Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively

From	Thorsten Kampe <thorsten@thorstenkampe.de>
Newsgroups	comp.lang.python
Subject	Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively
Date	2011-05-26 12:46 +0200
Message-ID	<MPG.28484e0b28e620fe989814@news.individual.de> (permalink)
References	(7 earlier) <enmta8-slc.ln1@murmur.very.softly> <MPG.2846cd7bb9b15b7498980f@news.individual.de> <4ddd7bde$0$29996$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com> <MPG.2848322f54e280e7989812@news.individual.de> <4dde2634$0$29997$c3e8da3$5496439d@news.astraweb.com>

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* Steven D'Aprano (26 May 2011 10:06:44 GMT)
> 
> On Thu, 26 May 2011 10:48:07 +0200, Thorsten Kampe wrote:
> 
> > But not to digress, the /real/ problem with commands or idioms like "rm
> > -r" is /not/ their choice of option names but that they explain these
> > options in the exact same terms. No one would have a problem with "-r,
> > --recursive -- remove directories including all sub-directories" instead
> > of "-r, --recursive -- remove directories and their contents
> > recursively".
> 
> I think you are understanding the description "remove directories and 
> their contents recursively" as a description of the *mechanism* by which 
> rm removes the directory, i.e. some recursive tree-walking function that 
> visits each node and deletes it.
> 
> I don't believe that's how the description is meant to be understood. I 
> understand it as describing the effect, not the implementation.

It doesn't matter how I interprete the explanation "-r = recursively 
delete". What matters is that I have to explain (interpret, translate 
the explanation.

> You're interpreting the reference to "recursive" as a nod to the
> implementation. I'm not, and therefore your arguments don't convince
> me.

No one understands what "recursively delete" means until someone 
explains ("translates") it to him. This is not an argument but a simple 
fact. I experienced it many times, others here in the thread did and 
probably you, too.

"recursively delete" is completely unneccessary because there is already 
a simple explanation that everyone understands without translation 
("delete including subdirectories").

It's unnecessary bullshit buzzword bingo from nerds which adds or helps 
or explains nothing. It's just that simple.

