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Re: Termination Analyzer H prevents Denial of Service attacks

Subject Re: Termination Analyzer H prevents Denial of Service attacks
Newsgroups comp.theory, comp.ai.philosophy, sci.logic
References (2 earlier) <u6fhtb$fogg$1@dont-email.me> <E3KiM.2296$Vpga.1840@fx09.iad> <u6fsb9$h14r$1@dont-email.me> <tcLiM.322$bv69.123@fx39.iad> <u6g8g4$imv4$1@dont-email.me>
From Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org>
Message-ID <35PiM.9$3XE8.8@fx42.iad> (permalink)
Organization Forte - www.forteinc.com
Date 2023-06-15 21:41 -0400

Cross-posted to 3 groups.

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On 6/15/23 7:56 PM, olcott wrote:
> On 6/15/2023 4:16 PM, Richard Damon wrote:
>> On 6/15/23 4:29 PM, olcott wrote:
>>> On 6/15/2023 2:58 PM, Richard Damon wrote:
>>>> On 6/15/23 1:31 PM, olcott wrote:
>>>>> On 6/15/2023 11:57 AM, Richard Damon wrote:
>>>>>> On 6/15/23 12:50 PM, olcott wrote:
>>>>>>> A termination analyzer is an ordinary computer program that is 
>>>>>>> supposed
>>>>>>> to determine whether or not its input program will ever stop 
>>>>>>> running or
>>>>>>> gets stuck in infinite execution.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Right, THE PROGRAM, not the simulation of the program by the 
>>>>>> analyzer.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> When a program input has been specifically defined to confuse a
>>>>>>> termination analyzer it is correct to determine that the program
>>>>>>> behavior is malevolent.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Nope, since the PROGRAM stops, the only correct answer (if you 
>>>>>> analyser is supposed to be accurate) is to say it stops.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If you are allowing FALSE answers,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Prior to my work nothing could be done about inputs having a
>>>>>>> pathological relationship to their termination analyzer. Prior to my
>>>>>>> work Rice's theorem prevented this pathological relationship from 
>>>>>>> being
>>>>>>> recognized.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Because there was no need to even try to define "pathological 
>>>>>> inputs", as the deciders are defined to work for ALL input.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The pathological relationship is when an input program D is 
>>>>>>> defined to
>>>>>>> do the opposite of whatever its termination analyzer H says it 
>>>>>>> will do.
>>>>>>> If H says that D will stop running D runs an infinite loop. If H 
>>>>>>> says
>>>>>>> that D will never stop running, D immediately stops running.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Right, so H is just wrong.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> When H(D,D) returns 0 this means that the input does not halt or the
>>>>>>> input has pathological behavior that would otherwise cause the
>>>>>>> termination analyzer to not halt. This means that the program has 
>>>>>>> either
>>>>>>> a non-termination bug or the program has malevolent behavior.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But Malevolent behaior is ALLOWED by the problem, so H is just wrong.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This reasoning completely overcomes the one key objection to my work
>>>>>>> that has persisted for two years.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Nope, just proves that you don't understand what requirements mean.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Termination Analyzer H prevents Denial of Service attacks*
>>>>>>> https://www.researchgate.net/publication/369971402_Termination_Analyzer_H_prevents_Denial_of_Service_attacks
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Since D(D) Halts, the ONLY correct answer for H(D,D) is Halting, 
>>>>>> so the fact it says non-halting says it is NOT a correct Halt 
>>>>>> Decider.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Maybe it is a correct POOP decider, but then you need to find a 
>>>>>> use for your POOP.
>>>>>
>>>>> *THERE IS NO WAY AROUND THIS VERIFIED FACT*
>>>>> H returns 0 indicating that:
>>>>> (a) D does not halt
>>>>
>>>> Except that D does Halt, and you admit it, thus your (a) is a 
>>>> VERIFIED LIE.
>>>>
>>>>> (b) D has a pathological relationship to H that would prevent H 
>>>>> from halting.
>>>>
>>>> Which is an issue with H, not D. H, is REQUIRED to be able to handle 
>>>> *ALL* inputs, so an input that gives H a problem is a problem with H.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> The algorithm used by H provides a way for DoS detectors and 
>>>>> termination
>>>>> analyzers to reject inputs having the halting problem's pathological
>>>>> relationship to H.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> And that same logic says that Trump actually won the election, as 
>>>> the actual votes don't actually matter.
>>>>
>>>>  From the DEFINITION of the Halt Problem, if M(d) Halts, then H(M,d) 
>>>> needs to say Halting.
>>>>
>>>> Since D(D) Halts, that means M(D,D) MUST return halting to be 
>>>> correct, and it doesn't and any claim that another answer is correct 
>>>> is just a LIE.
>>>>
>>>> The fact that you keep repeating this lie shows that you are just a 
>>>> pathetic hypocritical ignorant pathological lying idiot.
>>>>
>>>> YOU FAIL.
>>>>
>>>
>>> We can construe H as defeating Rice's theorem in that H
>>> correctly reports that input D has a [termination issue]
>>> where [termination issue] is defined as:
>>> (a) D does not halt
>>>      OR
>>> (b) D has a pathological relationship to H
>>>
>>
>> But D doesn't have a termination issue, because H DOES abort its 
>> simulation of it and returns 0 to it so it stops.
>>
>> Until you can show how that doesn't happen in the actual execution of 
>> D (not just via the INCORRECT simulation of H) you are just lying.
>>
>> Trying to define "iteration issue" in that matter means it isn't 
>> halting, and thus your H isn't a Halt Decider so not a counter to the 
>> proof.
>>
>> You are also just showing you don't understand Rice's Theorem. Note, 
>> the Halting Problem pathological case is NOT given as a proof of 
>> Rices's theorem, so your proof doesn't actually mean anything.
>>
>> You are just proving you are a failure.
> 
> 
> When we define [malevolent input] as an input that
> (a) does not halt <or>
> (b) targets the DoS detector with the conventional HP pathological 
> relationship
> 
> H does correctly recognize this [malevolent input] semantic property 
> thus refuting Rice’s theorem.
> 

