Re: should "self" be changed?

From	random832@fastmail.us
Subject	Re: should "self" be changed?
Date	2015-05-26 14:11 -0400
References	<551c8229-f426-45f0-a0ee-fdad1b161f59@googlegroups.com> <201505261657.t4QGvJYW019538@fido.openend.se>
Newsgroups	comp.lang.python
Message-ID	<mailman.63.1432663908.5151.python-list@python.org> (permalink)

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On Tue, May 26, 2015, at 12:57, Laura Creighton wrote:
> Guido did.  :)
> http://neopythonic.blogspot.se/2008/10/why-explicit-self-has-to-stay.html

It's worth noting that the "dynamically modify a class" argument (and to
some extent the decorator argument) misses Javascript's solution - _any_
function may refer to "this" (which is not in the argument list), which
will be the global scope object (the browser window for browser-hosted
javascript - presumably the current module for a hypothetical equivalent
python feature, though it might be more prudent to simply make it None.)
if the function is called without an object reference. Of course,
Javascript also lacks bound methods, which makes it much more likely to
happen by accident.

I can't really think of anything that you can do with decorators,
either, in the current model, that you _couldn't_ do in a JS-alike
function call model... but I doubt it would be possible to implement
backwards-compatibly.

In principle, if you added a class keyword (hey, technically, isn't
there one already?) you wouldn't need decorators at all for the
staticmethod/classmethod/instance method case.

Thread

should "self" be changed? zipher <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-05-26 09:37 -0700
  Re: should "self" be changed? Laura Creighton <lac@openend.se> - 2015-05-26 18:57 +0200
    Re: should "self" be changed? zipher <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-05-26 20:01 -0700
    Re: should "self" be changed? zipher <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-05-26 20:15 -0700
  Re: should "self" be changed? Laurent Pointal <laurent.pointal@free.fr> - 2015-05-26 18:59 +0200
  Re: should "self" be changed? Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2015-05-26 18:28 +0100
    Re: should "self" be changed? zipher <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-05-26 19:48 -0700
      Re: should "self" be changed? zipher <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-05-26 20:17 -0700
        Re: should "self" be changed? Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2015-05-27 14:39 +1000
          Re: should "self" be changed? Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2015-05-27 15:47 +1000
            Re: should "self" be changed? Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2015-05-27 21:29 +1000
              Re: should "self" be changed? zipher <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-05-27 05:40 -0700
                Re: should "self" be changed? Todd <toddrjen@gmail.com> - 2015-05-27 15:00 +0200
                Re: should "self" be changed? Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2015-05-27 14:19 +0000
                Re: should "self" be changed? zipher <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-05-30 16:18 -0700
            Re: should "self" be changed? zipher <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-05-30 16:10 -0700
          Re: should "self" be changed? zipher <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-05-30 16:13 -0700
  Re: should "self" be changed? Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2015-05-27 03:31 +1000
  Re: should "self" be changed? random832@fastmail.us - 2015-05-26 14:11 -0400
  Re: should "self" be changed? Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2015-05-26 22:46 +0300
    Re: should "self" be changed? Ned Batchelder <ned@nedbatchelder.com> - 2015-05-26 13:04 -0700
      Re: should "self" be changed? Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2015-05-26 23:36 +0300
        Re: should "self" be changed? Anssi Saari <as@sci.fi> - 2015-05-28 17:07 +0300
          Re: should "self" be changed? Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2015-05-28 18:01 +0300
            Re: should "self" be changed? Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2015-05-28 09:40 -0600
              Re: should "self" be changed? Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2015-05-28 19:59 +0300
                Re: should "self" be changed? Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2015-05-29 03:06 +1000
                Re: should "self" be changed? zipher <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-05-30 16:39 -0700
            Re: should "self" be changed? Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2015-05-29 12:00 +1000
              Re: should "self" be changed? Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2015-05-29 15:46 +1000
              Re: should "self" be changed? Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2015-06-03 02:50 +1000
                Re: should "self" be changed? "Dr. BigCock" <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 10:16 -0700
                Re: should "self" be changed? Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2015-06-02 20:19 +0300
                Re: should "self" be changed? "Dr. Bigcock" <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 11:02 -0700
                Re: should "self" be changed? Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 19:39 -0600
                Re: should "self" be changed? Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2015-06-03 17:05 +1000
    Re: should "self" be changed? Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2015-05-27 15:20 +1000
  Re: should "self" be changed? garabik-news-2005-05@kassiopeia.juls.savba.sk - 2015-05-26 20:26 +0000
    Re: should "self" be changed? Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2015-05-26 21:45 +0100
      Re: should "self" be changed? Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2015-05-27 15:23 +1000
        Re: should "self" be changed? Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2015-05-27 16:32 +1000
          Re: should "self" be changed? Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2015-05-27 10:39 +0300
            Re: should "self" be changed? Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2015-05-27 18:20 +1000
            Re: should "self" be changed? zipher <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-05-30 16:15 -0700
        Re: should "self" be changed? Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2015-05-27 17:59 -0400
    Re: should "self" be changed? Vito De Tullio <vito.detullio@gmail.com> - 2015-05-26 23:17 +0200
    Re: should "self" be changed? Tim Chase <python.list@tim.thechases.com> - 2015-05-26 16:10 -0500
  Re: should "self" be changed? Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2015-05-27 15:17 +1000

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