Groups > comp.mobile.android > #141174 > unrolled thread

Why are iPhone videos clear when sent to iPhones but blurry when sent to Android?

Started by	Andrew <andrew@spam.net>
First post	2024-05-16 22:12 +0000
Last post	2024-05-18 17:03 +0000
Articles	20 on this page of 94 — 10 participants

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#141324

From	Andrew <andrew@spam.net>
Date	2024-05-20 21:05 +0000
Message-ID	<v2gdvj$2n2l$1@nnrp.usenet.blueworldhosting.com>
In reply to	#141322

Andy Burns wrote on Mon, 20 May 2024 20:18:32 +0100 :

>> I think you people across the Pond actually pay less than we do, in
>> general, for our cellular services, don't you?
> 
> Generally it feels like it, I pay for SIM only, so no bundled cost for 
> handset.
> 
>> I pay about $30 a month lately for each of four phones in my plan.
>>   <https://i.postimg.cc/nhpbcP50/tmopromo04.jpg>
> 
> GBP8/month for 20GB data, wifi calling, unlimited SMS, unlimited minutes 
> to mobiles and "normal" landlines.
> 
>> With that I pretty much get unlimited everything, which is why I didn't
>> worry about using MMS until the great grandchild was born recently.
> 
> we pay about GBP 0.5 per MMS
> 
>> BTW, Andy, do you have any idea how to work around the problem that arose
>> when we set up an iPad to use Messages, where the problem was Apple is
>> incapable of sending the message BOTH to the Android & iPad over Wi-Fi?
> 
> No sorry, I have close to zero knowledge of iPads.

Thanks for both responses, where I think you guys across the Pond pay
mostly for what you use, while we pre-pay for packages of everything.

There are pros and cons to each system.
a. We pay through the nose but we don't worry a bit about usage.
   The only thing that costs me money is International calling
   (which costs, I think, twenty-five cents per minute as I recall)

   My kids (who are still on my plan, use about 10GB/month (or so), 
   and about 5GB/month for hotspotting/tethering, while my wife and
   I use only mere megabytes per month, which would easily fit into
   your 20GB/highspeeddata/month.

b. You pay about 1/3rd of what we pay, apparently, but when you 
   start using too much data (in the form of cellular or MMS), then 
   your bills start to rack up it seems, while our bills is steady.

Your system is about 1/3rd cheaper.
Our system is easier on the worries.

Specifically your system discourages data usage (including MMS); whiule
ours encourage data usage (including MMS). Which is partly why iPhones have
more traction in the US than elsewhere, as the iPhone is a dumb terminal
without connecting to the Internet.

I'm not sure about iPhone traction in the UK & Europe but last I had
checked it was slightly over 1/2 the American phones in use (but since the
iPhone requires the Internet to be useful, it's only going to have traction
in countries which have steady predictable and fast 24/7/365 Internet).

As for the iPad workaround that failed, I think we would have been fine if
the iPad had been registered to an Apple account using a _different_ phone
number than the phone number on Android (it was my wife's old iPad).

It seems Apple has everything rigged to fail the instant you cross
platforms, but if we gave the iPad a bogus phone number for the AppleID
that Messages was signed into, it probably (maybe?) would have worked.

Dunno. I'm waiting for an astute iOS owner (yes, I know) to help me out.

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#141372

From	Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com>
Date	2024-05-21 23:55 -0700
Message-ID	<v2k4sk$12g15$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to	#141324

On 2024-05-20 14:05, Andrew wrote:
> Andy Burns wrote on Mon, 20 May 2024 20:18:32 +0100 :
> 
>>> I think you people across the Pond actually pay less than we do, in
>>> general, for our cellular services, don't you?
>>
>> Generally it feels like it, I pay for SIM only, so no bundled cost for
>> handset.
>>
>>> I pay about $30 a month lately for each of four phones in my plan.
>>>    <https://i.postimg.cc/nhpbcP50/tmopromo04.jpg>
>>
>> GBP8/month for 20GB data, wifi calling, unlimited SMS, unlimited minutes
>> to mobiles and "normal" landlines.
>>
>>> With that I pretty much get unlimited everything, which is why I didn't
>>> worry about using MMS until the great grandchild was born recently.
>>
>> we pay about GBP 0.5 per MMS
>>
>>> BTW, Andy, do you have any idea how to work around the problem that arose
>>> when we set up an iPad to use Messages, where the problem was Apple is
>>> incapable of sending the message BOTH to the Android & iPad over Wi-Fi?
>>
>> No sorry, I have close to zero knowledge of iPads.
> 
> Thanks for both responses, where I think you guys across the Pond pay
> mostly for what you use, while we pre-pay for packages of everything.
> 
> There are pros and cons to each system.
> a. We pay through the nose but we don't worry a bit about usage.
>     The only thing that costs me money is International calling
>     (which costs, I think, twenty-five cents per minute as I recall)
> 
>     My kids (who are still on my plan, use about 10GB/month (or so),
>     and about 5GB/month for hotspotting/tethering, while my wife and
>     I use only mere megabytes per month, which would easily fit into
>     your 20GB/highspeeddata/month.
> 
> b. You pay about 1/3rd of what we pay, apparently, but when you
>     start using too much data (in the form of cellular or MMS), then
>     your bills start to rack up it seems, while our bills is steady.
> 
> Your system is about 1/3rd cheaper.
> Our system is easier on the worries.
> 
> Specifically your system discourages data usage (including MMS); whiule
> ours encourage data usage (including MMS). Which is partly why iPhones have
> more traction in the US than elsewhere, as the iPhone is a dumb terminal
> without connecting to the Internet.
> 
> I'm not sure about iPhone traction in the UK & Europe but last I had
> checked it was slightly over 1/2 the American phones in use (but since the
> iPhone requires the Internet to be useful, it's only going to have traction
> in countries which have steady predictable and fast 24/7/365 Internet).
> 
> As for the iPad workaround that failed, I think we would have been fine if
> the iPad had been registered to an Apple account using a _different_ phone
> number than the phone number on Android (it was my wife's old iPad).
> 
> It seems Apple has everything rigged to fail the instant you cross
> platforms, but if we gave the iPad a bogus phone number for the AppleID
> that Messages was signed into, it probably (maybe?) would have worked.
> 
> Dunno. I'm waiting for an astute iOS owner (yes, I know) to help me out.

Why must you lie, Arlen?

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#141230

From	Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com>
Date	2024-05-17 23:11 +0000
Message-ID	<laq6gtFrutkU2@mid.individual.net>
In reply to	#141199

On 2024-05-17, Tyrone <none@none.none> wrote:
> On May 17, 2024 at 9:15:35 AM EDT, "Andrew" <andrew@spam.net> wrote:
>> Tyrone wrote on Fri, 17 May 2024 00:48:21 +0000 :
>> 
>>>> Half my family is on Android, the other half iOS, so whenever the
>>>> iPhone users send a video through their text mechanism, it shows up
>>>> clear for their iPhone recipients but super blurry for their
>>>> Android recipients.  <https://i.postimg.cc/cLBNKJb7/fuzzy.jpg>
>>>> 
>>>> Why?
>>> 
>>> Because SMS/MMS is used between Android and iOS. They have
>>> incompatible messaging systems, so they fall back to the Lowest
>>> Common Denominator.  The quality drops in both directions.
>>> 
>>> However, if everyone uses WhatsApp or Facebook messenger (or others)
>>> then videos will be sent in full quality.  That's one of the (many)
>>> reasons these cross-platform messaging apps exist.
>> 
>> Thanks for explaining it. I haven't received videos until a great
>> grandchild was born, as it has been a while since the last baby.
>> 
>> This family is all on iPhones & iPads so everything comes from their
>> messaging app. The pictures come in fine.
>> 
>> It's just the short (ten to fifteen seconds long) videos that are
>> blurry.  Does that make sense from your experience that JPGs are fine
>> but not video?
>
> Yes. For SMS/MMS, pictures don't need to be compressed (unless its a
> VERY large, VERY high-res pic). But even a few seconds of video will
> be compressed.