No, that does not refute Rice's theorem, and shows that you totally 
don't understand how logic works or what Rice's Thoerem means.

DO you think that your H can answer correctly for EVERY possible input? 
If not, it isn't refutation, and shows you are just a stupid liar.

You are just showing how stupid you are, thinking that a proof by a 
single example actually shows that something is true for ALL inputs.

YOU FAIL

You are just a hypocritical ingorant pathological lying idiot.

Rice's theorem does NOT say that you can't make a decider on a semantic 
property that handles select inputs, it says you can't make a decider 
that decides for that property for ALL possible inputs.

IF I write a program that halts if it can find a refutation for one of 
the great problems (like the Collatz conjecture) can it tell if the 
program will ever halt?

I doubt it.

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Thread

Termination Analyzer H prevents Denial of Service attacks olcott <polcott2@gmail.com> - 2023-06-15 11:50 -0500
  Re: Termination Analyzer H prevents Denial of Service attacks Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2023-06-15 12:57 -0400
    Re: Termination Analyzer H prevents Denial of Service attacks olcott <polcott2@gmail.com> - 2023-06-15 12:31 -0500
      Re: Termination Analyzer H prevents Denial of Service attacks Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2023-06-15 15:58 -0400
        Re: Termination Analyzer H prevents Denial of Service attacks olcott <polcott2@gmail.com> - 2023-06-15 15:29 -0500
          Re: Termination Analyzer H prevents Denial of Service attacks Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2023-06-15 17:16 -0400
            Re: Termination Analyzer H prevents Denial of Service attacks olcott <polcott2@gmail.com> - 2023-06-15 18:56 -0500
              Re: Termination Analyzer H prevents Denial of Service attacks Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2023-06-15 21:41 -0400
                Re: Termination Analyzer H prevents Denial of Service attacks olcott <polcott2@gmail.com> - 2023-06-15 21:00 -0500
                Re: Termination Analyzer H prevents Denial of Service attacks Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2023-06-15 22:32 -0400
                Re: Termination Analyzer H prevents Denial of Service attacks olcott <polcott2@gmail.com> - 2023-06-15 22:00 -0500
                Re: Termination Analyzer H prevents Denial of Service attacks Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2023-06-15 23:17 -0400
                Re: Termination Analyzer H prevents Denial of Service attacks olcott <polcott2@gmail.com> - 2023-06-15 22:39 -0500
                Re: Termination Analyzer H prevents Denial of Service attacks Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2023-06-16 07:45 -0400
                Re: Termination Analyzer H prevents Denial of Service attacks olcott <polcott2@gmail.com> - 2023-06-16 09:38 -0500
                Re: Termination Analyzer H prevents Denial of Service attacks Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2023-06-16 19:45 -0400

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