN John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-09-25 08:34 -0700
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-09-25 09:07 -0700
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-09-25 10:05 -0700
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-09-25 10:19 -0700
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-25 21:30 +0000
            TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2024-09-25 15:18 -0400
              Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-09-29 01:44 -0400
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-29 07:50 +0100
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-29 07:06 +0000
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2024-09-29 06:55 -0700
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2024-09-29 09:08 -0700
                Re: Procedural, Functional, String [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-29 23:21 +0000
                Re: Procedural, Functional, String [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2024-09-29 16:25 -0700
                Re: Procedural, Functional, String [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] p.dean@invalid.net (Peter Dean) - 2024-09-29 23:36 +0000
                Re: Procedural, Functional, String [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] drb@ihatespam.msu.edu (Dennis Boone) - 2024-09-30 00:54 +0000
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-29 20:55 +0000
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-29 23:15 +0000
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Pancho <Pancho.Jones@proton.me> - 2024-09-30 10:24 +0100
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 21:19 +0000
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Louis Krupp <lkrupp@invalid.pssw.com.invalid> - 2024-09-30 15:44 -0600
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 23:42 +0000
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Pancho <Pancho.Jones@proton.me> - 2024-10-01 15:57 +0100
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-10-01 16:14 +0100
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-10-01 16:37 +0000
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-01 21:49 +0000
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-10-02 10:56 +0100
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-10-02 18:07 -0700
                Re: Recursion [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-03 01:22 +0000
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-01 21:48 +0000
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Louis Krupp <lkrupp@invalid.pssw.com.invalid> - 2024-10-03 03:04 -0600
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-03 18:35 +0000
                Re: C operator precedence rules Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-03 21:54 +0000
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-10-03 16:34 -0700
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-10-04 10:59 +0000
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-10-04 12:48 +0100
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-04 20:10 +0000
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-10-01 15:39 -0700
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-10-02 00:06 +0000
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-10-02 11:34 +0100
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2024-10-02 15:48 -0400
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-10-03 10:33 +0100
                Grace Hopper Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2024-10-03 10:35 -0700
                Re: Grace Hopper Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-03 22:19 +0000
                Re: Grace Hopper Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2024-10-04 17:17 -0400
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-10-02 11:30 +0100
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Pancho <Pancho.Jones@proton.me> - 2024-10-03 08:59 +0100
                Re: Multiple Inheritance [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-01 21:47 +0000
                Re: Multiple Inheritance [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Pancho <Pancho.Jones@proton.me> - 2024-10-03 08:58 +0100
                Re: Multiple Inheritance [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-10-03 15:34 +0000
                Re: Multiple Inheritance [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-03 21:52 +0000
                Re: Multiple Inheritance [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-04 03:46 +0000
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-09-30 11:09 -0700
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-09-30 13:52 -0700
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 21:27 +0000
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-09-30 15:00 -0700
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 23:21 +0000
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-09-30 16:27 -0700
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-10-01 13:43 +0100
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-10-01 07:58 -0700
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-10-01 16:15 +0100
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-01 21:51 +0000
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-10-01 14:59 -0700
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-01 22:17 +0000
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-10-01 16:07 -0700
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-02 00:54 +0000
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-10-01 07:57 -0700
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2024-10-03 00:17 +0000
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> - 2024-09-30 21:22 -0300
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-01 01:31 +0000
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-01 01:38 +0000
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-10-01 07:43 -0700
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] Pancho <Pancho.Jones@proton.me> - 2024-09-30 10:19 +0100
                Re: TeX and Pascal [was Re: The joy of FORTRAN] moi <findlaybill@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2024-09-30 23:28 +0100
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-25 21:27 +0000
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-09-25 14:42 -0700
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-26 17:52 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-27 01:41 +0000
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-25 21:29 +0000
    Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-24 17:53 +0000
      Re: The joy of FORTRAN R Daneel Olivaw <Danny@hyperspace.vogon.gov> - 2024-09-24 20:01 +0200
        Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-24 15:36 -0700
          Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-25 00:52 +0000
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-25 04:45 +0000
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN "Kerr-Mudd, John" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2024-09-25 17:39 +0100
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2024-09-25 07:13 -1000
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-25 19:11 +0000
          Re: The joy of FORTRAN The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-25 11:34 +0100
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2024-09-25 08:08 -0400
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN drb@ihatespam.msu.edu (Dennis Boone) - 2024-09-25 20:47 +0000
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-26 17:52 -0700
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-27 01:43 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-27 17:43 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-27 23:30 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-28 02:20 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-28 02:22 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-28 07:42 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-28 07:37 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2024-09-28 07:07 -0400