Anything over 1.2 MB is compressed by Verizon and smaller by AT&T. Don't
care enough to check other providers.

> It sucks, and the only solution is for everyone to be on the same app.
> Either all on iPhones (using Messages) or all on Android (using the
> same messaging app) OR using a cross-platform app as noted above.

True. Most cross-platform messaging apps support high-resolution images
and video. Just pick one.

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

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#141195

From	Andrew <andrew@spam.net>
Date	2024-05-17 15:21 +0000
Message-ID	<v27slt$2kus$1@nnrp.usenet.blueworldhosting.com>
In reply to	#141179

Tyrone wrote on Fri, 17 May 2024 00:48:21 +0000 :

>> Half my family is on Android, the other half iOS, so whenever the iPhone
>> users send a video through their text mechanism, it shows up clear for
>> their iPhone recipients but super blurry for their Android recipients.
>>  <https://i.postimg.cc/cLBNKJb7/fuzzy.jpg>
>> 
>> Why?
> 
> Because SMS/MMS is used between Android and iOS. They have incompatible
> messaging systems, so they fall back to the Lowest Common Denominator.  The
> quality drops in both directions.  
> 
> However, if everyone uses WhatsApp or Facebook messenger (or others) then
> videos will be sent in full quality.  That's one of the (many) reasons these
> cross-platform messaging apps exist.

Thanks for helping out, as I'm trying to understand the process.
1. iPhone logs into their iMessaging Apple server (automatically)
2. iPhone sends a short video clip to multiple recipients using Messages
3. Presumably that clip _first_ goes to an Apple iMessaging server?????
   (is that correct?) (or does the iPhone do the splitting?)

That's the first point of confusion that I'd like to iron out.

Assuming one sender on iOS using the default Messages app sending a short
video clip to two recipients, one on iOS and the other on Android, does the
video sent by Messages still go _first_ to the Apple iMessaging servers?

Where exactly do the clips get split into different outgoing mechanisms?

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#141196

From	Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com>
Date	2024-05-17 09:18 -0700
Message-ID	<v2800g$2941f$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to	#141195

On 2024-05-17 08:21, Andrew wrote:
> Tyrone wrote on Fri, 17 May 2024 00:48:21 +0000 :
> 
>>> Half my family is on Android, the other half iOS, so whenever the iPhone
>>> users send a video through their text mechanism, it shows up clear for
>>> their iPhone recipients but super blurry for their Android recipients.
>>>   <https://i.postimg.cc/cLBNKJb7/fuzzy.jpg>
>>>
>>> Why?
>>
>> Because SMS/MMS is used between Android and iOS. They have incompatible
>> messaging systems, so they fall back to the Lowest Common Denominator.  The
>> quality drops in both directions.
>>
>> However, if everyone uses WhatsApp or Facebook messenger (or others) then
>> videos will be sent in full quality.  That's one of the (many) reasons these
>> cross-platform messaging apps exist.
> 
> Thanks for helping out, as I'm trying to understand the process.
> 1. iPhone logs into their iMessaging Apple server (automatically)
> 2. iPhone sends a short video clip to multiple recipients using Messages
> 3. Presumably that clip _first_ goes to an Apple iMessaging server?????
>     (is that correct?) (or does the iPhone do the splitting?)
> 
> That's the first point of confusion that I'd like to iron out.
> 
> Assuming one sender on iOS using the default Messages app sending a short
> video clip to two recipients, one on iOS and the other on Android, does the
> video sent by Messages still go _first_ to the Apple iMessaging servers?
> 
> Where exactly do the clips get split into different outgoing mechanisms?

You're asking a lot of questions for someone who claims to always know 
everything...

...and not doing an easy test you could do if you were actually as 
bright as you claim you are.

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#141197

From	"Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid>
Date	2024-05-17 18:16 +0200
Message-ID	<8gckhkxl3j.ln2@Telcontar.valinor>
In reply to	#141195

On 2024-05-17 17:21, Andrew wrote:
> Tyrone wrote on Fri, 17 May 2024 00:48:21 +0000 :
> 
>>> Half my family is on Android, the other half iOS, so whenever the iPhone
>>> users send a video through their text mechanism, it shows up clear for
>>> their iPhone recipients but super blurry for their Android recipients.
>>>   <https://i.postimg.cc/cLBNKJb7/fuzzy.jpg>
>>>
>>> Why?
>>
>> Because SMS/MMS is used between Android and iOS. They have incompatible
>> messaging systems, so they fall back to the Lowest Common Denominator.  The
>> quality drops in both directions.
>>
>> However, if everyone uses WhatsApp or Facebook messenger (or others) then
>> videos will be sent in full quality.  That's one of the (many) reasons these
>> cross-platform messaging apps exist.
> 
> Thanks for helping out, as I'm trying to understand the process.
> 1. iPhone logs into their iMessaging Apple server (automatically)
> 2. iPhone sends a short video clip to multiple recipients using Messages
> 3. Presumably that clip _first_ goes to an Apple iMessaging server?????
>     (is that correct?) (or does the iPhone do the splitting?)
> 
> That's the first point of confusion that I'd like to iron out.
> 
> Assuming one sender on iOS using the default Messages app sending a short
> video clip to two recipients, one on iOS and the other on Android, does the
> video sent by Messages still go _first_ to the Apple iMessaging servers?
> 
> Where exactly do the clips get split into different outgoing mechanisms?

I have no idea, but I would start by looking at the video metadata.

Then I would look at the messages/imessages terms and conditions, it is 
probably mentioned there.

Doing the conversion on the phone makes sense for privacy, but it is a 
heavy load, so maybe it is done at the servers.

Also, somebody has to do the payment to the provider (which could be 
zero), but in any case the sending has to be assigned to a phone number, 
which means probably everything is done by the sender's phone.


-- 
Cheers, Carlos.

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#141198

From	Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com>
Date	2024-05-17 16:29 +0000
Message-ID	<lapeudFod2lU2@mid.individual.net>
In reply to	#141195

On 2024-05-17, Andrew <andrew@spam.net> wrote:
> Tyrone wrote on Fri, 17 May 2024 00:48:21 +0000 :
>
>>> Half my family is on Android, the other half iOS, so whenever the
>>> iPhone users send a video through their text mechanism, it shows up
>>> clear for their iPhone recipients but super blurry for their Android
>>> recipients.  <https://i.postimg.cc/cLBNKJb7/fuzzy.jpg>
>>> 
>>> Why?
>> 
>> Because SMS/MMS is used between Android and iOS. They have
>> incompatible messaging systems, so they fall back to the Lowest
>> Common Denominator.  The quality drops in both directions.  
>> 
>> However, if everyone uses WhatsApp or Facebook messenger (or others)
>> then videos will be sent in full quality.  That's one of the (many)
>> reasons these cross-platform messaging apps exist.
>
> Thanks for helping out, as I'm trying to understand the process.  1.
> iPhone logs into their iMessaging Apple server (automatically)

Wrong. iMessage is optional and opt-in.

> 2. iPhone sends a short video clip to multiple recipients using
> Messages

The user could choose to send the video on another messaging app/service
if they wish. 

> 3. Presumably that clip _first_ goes to an Apple iMessaging
> server?????  (is that correct?) (or does the iPhone do the splitting?)

