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Android apps development

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  Android apps development "sl@exabyte" <ecp_gen@my-rialto.com> - 2011-04-02 17:44 -0700
    Re: Android apps development Fredrik Jonson <fredrik@jonson.org> - 2011-04-02 08:47 +0000
      Re: Android apps development Steve Sobol <sjsobol@JustThe.net> - 2011-04-02 10:52 -0700
        Re: Android apps development Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-04-02 11:13 -0700
          Re: Android apps development Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-04-02 14:25 -0400
            Re: Android apps development Dirk Bruere at NeoPax <dirk.bruere@gmail.com> - 2011-04-02 20:22 +0100
            Re: Android apps development Tom Anderson <twic@urchin.earth.li> - 2011-04-03 00:06 +0100
              Re: Android apps development Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-04-02 19:10 -0400
              Re: Android apps development Sherm Pendley <sherm.pendley@gmail.com> - 2011-04-02 21:27 -0400
          Re: Android apps development Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-04-03 10:48 +1200
            Re: Android apps development Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-04-02 16:01 -0700
              Re: Android apps development Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-04-03 12:56 +1200
                Re: Android apps development Dirk Bruere at NeoPax <dirk.bruere@gmail.com> - 2011-04-03 17:31 +0100
    Re: Android apps development Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-04-02 21:57 +1300
      Re: Android apps development Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-04-02 10:07 -0300
        Re: Android apps development Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-04-03 10:44 +1200
          Re: Android apps development Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-04-03 10:36 -0300
            Re: Android apps development vjp2.at@at.BioStrategist.dot.dot.com - 2011-05-04 04:39 +0000
              Re: Android apps development Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-05-04 16:55 -0400
              Re: Android apps development Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2011-05-04 22:07 -0700
                Re: Android apps development Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-05 17:13 +1200
                  Re: Android apps development Dirk Bruere at NeoPax <dirk.bruere@gmail.com> - 2011-05-05 16:18 +0100
                    Re: Android apps development Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2011-05-05 08:43 -0700
                    Re: Android apps development Steve Sobol <sjsobol@JustThe.net> - 2011-05-05 09:11 -0700
                      Re: Android apps development Dirk Bruere at NeoPax <dirk.bruere@gmail.com> - 2011-05-05 21:07 +0100
                        Re: Android apps development Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-05-05 16:57 -0400
                        Re: Android apps development Steve Sobol <sjsobol@JustThe.net> - 2011-05-05 15:27 -0700
                          Re: Android apps development Dirk Bruere at NeoPax <dirk.bruere@gmail.com> - 2011-05-06 10:51 +0100
                            Re: Android apps development Steve Sobol <sjsobol@JustThe.net> - 2011-05-06 16:14 -0700
                              Re: Android apps development Dirk Bruere at NeoPax <dirk.bruere@gmail.com> - 2011-05-07 01:05 +0100
                                Re: Android apps development Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-07 15:52 +1200
                    Re: Android apps development Sherm Pendley <sherm.pendley@gmail.com> - 2011-05-05 15:28 -0400
                    Re: Android apps development Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-06 11:48 +1200
                      Re: Android apps development Dirk Bruere at NeoPax <dirk.bruere@gmail.com> - 2011-05-06 10:53 +0100
                    Re: Android apps development Nigel Wade <nmw-news@ion.le.ac.uk> - 2011-05-06 09:49 +0100
                      Re: Android apps development The Frog <mr.frog.to.you@googlemail.com> - 2011-05-06 02:15 -0700
                      Re: Android apps development Dirk Bruere at NeoPax <dirk.bruere@gmail.com> - 2011-05-06 10:56 +0100
      Re: Android apps development Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-04-02 06:24 -0700
        Re: Android apps development Dirk Bruere at NeoPax <dirk.bruere@gmail.com> - 2011-04-02 14:44 +0100
        Re: Android apps development Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2011-04-02 10:53 -0700
          Re: Android apps development Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-04-02 11:10 -0700
        Re: Android apps development Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-04-03 10:33 +1200
      Re: Android apps development Dirk Bruere at NeoPax <dirk.bruere@gmail.com> - 2011-04-02 14:43 +0100
        Re: Android apps development Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-04-02 11:04 -0400
    Re: Android apps development Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-04-02 11:01 -0400

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#2727 — Android apps development

For Android development questions, OK to ask here ? 

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#2728

sl@exabyte wrote:

>  For Android development questions, OK to ask here?

