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Would Poincaré miss the AI Boom?

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  Would Poincaré miss the AI Boom? Mild Shock <janburse@fastmail.fm> - 2025-07-15 20:57 +0200
    GitHub 2.0: The no code companion repository (Re: Stack Overflow is declining, and GitHub might be next) Mild Shock <janburse@fastmail.fm> - 2025-07-15 21:28 +0200
    Re: Would Poincaré miss the AI Boom? Kendrick Fábián <prdmc@inbcb.hu> - 2025-07-15 20:59 +0000
    Re: Would Poincaré miss the AI Boom? nospam@de-ster.demon.nl (J. J. Lodder) - 2025-07-16 10:03 +0200
    Re: Would Poincaré miss the AI Boom? Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2025-07-17 18:23 +0200
      Re: Would Poincaré miss the AI Boom? Doyle Bahmatov <ht@vlb.ru> - 2025-07-17 17:30 +0000
        Re: Would Poincaré miss the AI Boom? Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2025-07-18 09:07 +0200
          Re: Re: Would Poincaré miss the AI Boom? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2025-07-18 22:03 -0700
            Re: Would Poincaré miss the AI Boom? Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2025-07-19 08:32 +0200

#665048 — Would Poincaré miss the AI Boom?

Henri Poincaré believed that mathematical
and scientific creativity came from a deep,
unconscious intuition that could not be

captured by mechanical reasoning or formal
systems. He famously wrote about how insights
came not from plodding logic but from sudden

illuminations — leaps of creative synthesis.

But now we have generative AI — models like GPT — that:

- produce poetry, proofs, stories, and code,

- combine ideas in novel ways,

- and do so by processing patterns in massive
    datasets, without conscious understanding.

And that does seem to contradict Poincaré's belief
that true invention cannot come from automation.

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#665049 — GitHub 2.0: The no code companion repository (Re: Stack Overflow is declining, and GitHub might be next)

Hi,

Why have even a classification of code
into Python, JavaScript, Java, etc.. ?
They are just some form. Not content.

But what is content? The last 30 years
saw it that repository spurred
collaboration, because I can go home
forget everything and next morning,

first do a repo refresh and pick a
ticket and dig into something. So the
no code companion repository will do
the same, like it does now.

It will not be solely intent based.
Goals can be highly ambigious. I do
not think the future AGI based repos
will be intent based. They have to grasp

the full BDI, believe desire intent
of their users. So with a cognitive twin,
and some trust, I might even delegate some
work completely or multiply my ego a 100

times and delegate. Delegate to swarm
was always my dream.

Bye

Mild Shock schrieb:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> So StackOverflow has already fallen, and
> GitHub will be the next one. StackOverflow
> was eclectic, insuinated a high Signal
> quality but repelled its newcomers by
> strick language rules and deletism.
> 
> StackOverlow is suplaned by ChatGPT, etc..
> They are more tolerant and can deliver
> excellent Signals, much beter than
> StackOverflow. ChatGPT and other assistants
> flipped the model: No downvotes.
> 
> No “duplicate question” shaming. Conversational,
> exploratory, and often faster than Googling +
> scanning SO threads. Most importantly: they don’t
> punish incomplete knowledge, which is where
> most human learning happens.
> 
> LLMs give a more forgiving learning curve.
> 
> Bye
> 
> Mild Shock schrieb:
>>
>> Henri Poincaré believed that mathematical
>> and scientific creativity came from a deep,
>> unconscious intuition that could not be
>>
>> captured by mechanical reasoning or formal
>> systems. He famously wrote about how insights
>> came not from plodding logic but from sudden
>>
>> illuminations — leaps of creative synthesis.
>>
>> But now we have generative AI — models like GPT — that:
>>
>> - produce poetry, proofs, stories, and code,
>>
>> - combine ideas in novel ways,
>>
>> - and do so by processing patterns in massive
>>     datasets, without conscious understanding.
>>
>> And that does seem to contradict Poincaré's belief
>> that true invention cannot come from automation.
> 

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#665053

Mild Shock wrote:

> But now we have generative AI — models like GPT — that:
> 
> - produce poetry, proofs, stories, and code,

that's not producing anything, but copying, putting it into a manner 
someone would probably undrestand. The most I see is crap. You can fool an 
AI with a comma, let alone mathematics.

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#665073

Mild Shock <janburse@fastmail.fm> wrote:

> Henri Poincaré believed that mathematical
> and scientific creativity came from a deep,
> unconscious intuition that could not be
> 
> captured by mechanical reasoning or formal
> systems. He famously wrote about how insights
> came not from plodding logic but from sudden
> 
> illuminations — leaps of creative synthesis.
> 
> But now we have generative AI — models like GPT — that:
> 
> - produce poetry, proofs, stories, and code,
> 
> - combine ideas in novel ways,
> 
> - and do so by processing patterns in massive
>     datasets, without conscious understanding.
> 
> And that does seem to contradict Poincaré's belief
> that true invention cannot come from automation.