Wrong again. The video is sent as an MMS message which goes through the
cellular carriers MMS service. Cellular carriers are notorious for
degrading MMS video quality to reduce data usage on their networks.

> That's the first point of confusion that I'd like to iron out.

The fact that you are this clueless about basic messaging says all we
need to know about your claim to know more about Apple than anyone else
here. I'd feel embarrassed for you, except you sling insults regularly
here so you deserve the ridicule you get.

> Assuming one sender on iOS using the default Messages app sending a
> short video clip to two recipients, one on iOS and the other on
> Android, does the video sent by Messages still go _first_ to the Apple
> iMessaging servers?
>
> Where exactly do the clips get split into different outgoing
> mechanisms?

It's very simple: Messages sent to iMessage users are sent with
iMessage.  Messages sent to non-iMessage users are sent as SMS/MMS.
You've been told this countless times, and you continue to play dumb in
order to troll. You're playing dumb to bait someone into saying
something you can use as some sort of lame "gotcha" to sling more
insults and weak trolls around, polluting the newsgroup with your
bullshit. You're not fooling anyone.

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

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#141203

From	Andrew <andrew@spam.net>
Date	2024-05-17 17:03 +0000
Message-ID	<v282kp$13dv$1@nnrp.usenet.blueworldhosting.com>
In reply to	#141198

Jolly Roger wrote on 17 May 2024 16:29:02 GMT :

>> Thanks for helping out, as I'm trying to understand the process.  1.
>> iPhone logs into their iMessaging Apple server (automatically)
> 
> Wrong. iMessage is optional and opt-in.

Please see this image from one of my own iPads, Jolly Roger.
 <https://i.postimg.cc/hhFNJ5mq/appleid010.jpg> 

I'm fully aware that my iPads are NOT logged into the iMessaging 
tracking mainframe servers (since my Apple iPads complain every day all day 
multiple times a day about me refusing to log into those tracking servers).

What you don't seem to comprehend is most US iPhone owners do log into the 
Apple iMessaging servers every moment of every day of their entire lives.
 <https://i.postimg.cc/8k3GQyj4/appleid09.jpg> 

In fact, there are numerous Apple mainframe tracking servers that Apple 
will complain about to you every single day multiple times a day if you do 
not log into them for the rest of your natural life, Jolly Roger.
 <https://i.postimg.cc/ZR5mZ287/appleid07.jpg> 

Ask me how I know this (which you don't appear to know, Jolly Roger).
 <https://i.postimg.cc/nrFHSvby/appleid11.jpg>

Most likely the reason you are unaware that Apple nags you dozens of times 
a day, every day, to log into their many tracking servers, is you log in.

I don't.

That's why I know that iOS is a dumb terminal incapable of doing all the 
things you love about it, Jolly Roger, if you don't log into the mainframe.
 
>> 2. iPhone sends a short video clip to multiple recipients using
>> Messages
> 
> The user could choose to send the video on another messaging app/service
> if they wish. 

You do not understand that people on US iPhones prefer to communicate using 
their default messaging app, just as people on US Androids prefer the same.

It's actually no longer shocking you have no clue what people do on their 
devices, since your comments are contrary to what people in the USA do.

>> 3. Presumably that clip _first_ goes to an Apple iMessaging
>> server?????  (is that correct?) (or does the iPhone do the splitting?)
> 
> Wrong again. The video is sent as an MMS message which goes through the
> cellular carriers MMS service. Cellular carriers are notorious for
> degrading MMS video quality to reduce data usage on their networks.

You do not show that you understand the process, Jolly Roger, as we all 
know that it's _received_ as an MMS message on Android - but that's no 
longer the question that needs to be answered. 

The question that needs to be answered is the following:

1. Is the video split up (between platform recipients) on the iPhone, 
   or on the Apple mainframe servers or on carrier mainframe servers?
2. Is the video downsized on that same server?

>> That's the first point of confusion that I'd like to iron out.
> 
> The fact that you are this clueless about basic messaging says all we
> need to know about your claim to know more about Apple than anyone else
> here. I'd feel embarrassed for you, except you sling insults regularly
> here so you deserve the ridicule you get.

And yet you also don't appear to know the answer to the basic question of 
where is the action of splitting up the video to two different outgoing 
mechanisms performed - nor where the downsizing is performed, Jolly Roger.

>> Where exactly do the clips get split into different outgoing
>> mechanisms?
> 
> It's very simple: Messages sent to iMessage users are sent with
> iMessage.  Messages sent to non-iMessage users are sent as SMS/MMS.
> You've been told this countless times, and you continue to play dumb in
> order to troll. You're playing dumb to bait someone into saying
> something you can use as some sort of lame "gotcha" to sling more
> insults and weak trolls around, polluting the newsgroup with your
> bullshit. You're not fooling anyone.

My goal is to solve the problem.
In doing so, I need to understand exactly where the problem occurs.

Can you confirm that what you're apparently saying above is that the action 
of splitting the outgoing messages into two channels is done on the iPhone?
a. Channel 1 is to send it to other iOS users
b. Channel 2 is to send it to non-Apple users

And can you confirm that the action of downsizing the video is also done on 
the iPhone?

Bearing in mind anyone can put their SIM card into either an iPhone or an 
Android phone at any time... 

...If both the splitting & downsizing occur on the iPhone, how does the 
iPhone know who is an Android user without first communicating with the 
Apple mainframe tracking servers to derive that information, Jolly Roger?

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#141229

From	Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com>
Date	2024-05-17 23:09 +0000
Message-ID	<laq6ckFrutkU1@mid.individual.net>
In reply to	#141203

On 2024-05-17, Andrew <andrew@spam.net> wrote:
> Jolly Roger wrote on 17 May 2024 16:29:02 GMT :
>
>>> Thanks for helping out, as I'm trying to understand the process.  1.
>>> iPhone logs into their iMessaging Apple server (automatically)
>> 
>> Wrong. iMessage is optional and opt-in.
>
> Please see this image

I don't need to see any image. iMessage is optional and opt-in. That's a
fact, Jack.

> most US iPhone owners do log into the Apple iMessaging servers

Your claim that the iPhone logs into iMesage automatically is FALSE - a
LIE.

> Most likely the reason you are unaware that Apple nags you dozens of
> times a day, every day, to log into their many tracking servers, is
> you log in.

Nope, sorry. Thanks for playing. Normal people rarely are asked to log
in dozens of times a day. You created that situation by logging in with
a fake email address and credentials you admitted you don't remember
which made it impossible for you to recover access to your account - a
very, very stupid thing to do. Then you turn around every chance you get
and try to blame Apple for your utter stupidity. 🤡.

> iOS is a dumb terminal

Bullshit.

>>> 2. iPhone sends a short video clip to multiple recipients using
>>> Messages
>> 
>> The user could choose to send the video on another messaging app/service
>> if they wish. 
>
> You do not understand

I understand that you are here bitching about MMS messaging video
quality when any other messaging app/service will preserve video quality
just fine.

> you have no clue what people do on their devices

That's ironic as fuck coming from the dumb ass troll who doesn't know
how something as basic as MMS messaging works.

>>> 3. Presumably that clip _first_ goes to an Apple iMessaging
>>> server?????  (is that correct?) (or does the iPhone do the splitting?)
>> 
>> Wrong again. The video is sent as an MMS message which goes through the
>> cellular carriers MMS service. Cellular carriers are notorious for
>> degrading MMS video quality to reduce data usage on their networks.
>
> You do not show that you understand the process, Jolly Roger, as we all 
> know that it's _received_ as an MMS message on Android

You complete fool - it cannot be received as an MMS without it being
*sent* over the cellular network as an MMS. MMS messages are not sent
through iMessage - period.

