Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys)

From	The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>
Newsgroups	comp.os.linux.misc, alt.comp.os.windows-11
Subject	Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys)
Date	2025-09-05 10:33 +0100
Organization	A little, after lunch
Message-ID	<109eaps$2acbn$1@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References	(21 earlier) <6rOcnT-ikrnKpSX1nZ2dnZfqn_adnZ2d@giganews.com> <1099pev$18dit$2@dont-email.me> <109c2ms$1pa17$1@dont-email.me> <e0qoolxqi8.ln2@Telcontar.valinor> <vhGdnc0Z76GHNCf1nZ2dnZfqn_udnZ2d@giganews.com>

Cross-posted to 2 groups.

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On 05/09/2025 10:10, c186282 wrote:
> On 9/4/25 12:06 PM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
>> On 2025-09-04 15:03, Daniel70 wrote:
>>> On 4/09/2025 2:13 am, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>> On 03/09/2025 13:44, c186282 wrote:
>>>>> On 9/3/25 8:20 AM, Daniel70 wrote:
>>>>>> On 3/09/2025 4:11 am, Carlos E.R. wrote:
>>>>>>> On 2025-09-02 14:28, c186282 wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 9/2/25 8:07 AM, Daniel70 wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 1/09/2025 11:34 pm, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 01/09/2025 14:02, Daniel70 wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> <Snip>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> And, as I've mentioned before, here in Australia, our "Mains" 
>>>>>>>>>>> is 240V RMS so peaks out at about 340V between the Active 
>>>>>>>>>>> wire and the Neutral/Earth.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Everywhere it's R.M.S. Which is why mains reservoir caps in an 
>>>>>>>>>> SMPS are 400V rated as are the diodes feeding them...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Somewhere here I read where someone refered to a 120V supplied 
>>>>>>>>> that they typed was 90V effective. To me, 120V peak would be 
>>>>>>>>> about 90V RMS (or effective).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    Roughly, yes. It's sort of the REASON for 120vac - because
>>>>>>>>    the effective energy is about the same as Edison's old 90vcd
>>>>>>>>    service.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> There is something wrong with that. 120ac rms aka 170ac *ptp* has 
>>>>>>> the same thermal effect as 120 dc.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sorry, Carlos, but is that "ptp" supposed to mean "Peak to Peak" 
>>>>>> i.e. from Most Positive Value to Most Negative Value?? i.e. Double 
>>>>>> the Peak Value and almost TRIPLE the RMS value??
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    "AC/DC" appliances, "universal motors", work because 120vac
>>>>>>>>    and 90vdc are very similar in some important ways.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    USA had to support competing systems for quite awhile.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>    Just look at what you get if you put the 120vac through
>>>>>    a full-wave rectifier with a load. It's close, though
>>>>>    not exactly of course, equiv to 90vdc.
>>>>>
>>>> No., with capacitative smoothing its nearly 168V DC
>>>> Its still 120V RMS, even though the waveform is kooky.
>>>> Its never equivalent to 90V DC in any universe I know of.
>>>
>>> Sorry!! WHAT?? By feeding in a 120V RMS waveform, how the hell do you 
>>> get anywhere near 168V DC??
>>>
>>> The 120V RMS waveform has a Peak Positive Value of +170V and a Peak 
>>> Negative Value of -170V.
>>>
>>> How could you possibly expect to get an AVERAGE (smoothed) value of 
>>> 168V DC??
>>>
>>> If you Full wave rectified the Sine Wave (so you had two Positive 
>>> bumps per Cycle) and you then Filtered that (to produce DC), sure, 
>>> you might get an UNLOADED 170V DC'ish ..... but not very useful!!
>>
>> Actually, you also get nearly 170V dc under some load, with a good LC 
>> filter. If the load is higher, you need a transistor to smooth it out 
>> at a lower voltage.
> 
>    At zero load you MAY see those higher voltages.
> 
>    However real world, heavy loads ......
> 
In general  its about 20% above RMS.
So 120vAC would be usable at around 150V DC average


-- 
Ideas are more powerful than guns. We would not let our enemies have 
guns, why should we let them have ideas?

Josef Stalin

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Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-02 22:07 +1000
  Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-02 14:13 +0200
  Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-02 08:28 -0400
    Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-02 20:11 +0200
      Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-02 19:34 +0100
        Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-02 22:06 +0200
          Re: Electicity Supply Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-02 23:00 +0100
            Re: Electicity Supply Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2025-09-02 23:55 +0000
              Re: Electicity Supply Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-03 10:10 +0100
            Re: Electicity Supply Marc Haber <mh+usenetspam1118@zugschl.us> - 2025-09-03 11:00 +0200
          Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-03 22:30 +1000
            Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-03 14:57 +0200
            Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Mark Lloyd <not.email@all.invalid> - 2025-09-05 20:20 +0000
              Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-06 04:45 +0200
      Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-03 01:45 -0400
        Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-03 10:02 +0100
          Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-03 05:57 -0400
            Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-03 11:37 +0100
              Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Mark Lloyd <not.email@all.invalid> - 2025-09-05 20:25 +0000
            Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-03 22:45 +1000
              Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Mark Lloyd <not.email@all.invalid> - 2025-09-05 20:27 +0000
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-06 10:30 +0100
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Graham J <nobody@nowhere.co.uk> - 2025-09-06 10:54 +0100
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-06 11:48 +0100
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-06 13:54 -0400
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-07 23:48 +1000
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-06 21:29 +1000
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-06 12:37 +0100
          Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-03 14:22 +0200
          Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-03 22:41 +1000
            Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-03 14:59 +0200
              Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-04 22:42 +1000
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-04 18:02 +0200
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-05 23:38 +1000
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-05 18:45 +0200
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-05 19:35 +0100
        Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-03 22:34 +1000
          Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-03 08:53 -0400
            Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-09-03 21:02 +0000
              Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-04 22:45 +1000
          Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-03 17:09 +0100
      Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-03 22:20 +1000
        Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-03 08:44 -0400
          Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-03 17:13 +0100
            Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-04 23:03 +1000
              Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-09-04 18:06 +0200
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-04 19:25 +0100
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-05 04:03 -0400
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-05 09:22 +0100
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-05 08:09 -0400
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-05 23:57 +1000
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-05 19:44 +0100
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-05 05:10 -0400
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-05 10:33 +0100
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-05 05:46 -0400
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-05 11:14 +0100
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-05 06:44 -0400
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-05 12:02 +0100
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-05 23:44 +1000
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-05 19:36 +0100
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-06 21:35 +1000
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-06 12:57 +0100
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-06 22:26 +1000
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-06 17:01 +0100
              Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-04 19:16 +0100
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-05 03:45 -0400
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-05 09:12 +0100
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-06 00:12 +1000
                Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-06 00:10 +1000
            Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Mark Lloyd <not.email@all.invalid> - 2025-09-05 20:37 +0000
  Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Graham J <nobody@nowhere.co.uk> - 2025-09-02 15:30 +0100
    Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-09-02 15:35 +0100
    Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2025-09-02 21:22 +0000
    Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-09-03 01:08 -0400
      Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-03 23:03 +1000
    Re: Electicity Supply (Re: Pickup trucks for city boys) Daniel70 <daniel47@somewhere.someplaceelse> - 2025-09-03 23:00 +1000

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