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Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics

From The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com>
Newsgroups sci.physics.relativity
Subject Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics
Date 2022-03-04 13:41 -0800
Organization Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID <6222876C.76A5@ix.netcom.com> (permalink)
References <svt5d2$vag$1@gioia.aioe.org> <19e49842-ab2f-4aee-b50b-55bb3686b478n@googlegroups.com> <svtv6t$b4c$1@gioia.aioe.org>

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Odd Bodkin wrote:
> 
> patdolan <patdolan@comcast.net> wrote:
> > On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 5:49:26 AM UTC-8, bodk...@gmail.com wrote:
> >> There’s a very simple test to see if you’re interested in physics, or if
> >> you only want to casually waste your time with it. And hey, if you find
> >> yourself with a lot of time and can think of nothing better to do than to
> >> waste it, far be it from me to keep you from that squandering.
> >>
> >> If you’re truly interested in physics (or any subject), you will do what
> >> you did early in your life, from 15-30. You will learn the subject by
> >> studying books and materials generated specifically to teach you the
> >> subject. Engineers did this on the way to being an engineer, doctors did
> >> this on the way to becoming a doctor, chemists did this on the way to being
> >> a chemist.
> >>
> >> On the other hand, if you do not wish to spend time studying books and
> >> instructional materials in physics, then you aren’t really interested in
> >> the subject. It doesn’t matter what excuses you might offer for not
> >> studying those materials — there have been many offered. You’re just not
> >> interested enough in the subject to learn it.
> >>
> >> It’s as simple as that, and a little brutal self-awareness would come in
> >> handy.
> >>
> >> And if you do not want to have that conversation with yourself, just be
> >> aware (if nothing else) that everyone else will make that assessment on
> >> their own about you. This means that if you bristle and splutter that you
> >> really are interested in physics, despite this observation, everyone will
> >> still be aware that you are not telling the truth.
> >>
> >> It does not matter how many years you spent with physics, it does not
> >> matter how many books you own or have opened, it does not matter how much
> >> effort you have put into writing your own musings about physics, it does
> >> not matter how many physicists you have as friends.
> >>
> >> If you don’t learn physics, you’re just not interested in physics.
> >
> > Bodkin,
> >
> > Galileo learnt physics--forward and back.  And he kept studying it after
> > he learnt it.  Guess what, like me, he discovered that it was wrong in several areas.
> 
> 1. Galileo was widely read.
> 
> 2. Galileo performed real experiments and made quantitative experiments.
> 
> 3. Where he discovered things were wrong, it was because of those
> experimental observations, not because of “logical thinking”.
> 
> 4. Galileo did not descend into self-amused babbling due to excessive
> drinking.


You forgot number 5...didn't he invented the Cuckoo Clock??? 

Cuckoo
Cuckoo
Cuckoo



-- 
The Starmaker -- To question the unquestionable, ask the unaskable,
 to think the unthinkable, mention the unmentionable, say the unsayable,
and challenge
 the unchallengeable.