> but that's no longer the question that needs to be answered. 

I'm not answering a question. I'm telling you what reality is, dummy.
>
> The question that needs to be answered is the following:
>
> 1. Is the video split up (between platform recipients) on the iPhone, 
>    or on the Apple mainframe servers or on carrier mainframe servers?

The video isn't "split up" at all. As I have already told you, if the
recipient is an iMessage user, the video is sent via iMessage. If not,
it is sent via the cellular network as an MMS message. 

> 2. Is the video downsized on that same server?

The video is downsized as a requirement for MMS messaging because MMS
has strict file size limits set by the particular cellular service
providers. For instance Verizon allows images up to 1.2 MB in size and
videos up to 3.5 MB in size. AT&T restricts videos to only 1 MB in size.
If a video is larger than that, it gets compressed automatically by the
cellular service provider before delivery. Note, Arlen, that iMessage is
not involved in any part of this process - nor is a log in to Apple's
servers required or used.

>>> That's the first point of confusion that I'd like to iron out.
>> 
>> The fact that you are this clueless about basic messaging says all we
>> need to know about your claim to know more about Apple than anyone
>> else here. I'd feel embarrassed for you, except you sling insults
>> regularly here so you deserve the ridicule you get.
>
> And yet you also don't appear to know the answer to the basic question
> of where is the action of splitting up the video to two different
> outgoing mechanisms performed - nor where the downsizing is performed,
> Jolly Roger.

Bitch, I've known this for literal decades. It's no secret. You can find
this out with basic web searches. You're just a huge fucking clown. 🤣

>>> Where exactly do the clips get split into different outgoing
>>> mechanisms?
>> 
>> It's very simple: Messages sent to iMessage users are sent with
>> iMessage.  Messages sent to non-iMessage users are sent as SMS/MMS.
>> You've been told this countless times, and you continue to play dumb
>> in order to troll. You're playing dumb to bait someone into saying
>> something you can use as some sort of lame "gotcha" to sling more
>> insults and weak trolls around, polluting the newsgroup with your
>> bullshit. You're not fooling anyone.
>
> My goal is to solve the problem.

No, your goal is - as always - to troll the Apple news groups in the
guise of "asking for help to solve a problem".

> In doing so, I need to understand exactly where the problem occurs.

Already told you - you just don't like the answer.

> Can you confirm that what you're apparently saying above is that the
> action of splitting the outgoing messages into two channels is done on
> the iPhone?  a. Channel 1 is to send it to other iOS users b. Channel
> 2 is to send it to non-Apple users

There are no "channels" each recipient is sent the message, either
through iMessage or through the cellular network, depending on whether
the recipient is an iMessage user.

> And can you confirm that the action of downsizing the video is also
> done on the iPhone?

Nope, it's done by the cellular service provider. Sorry, you don't get
to blame Apple for this (and we all know that's where you were headed).

> Bearing in mind anyone can put their SIM card into either an iPhone or
> an Android phone at any time... 

Irrelevant.

> ...If both the splitting & downsizing occur on the iPhone

Wrong.

> how does the iPhone know who is an Android user without first
> communicating with the Apple mainframe tracking servers to derive that
> information, Jolly Roger?

How do you expect iMessage users to be able to message each other
*without* logging into the iMessage service, smooth brain? My god,
you're an idiot. 🤣

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#141243

From	Andrew <andrew@spam.net>
Date	2024-05-18 00:59 +0000
Message-ID	<v28uh0$7f9$1@nnrp.usenet.blueworldhosting.com>
In reply to	#141229

Jolly Roger wrote on 17 May 2024 23:09:08 GMT :

>> Please see this image
> 
> I don't need to see any image. iMessage is optional and opt-in. That's a
> fact, Jack.

Actually, if you stop logging into the various Apple mainframe tracking
servers, after about two years, Apple will unilaterally lock you out.

Ask me how I know this fact.

>> most US iPhone owners do log into the Apple iMessaging servers
> 
> Your claim that the iPhone logs into iMesage automatically is FALSE - a
> LIE.

You log in once, and forever more it keeps you logged in Jolly Roger.
That you don't know that is no longer shocking about you Apple zealots.
 
>> Most likely the reason you are unaware that Apple nags you dozens of
>> times a day, every day, to log into their many tracking servers, is
>> you log in.
> 
> Nope, sorry. Thanks for playing. Normal people rarely are asked to log
> in dozens of times a day. You created that situation by logging in with
> a fake email address and credentials you admitted you don't remember
> which made it impossible for you to recover access to your account - a
> very, very stupid thing to do. Then you turn around every chance you get
> and try to blame Apple for your utter stupidity. 

You're wrong, Jolly Roger. I have the full login/password of all devices.
You just wish that were the case - but I went to Apple and they unbricked
one of my iPads so that I could log in again - using the SAME
login/password that I always used, Jolly Roger.

The second iPad they wouldn't unbrick because I had to produce the receipt,
even though I gave them my government ID to prove who I was.

Those to situations prove the lies Apple spews about privacy since there is
no privacy on iPhones for a huge variety of reasons, the fact you must log
into the Apple servers (or Apple will brick it) being just one of them.

>> iOS is a dumb terminal
> 
> Bullshit.

Heh heh heh... you hate the truth about Apple products Jolly Roger.
It's no longer shocking you think you can download apps without logging
into Apple's mainframe tracking servers (yes, I know about the EU thing).

You can't.

>>>> 2. iPhone sends a short video clip to multiple recipients using
>>>> Messages
>>> 
>>> The user could choose to send the video on another messaging app/service
>>> if they wish. 
>>
>> You do not understand
> 
> I understand that you are here bitching about MMS messaging video
> quality when any other messaging app/service will preserve video quality
> just fine.

The problem is simply that nobody in this thread has fully understood how
it works, least of all you and certainly I've said from the start I didn't.

You say you do but you say you understand everything and yet you're always
wrong, Jolly Roger. Like when you said Apple fully supports older releases.

>> you have no clue what people do on their devices
> 
> That's ironic as fuck coming from the dumb ass troll who doesn't know
> how something as basic as MMS messaging works.

And yet, not only don't you know how it works on an iPhone when they send a
video clip to a group of users on both platforms, but nobody else knew
either.

The only difference is you claim to know everything when it's clear you
don't know how it works (e.g., it's highly likely the downsizing is done by
the iPhone as doing it anywhere else would negate the purpose of doing it).


>>>> 3. Presumably that clip _first_ goes to an Apple iMessaging
>>>> server?????  (is that correct?) (or does the iPhone do the splitting?)
>>> 
>>> Wrong again. The video is sent as an MMS message which goes through the
>>> cellular carriers MMS service. Cellular carriers are notorious for
>>> degrading MMS video quality to reduce data usage on their networks.
>>
>> You do not show that you understand the process, Jolly Roger, as we all 
>> know that it's _received_ as an MMS message on Android
> 
> You complete fool - it cannot be received as an MMS without it being
> *sent* over the cellular network as an MMS. MMS messages are not sent
> through iMessage - period.

I said we all know it's received as an MMS message on Android, JR.

> 
>> but that's no longer the question that needs to be answered. 
> 
> I'm not answering a question. I'm telling you what reality is, dummy.

Except that you don't know how it works either, Jolly Roger. 

The two things you don't know, and nobody so far knows, is
a. How does the iPhone know you're no longer logged into the 
   Apple mainframe tracking servers if it doesn't check them?
b. Where is the downsizing done?