Thorsten

Thread

English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Xah Lee <xahlee@gmail.com> - 2011-05-17 15:26 -0700
  Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2011-05-17 17:20 -0600
    Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively "Martin P. Hellwig" <martin.hellwig@gmail.com> - 2011-05-18 22:22 +0000
  Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2011-05-18 09:42 +1000
  Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively "Steven W. Orr" <steveo@syslang.net> - 2011-05-17 21:16 -0400
  Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Roland Hutchinson <my.spamtrap@verizon.net> - 2011-05-18 04:51 +0000
    Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively "Pascal J. Bourguignon" <pjb@informatimago.com> - 2011-05-18 07:19 +0200
      Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively tar@sevak.isi.edu (Thomas A. Russ) - 2011-05-17 23:42 -0700
        Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Hans Georg Schaathun <hg@schaathun.net> - 2011-05-18 09:26 +0100
          Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively tar@sevak.isi.edu (Thomas A. Russ) - 2011-05-18 09:16 -0700
            Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Hans Georg Schaathun <hg@schaathun.net> - 2011-05-18 19:11 +0100
              Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Raymond Wiker <raw@RAWMBP-2.local> - 2011-05-18 20:20 +0200
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Hans Georg Schaathun <hg@schaathun.net> - 2011-05-18 19:39 +0100
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Raymond Wiker <raw@RAWMBP-2.local> - 2011-05-18 21:09 +0200
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Hans Georg Schaathun <hg@schaathun.net> - 2011-05-18 21:02 +0100
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Raymond Wiker <raw@RAWMBP-2.local> - 2011-05-18 22:40 +0200
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Hans Georg Schaathun <hg@schaathun.net> - 2011-05-19 05:56 +0100
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively tar@sevak.isi.edu (Thomas A. Russ) - 2011-05-19 16:14 -0700
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2011-05-19 04:41 +1000
            Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2011-05-19 04:12 +1000
            Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively "Pascal J. Bourguignon" <pjb@informatimago.com> - 2011-05-18 20:57 +0200
              Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively tar@sevak.isi.edu (Thomas A. Russ) - 2011-05-19 16:17 -0700
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively "Pascal J. Bourguignon" <pjb@informatimago.com> - 2011-05-20 02:38 +0200
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Antti J Ylikoski <antti.ylikoski@tkk.fi> - 2011-05-20 12:00 +0300
        Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Peter Moylan <invalid@peter.pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2011-05-18 22:09 +1000
          Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively rusi <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2011-05-18 06:14 -0700
            Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Peter Moylan <invalid@peter.pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2011-05-19 11:06 +1000
              Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Jonathan de Boyne Pollard <J.deBoynePollard-newsgroups@NTLWorld.COM> - 2011-05-21 09:32 +0100
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Lars Enderin <lars.enderin@telia.com> - 2011-05-21 11:52 +0200
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Lars Enderin <lars.enderin@telia.com> - 2011-05-21 11:54 +0200
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Lars Enderin <lars.enderin@telia.com> - 2011-05-21 11:56 +0200
              Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2011-05-21 15:34 +0000
      Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Roland Hutchinson <my.spamtrap@verizon.net> - 2011-05-20 06:50 +0000
    Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively rusi <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2011-05-17 23:06 -0700
      Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Harrison Hill <harrishill@gmx.com> - 2011-05-17 23:50 -0700
        Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively rusi <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2011-05-18 00:16 -0700
        Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Peter Moylan <invalid@peter.pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2011-05-18 22:19 +1000
          Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively rantingrick <rantingrick@gmail.com> - 2011-05-29 13:16 -0700
            Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Peter Moylan <invalid@peter.pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2011-05-30 22:58 +1000
        Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively see@sig.for.address (Victor Eijkhout) - 2011-05-18 12:59 -0500
          Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Roland Hutchinson <my.spamtrap@verizon.net> - 2011-05-20 06:54 +0000
            Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2011-05-20 17:10 +1000
          Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively rantingrick <rantingrick@gmail.com> - 2011-05-29 13:28 -0700
            Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Peter Moylan <invalid@peter.pmoylan.org.invalid> - 2011-05-30 23:02 +1000
          Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively rantingrick <rantingrick@gmail.com> - 2011-05-29 13:28 -0700
        Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Glenn Knickerbocker <NotR@bestweb.net> - 2011-05-18 16:54 -0400
      Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2011-05-18 00:58 -0600
        Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively rusi <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2011-05-18 00:10 -0700
          Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2011-05-18 08:32 -0600
            Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively rusi <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2011-05-18 08:15 -0700
              Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2011-05-18 09:43 -0600
  Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Hans Georg Schaathun <hg@schaathun.net> - 2011-05-18 09:12 +0100
    Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Espen Vestre <espen@vestre.net> - 2011-05-18 10:20 +0200
    Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Rikishi42 <skunkworks@rikishi42.net> - 2011-05-19 23:21 +0200
      Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Hans Georg Schaathun <hg@schaathun.net> - 2011-05-20 05:28 +0100
        Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Rikishi42 <skunkworks@rikishi42.net> - 2011-05-23 20:48 +0200
      Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively rusi <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2011-05-19 22:13 -0700
        Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2011-05-20 06:55 +0000
          Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Hans Georg Schaathun <hg@schaathun.net> - 2011-05-20 09:48 +0100
            Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively rusi <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2011-05-20 10:21 -0700
          Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Rikishi42 <skunkworks@rikishi42.net> - 2011-05-23 20:56 +0200
            Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2011-05-24 00:18 +0000
              Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Rikishi42 <skunkworks@rikishi42.net> - 2011-05-25 00:06 +0200
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2011-05-25 10:40 +1000
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively rantingrick <rantingrick@gmail.com> - 2011-05-29 14:18 -0700
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively rantingrick <rantingrick@gmail.com> - 2011-05-29 14:19 -0700
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Xah Lee <xahlee@gmail.com> - 2011-05-24 23:05 -0700
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Thorsten Kampe <thorsten@thorstenkampe.de> - 2011-05-25 09:26 +0200
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Xah Lee <xahlee@gmail.com> - 2011-05-25 00:51 -0700
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2011-05-25 17:59 +1000
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2011-05-25 21:59 +0000
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Thorsten Kampe <thorsten@thorstenkampe.de> - 2011-05-26 10:48 +0200
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2011-05-26 10:06 +0000
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Thorsten Kampe <thorsten@thorstenkampe.de> - 2011-05-26 12:46 +0200
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively harrismh777 <harrismh777@charter.net> - 2011-05-27 09:31 -0500
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2011-05-25 22:58 +0000
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2011-05-26 14:00 +1000
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Thorsten Kampe <thorsten@thorstenkampe.de> - 2011-05-26 10:59 +0200
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively "Charles" <C.Sanders@DeleteThis.Bom.GOV.AU> - 2011-05-26 20:58 +1000
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2011-05-26 21:12 +1000
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively rantingrick <rantingrick@gmail.com> - 2011-05-29 14:38 -0700
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2011-05-30 07:46 +1000
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively rantingrick <rantingrick@gmail.com> - 2011-05-29 15:54 -0700
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively rantingrick <rantingrick@gmail.com> - 2011-05-29 14:38 -0700
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Thorsten Kampe <thorsten@thorstenkampe.de> - 2011-05-26 13:20 +0200
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2011-05-26 21:28 +1000
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Xah Lee <xahlee@gmail.com> - 2011-05-26 14:51 -0700
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Rikishi42 <skunkworks@rikishi42.net> - 2011-05-28 21:36 +0200
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2011-05-29 05:58 +1000
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2011-05-29 00:49 +0000
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Rikishi42 <skunkworks@rikishi42.net> - 2011-05-30 23:04 +0200
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2011-05-30 23:17 +0000
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2011-05-29 07:28 +1000
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Rikishi42 <skunkworks@rikishi42.net> - 2011-05-30 23:10 +0200
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively rantingrick <rantingrick@gmail.com> - 2011-05-29 13:58 -0700
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2011-05-30 07:27 +1000
          Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively rantingrick <rantingrick@gmail.com> - 2011-05-29 13:39 -0700
  Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Mike Barnes <mikebarnes@bluebottle.com> - 2011-05-18 10:25 +0100
    Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Xah Lee <xahlee@gmail.com> - 2011-05-18 13:00 -0700
      Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Hans Georg Schaathun <hg@schaathun.net> - 2011-05-18 21:19 +0100
        Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Lanarcam <lanarcam1@yahoo.fr> - 2011-05-18 22:33 +0200
      Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Mike Barnes <mikebarnes@bluebottle.com> - 2011-05-18 22:00 +0100
      Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Jonathan de Boyne Pollard <J.deBoynePollard-newsgroups@NTLWorld.COM> - 2011-05-20 08:10 +0100
        Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Xah Lee <xahlee@gmail.com> - 2011-05-22 13:22 -0700
          Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2011-05-23 08:46 +1000
            Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Xah Lee <xahlee@gmail.com> - 2011-05-22 16:17 -0700
              Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2011-05-23 09:32 +1000
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Xah Lee <xahlee@gmail.com> - 2011-05-23 21:20 -0700
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2011-05-24 14:28 +1000
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Xah Lee <xahlee@gmail.com> - 2011-05-24 10:40 -0700
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2011-05-25 08:14 +1000
                Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2011-05-25 10:15 +0000
      Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively rantingrick <rantingrick@gmail.com> - 2011-05-29 13:32 -0700
    Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Jonathan de Boyne Pollard <J.deBoynePollard-newsgroups@NTLWorld.COM> - 2011-05-20 08:07 +0100
  Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively John Nagle <nagle@animats.com> - 2011-05-18 13:07 -0700
  Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively Jonathan de Boyne Pollard <J.deBoynePollard-newsgroups@NTLWorld.COM> - 2011-05-20 08:00 +0100
    Re: English Idiom in Unix: Directory Recursively David Schwartz <davids@webmaster.com> - 2011-05-27 22:56 -0700

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