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-28 19:36 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-28 22:04 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2024-09-28 21:20 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-28 22:28 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-29 03:11 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-29 07:22 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-29 19:56 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-09-30 10:01 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-30 18:39 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-09-30 11:15 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-10-01 13:45 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-10-01 08:02 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-30 14:19 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-29 04:26 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-29 05:17 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-30 05:46 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 05:53 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-30 14:19 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-30 13:17 +0100
                Re: The joy of ALGOL-like languages Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 21:37 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-30 14:19 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 23:25 +0000
                Re: stacks are not hard, The joy of FORTRAN-like languages John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2024-10-04 03:49 +0000
                Re: stacks are not hard, The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-04 03:51 +0000
                Re: stacks are not hard, The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2024-10-04 17:07 -1000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-29 07:26 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-29 13:15 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-30 13:11 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-30 14:19 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2024-09-30 16:51 -0400
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-09-30 20:58 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 21:33 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2024-09-30 19:03 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2024-10-01 16:53 -0400
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-01 21:53 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2024-10-02 15:33 -0400
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-02 22:09 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2024-10-01 16:39 -0400
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-10-01 23:05 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2024-10-02 15:39 -0400
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-10-02 20:22 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-09-30 23:10 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2024-10-01 17:36 -0400
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages geodandw <geodandw@gmail.com> - 2024-09-28 17:41 -0400
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Niklas Karlsson <nikke.karlsson@gmail.com> - 2024-09-28 21:44 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-29 07:14 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-29 07:06 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages geodandw <geodandw@gmail.com> - 2024-09-29 02:57 -0400
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-29 08:34 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-29 19:39 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-29 23:25 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2024-09-28 15:17 -0700
                7-bit encodings (was: Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-29 00:36 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-29 03:15 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-29 07:16 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-29 19:29 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-29 23:24 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-09-30 16:31 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-30 18:12 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages scott@alfter.diespammersdie.us (Scott Alfter) - 2024-09-30 21:26 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-29 13:15 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN-like languages The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-30 13:10 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-29 03:01 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2024-09-29 07:58 +0000
                Into the woods of business Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2024-09-29 07:11 -0700
                Re: Into the woods of business vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2024-09-29 20:02 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-29 20:09 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-28 10:29 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-28 21:41 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-29 04:26 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-29 05:26 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-30 05:46 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 05:54 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-30 14:19 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 23:26 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Harold Stevens <wookie@aspen.localdomain> - 2024-10-01 03:52 -0500
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Louis Krupp <lkrupp@invalid.pssw.com.invalid> - 2024-10-01 15:49 -0600
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Harold Stevens <wookie@aspen.localdomain> - 2024-10-01 18:04 -0500
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Louis Krupp <lkrupp@invalid.pssw.com.invalid> - 2024-10-02 03:12 -0600
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-29 07:27 +0100
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2024-09-30 12:35 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-30 14:26 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-30 19:53 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 21:47 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-01 18:39 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-01 21:55 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 21:45 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2024-10-01 17:40 -0400
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-30 14:19 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 21:44 +0000
        Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-24 23:31 +0000
      Re: The joy of FORTRAN scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-09-24 19:11 +0000
        Re: The joy of FORTRAN The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-24 20:22 +0100
    Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-24 21:09 +0000
      Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-24 23:49 +0000
    Re: The joy of FORTRAN Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-09-24 22:05 +0000
      Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-24 15:37 -0700
    Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2024-09-24 17:54 -0700
      Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-25 01:46 +0000
      Re: The joy of FORTRAN Bill Findlay <findlaybill@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2024-09-25 15:40 +0100
        Re: The joy of FORTRAN R Daneel Olivaw <Danny@hyperspace.vogon.gov> - 2024-09-25 16:59 +0200
          Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-26 17:52 -0700
        Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2024-09-25 10:45 -0700
      Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-25 19:11 +0000
  Re: The joy of FORTRAN Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-09-24 13:21 +0000