>> The question that needs to be answered is the following:
>>
>> 1. Is the video split up (between platform recipients) on the iPhone, 
>>    or on the Apple mainframe servers or on carrier mainframe servers?
> 
> The video isn't "split up" at all. As I have already told you, if the
> recipient is an iMessage user, the video is sent via iMessage. If not,
> it is sent via the cellular network as an MMS message. 

That's what I mean by split. It's a fork. 

>> 2. Is the video downsized on that same server?
> 
> The video is downsized as a requirement for MMS messaging because MMS
> has strict file size limits set by the particular cellular service
> providers. For instance Verizon allows images up to 1.2 MB in size and
> videos up to 3.5 MB in size. AT&T restricts videos to only 1 MB in size.
> If a video is larger than that, it gets compressed automatically by the
> cellular service provider before delivery. Note that iMessage is
> not involved in any part of this process - nor is a log in to Apple's
> servers required or used.

Nobody is sure of that except you.
And you've never been right before.

So what you say is suspect without any cites to back up your guesses.

>>>> That's the first point of confusion that I'd like to iron out.
>>> 
>>> The fact that you are this clueless about basic messaging says all we
>>> need to know about your claim to know more about Apple than anyone
>>> else here. I'd feel embarrassed for you, except you sling insults
>>> regularly here so you deserve the ridicule you get.
>>
>> And yet you also don't appear to know the answer to the basic question
>> of where is the action of splitting up the video to two different
>> outgoing mechanisms performed - nor where the downsizing is performed,
>> Jolly Roger.
> 
> Bitch, I've known this for literal decades. It's no secret. You can find
> this out with basic web searches. You're just a huge fucking clown. 

And you "knew for decades" that Apple fully supported older releases too.
And that was a lie since the start.
 
>>>> Where exactly do the clips get split into different outgoing
>>>> mechanisms?
>>> 
>>> It's very simple: Messages sent to iMessage users are sent with
>>> iMessage.  Messages sent to non-iMessage users are sent as SMS/MMS.
>>> You've been told this countless times, and you continue to play dumb
>>> in order to troll. You're playing dumb to bait someone into saying
>>> something you can use as some sort of lame "gotcha" to sling more
>>> insults and weak trolls around, polluting the newsgroup with your
>>> bullshit. You're not fooling anyone.
>>
>> My goal is to solve the problem.
> 
> No, your goal is - as always - to troll the Apple news groups in the
> guise of "asking for help to solve a problem".

Nope. My goal is to receive the baby videos without the iPhone destroying
their quality. That's a simple goal. I've never cared about iPhone videos
until now - so it didn't matter until now. 
> 
>> In doing so, I need to understand exactly where the problem occurs.
> 
> Already told you - you just don't like the answer.

Nobody agrees with you Jolly Roger. 
And you've been wrong about everything in the past too.

So without a cite backing your claims, you're just guessing.

>> Can you confirm that what you're apparently saying above is that the
>> action of splitting the outgoing messages into two channels is done on
>> the iPhone?  a. Channel 1 is to send it to other iOS users b. Channel
>> 2 is to send it to non-Apple users
> 
> There are no "channels" each recipient is sent the message, either
> through iMessage or through the cellular network, depending on whether
> the recipient is an iMessage user.

Yes. It's a fork. But the question isn't whether it's a fork or not.
It is.

>> And can you confirm that the action of downsizing the video is also
>> done on the iPhone?
> 
> Nope, it's done by the cellular service provider. Sorry, you don't get
> to blame Apple for this (and we all know that's where you were headed).

It's not clear to anyone but you that the downsizing is done at the
carrier. At first I thought that but Frank came up with a convincing
argument that it's done on the iPhone. 

We need to find a cite for the correct answer.
Not just your guess.

>> Bearing in mind anyone can put their SIM card into either an iPhone or
>> an Android phone at any time... 
> 
> Irrelevant.

Actually not.

>> ...If both the splitting & downsizing occur on the iPhone
> 
> Wrong.

Could be right.
Without a cite, we don't know.

>> how does the iPhone know who is an Android user without first
>> communicating with the Apple mainframe tracking servers to derive that
>> information, Jolly Roger?
> 
> How do you expect iMessage users to be able to message each other
> *without* logging into the iMessage service, smooth brain? My god,
> you're an idiot. 

Which is why I said the iPhone is designed as a dumb terminal.

It can't do all the things you love about it without logging into one of
the Apple mainframe tracking servers. You just said so yourself.

Android works just fine even if you never log into the Google servers.
So does every other common consumer operating system work without logging
into the mothership's mainframe tracking servers, Jolly Roger.

That you're unaware of that is no longer shocking.
But if you have a cite for your claims, I'll read it and understand it.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#141247

From	Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com>
Date	2024-05-17 18:07 -0700
Message-ID	<v28v1g$2erec$3@dont-email.me>
In reply to	#141243

On 2024-05-17 17:59, Andrew wrote:
> Jolly Roger wrote on 17 May 2024 23:09:08 GMT :
> 
>>> Please see this image
>>
>> I don't need to see any image. iMessage is optional and opt-in. That's a
>> fact, Jack.
> 
> Actually, if you stop logging into the various Apple mainframe tracking
> servers, after about two years, Apple will unilaterally lock you out.
> 
> Ask me how I know this fact.

It's not a fact.

It is completely and utterly false.


> 
>>> most US iPhone owners do log into the Apple iMessaging servers
>>
>> Your claim that the iPhone logs into iMesage automatically is FALSE - a
>> LIE.
> 
> You log in once, and forever more it keeps you logged in Jolly Roger.
> That you don't know that is no longer shocking about you Apple zealots.

But you can log out of iMessages on any iOS device:

'On your iPhone, iPad, and iPod touch:

Go to Settings > Messages > Send & Receive. Tap your Apple ID, then tap 
Sign Out.'

<https://support.apple.com/en-ca/108758>

>   
>>> Most likely the reason you are unaware that Apple nags you dozens of
>>> times a day, every day, to log into their many tracking servers, is
>>> you log in.
>>
>> Nope, sorry. Thanks for playing. Normal people rarely are asked to log
>> in dozens of times a day. You created that situation by logging in with
>> a fake email address and credentials you admitted you don't remember
>> which made it impossible for you to recover access to your account - a
>> very, very stupid thing to do. Then you turn around every chance you get
>> and try to blame Apple for your utter stupidity.
> 
> You're wrong, Jolly Roger. I have the full login/password of all devices.
> You just wish that were the case - but I went to Apple and they unbricked
> one of my iPads so that I could log in again - using the SAME
> login/password that I always used, Jolly Roger.
> 
> The second iPad they wouldn't unbrick because I had to produce the receipt,
> even though I gave them my government ID to prove who I was.

But that ID didn't prove you OWNED that iPad, Arlen.

> 
> Those to situations prove the lies Apple spews about privacy since there is
> no privacy on iPhones for a huge variety of reasons, the fact you must log
> into the Apple servers (or Apple will brick it) being just one of them.
> 
>>> iOS is a dumb terminal
>>
>> Bullshit.
> 
> Heh heh heh... you hate the truth about Apple products Jolly Roger.
> It's no longer shocking you think you can download apps without logging
> into Apple's mainframe tracking servers (yes, I know about the EU thing).

I'm sorry, but the idea that iOS is a dumb terminal IS bullshit.

> 
> You can't.
> 
>>>>> 2. iPhone sends a short video clip to multiple recipients using
>>>>> Messages
>>>>
>>>> The user could choose to send the video on another messaging app/service
>>>> if they wish.
>>>
>>> You do not understand
>>
>> I understand that you are here bitching about MMS messaging video
>> quality when any other messaging app/service will preserve video quality
>> just fine.
> 
> The problem is simply that nobody in this thread has fully understood how
> it works, least of all you and certainly I've said from the start I didn't.

