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Groups > comp.lang.python > #20242 > unrolled thread
| Started by | Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2012-02-12 12:28 +1100 |
| Last post | 2012-02-15 11:56 +0200 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 109 — 31 participants |
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Re: Python usage numbers Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2012-02-12 12:28 +1100
Re: Python usage numbers Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2012-02-12 02:23 +0000
Re: Python usage numbers Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2012-02-11 18:36 -0800
Re: Python usage numbers Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2012-02-12 15:38 +1100
Re: Python usage numbers Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2012-02-12 05:51 +0000
Re: Python usage numbers Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2012-02-12 17:08 +1100
Re: Python usage numbers Roy Smith <roy@panix.com> - 2012-02-12 10:48 -0500
Re: Python usage numbers Dennis Lee Bieber <wlfraed@ix.netcom.com> - 2012-02-12 11:47 -0500
Re: Python usage numbers Roy Smith <roy@panix.com> - 2012-02-12 12:11 -0500
Re: Python usage numbers Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2012-02-12 22:49 +0000
Re: Python usage numbers Dan Sommers <dan@tombstonezero.net> - 2012-02-12 15:55 +0000
Re: Python usage numbers rusi <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2012-02-12 08:50 -0800
Re: Python usage numbers Roy Smith <roy@panix.com> - 2012-02-12 12:21 -0500
Re: Python usage numbers Nick Dokos <nicholas.dokos@hp.com> - 2012-02-12 12:36 -0500
entering unicode (was Python usage numbers) rusi <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2012-02-12 19:09 -0800
Re: entering unicode (was Python usage numbers) Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2012-02-19 03:44 +0000
Re: entering unicode (was Python usage numbers) rusi <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2012-02-19 00:52 -0800
How do you Unicode proponents type your non-ASCII characters? (was: Python usage numbers) Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2012-02-13 09:43 +1100
Re: Python usage numbers Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2012-02-12 22:56 +0000
Re: Python usage numbers Roy Smith <roy@panix.com> - 2012-02-12 10:13 -0500
Re: Python usage numbers Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2012-02-12 17:07 -0500
Re: Python usage numbers Roy Smith <roy@panix.com> - 2012-02-12 17:22 -0500
Re: Python usage numbers Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2012-02-13 09:14 +1100
Re: Python usage numbers Roy Smith <roy@panix.com> - 2012-02-12 17:27 -0500
Re: Python usage numbers Dave Angel <davea@dejaviewphoto.com> - 2012-02-12 17:40 -0500
Re: Python usage numbers Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2012-02-12 23:29 +0000
Re: Python usage numbers Roy Smith <roy@panix.com> - 2012-02-12 18:41 -0500
Re: Python usage numbers Dave Angel <d@davea.name> - 2012-02-12 19:03 -0500
Re: Python usage numbers Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2012-02-13 11:59 +1100
Re: Python usage numbers Roy Smith <roy@panix.com> - 2012-02-12 20:11 -0500
Re: Python usage numbers Christian Heimes <lists@cheimes.de> - 2012-02-13 01:00 +0100
Re: Python usage numbers Dennis Lee Bieber <wlfraed@ix.netcom.com> - 2012-02-12 21:37 -0500
Re: Python usage numbers Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2012-02-12 22:09 -0500
Re: Python usage numbers Roy Smith <roy@panix.com> - 2012-02-12 22:57 -0500
Re: Python usage numbers Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2012-02-13 15:19 +1100
Re: Python usage numbers Andrew Berg <bahamutzero8825@gmail.com> - 2012-02-13 12:26 -0600
Re: Python usage numbers jmfauth <wxjmfauth@gmail.com> - 2012-02-14 00:00 -0800
Re: Python usage numbers Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2012-02-12 06:10 +0000
Re: Python usage numbers Andrew Berg <bahamutzero8825@gmail.com> - 2012-02-12 01:05 -0600
Re: Python usage numbers Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2012-02-12 09:12 +0000
Re: Python usage numbers Andrew Berg <bahamutzero8825@gmail.com> - 2012-02-12 05:11 -0600
Re: Python usage numbers Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2012-02-12 22:30 +0000
Re: Python usage numbers Dave Angel <d@davea.name> - 2012-02-12 17:50 -0500
Re: Python usage numbers Peter Pearson <ppearson@nowhere.invalid> - 2012-02-12 17:58 +0000
Re: Python usage numbers Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2012-02-12 20:48 -0800
Re: Python usage numbers Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2012-02-13 16:03 +1100
OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2012-02-13 08:05 +0000
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2012-02-13 08:01 -0800
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2012-02-13 16:12 +0000
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2012-02-13 08:27 -0800
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2012-02-13 11:38 -0700
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2012-02-13 13:01 -0800
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2012-02-14 08:27 +1100
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2012-02-13 21:46 +0000
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2012-02-14 00:19 +0000
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2012-02-13 17:07 -0800
