Re: A little puzzle.

From	David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no>
Newsgroups	comp.programming
Subject	Re: A little puzzle.
Date	2022-11-22 15:26 +0100
Organization	A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID	<tlim77$3u8n$1@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References	<875yf8nijb.fsf@bsb.me.uk> <tlgp7v$3sinl$1@dont-email.me> <87tu2sm2bg.fsf@bsb.me.uk> <tli0jj$25jq$1@dont-email.me> <87tu2rkyjp.fsf@bsb.me.uk>

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On 22/11/2022 12:40, Ben Bacarisse wrote:
> David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> writes:
> 
>> On 21/11/2022 22:21, Ben Bacarisse wrote:
>>> David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> writes:
>>>

(We don't need secrets here, I think, so I'll snip the FF's.)

>>>> Are there any restrictions, such as sticking to integers?  The problem
>>>> becomes quite difficult if your measure is the reals in [0, 1) and
>>>> your "n" is, say, π/4...
>>> I don't follow.  What is "my" n?  I did not mention an n.
>>
>> You referred to a "start value" and an "en value".
> 
> Sorry, typo.  End value.
> 
>> I like to use names, so I'll call the "start value" "a", and use "n"
>> for the "en value".  So as far as I understand it, you are asking for
>> a function that takes an input "x" and determines if there is an
>> integer "i" such that
>>
>> 	x ≡ a + i.n
>>
>> where the congruence is over a "wrapping" set.
> 
> Hmm...  I must have made a real hash of the description (and I was being
> deliberately a bit vague for reasons that should come out later) because
> there is always such an i.

Maybe I had formed an impression of the problem too early, and 
interpreted everything you wrote to fit that idea.  Certainly for my 
interpretation, there is not always such an "i".  (For example, use 
modulo 24, with a = 0, n = 4, and x = 1.  No "i" can be found.  It's all 
about cyclic groups and subgroups.  Since I have no doubt at all that 
you know this, I assume I am misinterpreting you again :-) )

> 
> Here's an example.  An event starts at 5 minutes to the hour (start =
> 55) and ends at quarter past (end = 15).  The x's 55, 58, 3, 12 and so
> on are in the range, 53, 17 and 33 are not.
> 

OK.  We are talking ranges, rather than points.

> The fact that all data are integers is not really material.  We could
> consider compass points in [0, 2*pi) and have arbitrary start and end
> bearings.
> 
>>> I don't see why the problem can't be naturally extended to a circular
>>> real interval [0, 1), subject to the fact that we'll use floating point
>>> numbers for practical purposes.  But I don't think this is what you were
>>> talking about.
>>
>> Well, the point is if "being specifically concerned with integers"
>> means the puzzle is limited to integer ranges, or if that is just what
>> you were thinking about first.  I suppose you /do/ mean sticking to
>> integers, because I'd be surprised if a solution were possible once
>> you bring arbitrary real numbers into it.  That kind of mathematics
>> leads to things like the Banach-Tarski paradox, and watching far too
>> many maths Youtube videos...
> 
> I think I've not explained the problem well because there's not that
> rarefied about it!
> 

Surely it is not that unusual to enjoy things like this?