<https://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=what+happens+when+you+send+a+large+video+file+by+mms&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8>


'A recipient's carrier can also limit the size. For example, if the 
intended recipient's carrier doesn't support your large file size, it 
will reject or compress the file. This will happen even if your carrier 
supports the large file size.'

'Have you ever tried to text a video to a friend, but you got a “Message 
size limit reached” error? Or perhaps you sent the message, but your 
friend received a blurry video instead of the original? That’s probably 
because your message exceeded the Multimedia Messaging Service (MMS) 
file size limit.'

<https://www.twilio.com/en-us/blog/how-to-increase-mms-size-limit-android>


> 
> You say you do but you say you understand everything and yet you're always
> wrong, Jolly Roger. Like when you said Apple fully supports older releases.
> 
>>> you have no clue what people do on their devices
>>
>> That's ironic as fuck coming from the dumb ass troll who doesn't know
>> how something as basic as MMS messaging works.
> 
> And yet, not only don't you know how it works on an iPhone when they send a
> video clip to a group of users on both platforms, but nobody else knew
> either.
> 
> The only difference is you claim to know everything when it's clear you
> don't know how it works (e.g., it's highly likely the downsizing is done by
> the iPhone as doing it anywhere else would negate the purpose of doing it).

'First of all, your carrier is the one that limits the MMS file size, 
not your phone. For example, Verizon only allows images up to 1.2 MB and 
videos up to 3.5 MB, while T-Mobile has a 1 MB limit for sending (3 MB 
for receiving).

A recipient’s carrier can also limit the size. For example, if the 
intended recipient’s carrier doesn’t support your large file size, it 
will reject or compress the file. This will happen even if your carrier 
supports the large file size.'

> 
> 
>>>>> 3. Presumably that clip _first_ goes to an Apple iMessaging
>>>>> server?????  (is that correct?) (or does the iPhone do the splitting?)
>>>>
>>>> Wrong again. The video is sent as an MMS message which goes through the
>>>> cellular carriers MMS service. Cellular carriers are notorious for
>>>> degrading MMS video quality to reduce data usage on their networks.
>>>
>>> You do not show that you understand the process, Jolly Roger, as we all
>>> know that it's _received_ as an MMS message on Android
>>
>> You complete fool - it cannot be received as an MMS without it being
>> *sent* over the cellular network as an MMS. MMS messages are not sent
>> through iMessage - period.
> 
> I said we all know it's received as an MMS message on Android, JR.
> 
>>
>>> but that's no longer the question that needs to be answered.
>>
>> I'm not answering a question. I'm telling you what reality is, dummy.
> 
> Except that you don't know how it works either, Jolly Roger.
> 
> The two things you don't know, and nobody so far knows, is
> a. How does the iPhone know you're no longer logged into the
>     Apple mainframe tracking servers if it doesn't check them?
> b. Where is the downsizing done?

The only one who doesn't know those things is you, Arlen.

> 
>>> The question that needs to be answered is the following:
>>>
>>> 1. Is the video split up (between platform recipients) on the iPhone,
>>>     or on the Apple mainframe servers or on carrier mainframe servers?
>>
>> The video isn't "split up" at all. As I have already told you, if the
>> recipient is an iMessage user, the video is sent via iMessage. If not,
>> it is sent via the cellular network as an MMS message.
> 
> That's what I mean by split. It's a fork.
> 
>>> 2. Is the video downsized on that same server?
>>
>> The video is downsized as a requirement for MMS messaging because MMS
>> has strict file size limits set by the particular cellular service
>> providers. For instance Verizon allows images up to 1.2 MB in size and
>> videos up to 3.5 MB in size. AT&T restricts videos to only 1 MB in size.
>> If a video is larger than that, it gets compressed automatically by the
>> cellular service provider before delivery. Note that iMessage is
>> not involved in any part of this process - nor is a log in to Apple's
>> servers required or used.
> 
> Nobody is sure of that except you.
> And you've never been right before.

<https://www.twilio.com/en-us/blog/how-to-increase-mms-size-limit-android>

> 
> So what you say is suspect without any cites to back up your guesses.
> 
>>>>> That's the first point of confusion that I'd like to iron out.
>>>>
>>>> The fact that you are this clueless about basic messaging says all we
>>>> need to know about your claim to know more about Apple than anyone
>>>> else here. I'd feel embarrassed for you, except you sling insults
>>>> regularly here so you deserve the ridicule you get.
>>>
>>> And yet you also don't appear to know the answer to the basic question
>>> of where is the action of splitting up the video to two different
>>> outgoing mechanisms performed - nor where the downsizing is performed,
>>> Jolly Roger.
>>
>> Bitch, I've known this for literal decades. It's no secret. You can find
>> this out with basic web searches. You're just a huge fucking clown.
> 
> And you "knew for decades" that Apple fully supported older releases too.
> And that was a lie since the start.

Apple fully supports older DEVICES.

>   
>>>>> Where exactly do the clips get split into different outgoing
>>>>> mechanisms?
>>>>
>>>> It's very simple: Messages sent to iMessage users are sent with
>>>> iMessage.  Messages sent to non-iMessage users are sent as SMS/MMS.
>>>> You've been told this countless times, and you continue to play dumb
>>>> in order to troll. You're playing dumb to bait someone into saying
>>>> something you can use as some sort of lame "gotcha" to sling more
>>>> insults and weak trolls around, polluting the newsgroup with your
>>>> bullshit. You're not fooling anyone.
>>>
>>> My goal is to solve the problem.
>>
>> No, your goal is - as always - to troll the Apple news groups in the
>> guise of "asking for help to solve a problem".
> 
> Nope. My goal is to receive the baby videos without the iPhone destroying
> their quality. That's a simple goal. I've never cared about iPhone videos
> until now - so it didn't matter until now.

<https://www.twilio.com/en-us/blog/how-to-increase-mms-size-limit-android>

>>
>>> In doing so, I need to understand exactly where the problem occurs.
>>
>> Already told you - you just don't like the answer.
> 
> Nobody agrees with you Jolly Roger.
> And you've been wrong about everything in the past too.
> 
> So without a cite backing your claims, you're just guessing.
> 
>>> Can you confirm that what you're apparently saying above is that the
>>> action of splitting the outgoing messages into two channels is done on
>>> the iPhone?  a. Channel 1 is to send it to other iOS users b. Channel
>>> 2 is to send it to non-Apple users
>>
>> There are no "channels" each recipient is sent the message, either
>> through iMessage or through the cellular network, depending on whether
>> the recipient is an iMessage user.
> 
> Yes. It's a fork. But the question isn't whether it's a fork or not.
> It is.
> 
>>> And can you confirm that the action of downsizing the video is also
>>> done on the iPhone?
>>
>> Nope, it's done by the cellular service provider. Sorry, you don't get
>> to blame Apple for this (and we all know that's where you were headed).
> 
> It's not clear to anyone but you that the downsizing is done at the
> carrier. At first I thought that but Frank came up with a convincing
> argument that it's done on the iPhone.

<https://www.twilio.com/en-us/blog/how-to-increase-mms-size-limit-android>

> 
> We need to find a cite for the correct answer.
> Not just your guess.