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2012-02-13 18:29 -0700
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2012-02-17 17:13 -0800
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2012-02-18 13:13 +1100
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2012-02-18 02:39 +0000
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2012-02-18 00:28 -0700
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2012-02-18 07:02 -0800
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2012-02-18 16:15 +0000
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2012-02-18 10:34 -0800
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] random joe <pywin32@gmail.com> - 2012-02-18 10:49 -0800
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-02-26 12:14 +0000
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2012-02-18 04:16 -0500
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] John O'Hagan <research@johnohagan.com> - 2012-02-14 19:41 +1100
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2012-02-14 16:21 -0800
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2012-02-15 11:44 +1100
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2012-02-14 17:26 -0800
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] John O'Hagan <research@johnohagan.com> - 2012-02-15 19:56 +1100
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2012-02-15 07:04 -0800
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2012-02-15 15:18 +0000
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2012-02-15 08:27 -0800
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2012-02-15 17:16 +0000
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2012-02-15 09:46 -0700
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-02-26 12:44 +0000
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2012-02-26 12:35 -0800
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2012-02-27 07:50 +1100
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2012-02-26 14:32 -0800
Re: OT: Entitlements Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2012-02-27 07:46 +1100
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2012-02-14 07:47 +1100
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Michael Torrie <torriem@gmail.com> - 2012-02-13 14:46 -0700
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2012-02-13 16:39 -0800
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Michael Torrie <torriem@gmail.com> - 2012-02-13 18:36 -0700
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2012-02-14 12:37 +1100
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2012-02-17 17:37 -0800
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Tim Wintle <tim.wintle@teamrubber.com> - 2012-02-13 16:41 +0000
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2012-02-14 16:40 -0800
RE: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] "Prasad, Ramit" <ramit.prasad@jpmorgan.com> - 2012-02-17 20:09 +0000
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Duncan Booth <duncan.booth@invalid.invalid> - 2012-02-14 11:31 +0000
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Devin Jeanpierre <jeanpierreda@gmail.com> - 2012-02-14 07:06 -0500
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> - 2012-02-14 16:48 -0800
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2012-02-15 12:32 +1100
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Duncan Booth <duncan.booth@invalid.invalid> - 2012-02-15 09:47 +0000
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Arnaud Delobelle <arnodel@gmail.com> - 2012-02-15 09:58 +0000
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Duncan Booth <duncan.booth@invalid.invalid> - 2012-02-15 10:04 +0000
Kill files [was Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers]] Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2012-02-15 10:27 +0000
Re: Kill files [was Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers]] Ethan Furman <ethan@stoneleaf.us> - 2012-02-15 11:29 -0800
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] rusi <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2012-02-14 04:56 -0800
Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] Dennis Lee Bieber <wlfraed@ix.netcom.com> - 2012-02-14 09:37 -0500
Re: Python usage numbers Matej Cepl <mcepl@redhat.com> - 2012-02-12 09:14 +0100
Re: Python usage numbers Matej Cepl <mcepl@redhat.com> - 2012-02-12 09:26 +0100
Re: Python usage numbers Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2012-02-12 12:11 +0000
Re: Python usage numbers alister <alister.ware@ntlworld.com> - 2012-02-12 18:55 +0000
Re: Python usage numbers jmfauth <wxjmfauth@gmail.com> - 2012-02-12 11:52 -0800
French and IDLE on Windows (was Re: Python usage numbers) Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2012-02-12 18:30 -0500
Re: Python usage numbers Anssi Saari <as@sci.fi> - 2012-02-15 11:56 +0200
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| From | Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-02-26 14:32 -0800 |
| Subject | Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] |
| Message-ID | <7b67d136-5c5e-4714-969a-d93a91b86bbc@m3g2000yqc.googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #20908 |
On Feb 26, 2:50 pm, Chris Angelico <ros...@gmail.com> wrote: > Hmm, I wonder how you go about adopting that policy... oh! I know! By > fighting each bully on a case-by-case basis! Funny though, you just > said that won't work. It's a two-pronged solution Chris. Compound.
