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Re: How security holes happen

References (8 earlier) <87d2i1mvg7.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <qsrch9lgi81sd33hu8kag5s6cvhhj637g9@4ax.com> <mailman.7823.1394029216.18130.python-list@python.org> <87zjl47l18.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <53177025$0$29985$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com>
Date 2014-03-06 06:00 +1100
Subject Re: How security holes happen
From Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com>
Newsgroups comp.lang.python
Message-ID <mailman.7831.1394046014.18130.python-list@python.org> (permalink)

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On Thu, Mar 6, 2014 at 5:42 AM, Steven D'Aprano
<steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> wrote:
> On Wed, 05 Mar 2014 16:54:59 +0200, Marko Rauhamaa wrote:
>
>> I don't think Lisp was really originally designed.
>
> The history of Lisp is described here in detail:
>
> http://www-formal.stanford.edu/jmc/history/lisp/lisp.html
>
> Like all complex systems, it did not appear fully-formed in a flash of
> inspiration. It was both designed and evolved through experimentation.
> That process of *trying things* and keeping those that work is usually
> called "design".

There's a difference between iterative design of that nature and
initial design. An initial clean design is a good basis for further
iterative design; a messy initial design means backward compatibility
shackles you. "Originally designed" is different from "constantly
worked on".

But Lisp has enough variants that the backward compat issue isn't as
major. There's no specific need for Scheme to maintain every mistake
of Common Lisp, or Clojure to support everything that elisp does.

ChrisA

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Thread

Re: How security holes happen Chris Kaynor <ckaynor@zindagigames.com> - 2014-03-03 14:55 -0800
  Re: How security holes happen sffjunkie@gmail.com - 2014-03-04 08:41 -0800
    Re: How security holes happen Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 04:07 +1100
    Re: How security holes happen Skip Montanaro <skip@pobox.com> - 2014-03-04 11:16 -0600
    Re: How security holes happen Ned Batchelder <ned@nedbatchelder.com> - 2014-03-04 15:47 -0500
    Re: How security holes happen Ethan Furman <ethan@stoneleaf.us> - 2014-03-04 13:49 -0800
      Re: How security holes happen Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-03-05 00:48 +0200
        Re: How security holes happen Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 09:57 +1100
          Re: How security holes happen Roy Smith <roy@panix.com> - 2014-03-04 17:59 -0500
            Re: How security holes happen Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-03-04 23:16 +0000
            Re: How security holes happen Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 10:22 +1100
            Re: How security holes happen Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-03-04 23:40 +0000
        Re: How security holes happen Dennis Lee Bieber <wlfraed@ix.netcom.com> - 2014-03-04 19:31 -0500
        Re: How security holes happen Dennis Lee Bieber <wlfraed@ix.netcom.com> - 2014-03-04 19:30 -0500
          Re: How security holes happen Roy Smith <roy@panix.com> - 2014-03-04 20:57 -0500
            Re: How security holes happen MRAB <python@mrabarnett.plus.com> - 2014-03-05 04:11 +0000
              Re: How security holes happen Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-03-05 08:37 +0200
                Re: How security holes happen Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-05 08:26 +0000
                Re: How security holes happen Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-03-05 19:57 +1100
                Re: How security holes happen Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-03-05 11:01 +0200
                Re: How security holes happen "Mark H. Harris" <harrismh777@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 06:11 -0800
                Re: How security holes happen Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-06 02:16 +1100
                Re: How security holes happen Dennis Lee Bieber <wlfraed@ix.netcom.com> - 2014-03-05 19:24 -0500
                Re: How security holes happen "Mark H. Harris" <harrismh777@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 17:24 -0800
                Re: How security holes happen MRAB <python@mrabarnett.plus.com> - 2014-03-06 01:40 +0000
                Re: How security holes happen "Mark H. Harris" <harrismh777@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 18:07 -0800
                Re: How security holes happen Dennis Lee Bieber <wlfraed@ix.netcom.com> - 2014-03-06 19:28 -0500
                Re: How security holes happen "Mark H. Harris" <harrismh777@gmail.com> - 2014-03-06 17:53 -0800
                Re: How security holes happen MRAB <python@mrabarnett.plus.com> - 2014-03-07 02:13 +0000
                Re: How security holes happen "Mark H. Harris" <harrismh777@gmail.com> - 2014-03-06 18:39 -0800
                Re: How security holes happen Dennis Lee Bieber <wlfraed@ix.netcom.com> - 2014-03-07 19:46 -0500
                Re: How security holes happen Dennis Lee Bieber <wlfraed@ix.netcom.com> - 2014-03-07 19:43 -0500
        Re: How security holes happen Neil Cerutti <neilc@norwich.edu> - 2014-03-05 14:19 +0000
          Re: How security holes happen Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-03-05 16:54 +0200
            Re: How security holes happen Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-05 18:42 +0000
              Re: How security holes happen Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-03-06 06:00 +1100
        Re: How security holes happen Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2014-03-05 15:28 +0000
        Re: How security holes happen Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-03-05 15:47 +0000
          Re: How security holes happen "Mark H. Harris" <harrismh777@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 08:37 -0800

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