You're more likely to get appropriate help if you ask on the official mailing
list <http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers>. If you prefer to use
a newsgroup interface that mailing list is also available as a newsgroup on at
gmane: <news://news.gmane.org/gmane.comp.handhelds.android.devel>.

-- 
Fredrik Jonson

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#2764

In article <slrnipdolk.1k5.fredrik@scout.jonson.org>, Fredrik Jonson 
says...
> 
> sl@exabyte wrote:
> 
> >  For Android development questions, OK to ask here?
> 
> You're more likely to get appropriate help if you ask on the official mailing
> list <http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers>. If you prefer to use
> a newsgroup interface that mailing list is also available as a newsgroup on at
> gmane: <news://news.gmane.org/gmane.comp.handhelds.android.devel>.

I second that, although I do some Android development and would not mind 
discussing things and (hopefully) answering some questions here, too.


-- 
Steve Sobol - Programming/WebDev/IT Support
sjsobol@JustThe.net

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#2767

On 4/2/2011 10:52 AM, Steve Sobol wrote:
> In article<slrnipdolk.1k5.fredrik@scout.jonson.org>, Fredrik Jonson
> says...
>>
>> sl@exabyte wrote:
>>
>>>   For Android development questions, OK to ask here?
>>
>> You're more likely to get appropriate help if you ask on the official mailing
>> list<http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers>. If you prefer to use
>> a newsgroup interface that mailing list is also available as a newsgroup on at
>> gmane:<news://news.gmane.org/gmane.comp.handhelds.android.devel>.
>
> I second that, although I do some Android development and would not mind
> discussing things and (hopefully) answering some questions here, too.
>
>

I've found the Android discussions here interesting. My doctoral
dissertation research was in ubiquitous computing, and I continue to pay
attention to the subject. One of the limitations has been the way phone
companies lock things up, making it difficult to add research
applications. Android may make things a bit more open, which would be good.

Patricia

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#2768

Patricia Shanahan wrote:
> Steve Sobol wrote:

>> Fredrik Jonson says...

>>> sl@exabyte wrote:
>>>> For Android development questions, OK to ask here?

>>> You're more likely to get appropriate help if you ask on the official mailing
>>> list<http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers>. If you prefer to use
>>> a newsgroup interface that mailing list is also available as a newsgroup on at
>>> gmane:<news://news.gmane.org/gmane.comp.handhelds.android.devel>.

>> I second that, although I do some Android development and would not mind
>> discussing things and (hopefully) answering some questions here, too.

> I've found the Android discussions here interesting. My doctoral
> dissertation research was in ubiquitous computing, and I continue to pay
> attention to the subject. One of the limitations has been the way phone
> companies lock things up, making it difficult to add research
> applications. Android may make things a bit more open, which would be good.

 From a pragmatic standpoint, Android is a lucrative gold-rush land for Java 
developers, but one must strive mightily to succeed over the herd of other 
prospectors staking Android claims in dreams of easy riches.  The putative 
crowd of cljp denizens comprises an already committed, skilled subgroup of 
Java programmers who would thus naturally have both an interest and an edge in 
that competition.

-- 
Lew
Honi soit qui mal y pense.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/cf/Friz.jpg

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#2770

On 02/04/2011 19:25, Lew wrote:
> Patricia Shanahan wrote:
>> Steve Sobol wrote:
>
>>> Fredrik Jonson says...
>
>>>> sl@exabyte wrote:
>>>>> For Android development questions, OK to ask here?
>
>>>> You're more likely to get appropriate help if you ask on the
>>>> official mailing
>>>> list<http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers>. If you
>>>> prefer to use
>>>> a newsgroup interface that mailing list is also available as a
>>>> newsgroup on at
>>>> gmane:<news://news.gmane.org/gmane.comp.handhelds.android.devel>.
>
>>> I second that, although I do some Android development and would not mind
>>> discussing things and (hopefully) answering some questions here, too.
>
>> I've found the Android discussions here interesting. My doctoral
>> dissertation research was in ubiquitous computing, and I continue to pay
>> attention to the subject. One of the limitations has been the way phone
>> companies lock things up, making it difficult to add research
>> applications. Android may make things a bit more open, which would be
>> good.
>
>  From a pragmatic standpoint, Android is a lucrative gold-rush land for
> Java developers, but one must strive mightily to succeed over the herd
> of other prospectors staking Android claims in dreams of easy riches.
> The putative crowd of cljp denizens comprises an already committed,
> skilled subgroup of Java programmers who would thus naturally have both
> an interest and an edge in that competition.
>
If you're talking mass market apps, that's true.
However, there's plenty of niches for custom apps for control 
applications for non mass market hardware eg instrumentation etc.