<https://www.twilio.com/en-us/blog/how-to-increase-mms-size-limit-android>

> 
>>> Bearing in mind anyone can put their SIM card into either an iPhone or
>>> an Android phone at any time...
>>
>> Irrelevant.
> 
> Actually not.
> 
>>> ...If both the splitting & downsizing occur on the iPhone
>>
>> Wrong.
> 
> Could be right.
> Without a cite, we don't know.
> 
>>> how does the iPhone know who is an Android user without first
>>> communicating with the Apple mainframe tracking servers to derive that
>>> information, Jolly Roger?
>>
>> How do you expect iMessage users to be able to message each other
>> *without* logging into the iMessage service, smooth brain? My god,
>> you're an idiot.
> 
> Which is why I said the iPhone is designed as a dumb terminal.
> 
> It can't do all the things you love about it without logging into one of
> the Apple mainframe tracking servers. You just said so yourself.
> 
> Android works just fine even if you never log into the Google servers.
> So does every other common consumer operating system work without logging
> into the mothership's mainframe tracking servers, Jolly Roger.
> 
> That you're unaware of that is no longer shocking.
> But if you have a cite for your claims, I'll read it and understand it.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#141257

From	Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com>
Date	2024-05-18 03:17 +0000
Message-ID	<laqkurFtmjkU2@mid.individual.net>
In reply to	#141243

On 2024-05-18, Andrew <andrew@spam.net> wrote:
> Jolly Roger wrote on 17 May 2024 23:09:08 GMT :
>
>>> Please see this image
>> 
>> I don't need to see any image. iMessage is optional and opt-in.
>> That's a fact, Jack.
>
> Actually, if you stop logging into the various Apple mainframe
> tracking servers, after about two years, Apple will unilaterally lock
> you out.

Actually, you purposely caused yourself to be locked out by using a
bogus email address and a password you never intended to remember when
creating your *optional* Apple account, then putting your Apple device
in a drawer or wherever for two years, then since you no longer knew the
email address and password you used, you were unable to verify your
login or recover your password - something only a true idiot would do -
or a troll who plans on using the circumstance to turn around and claim
"ERRMEGHERD, APPLE LOCKED ME OUT". You're an idiot and a weak troll.

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#141258

From	Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com>
Date	2024-05-18 03:27 +0000
Message-ID	<laqlg8FtmjkU3@mid.individual.net>
In reply to	#141243

On 2024-05-18, Andrew <andrew@spam.net> wrote:
> Jolly Roger wrote on 17 May 2024 23:09:08 GMT :
>
>>> Please see this image
>> 
>> I don't need to see any image. iMessage is optional and opt-in. That's a
>> fact, Jack.
>
> Actually, if you stop logging into the various Apple mainframe tracking
> servers, after about two years, Apple will unilaterally lock you out.
>
> Ask me how I know this fact.
>
>>> most US iPhone owners do log into the Apple iMessaging servers
>> 
>> Your claim that the iPhone logs into iMesage automatically is FALSE - a
>> LIE.
>
> You log in once, and forever more it keeps you logged in Jolly Roger.

You don't have to log in at all if you don't want to. And no, you are
asked to verify your credentials once in a while - certainly after two
years which is what happened in your case, and since you chose to use a
bogus email address and forgot your password, you left yourself no way
to recover from it, like a dumb ass.

> That you don't know that is no longer shocking about you Apple
> zealots.

It is crystal clear I know way more about this than you. And the real
zealot is the one non-stop trolling in the iOS newsgroup lying and
slinging insults at anyone who sets you straight - that would be you.

>>> Most likely the reason you are unaware that Apple nags you dozens of
>>> times a day, every day, to log into their many tracking servers, is
>>> you log in.
>> 
>> Nope, sorry. Thanks for playing. Normal people rarely are asked to
>> log in dozens of times a day. You created that situation by logging
>> in with a fake email address and credentials you admitted you don't
>> remember which made it impossible for you to recover access to your
>> account - a very, very stupid thing to do. Then you turn around every
>> chance you get and try to blame Apple for your utter stupidity. 
>
> You're wrong, Jolly Roger. 

You admitted it right here, Arlen. We all remember it well because you
pointed out just how dumb you are.

> I have the full login/password of all devices.

Nope. You already admitted you didn't use a real email address, Arlen.
You also forgot your password.

> You just wish that were the case - but I went to Apple and they
> unbricked one of my iPads so that I could log in again - using the
> SAME login/password that I always used, Jolly Roger.

That's not what you said when you originally told us all about this
little "adventure", Arlen. You're lying to save face now. 

> The second iPad they wouldn't unbrick because I had to produce the
> receipt, even though I gave them my government ID to prove who I was.

You purposely locked yourself out, got your account locked for trying
too many wrong passwords, and Apple was done with your stupid games the
second time around. That's what really happened. 

> Those to situations prove the lies Apple spews blah blah blah

Your only intent with all of your little manufactured "problems" is to
troll, Arlen. That's crystal clear. 

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#141288

From	"Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid>
Date	2024-05-19 17:28 +0200
Message-ID	<6diphkxrgd.ln2@Telcontar.valinor>
In reply to	#141198

On 2024-05-17 18:29, Jolly Roger wrote:
> On 2024-05-17, Andrew <andrew@spam.net> wrote:
>> Tyrone wrote on Fri, 17 May 2024 00:48:21 +0000 :

...

>> 3. Presumably that clip _first_ goes to an Apple iMessaging
>> server?????  (is that correct?) (or does the iPhone do the splitting?)
> 
> Wrong again. The video is sent as an MMS message which goes through the
> cellular carriers MMS service. Cellular carriers are notorious for
> degrading MMS video quality to reduce data usage on their networks.

I doubt that. They would directly reject the MMS, or simply charge for it.

I have never known of a cellular carrier degrading a video in transit. 
The entry gate to the service that accepts or reject the video, yes. And 
that one is Apple in this case.

...

-- 
Cheers, Carlos.

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#141290

From	Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com>
Date	2024-05-19 10:05 -0700
Message-ID	<v2dbhe$3fmbt$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to	#141288

On 2024-05-19 08:28, Carlos E.R. wrote:
> On 2024-05-17 18:29, Jolly Roger wrote:
>> On 2024-05-17, Andrew <andrew@spam.net> wrote:
>>> Tyrone wrote on Fri, 17 May 2024 00:48:21 +0000 :
> 
> ...
> 
>>> 3. Presumably that clip _first_ goes to an Apple iMessaging
>>> server?????  (is that correct?) (or does the iPhone do the splitting?)
>>
>> Wrong again. The video is sent as an MMS message which goes through the
>> cellular carriers MMS service. Cellular carriers are notorious for
>> degrading MMS video quality to reduce data usage on their networks.
> 
> I doubt that. They would directly reject the MMS, or simply charge for it.

I'm sorry, but this is known to be false.

> 
> I have never known of a cellular carrier degrading a video in transit. 

You not knowing it doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

> The entry gate to the service that accepts or reject the video, yes. And 
> that one is Apple in this case.

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#141291

From	Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com>
Date	2024-05-19 17:12 +0000
Message-ID	<lauq8dFifjfU1@mid.individual.net>
In reply to	#141288

On 2024-05-19, Carlos E.R. <robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:
> On 2024-05-17 18:29, Jolly Roger wrote:
>> On 2024-05-17, Andrew <andrew@spam.net> wrote:
>>> Tyrone wrote on Fri, 17 May 2024 00:48:21 +0000 :
>
> ...
>
>>> 3. Presumably that clip _first_ goes to an Apple iMessaging
>>> server?????  (is that correct?) (or does the iPhone do the
>>> splitting?)
>> 
>> Wrong again. The video is sent as an MMS message which goes through
>> the cellular carriers MMS service. Cellular carriers are notorious
>> for degrading MMS video quality to reduce data usage on their
>> networks.
>
> I doubt that.