    Re: The joy of FORTRAN cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2024-09-24 17:12 +0000
      Re: The joy of FORTRAN Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-09-24 22:05 +0000
        Re: The joy of FORTRAN cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2024-09-25 13:01 +0000
          Re: The joy of FORTRAN Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-09-25 15:13 +0000
  Re: The joy of FORTRAN R Daneel Olivaw <Danny@hyperspace.vogon.gov> - 2024-09-24 19:55 +0200
  Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-24 15:36 -0700
  Re: The joy of FORTRAN "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-09-25 02:42 -0400
    Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-25 06:47 +0000
      Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-25 07:14 +0000
    Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-25 19:11 +0000
      Re: The joy of FORTRAN "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-09-25 23:16 -0400
        Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-26 16:18 +0000
          Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-26 20:51 +0000
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN "Kerr-Mudd, John" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2024-09-27 11:32 +0100
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-27 12:10 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Bob Martin <bob.martin@excite.com> - 2024-09-27 11:52 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-09-27 14:17 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN "Kerr-Mudd, John" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2024-09-28 09:33 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-09-28 09:41 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN "Kerr-Mudd, John" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2024-09-29 09:19 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN R Daneel Olivaw <Danny@hyperspace.vogon.gov> - 2024-09-29 11:23 +0200
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-09-29 10:18 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN R Daneel Olivaw <Danny@hyperspace.vogon.gov> - 2024-09-29 16:47 +0200
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-29 13:15 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-09-29 10:10 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-29 23:37 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN lar3ryca <larry@invalid.ca> - 2024-10-08 19:53 -0600
                Re: The joy of Python Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-09 05:46 +0000
                Re: The joy of Python p.dean@invalid.net (Peter Dean) - 2024-10-09 07:12 +0000
                Re: The joy of Python "Kerr-Mudd, John" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2024-10-09 09:27 +0100
                Re: The joy of Python lar3ryca <larry@invalid.ca> - 2024-10-09 21:42 -0600
                Re: The joy of Python p.dean@invalid.net (Peter Dean) - 2024-10-10 04:39 +0000
                Re: The joy of perl p.dean@invalid.net (Peter Dean) - 2024-10-09 14:01 +0000
                Re: The joy of awk p.dean@invalid.net (Peter Dean) - 2024-10-09 15:32 +0000
                Re: The joy of awk "Kerr-Mudd, John" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2024-10-11 09:25 +0100
                Re: The joy of awk John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-10-11 07:55 -0700
                Re: The joy of awk Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-10-11 17:59 +0000
                Re: The joy of perl Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-10 07:48 +0000
                Re: The joy of perl Geoff Clare <geoff@clare.See-My-Signature.invalid> - 2024-10-10 13:21 +0100
                Re: The joy of perl cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2024-10-10 12:49 +0000
                Re: The joy of perl Geoff Clare <geoff@clare.See-My-Signature.invalid> - 2024-10-10 15:24 +0100
                Re: The joy of perl p.dean@invalid.net (Peter Dean) - 2024-10-10 20:27 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-27 23:52 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-09-27 14:15 +0000
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-09-27 14:13 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-09-27 22:00 +0200
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-27 20:38 +0000
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-27 23:33 +0000
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-28 10:29 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-09-28 20:17 +0000
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-10-04 01:19 -0400
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-04 05:48 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-10-04 02:03 -0400
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-04 06:56 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-04 07:40 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-04 20:13 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-04 22:47 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-05 06:12 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-10-05 23:20 -0400
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-06 03:29 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Louis Krupp <lkrupp@invalid.pssw.com.invalid> - 2024-10-06 16:06 -0600
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-07 03:02 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-10-07 10:00 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-10-05 02:37 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-05 06:13 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-05 07:00 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-05 08:08 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-06 02:29 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-06 03:43 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2024-10-04 08:39 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-10-04 08:00 -0700
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-10-04 17:06 +0000
              Re: python abstractions, The joy of FORTRAN John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2024-10-04 18:00 +0000
          Re: The joy of FORTRAN "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-09-27 02:45 -0400
            Re: The joy of Ada Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-27 06:52 +0000
              Re: The joy of Ada Andy Walker <anw@cuboid.co.uk> - 2024-09-27 12:02 +0100
                Re: The joy of Ada Bob Martin <bob.martin@excite.com> - 2024-09-27 11:53 +0000
                Re: The joy of Ada Bill Findlay <findlaybill@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2024-09-28 00:01 +0100
                Re: The joy of Ada Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-28 00:05 +0000
                Re: The joy of Ada Bill Findlay <findlaybill@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2024-09-28 01:31 +0100
                The joy of Oldtimers Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2024-09-28 12:37 -0700
                Re: The joy of Oldtimers drb@ihatespam.msu.edu (Dennis Boone) - 2024-09-29 01:40 +0000
                Re: The joy of Oldtimers Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2024-09-29 07:17 -0700
                Re: The joy of Ada Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-27 23:35 +0000
                Re: The joy of Ada "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-09-27 20:54 -0400
                Re: The joy of Ada Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-09-28 09:32 +0000
                Re: The joy of Ada "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-09-29 01:30 -0400
                Re: The joy of Ada Louis Krupp <lkrupp@invalid.pssw.com.invalid> - 2024-10-04 05:26 -0600
                Re: The joy of Ada Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2024-10-04 15:48 +0000
              Re: The joy of Ada Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-28 10:29 -0700