-- 
Dirk

http://www.neopax.com/technomage/ - My new book - Magick and Technology

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#2779

On Sat, 2 Apr 2011, Lew wrote:

> From a pragmatic standpoint, Android is a lucrative gold-rush land for 
> Java developers,

It is? Is anyone making serious P from Android apps? I know a few people 
involved in iPhone apps; none of them have made more than beer money 
(well, champagne money, perhaps) from apps they've written themselves, and 
one who's contracting to write apps for companies is not exactly coining 
it in. Those in my professional circle sweating away in the e-commerce 
contracting mines are certainly commanding higher day rates. I can't 
imagine Android apps are much different.

> but one must strive mightily to succeed over the herd of other 
> prospectors staking Android claims in dreams of easy riches.

Ah - is your metaphor that many will pan the rivers in vain, but the lucky 
few will hit paydirt and become so rich they're paying for the finest 
floozies in Sacramento with bags of gold dust? Again, has anyone actually 
achieved this? I suppose Roxio probably have; i don't know how much of 
that money is going to developers rather than some kind of suited people. 
Apparently a chap called Yong Zhang has made a colossal amount of money 
from a range of emulators for old video game consoles. Anyone else?

tom

-- 
Give the future a chance!

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#2780

On 04/02/2011 07:06 PM, Tom Anderson wrote:
> On Sat, 2 Apr 2011, Lew wrote:
>
>> From a pragmatic standpoint, Android is a lucrative gold-rush land for Java
>> developers,
>
> It is? Is anyone making serious P from Android apps? I know a few people
> involved in iPhone apps; none of them have made more than beer money (well,
> champagne money, perhaps) from apps they've written themselves, and one who's
> contracting to write apps for companies is not exactly coining it in. Those in
> my professional circle sweating away in the e-commerce contracting mines are
> certainly commanding higher day rates. I can't imagine Android apps are much
> different.
>
>> but one must strive mightily to succeed over the herd of other prospectors
>> staking Android claims in dreams of easy riches.
>
> Ah - is your metaphor that many will pan the rivers in vain, but the lucky few

There will be rumors of the lucky few, but yes.

> will hit paydirt and become so rich they're paying for the finest floozies in
> Sacramento with bags of gold dust? Again, has anyone actually achieved this? I

The opportunities for enrichment are similar to those in and around Sutter's 
Mill, California, in 1849.

> suppose Roxio probably have; i don't know how much of that money is going to
> developers rather than some kind of suited people. Apparently a chap called
> Yong Zhang has made a colossal amount of money from a range of emulators for
> old video game consoles. Anyone else?

If you want to work for a company that develops for Android, it would be nice 
to have the skills.

-- 
Lew
Honi soit qui mal y pense.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/cf/Friz.jpg

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#2790

Tom Anderson <twic@urchin.earth.li> writes:

> Ah - is your metaphor that many will pan the rivers in vain, but the
> lucky few will hit paydirt and become so rich they're paying for the
> finest floozies in Sacramento with bags of gold dust?

That seems to have been the case with every past "boom," from gold to
internet to real estate. I have no reason to believe this one will prove
to be much different.

sherm--

-- 
Sherm Pendley
                                   <http://camelbones.sourceforge.net>
Cocoa Developer

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#2776

In message <CLednRzIxuOv-grQnZ2dnUVZ_iwAAAAA@earthlink.com>, Patricia 
Shanahan wrote:

> My doctoral dissertation research was in ubiquitous computing ...

How long ago was that, if you don’t mind my asking? :)

(I graduated with an MSc in computer science in 1985, if that helps to even 
the score.)

I remember the last interesting things I heard coming out of Xerox PARC was 
their idea of “boards”, “pads” and “tabs”, which were three different sizes 
of wirelessly-networked keyboardless computers. All user data lived in the 
cloud, so you could go into any office, pick up any one of these devices, 
and have all your own data immediately to hand.

> One of the limitations has been the way phone companies lock things up,
> making it difficult to add research applications. Android may make things
> a bit more open, which would be good.

Amen to that. Though some see that is simply giving more power to the 
handset makers and the network operators...