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| From | Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-02-27 07:46 +1100 |
| Subject | Re: OT: Entitlements |
| Message-ID | <874nuds4p5.fsf@benfinney.id.au> |
| In reply to | #20892 |
Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> writes: > In article <40af8461-1583-4496-9d81-d52d6905d24d@b23g2000yqn.googlegroups.com>, > Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> wrote: > >Because the Jews allowed themselves to be subjected. Sad, but true. > > Actually Jew stands for (relative) coward. Let me explain. No, please don't. Slander of racial groups is not only off-topic here, it's wholly inappropriate regardless of your explanation. Stop doing it, and don't encourage it in others. -- \ “The sun never sets on the British Empire. But it rises every | `\ morning. The sky must get awfully crowded.” —Steven Wright | _o__) | Ben Finney
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| From | Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-02-14 07:47 +1100 |
| Subject | Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] |
| Message-ID | <mailman.5777.1329166081.27778.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #20347 |
On Tue, Feb 14, 2012 at 5:38 AM, Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> wrote: > "... Rights, that > **AMONG** these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness." AMONG our rights are such elements as Life, Liberty, the Pursuit of Happiness, and an almost fanatical devotion to the Founding Fathers.... I'll come in again. (Does that drag this back on topic? Almost? Vain attempt to at least look like it's on topic?) ChrisA
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| From | Michael Torrie <torriem@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-02-13 14:46 -0700 |
| Subject | Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] |
| Message-ID | <mailman.5781.1329169633.27778.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #20347 |
On 02/13/2012 09:01 AM, Rick Johnson wrote: > Look, i hate super rich, arrogant people just as much i hate selfish > people. But wait, Rick. You are a man of contradictions. We all are, but you seem to bluster on and on more about it than most. Firstly, to *hate* anyone, super-rich, arrogant, or not, _is_ selfish by definition. Also, while I accept that you do not see yourself as arrogant, there are others on this list, who are not particularly arrogant, who read your posts as occasionally being extremely arrogant. For example, your post mocking people for using English in ways that you do not personally approve. Maybe this is just an artifact of the limitations of the written word. Now to the second contradiction. You said that one way to fix health care costs would be to deny it to anyone who could not afford health care insurance. Put in another way, health care should only go to those that can afford to pay for the insurance or care, and not the free-loaders. Is that not what you said? Thus a "super rich" person should be commended as he will be able to afford health care without burdening anyone else in society. Does your hatred for super-rich, arrogant, people mean that you believe there is an acceptable dollar value for the wealth a person should morally be able to amass? All of this reminds me that I've always wanted to ask you something. After reading your many posts over the last couple of years, I am curious. What do you do for your career? Are you a professional software developer?