<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s86-Z-CbaHA>

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A little puzzle. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2022-11-21 20:45 +0000
  Re: A little puzzle. David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2022-11-21 22:06 +0100
    Re: A little puzzle. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2022-11-21 21:21 +0000
      Re: A little puzzle. David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2022-11-22 09:17 +0100
        Re: A little puzzle. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2022-11-22 11:07 +0000
          Re: A little puzzle. David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2022-11-22 15:17 +0100
        Re: A little puzzle. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2022-11-22 11:40 +0000
          Re: A little puzzle. David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2022-11-22 15:26 +0100
            Re: A little puzzle. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2022-11-22 15:28 +0000
              Re: A little puzzle. David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2022-11-22 16:30 +0100
      Re: A little puzzle. David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2022-11-22 09:23 +0100
        Re: A little puzzle. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2022-11-22 11:08 +0000
        Re: A little puzzle. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2022-11-22 12:54 +0000
  Re: A little puzzle. Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2022-11-21 17:39 -0800
    Re: A little puzzle. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2022-11-22 13:00 +0000
      Re: A little puzzle. Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2022-11-22 05:31 -0800
  Re: A little puzzle. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2022-11-22 11:04 +0000
    Re: A little puzzle. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2022-11-22 12:53 +0000
      Re: A little puzzle. Paul N <gw7rib@aol.com> - 2022-11-22 05:01 -0800
        Re: A little puzzle. Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2022-11-22 05:48 -0800
          Re: A little puzzle. David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2022-11-22 15:31 +0100
      FFs [was Re: A little puzzle] Richard Harnden <richard.nospam@gmail.com> - 2022-11-22 16:29 +0000
    Re: A little puzzle. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2022-12-14 13:57 +0000
      Re: A little puzzle. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2022-12-14 13:58 +0000
      Re: A little puzzle. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2022-12-14 16:22 +0000
  Re: A little puzzle. Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2022-11-22 05:24 -0800
    Re: A little puzzle. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2022-11-22 15:23 +0000
      Re: A little puzzle. Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2022-11-23 08:04 -0800
        Re: A little puzzle. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2022-11-24 00:06 +0000
          Re: A little puzzle. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2022-11-24 04:06 +0000
            Re: A little puzzle. David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2022-11-24 09:29 +0100
              Re: A little puzzle. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2022-11-24 13:23 +0000
            Re: A little puzzle. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2022-11-24 13:14 +0000
              Re: A little puzzle. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2022-11-24 14:00 +0000
                Re: A little puzzle. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2022-11-24 14:59 +0000
                Re: A little puzzle. Richard Harnden <richard.nospam@gmail.com> - 2022-11-24 19:00 +0000
                Re: A little puzzle. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2022-11-24 20:36 +0000
              Re: A little puzzle. Andreas <nobody@me.com> - 2022-11-27 00:38 +0100
                Re: A little puzzle. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2022-11-27 00:11 +0000
          Re: A little puzzle. Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2022-11-24 14:51 -0800
            Re: A little puzzle. "Dmitry A. Kazakov" <mailbox@dmitry-kazakov.de> - 2022-11-25 09:30 +0100
              Re: A little puzzle. Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2022-11-25 01:16 -0800
                Re: A little puzzle. "Dmitry A. Kazakov" <mailbox@dmitry-kazakov.de> - 2022-11-25 11:11 +0100
                Re: A little puzzle. Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2022-11-25 06:26 -0800
                Re: A little puzzle. "Dmitry A. Kazakov" <mailbox@dmitry-kazakov.de> - 2022-11-25 15:59 +0100
            Re: A little puzzle. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2022-11-26 16:25 +0000
              Re: A little puzzle. "Dmitry A. Kazakov" <mailbox@dmitry-kazakov.de> - 2022-11-26 19:36 +0100
                Re: A little puzzle. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2022-11-27 02:03 +0000
                Re: A little puzzle. "Dmitry A. Kazakov" <mailbox@dmitry-kazakov.de> - 2022-11-27 11:02 +0100
                Re: A little puzzle. Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2022-12-01 04:30 -0800
                Re: A little puzzle. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2022-12-02 00:22 +0000
                Re: A little puzzle. Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2022-12-02 22:30 -0800
                Re: A little puzzle. Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> - 2022-12-03 02:43 -0800
              Re: A little puzzle. Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2022-11-27 18:38 -0800
  Re: A little puzzle. Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> - 2022-11-27 02:27 -0800
    Re: A little puzzle. Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2022-11-27 19:23 -0800
      Re: A little puzzle. Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> - 2022-11-27 22:59 -0800
        Re: A little puzzle. Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> - 2022-11-27 23:03 -0800
        Re: A little puzzle. Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2022-11-28 07:22 -0800
          Re: A little puzzle. Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> - 2022-11-28 10:20 -0800
            Re: A little puzzle. Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2022-11-29 04:29 -0800
              Re: A little puzzle. Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> - 2022-11-29 04:50 -0800
                Re: A little puzzle. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2022-11-29 14:47 +0000
                Re: A little puzzle. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2022-11-29 17:23 +0000
                Re: A little puzzle. Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> - 2022-11-29 09:50 -0800
                Re: A little puzzle. Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2022-11-30 01:39 -0800
                Re: A little puzzle. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2022-11-30 11:10 +0000
                Re: A little puzzle. Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2022-11-30 02:24 -0800
                Re: A little puzzle. Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> - 2022-11-30 06:28 -0800
                Re: A little puzzle. Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2022-12-01 06:55 -0800
                Re: A little puzzle. Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> - 2022-12-02 01:54 -0800
  Re: A little puzzle. Richard Harnden <richard.nospam@gmail.com> - 2022-11-28 11:20 +0000
    Re: A little puzzle. Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2022-11-28 07:30 -0800
      Re: A little puzzle. Richard Harnden <richard.nospam@gmail.com> - 2022-11-28 17:15 +0000
        Re: A little puzzle. Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2022-11-29 04:03 -0800
          Re: A little puzzle. Richard Harnden <richard.nospam@gmail.com> - 2022-11-29 15:03 +0000
            Re: A little puzzle. "Dmitry A. Kazakov" <mailbox@dmitry-kazakov.de> - 2022-11-29 16:13 +0100
              Re: A little puzzle. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2022-11-29 17:37 +0000
                Re: A little puzzle. "Dmitry A. Kazakov" <mailbox@dmitry-kazakov.de> - 2022-11-29 19:02 +0100
                Re: A little puzzle. Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> - 2022-11-29 10:10 -0800
            Re: A little puzzle. Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2022-11-30 03:32 -0800
              Re: A little puzzle. Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> - 2022-11-30 06:36 -0800
              Re: A little puzzle. Richard Harnden <richard.nospam@gmail.com> - 2022-11-30 15:21 +0000
                Re: A little puzzle. Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2022-12-01 06:51 -0800

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