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#2778

On 4/2/2011 3:48 PM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
> In message<CLednRzIxuOv-grQnZ2dnUVZ_iwAAAAA@earthlink.com>, Patricia
> Shanahan wrote:
>
>> My doctoral dissertation research was in ubiquitous computing ...
>
> How long ago was that, if you don’t mind my asking? :)

I completed my Ph.D. in December 2009, but got an MSc in computer
science in 1975, so my CS degrees bracket yours.

> (I graduated with an MSc in computer science in 1985, if that helps to even
> the score.)
>
> I remember the last interesting things I heard coming out of Xerox PARC was
> their idea of “boards”, “pads” and “tabs”, which were three different sizes
> of wirelessly-networked keyboardless computers. All user data lived in the
> cloud, so you could go into any office, pick up any one of these devices,
> and have all your own data immediately to hand.

I think the trend is in that direction.

Patricia

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#2789

In message <0audnf54k6BKNwrQnZ2dnUVZ_qednZ2d@earthlink.com>, Patricia 
Shanahan wrote:

> On 4/2/2011 3:48 PM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>
>> I remember the last interesting things I heard coming out of Xerox PARC
>> was their idea of “boards”, “pads” and “tabs”, which were three different
>> sizes of wirelessly-networked keyboardless computers. All user data lived
>> in the cloud, so you could go into any office, pick up any one of these
>> devices, and have all your own data immediately to hand.
> 
> I think the trend is in that direction.

Can be a two-edged sword. There have been some high-profile failures of 
cloud services.

I don’t think the PARC researchers envisioned that these mobile devices 
would have gigabytes of storage on them—enough to do a lot without reference 
to any cloud.

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#2807

On 03/04/2011 01:56, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
> In message<0audnf54k6BKNwrQnZ2dnUVZ_qednZ2d@earthlink.com>, Patricia
> Shanahan wrote:
>
>> On 4/2/2011 3:48 PM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>>
>>> I remember the last interesting things I heard coming out of Xerox PARC
>>> was their idea of “boards”, “pads” and “tabs”, which were three different
>>> sizes of wirelessly-networked keyboardless computers. All user data lived
>>> in the cloud, so you could go into any office, pick up any one of these
>>> devices, and have all your own data immediately to hand.
>>
>> I think the trend is in that direction.
>
> Can be a two-edged sword. There have been some high-profile failures of
> cloud services.
>
> I don’t think the PARC researchers envisioned that these mobile devices
> would have gigabytes of storage on them—enough to do a lot without reference
> to any cloud.

When I first started work 2GB of storage took up a whole building of one 
of the biggest computer time sharing companies in the UK - Comshare:
http://www.answers.com/topic/comshare-inc

They have done well to survive

-- 
Dirk

http://www.neopax.com/technomage/ - My new book - Magick and Technology

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#2730

In message <in6n58$7oj$1@news.albasani.net>, sl@exabyte wrote:

> For Android development questions, OK to ask here ?

Only if you have a thick skin.

Android is a bit of a shock to the system to many of the corporate code-
cutter drones who normally hang out here.

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#2740

On 11-04-02 05:57 AM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
> In message <in6n58$7oj$1@news.albasani.net>, sl@exabyte wrote:
> 
>> For Android development questions, OK to ask here ?
> 
> Only if you have a thick skin.
> 
> Android is a bit of a shock to the system to many of the corporate code-
> cutter drones who normally hang out here.

Android isn't - many of the hide-bound, ossified clients or companies we
work for have aggressive mobile strategies, including Android. _You_ are
a bit of a shock to the system.

AHS
-- 
That's not the recollection that I recall...All this information is
certainly in the hands of the auditor and we certainly await his report
to indicate what he deems has occurred.
-- Halifax, Nova Scotia mayor Peter Kelly, who is currently deeply in
the shit

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#2775

In message <HcFlp.26272$tL6.8699@newsfe03.iad>, Arved Sandstrom wrote:

> On 11-04-02 05:57 AM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>
>> Android is a bit of a shock to the system to many of the corporate code-
>> cutter drones who normally hang out here.
> 
> Android isn't - many of the hide-bound, ossified clients or companies we
> work for have aggressive mobile strategies, including Android.

As Roedy Green has pointed out elsewhere, this is a world with a much 
shorter attention span. Frankly, I don’t think most big corporates have the 
agility to cope.

> _You_ are a bit of a shock to the system.