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| From | Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-02-13 16:39 -0800 |
| Subject | Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] |
| Message-ID | <e8391706-1943-4dd4-a3b0-6e173e216ef3@f14g2000yqe.googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #20372 |
On Feb 13, 3:46 pm, Michael Torrie <torr...@gmail.com> wrote: > On 02/13/2012 09:01 AM, Rick Johnson wrote: > > > Look, i hate super rich, arrogant people just as much i hate selfish > > people. > > But wait, Rick. You are a man of contradictions. We all are, but you > seem to bluster on and on more about it than most. Firstly, to *hate* > anyone, super-rich, arrogant, or not, _is_ selfish by definition. Not necessarily. But i will admit that i did not choose my words correctly. I don't "hate" people simply BECAUSE they are rich. Just like i don't hate people simply because they are poor. However i DO hate what the super rich people BECOME. They become blind to their own position in the universe and instead start to believe the universe revolves around them. When their daily lives are consumed with vanity, and they lose all appreciation for the value of money. Yes, they have become something NOT to aspire to. But how much is too much? Good question, and the answer is ALWAYS subjective isn't it? A child might think $20 dollars is a lot of money. A homeless person might think someone who has a new model car is rich and not struggling. Same goes in the opposite direction. A rich man might choose suicide over life if confronted with the possibility of surviving on $40,000 a year. However, as we know, many folks survive on much less than that -- some even pretend to be happy! Can there be a specific amount wherein if you exceed that amount THEN you are living in excess? I believe there is a specific amount, however it is constantly changing depending on the current state of employment and wages. My equation looks like: # Py>=3.0 py> sum(earner.get_income(2012) for earner in earners2012) / len(earners2012) average_income Once you exceed that amount you are robbing your fellow man. How can you justify making more than your fair share UNLESS someone offers their work load to YOU? You can't. You are living in excess. And for those who think the average_income is too small, well then, it's time to implement population control! The fact is, we have far too many people living beyond their needs. We have people buying houses they can't afford and then blaming the bank for some how "tricking" them. They don't have the scruples to accept the blame! Take a look around man. The world is in death throes. World wide economic collapse is upon us. And how did we get here? Entitlements: which is just another manifestation of selfishness. Look at Greece. Look at Europe. America YOU are next! > Put in another way, health care should only go to those > that can afford to pay for the insurance or care, and not the > free-loaders. Yes. Healthcare is a luxury available only to those who can afford it. If you can't afford healthcare, then visit a REAL charity hospital (not one subsidized by taxpayers!). A real charity is subsidized by caring folks who want to help their fellow man -- even if to only extend his suffering a few more days, months, or years. > Thus a "super rich" person > should be commended as he will be able to afford health care without > burdening anyone else in society. "commend" is a strong word. I don't think paying your debts requires a pat on the back. If you have children, then you are required to raise them, you don't get brownie points for raising your children, it's your job! Same for debts. > Does your hatred for super-rich, > arrogant, people mean that you believe there is an acceptable dollar > value for the wealth a person should morally be able to amass? see above equation for enlightenment ^^^ > What do you do for your career? Are you a professional > software developer? Why? Do you need the services of a professional software developer?
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| From | Michael Torrie <torriem@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-02-13 18:36 -0700 |
| Subject | Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] |
| Message-ID | <mailman.5789.1329183413.27778.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #20382 |
On 02/13/2012 05:39 PM, Rick Johnson wrote: > Why? Do you need the services of a professional software developer? Do you have some to offer?