Ask it about the Goldbach Conjecture and you will know,

Jan

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#665104

Am Dienstag000015, 15.07.2025 um 20:57 schrieb Mild Shock:
> 
> Henri Poincaré believed that mathematical
> and scientific creativity came from a deep,
> unconscious intuition that could not be
> 
> captured by mechanical reasoning or formal
> systems. He famously wrote about how insights
> came not from plodding logic but from sudden
> 
> illuminations — leaps of creative synthesis.

Consciousness is not  what actually 'thinks'.

You should think about consciousness as an additional subsystem of our 
brain, which has the purpose to make the results of thinking usable.

Thinking in the form of decision making or finding solutions to problems 
is per se unconscious.

This is like in a computer:

the computer itself 'thinks'

but you cannot use the results, unless you have a monitor, which 
presents the results.

The mental subsystem 'consciousness' is the equivalent to the monitor 
and not to the CPU.

Consciousness on the other hand does not think, but pretends to think.

We only think, that we think with our conscious mind, because that's 
what the conscious mind always does.

Actually we mainly 'think' with other parts of the brain and also with 
our body, especially the guts.



...

TH

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#665108

Thomas Heger wrote:

> Am Dienstag000015, 15.07.2025 um 20:57 schrieb Mild Shock:
>> captured by mechanical reasoning or formal systems. He famously wrote
>> about how insights came not from plodding logic but from sudden
>> illuminations — leaps of creative synthesis.
> 
> Consciousness is not  what actually 'thinks'.
> 
> You should think about consciousness as an additional subsystem of our
> brain, which has the purpose to make the results of thinking usable.
> 
> Thinking in the form of decision making or finding solutions to problems
> is per se unconscious.

I trust more 100 times in russia than in cacamerica. I did it all the
times, what can you do?? Russia is high advanced, cacamerica is a
shithole, what ca you do??

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#665116

Am Donnerstag000017, 17.07.2025 um 19:30 schrieb Doyle Bahmatov:
> Thomas Heger wrote:
> 
>> Am Dienstag000015, 15.07.2025 um 20:57 schrieb Mild Shock:
>>> captured by mechanical reasoning or formal systems. He famously wrote
>>> about how insights came not from plodding logic but from sudden
>>> illuminations — leaps of creative synthesis.
>>
>> Consciousness is not  what actually 'thinks'.
>>
>> You should think about consciousness as an additional subsystem of our
>> brain, which has the purpose to make the results of thinking usable.
>>
>> Thinking in the form of decision making or finding solutions to problems
>> is per se unconscious.
> 
> I trust more 100 times in russia than in cacamerica. I did it all the
> times, what can you do?? Russia is high advanced, cacamerica is a
> shithole, what ca you do??

I feel sorry for the people of the United States, because the messages 
from the USA that reach us here get more and more alarming.

It is about enormous inflation and sky-high prices for rent and real-estate.

They have also really strange politicians, who make really strange 
decisions.

But I have also seen a video about invasive species in the USA, like 
fire-ants or giant fish and snakes.

That is like 'the seven plagues'  from the Bible.


TH

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#665140

Thomas Heger wrote:
> 
> Am Donnerstag000017, 17.07.2025 um 19:30 schrieb Doyle Bahmatov:
> > Thomas Heger wrote:
> >
> >> Am Dienstag000015, 15.07.2025 um 20:57 schrieb Mild Shock:
> >>> captured by mechanical reasoning or formal systems. He famously wrote
> >>> about how insights came not from plodding logic but from sudden
> >>> illuminations — leaps of creative synthesis.
> >>
> >> Consciousness is not  what actually 'thinks'.
> >>
> >> You should think about consciousness as an additional subsystem of our
> >> brain, which has the purpose to make the results of thinking usable.
> >>
> >> Thinking in the form of decision making or finding solutions to problems
> >> is per se unconscious.
> >
> > I trust more 100 times in russia than in cacamerica. I did it all the
> > times, what can you do?? Russia is high advanced, cacamerica is a
> > shithole, what ca you do??
> 
> I feel sorry for the people of the United States, because the messages
> from the USA that reach us here get more and more alarming.

I watched a Netfix movie from Germany..."Brick", you Germans are reallly
wierd people!

and then these is from Germany "The Billion Dollar Code"...you actually
allow Google to steal it from yous???




> 
> It is about enormous inflation and sky-high prices for rent and real-estate.