:)

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#2804

On 11-04-02 07:44 PM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
> In message <HcFlp.26272$tL6.8699@newsfe03.iad>, Arved Sandstrom wrote:
> 
>> On 11-04-02 05:57 AM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>>
>>> Android is a bit of a shock to the system to many of the corporate code-
>>> cutter drones who normally hang out here.
>>
>> Android isn't - many of the hide-bound, ossified clients or companies we
>> work for have aggressive mobile strategies, including Android.
> 
> As Roedy Green has pointed out elsewhere, this is a world with a much 
> shorter attention span. Frankly, I don’t think most big corporates have the 
> agility to cope.
[ SNIP ]

True agility (not "agile" in the methodology sense) gives you just that
- shorter time-to-market with an equally capable, equal-quality product.
And there's no question that smaller teams with fewer formal
stakeholders, and less rigid process, and fewer managers, can often beat
the big boys. In other words, for the same end-result they are faster.

The downside to being "agile" is that often conservatism and process is
a good thing. Above I qualified carefully: equally capable, and
equal-quality. What actually happens in real life is that the small
teams are often faster...and that's all they are. Nice feature-set, but
badly-tested bug-ridden software, with little or no thought given to how
it fits into a larger ecosystem (because this small, "agile" team is
isolated).

What frequently happens is that the megacorps - with their professional
developers - simply snap up the ideas, once they start to prove out in
the market, maybe keeping one or two of the salvageable original "agile"
coders. The professional developers - the "drones" - are the ones that
actually fix the original code and rewrite it and make it work.
Sometimes (read often) they turf the original codebase because it's so
awful, and only keep the good ideas.

It only seems like there is a magical, quick road to product. There
really isn't.

AHS
-- 
That's not the recollection that I recall...All this information is
certainly in the hands of the auditor and we certainly await his report
to indicate what he deems has occurred.
-- Halifax, Nova Scotia mayor Peter Kelly, who is currently deeply in
the shit

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#3488

When I got a PPC machine and a Linux machine, I thought I would be able to
gain portability with Java apps.. but that was a mirage.. the only machine I
own where Java works is XP pro. I don't get why Android can't run Java well.
I tis pretty silly from my view.


				    - = -
 Vasos Panagiotopoulos, Columbia'81+, Reagan, Mozart, Pindus, BioStrategist
		    http://www.panix.com/~vjp2/vasos.htm
  ---{Nothing herein constitutes advice.  Everything fully disclaimed.}---
   [Homeland Security means private firearms not lazy obstructive guards]
 [Urb sprawl confounds terror] [Phooey on GUI: Windows for subprime Bimbos]

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#3518

vjp2.at@at.BioStrategist.dot.dot.com wrote:
> When I got a PPC machine and a Linux machine, I thought I would be able to
> gain portability with Java apps.. but that was a mirage.. the only machine I
> own where Java works is XP pro. I don't get why Android can't run Java well.
> I tis pretty silly from my view.

Are you saying that Java doesn't work on Linux, IBM mainframes, Solaris, 
Windows Vista, Windows 7, Windows Server, BSD, Mac or Android, or that you 
don't own those machines?  Because it does work on all those platforms.

The version of Java on Android is not the desktop version.  So?  How does Java 
not work on Android?

You don't "gain portability" by writing in Java for all definitions of 
"portability".  If you had the wrong idea of what portability is, that ain't 
Java's fault, sport.  That's your fault.

What kind of portability did you want that you did not get?  Don't Java 5 
desktop programs work on all Java 5 and 6 desktop platforms?  What are you 
doing wrong that you are whining is Java's fault?


-- 
Lew
Honi soit qui mal y pense.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/cf/Friz.jpg

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#3540

On Wed, 4 May 2011 04:39:29 +0000 (UTC),
vjp2.at@at.BioStrategist.dot.dot.com wrote, quoted or indirectly
quoted someone who said :

> I don't get why Android can't run Java well.
>I tis pretty silly from my view.

Android is a Java variant.  I don't think it was ever intended to run
off-the-shelf Java Apps.  From the quick exploration I did, it does
not even support AWT, SWT or Swing. 

It would probably be safest to think of it as in the Java family, and
marvel every time you find they work identically.
-- 
Roedy Green Canadian Mind Products
http://mindprod.com
Politicians complain that Kindles and iBooks are killing jobs by 
destroying the paper book industry.  I see it that they have create a way 
to produce books for less than a third the cost without destroying forests 
and emitting greenhouse gases in the process.  They have created wealth.  
They are encouraging literacy and cutting the costs of education.  

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