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| From | Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-02-14 12:37 +1100 |
| Subject | Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] |
| Message-ID | <mailman.5790.1329183454.27778.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #20382 |
On Tue, Feb 14, 2012 at 11:39 AM, Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> wrote: > # Py>=3.0 > py> sum(earner.get_income(2012) for earner in earners2012) / > len(earners2012) > average_income > > Once you exceed that amount you are robbing your fellow man. How can > you justify making more than your fair share UNLESS someone offers > their work load to YOU? You can't. You are living in excess. And for > those who think the average_income is too small, well then, it's time > to implement population control! My equation looks something like this: # Brain >= 0,1 brain> Your contribution to society / Society's contribution to you This value should be able to exceed 1.0 across the board. In fact, if it doesn't, then as a society we're moving backward. Rick, what's YOUR ratio? Oh wait, you mightn't be able to run that code. You may need to download an upgraded brain. ChrisA
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| From | Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-02-17 17:37 -0800 |
| Subject | Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] |
| Message-ID | <32cb82b9-0e35-4d92-983e-0c08df828174@n12g2000yqb.googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #20386 |
On Feb 13, 7:37 pm, Chris Angelico <ros...@gmail.com> wrote: > On Tue, Feb 14, 2012 at 11:39 AM, Rick Johnson > > <rantingrickjohn...@gmail.com> wrote: > > # Py>=3.0 > > py> sum(earner.get_income(2012) for earner in earners2012) / > > len(earners2012) > > average_income > > > Once you exceed that amount you are robbing your fellow man. How can > > you justify making more than your fair share UNLESS someone offers > > their work load to YOU? You can't. You are living in excess. And for > > those who think the average_income is too small, well then, it's time > > to implement population control! > > My equation looks something like this: > > # Brain >= 0,1 > brain> Your contribution to society / Society's contribution to you > > This value should be able to exceed 1.0 across the board. In fact, if > it doesn't, then as a society we're moving backward. Are we talking about money or deeds? If deeds then i agree, if money then i disagree. A society is NOT made better by contributing money. Who does the money go to? History has shown that money ends up being wasted, that money ends up being squandered, and that money ends up empowering tyranny! However A society IS improved when good deeds and good wills are injected by the individual. We should ALWAYS invest more good deeds and expect less. So in this case we should ALWAYS exceed 1.0.
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| From | Tim Wintle <tim.wintle@teamrubber.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-02-13 16:41 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] |
| Message-ID | <mailman.5795.1329211476.27778.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #20347 |
(Sorry for top-posting this bit, but I think it's required before the rest of my response) At the risk of wading into this from a UK citizen's perspective: You're imagining a public healthcare system as if it were private. Imagine you go to a doctor and say "I've got the flu, can you give me antibiotics". In a Private healthcare system: * The doctor gets paid for retaining a client. * He is incentivised to do what you request. ... so he gives you the antibiotics. In a Public healthcare system: * The doctor is paid no matter what. * His job is to stop the population becoming ill. * By reducing illnesses he reduces his workload, without reducing his wage ... so he'll only give you antibiotics if he feels you are at serious risk, and giving you antibiotics carries less risk for the population than the risk of the population getting immunities. Same goes for surgery etc. On Mon, 2012-02-13 at 08:01 -0800, Rick Johnson wrote: > And just how much healthcare dollars are you entitled to exactly? Can > you put your entitlement into some form of monetary value? > > And how can we ever make a system like this fair? If someone works for > 30 years and pays a 30% tax rate and another works for 2 years and > pays 15%, then how do we delegate the fair share? If your children are educated privately then should you still be paying taxes for education? If you work for/bank with a company that doesn't need to be bailed out, then should you still pay tax for that? If you never need benefits (welfare) then should your taxes be paying for that? you can use that same argument for everything that taxes pay for - the only logical conclusion of that argument is anarchy (i.e. no taxes, and no government). If you are an anarchist then that's a different argument all together (not saying it doesn't have intellectual validity). <snip> > Healthcare is expensive. Do you want a minimum wage doctor curing your > ills? And the frivolous lawsuits are not bringing the costs down > either. It's so expensive because of the marketing, and because of all the middle-men. A public health system doesn't need to do that marketing. They also don't need to put up with people who aren't seriously ill - I don't know how long your private appointments are, but here in the UK a standard doctor's appointment is 5-10 minutes. If they decide you're actually ill they may extend that. > > - bosses win, because they have reduced absenteeism, lower training costs > > to replace workers who die, and fewer epidemics that threaten their own > > families > > BS! With free healthcare, those who would have allowed their immune > system fight off the flu, now take off from work, visit a local > clinic, and get pumped full of antibiotics so they can create a new > strain of antibiotic resistant flu virus! Thanks free healthcare! See my comments at the top.