It's a well known fact that cellular carriers compress MMS videos.
Whether you believe it or not doesn't change that fact.

> They would directly reject the MMS, or simply charge for it.

They compress MMS videos that exceed a certain file size before
delivery. That's a fact.

> I have never known of a cellular carrier degrading a video in transit. 

You don't know much then, because it's standard practice.

> The entry gate to the service that accepts or reject the video, yes.
> And that one is Apple in this case.

Wrong. MMS videos are sent and received over the cellular network -
internet services like Apple's iMessage) are *not* involved in the
transmission of the video.

The fact that people like Arlen and his little band of trolls claim to
know so much about technology, yet are this clueless about such basics
which have been in place for literal decades (all while chiding Apple
users for being clueless) says a *lot* about them.

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

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#141202

From	Tyrone <none@none.none>
Date	2024-05-17 16:36 +0000
Message-ID	<NXednYe--uAKGtr7nZ2dnZfqnPidnZ2d@supernews.com>
In reply to	#141195

On May 17, 2024 at 11:21:34 AM EDT, "Andrew" <andrew@spam.net> wrote:

> Tyrone wrote on Fri, 17 May 2024 00:48:21 +0000 :
> 
>>> Half my family is on Android, the other half iOS, so whenever the iPhone
>>> users send a video through their text mechanism, it shows up clear for
>>> their iPhone recipients but super blurry for their Android recipients.
>>>  <https://i.postimg.cc/cLBNKJb7/fuzzy.jpg>
>>> 
>>> Why?
>> 
>> Because SMS/MMS is used between Android and iOS. They have incompatible
>> messaging systems, so they fall back to the Lowest Common Denominator.  The
>> quality drops in both directions.
>> 
>> However, if everyone uses WhatsApp or Facebook messenger (or others) then
>> videos will be sent in full quality.  That's one of the (many) reasons these
>> cross-platform messaging apps exist.
> 
> Thanks for helping out, as I'm trying to understand the process.
> 1. iPhone logs into their iMessaging Apple server (automatically)
> 2. iPhone sends a short video clip to multiple recipients using Messages
> 3. Presumably that clip _first_ goes to an Apple iMessaging server?????
>    (is that correct?) (or does the iPhone do the splitting?)
> 
> That's the first point of confusion that I'd like to iron out.
> 
> Assuming one sender on iOS using the default Messages app sending a short
> video clip to two recipients, one on iOS and the other on Android, does the
> video sent by Messages still go _first_ to the Apple iMessaging servers?
> 
> Where exactly do the clips get split into different outgoing mechanisms?

Not really sure how it all works.  Assuming a "group chat" of mixed Apple and
Android phones (I have several of those) I would ASSUME that it first goes to
Apple servers. But not necessarily. There are settings on iPhones to use
SMS/MMS "When iMessage is unavailable" but that could mean "When iMessage is
down".

The bottom line is you need the same app on both ends. If someone sends a
video from any phone with WhatsApp to any phone without WhatsApp (is that even
possible?) then it would probably also be bad quality. Proprietary
formats/protocols and such are likely involved.

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#141204

From	Andrew <andrew@spam.net>
Date	2024-05-17 17:29 +0000
Message-ID	<v2845k$1443$1@nnrp.usenet.blueworldhosting.com>
In reply to	#141202

Tyrone wrote on Fri, 17 May 2024 16:36:39 +0000 :

>> Where exactly do the clips get split into different outgoing mechanisms?
> 
> Not really sure how it all works.  Assuming a "group chat" of mixed Apple and
> Android phones (I have several of those) I would ASSUME that it first goes to
> Apple servers. But not necessarily. There are settings on iPhones to use
> SMS/MMS "When iMessage is unavailable" but that could mean "When iMessage is
> down".

Thank you for appreciating what the question is, which is where exactly is
the decision to modify the video in two different ways being made.
1. The decision to split the video into iOS & Android recipients, and,
2. The decision to downsize that video when it's sent to Android users.

Since anyone can put their SIM card into any phone, that decision I would
think must be made at the moment the video is being sent - does that make
sense?

If so, then I would agree that some intelligent server needs to know who is
an Apple recipient versus who is not an Apple recipient and that
information has to be conveyed to the machine that does the downsizing.

> The bottom line is you need the same app on both ends. 

You just gave me an idea. I have an old iPhone in my phone drawer, which I
hope uses the same SIM card size as my Android and I will try an experiment
(but I will have to charge the iPhone as it's likely dead at the moment).

A. I will pop the SIM card into the charged iPhone (if it fits).
B. I will ask the iPhone sender to send me a video.
C. Then I will pop the SIM back into my iphone & ask for the video again.

That might give me evidence for WHERE the decision is being made that the
user is an iPhone user who is logged into Apple mainframe servers, or not.

Note: Do you suggest a different test given I have an old iPhone
(registered to someone who passed away) which might fit my SIM card?

> video from any phone with WhatsApp to any phone without WhatsApp (is that even
> possible?) then it would probably also be bad quality. Proprietary
> formats/protocols and such are likely involved.

WhatsApp works on desktops I believe, but I'm in the USA where we don't use
WhatsApp all that much unless we are communicating with people outside the
US. 

But even Android messaging works on the desktop. All you need is, as you
said, for everyone to log into the same messaging servers. I'm using Pulse.
 <https://home.pulsesms.app/overview/>

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#141283

From	"Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid>
Date	2024-05-19 00:26 +0200
Message-ID	<himnhkxtac.ln2@Telcontar.valinor>
In reply to	#141202

On 2024-05-17 18:36, Tyrone wrote:
> On May 17, 2024 at 11:21:34 AM EDT, "Andrew" <andrew@spam.net> wrote:
> 
>> Tyrone wrote on Fri, 17 May 2024 00:48:21 +0000 :

...

>> Where exactly do the clips get split into different outgoing mechanisms?
> 
> Not really sure how it all works.  Assuming a "group chat" of mixed Apple and
> Android phones (I have several of those) I would ASSUME that it first goes to
> Apple servers. But not necessarily. There are settings on iPhones to use
> SMS/MMS "When iMessage is unavailable" but that could mean "When iMessage is
> down".
> 
> The bottom line is you need the same app on both ends. If someone sends a
> video from any phone with WhatsApp to any phone without WhatsApp (is that even
> possible?)

Currently, no. It may be in the near/medium future, at least in the EU.

> then it would probably also be bad quality. Proprietary
> formats/protocols and such are likely involved.

-- 
Cheers, Carlos.

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#141191

From	"Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid>
Date	2024-05-17 15:56 +0200
Message-ID	<t94khkxpnq.ln2@Telcontar.valinor>
In reply to	#141174

On 2024-05-17 00:12, Andrew wrote:
> Half my family is on Android, the other half iOS, so whenever the iPhone
> users send a video through their text mechanism, it shows up clear for
> their iPhone recipients but super blurry for their Android recipients.
>   <https://i.postimg.cc/cLBNKJb7/fuzzy.jpg>
> 
> Why?

Probably because you are using MMS and not RCS, so there is a size 
limitation, or IOS is doing a conversion at their side (imessages to mms)

Convince your family to switch to WhatsApp, or Telegram, or Signal, or 
Threema...

If they refuse, then tell them to resend those videos over mail. O use 
some sharing site on the cloud.

Or convince them to switch to Android :-D

-- 
Cheers, Carlos.

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csiph-web

Why are iPhone videos clear when sent to iPhones but blurry when sent to Android?

Contents

#141324

#141372

#141230

#141195

#141196

#141197

#141198

#141203

#141229

#141243

#141247

#141257

#141258

#141288

#141290

#141291

#141202

#141204

#141283

#141191