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Thread

How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-04 13:49 +0000
  Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2022-03-04 11:37 -0600
    Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-04 18:07 +0000
      Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-03-04 11:28 -0800
        Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-04 21:17 +0000
      Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2022-03-05 18:15 -0600
        Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-06 13:25 +0000
          Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2022-03-06 12:02 -0600
  Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics patdolan <patdolan@comcast.net> - 2022-03-04 10:20 -0800
    Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics "Paul B. Andersen" <paul.b.andersen@paulba.no> - 2022-03-04 19:48 +0100
    Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-04 21:09 +0000
      Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-03-04 13:41 -0800
        Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-03-05 11:41 -0800
          Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-03-05 16:49 -0800
            Crank Richard Hertz complains that he's been assfucked "Dono." <eggy20011951@gmail.com> - 2022-03-05 17:04 -0800
              Re: Crank Richard Hertz complains that he's been assfucked Ober Corn <nm@cvslm.ca> - 2022-03-06 22:33 +0000
            Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2022-03-06 16:11 -0500
      Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-03-04 21:30 -0800
  Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics patdolan <patdolan@comcast.net> - 2022-03-04 11:09 -0800
    Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-04 21:17 +0000
      Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2022-03-04 16:20 -0800
  Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2022-03-04 11:16 -0800
  Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-03-04 14:01 -0800
  Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Grant Knox <iir@nnewa.ca> - 2022-03-04 22:22 +0000
  Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Ken Seto <setoken47@gmail.com> - 2022-03-06 08:19 -0800
    Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2022-03-06 12:31 -0600
      Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-06 20:07 +0000
        Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2022-03-06 15:21 -0600
          Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-07 13:38 +0000
            Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2022-03-07 12:15 -0600
              Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-07 18:32 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-03-07 10:47 -0800
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-03-07 20:25 -0800
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-08 13:52 +0000
    Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-06 20:07 +0000
      Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Ken Seto <setoken47@gmail.com> - 2022-03-07 08:00 -0800
        Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-07 16:15 +0000
          Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Ken Seto <setoken47@gmail.com> - 2022-03-07 20:17 -0800
            Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-08 13:52 +0000
              Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Ken Seto <setoken47@gmail.com> - 2022-03-09 06:00 -0800
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-09 14:13 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Ken Seto <setoken47@gmail.com> - 2022-03-11 07:02 -0800
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-11 16:16 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Ken Seto <setoken47@gmail.com> - 2022-03-13 14:39 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-13 21:58 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2022-03-11 11:51 -0500
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Ken Seto <setoken47@gmail.com> - 2022-03-13 14:59 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Python <python@example.invalid> - 2022-03-13 23:08 +0100
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-03-13 22:12 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-13 22:10 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Ken Seto <setoken47@gmail.com> - 2022-03-14 06:54 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-14 15:05 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2022-03-13 20:22 -0400
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-03-13 22:13 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Ken Seto <setoken47@gmail.com> - 2022-03-14 06:42 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-14 15:05 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Ken Seto <setoken47@gmail.com> - 2022-03-15 06:36 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-15 15:48 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-18 07:14 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-18 18:01 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-03-18 21:30 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-03-18 22:25 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-03-20 11:48 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2022-03-20 12:32 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2022-03-14 12:43 -0400
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Ken Seto <setoken47@gmail.com> - 2022-03-15 06:42 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Python <python@example.invalid> - 2022-03-15 14:47 +0100
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Ken Seto <setoken47@gmail.com> - 2022-03-15 07:31 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Python <python@example.invalid> - 2022-03-15 15:37 +0100
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Ken Seto <setoken47@gmail.com> - 2022-03-15 08:01 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Python <python@example.invalid> - 2022-03-15 16:18 +0100
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-03-15 09:16 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2022-03-15 12:56 -0400
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-18 07:22 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2022-03-18 13:54 -0400
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-18 18:01 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-20 04:52 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-20 12:10 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-20 05:26 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-20 05:46 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-20 13:11 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-20 06:52 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2022-03-20 12:01 -0400
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-03-20 09:21 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-20 09:52 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2022-03-20 12:53 -0500
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-20 12:03 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2022-03-20 14:40 -0500
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-20 20:10 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-03-20 14:23 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2022-03-20 22:29 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2022-03-20 18:18 -0500
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-21 11:43 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2022-03-21 17:51 -0500
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-22 00:07 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2022-03-22 11:12 -0500
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-22 16:22 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2022-03-22 11:54 -0500
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2022-03-22 17:19 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-22 21:14 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2022-03-22 21:33 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2022-03-22 22:16 -0500
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2022-03-24 10:59 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-22 18:28 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-20 19:35 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2022-03-22 00:41 -0400
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-20 19:35 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-03-20 06:53 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-20 09:48 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-20 19:35 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-21 11:43 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-21 07:43 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-21 15:04 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-21 11:53 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-21 22:07 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-21 15:27 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-22 00:07 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-22 05:41 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-22 14:51 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-22 14:55 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-23 07:46 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-23 15:23 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-24 05:40 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-24 13:55 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-03-24 09:03 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-25 06:46 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-25 15:11 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-25 18:32 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2022-03-25 18:46 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-26 05:59 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-26 13:13 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-26 01:55 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2022-03-25 15:20 -0400
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-26 05:48 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-25 07:34 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2022-03-22 00:48 -0400
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-20 09:56 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-20 19:35 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-21 11:43 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-21 07:26 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-21 15:04 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-21 08:47 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-21 15:57 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-21 12:19 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Prokaryotic Capase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2022-03-21 14:54 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-21 15:12 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Prokaryotic Capase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2022-03-22 02:06 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Prokaryotic Capase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2022-03-22 04:13 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2022-03-21 17:16 -0500
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> - 2022-03-22 18:41 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2022-03-22 19:32 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Prokaryotic Capase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2022-03-23 06:47 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> - 2022-03-23 15:32 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2022-03-22 22:17 -0500
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-21 22:07 +0000
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-21 07:47 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-21 07:48 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-03-20 05:18 -0700
                Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2022-03-20 05:44 -0700
        Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2022-03-07 10:22 -0800
    Re: How you can tell if someone is really interested in physics Ober Corn <nm@cvslm.ca> - 2022-03-06 20:42 +0000

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