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| From | Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-02-14 16:40 -0800 |
| Subject | Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] |
| Message-ID | <0d04f99d-f7a0-4b8a-9552-e545a012decd@p7g2000yqk.googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #20391 |
On Feb 13, 10:41 am, Tim Wintle <tim.win...@teamrubber.com> wrote: > Imagine you go to a doctor and say "I've got the flu, can you give me > antibiotics". > > In a Private healthcare system: > > * The doctor gets paid for retaining a client. > * He is incentivised to do what you request. > ... so he gives you the antibiotics. > > In a Public healthcare system: > * The doctor is paid no matter what. > * His job is to stop the population becoming ill. > * By reducing illnesses he reduces his workload, without reducing his > wage > > ... so he'll only give you antibiotics if he feels you are at serious > risk, and giving you antibiotics carries less risk for the population > than the risk of the population getting immunities. Of all the great arguments i have presented you choose the minor "antibiotic comment" and run with it? But you take NO position on "supporting the degenerates of society"? Would you mind making your position known? You see, you can have all the healthcare and healthcare dollars in the world. But if your patient keeps eating greasy hamburgers, salty/oily french fries, and blood-sugar spiking soda-pops, he is going to die a nasty death! Sadly however, he will live for many years in a state of poor heath before finally "kicking the bucket". All the while draining the system of resources and money. > [...] > you can use that same argument for everything that taxes pay for - the > only logical conclusion of that argument is anarchy (i.e. no taxes, and > no government). > > If you are an anarchist then that's a different argument all together > (not saying it doesn't have intellectual validity). I am not an anarchist. Stop trying to label me. > > Healthcare is expensive. Do you want a minimum wage doctor curing your > > ills? And the frivolous lawsuits are not bringing the costs down > > either. > > It's so expensive because of the marketing, and because of all the > middle-men. You're thinking of pharmaceuticals NOT healthcare. And while marketing is a large expense for pharmaceutical companies; R&D, lawsuits, and brown-nosing are the main cost of doing buisness. > They also don't need to put up with people who aren't seriously ill - I > don't know how long your private appointments are, but here in the UK a > standard doctor's appointment is 5-10 minutes. If they decide you're > actually ill they may extend that. Five to ten minutes? Is the doctor an a-hole or a machine? Can a doctor REALLY diagnose an illness in five to ten minutes? Are you joking? And if not, do you ACTUALLY want the experience to be synonymous with an assembly line? You don't fear misdiagnosis? I envy your bravery!
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| From | "Prasad, Ramit" <ramit.prasad@jpmorgan.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-02-17 20:09 +0000 |
| Subject | RE: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] |
| Message-ID | <mailman.5925.1329509411.27778.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #20421 |
>> They also don't need to put up with people who aren't seriously ill - I >> don't know how long your private appointments are, but here in the UK a >> standard doctor's appointment is 5-10 minutes. If they decide you're >> actually ill they may extend that. >Five to ten minutes? Is the doctor an a-hole or a machine? Can a >doctor REALLY diagnose an illness in five to ten minutes? Are you >joking? And if not, do you ACTUALLY want the experience to be >synonymous with an assembly line? You don't fear misdiagnosis? I envy >your bravery! Actually, I find that (5-10 minutes of doctor time) completely true even in America. The difference is that I spend 30-60minutes waiting to be called, then another 5min with a nurse for pre-doctor stuff (blood pressure, why I am there, etc), finally another 5 minutes with the nurse for any necessary post-doctor work (drawing blood, shots, etc.). My total doctor talking time is really 5-10 minutes. Of course, if I was sick in an unusual way then the doctor would see me for longer, but the average doctor tends to see the same couple dozen things over and over. This is true for every doctor I can remember, but YMMV. Ramit Ramit Prasad | JPMorgan Chase Investment Bank | Currencies Technology 712 Main Street | Houston, TX 77002 work phone: 713 - 216 - 5423 -- This email is confidential and subject to important disclaimers and conditions including on offers for the purchase or sale of securities, accuracy and completeness of information, viruses, confidentiality, legal privilege, and legal entity disclaimers, available at http://www.jpmorgan.com/pages/disclosures/email.