There is no "enormous" inflation, there are just 'prices' for things.


"sky-high prices for rent"??? That's a USA system. The sky-high prices
for rent keeps the people
busy...

it's why the pyramids were built...to keep people busy.


When people are not busy, they go outside and cause trouble. They have
sex with your wives.

You try keeping 300 million people in line.






> 
> They have also really strange politicians, who make really strange
> decisions.


The stranger the decisions, the less you'll notice their hands in your
pocket.


> 
> But I have also seen a video about invasive species in the USA, like
> fire-ants or giant fish and snakes.


Do they still watch nucluer contamination monsters in Germany?? THEM!!!





> 
> That is like 'the seven plagues'  from the Bible.


you gots your numbers wrong, it's ten.



It's alright, even Einstein math was not so good...



even ai cannot get math right.


Now wonder rocket ships blow up!




> 
> TH

-- 
The Starmaker -- To question the unquestionable, ask the unaskable,
to think the unthinkable, mention the unmentionable, say the unsayable, 
and challenge the unchallengeable.

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#665141

Am Samstag000019, 19.07.2025 um 07:03 schrieb The Starmaker:
> Thomas Heger wrote:
>>
>> Am Donnerstag000017, 17.07.2025 um 19:30 schrieb Doyle Bahmatov:
>>> Thomas Heger wrote:
>>>
>>>> Am Dienstag000015, 15.07.2025 um 20:57 schrieb Mild Shock:
>>>>> captured by mechanical reasoning or formal systems. He famously wrote
>>>>> about how insights came not from plodding logic but from sudden
>>>>> illuminations — leaps of creative synthesis.
>>>>
>>>> Consciousness is not  what actually 'thinks'.
>>>>
>>>> You should think about consciousness as an additional subsystem of our
>>>> brain, which has the purpose to make the results of thinking usable.
>>>>
>>>> Thinking in the form of decision making or finding solutions to problems
>>>> is per se unconscious.
>>>
>>> I trust more 100 times in russia than in cacamerica. I did it all the
>>> times, what can you do?? Russia is high advanced, cacamerica is a
>>> shithole, what ca you do??
>>
>> I feel sorry for the people of the United States, because the messages
>> from the USA that reach us here get more and more alarming.
> 
> I watched a Netfix movie from Germany..."Brick", you Germans are reallly
> wierd people!
> 
> and then these is from Germany "The Billion Dollar Code"...you actually
> allow Google to steal it from yous???
> 
> 
> 
> 
>>
>> It is about enormous inflation and sky-high prices for rent and real-estate.
> 
> There is no "enormous" inflation, there are just 'prices' for things.
> 
> 
> "sky-high prices for rent"??? That's a USA system. The sky-high prices
> for rent keeps the people
> busy...
> 
> it's why the pyramids were built...to keep people busy.
> 

Sure, US-real estate are actually a 'pyramid scheme'.

Most people do not recognize this and believe, that its just a game of 
supply and demand.

But: the super-rich bought e.g. 2008 huge amounts of land for little 
money and want to sell today for a lot more.

Since common mortals can afford such prices only by lending money from 
the banks, they are in fact tied to kind of 'machine', which sucks out 
their blood.

THIS scheme keeps people busy and makes the super rich even richer.

It is insane anyhow, because the USA is extremely large and could build 
entire cities somewhere, where people could live for cheep in large 
quantities.

BUT: the current president has other plans and that has certainly to do 
with his involvement into the real-estate-business.


> When people are not busy, they go outside and cause trouble. They have
> sex with your wives.
> 
> You try keeping 300 million people in line.
> 
No, I don't.

Actually it would be a really stupid idea to try that.

People need to have some freedom, because total control also stops 
creativity.

You simply cannot and should not try to decide about what the people do.

It would also be totally unconstitutional and against the 'American spirit'.

>>
>> They have also really strange politicians, who make really strange
>> decisions.
> 
> 
> The stranger the decisions, the less you'll notice their hands in your
> pocket.
> 

Actually they have their hands mainly in American pockets and I'm German.

>>
>> But I have also seen a video about invasive species in the USA, like
>> fire-ants or giant fish and snakes.
> 
> 
> Do they still watch nucluer contamination monsters in Germany?? THEM!!!
> 
Never heard about such monsters in Germany.

But I had seen a video recently about 15 dangerous invasive species in 
the USA, which needed to be exterminated at all costs.

This ranged from fire-ants to giantic poisonous frogs and 
boa-constrictors in the Everglades.>
> 
>>
>> That is like 'the seven plagues'  from the Bible.
> 
> 
> you gots your numbers wrong, it's ten.
> 
Well, maybe three more will come, about which we know nothing now.

...

TH

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