                Re: The joy of Ada Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-28 21:45 +0000
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-09-27 07:59 -0700
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN Harold Stevens <wookie@aspen.localdomain> - 2024-09-27 11:08 -0500
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-09-27 09:32 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN R Daneel Olivaw <Danny@hyperspace.vogon.gov> - 2024-09-27 18:38 +0200
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-27 17:43 +0000
              Re: The pain of Excel Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-27 23:41 +0000
                Re: The pain of Excel Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-29 04:26 +0000
                Re: The pain of Excel Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-29 05:35 +0000
                Re: The pain of Excel Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-30 05:46 +0000
                Re: The pain of Excel Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 05:55 +0000
                Re: The pain of Excel Pancho <Pancho.Jones@proton.me> - 2024-09-30 10:36 +0100
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-09-27 21:49 -0400
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2024-09-30 10:36 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-30 18:51 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 21:48 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-09-30 18:04 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-30 14:19 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 21:52 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-01 01:26 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-01 01:39 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2024-10-01 11:35 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-10-01 15:39 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-02 00:58 +0000
        Re: The joy of FORTRAN moi <findlaybill@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2024-09-26 23:30 +0100
      Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-26 17:52 -0700
        Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-27 17:43 +0000
    Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-26 17:52 -0700
      Re: The joy of FORTRAN geodandw <geodandw@gmail.com> - 2024-09-26 21:20 -0400
        Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-27 17:43 +0000
          Re: The joy of FORTRAN geodandw <geodandw@gmail.com> - 2024-09-27 15:09 -0400
            Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-27 20:38 +0000
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-27 23:43 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-09-29 04:26 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-29 05:36 +0000
              Re: The joy of FORTRAN "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-09-28 03:18 -0400
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-28 09:12 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-28 08:24 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-09-29 01:28 -0400
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-29 05:42 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-29 20:00 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Harold Stevens <wookie@aspen.localdomain> - 2024-09-29 17:08 -0500
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-29 23:28 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-09-29 23:36 -0400
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-30 07:40 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 07:52 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-09-30 20:19 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN jgd@cix.co.uk (John Dallman) - 2024-09-30 22:04 +0100
                OT: Scientology, was Re: The joy of FORTRAN Chuck Martin <cmartin+usenetYYMMDD@nyx.net> - 2024-10-02 07:40 +0000
                Re: OT: Scientology, was Re: The joy of FORTRAN jgd@cix.co.uk (John Dallman) - 2024-10-02 09:57 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-30 13:08 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-30 14:19 -0700
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN "186282@ud0s4.net" <186283@ud0s4.net> - 2024-10-02 03:34 -0400
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN moi <findlaybill@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2024-10-03 17:32 +0100
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-01 01:06 +0000
                Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-01 01:42 +0000
                OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN Bobbie Sellers <blissInSanFrancisco@mouse-potato.com> - 2024-09-30 08:36 -0700
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-09-30 17:00 +0100
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 21:57 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-01 00:51 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN Bobbie Sellers <blissInSanFrancisco@mouse-potato.com> - 2024-09-30 20:32 -0700
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-10-01 16:37 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-10-02 11:02 +0100
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-02 16:43 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-10-02 18:07 -0700
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-10-01 13:51 +0100
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-01 19:00 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-10-02 11:18 +0100
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-02 16:41 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-09-30 14:19 -0700
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-09-30 23:34 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-01 19:03 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-01 22:00 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-02 02:40 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-02 03:05 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-02 07:29 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-02 08:30 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-02 16:46 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-10-02 18:11 +0100
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-02 22:33 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-02 23:53 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-03 02:10 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-03 03:48 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-10-03 10:56 +0100
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-10-03 15:34 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-03 18:38 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-03 22:26 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-04 03:26 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-04 03:54 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-10-04 10:47 +0100
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-04 19:39 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-03 22:24 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-10-03 23:55 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-04 00:38 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2024-10-03 18:11 -0700
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of Population Growth Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-10-04 01:46 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN D <nospam@example.net> - 2024-10-04 10:20 +0200
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-10-04 10:39 +0100
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-10-04 17:06 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-04 19:46 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2024-10-04 10:33 +0100
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-10-04 17:06 +0000
                Re: OT ; Re: The joy of FORTRAN rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2024-10-04 03:01 +0000

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