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| From | Duncan Booth <duncan.booth@invalid.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-02-14 11:31 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] |
| Message-ID | <Xns9FF975445EA20duncanbooth@127.0.0.1> |
| In reply to | #20347 |
Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> wrote: > BS! With free healthcare, those who would have allowed their immune > system fight off the flu, now take off from work, visit a local > clinic, and get pumped full of antibiotics so they can create a new > strain of antibiotic resistant flu virus! Thanks free healthcare! Anyone who can write 'antibiotic resistant flu virus' as though they believe it really needs to read some elementary books about disease. Here's a clue: No flu viruses are treatable with antibiotics. In some cases antibiotics may be useful for flu patients to treat secondary bacterial infections, but they are not effective against viruses. -- Duncan Booth http://kupuguy.blogspot.com
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| From | Devin Jeanpierre <jeanpierreda@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-02-14 07:06 -0500 |
| Subject | Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] |
| Message-ID | <mailman.5797.1329221208.27778.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #20393 |
On Tue, Feb 14, 2012 at 6:31 AM, Duncan Booth <duncan.booth@invalid.invalid> wrote: > Here's a clue: No flu viruses are treatable with antibiotics. Oh my god we're too late! Now they're ALL resistant! -- Devin
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| From | Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-02-14 16:48 -0800 |
| Subject | Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] |
| Message-ID | <6d40acbf-1a4e-4004-8968-edc8f84015ab@p7g2000yqk.googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #20393 |
On Feb 14, 5:31 am, Duncan Booth <duncan.bo...@invalid.invalid> wrote: > Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohn...@gmail.com> wrote: > > BS! With free healthcare, those who would have allowed their immune > > system fight off the flu, now take off from work, visit a local > > clinic, and get pumped full of antibiotics so they can create a new > > strain of antibiotic resistant flu virus! Thanks free healthcare! > > Anyone who can write 'antibiotic resistant flu virus' as though they > believe it really needs to read some elementary books about disease. > > Here's a clue: No flu viruses are treatable with antibiotics. In some cases > antibiotics may be useful for flu patients to treat secondary bacterial > infections, but they are not effective against viruses. Duncan, your reading and comprehension skills are atrocious. Please re- read the paragraph you quoted, then spend some time "comprehending" it, then show me where i stated that "antibiotics cure viral infections". psst: i NEVER said any such thing! My point is: these "quacks" are prescribing antibiotics when people don't even need them! Such disregard for immunity is frightening. Penicillin was a gift from the gods, and we have squandered it! Thanks free healthcare!
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| From | Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-02-15 12:32 +1100 |
| Subject | Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] |
| Message-ID | <mailman.5815.1329269578.27778.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #20422 |
On Wed, Feb 15, 2012 at 11:48 AM, Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> wrote: > Duncan, your reading and comprehension skills are atrocious. Please re- > read the paragraph you quoted, then spend some time "comprehending" > it, then show me where i stated that "antibiotics cure viral > infections". psst: i NEVER said any such thing! I'm not sure how you'd go about creating a new strain of a virus that's resistant to antibiotics, unless the previous strain was NOT resistant. Viruses are _immune_ to antibiotics, and as we know from Angband, immunity equals resistance times ten. ChrisA
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| From | Duncan Booth <duncan.booth@invalid.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-02-15 09:47 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] |
| Message-ID | <Xns9FFA63A01C063duncanbooth@127.0.0.1> |
| In reply to | #20422 |
Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> wrote: > On Feb 14, 5:31 am, Duncan Booth <duncan.bo...@invalid.invalid> wrote: >> Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohn...@gmail.com> wrote: >> > BS! With free healthcare, those who would have allowed their immune >> > system fight off the flu, now take off from work, visit a local >> > clinic, and get pumped full of antibiotics so they can create a new >> > strain of antibiotic resistant flu virus! Thanks free healthcare! >> >> Anyone who can write 'antibiotic resistant flu virus' as though they >> believe it really needs to read some elementary books about disease. >> >> Here's a clue: No flu viruses are treatable with antibiotics. In some >> cas > es >> antibiotics may be useful for flu patients to treat secondary >> bacterial infections, but they are not effective against viruses. > > Duncan, your reading and comprehension skills are atrocious. Please > re- read the paragraph you quoted, then spend some time > "comprehending" it, then show me where i stated that "antibiotics cure > viral infections". psst: i NEVER said any such thing! Rick, your reading and comprehension skills are atrocious. Please re-read the paragraph you quoted, then spend some time "comprehending" it, then show me where I stated that you '''stated that "antibiotics cure viral infections"'''. I never said any such thing. -- Duncan Booth http://kupuguy.blogspot.com
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| From | Arnaud Delobelle <arnodel@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-02-15 09:58 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] |
| Message-ID | <mailman.5824.1329299889.27778.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #20433 |
On 15 February 2012 09:47, Duncan Booth <duncan.booth@invalid.invalid> wrote: > Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> wrote: [...] Perhaps it's a bit presumptuous of me but... It's tempting to react to his inflammatory posts, but after all Rick is a troll and experience shows that trolls are best left alone. Also, please spare a thought for all of us who have him in our killfiles. -- Arnaud
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| From | Duncan Booth <duncan.booth@invalid.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-02-15 10:04 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers] |
| Message-ID | <Xns9FFA667CB8775duncanbooth@127.0.0.1> |
| In reply to | #20435 |
Arnaud Delobelle <arnodel@gmail.com> wrote: > On 15 February 2012 09:47, Duncan Booth <duncan.booth@invalid.invalid> > wrote: >> Rick Johnson <rantingrickjohnson@gmail.com> wrote: > [...] > > Perhaps it's a bit presumptuous of me but... > > It's tempting to react to his inflammatory posts, but after all Rick > is a troll and experience shows that trolls are best left alone. > Also, please spare a thought for all of us who have him in our > killfiles. > Yes, sorry about that. Actually, I thought it was a bit weird that I saw ChrisA's comment but not the message he was commenting on until I went and looked for it. I read this group on a couple of machines and it looks like Rick's killfile entry had expired on the other but not this one. Next time I'm back on the other machine I'll try to remember to sort out the killfile. -- Duncan Booth http://kupuguy.blogspot.com
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| From | Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-02-15 10:27 +0000 |
| Subject | Kill files [was Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers]] |
| Message-ID | <4f3b8875$0$29986$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> |
| In reply to | #20436 |
On Wed, 15 Feb 2012 10:04:34 +0000, Duncan Booth wrote: > Actually, I thought it was a bit weird that I saw ChrisA's comment but > not the message he was commenting on until I went and looked for it. I > read this group on a couple of machines and it looks like Rick's > killfile entry had expired on the other but not this one. Next time I'm > back on the other machine I'll try to remember to sort out the killfile. Yes, I have this problem too. I'm reluctant to killfile people forever, call me a sucker if you like, but I'm willing to give people second chances (and apparently third and fourth and fifth chances). Methinks it's time for Monsieur Johnson to go back in the killfile. -- Steven
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| From | Ethan Furman <ethan@stoneleaf.us> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-02-15 11:29 -0800 |
| Subject | Re: Kill files [was Re: OT: Entitlements [was Re: Python usage numbers]] |
| Message-ID | <mailman.5848.1329335511.27778.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #20437 |
Steven D'Aprano wrote: > On Wed, 15 Feb 2012 10:04:34 +0000, Duncan Booth wrote: > >> Actually, I thought it was a bit weird that I saw ChrisA's comment but >> not the message he was commenting on until I went and looked for it. I >> read this group on a couple of machines and it looks like Rick's >> killfile entry had expired on the other but not this one. Next time I'm >> back on the other machine I'll try to remember to sort out the killfile. > > Yes, I have this problem too. I'm reluctant to killfile people forever, > call me a sucker if you like, but I'm willing to give people second > chances (and apparently third and fourth and fifth chances). Methinks > it's time for Monsieur Johnson to go back in the killfile. Luckily for me there are enough folks that still reply to the trolls in my killfile that I can see if it's time to take them off or not. ;) (This one is a resounding NOT) ~Ethan~
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