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Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives

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On 06/22/2012 01:34 PM, markspace wrote:
> On 6/22/2012 12:45 PM, Lew wrote:
>> markspace wrote:
>>> rossum wrote:
>>>> By all means eleminate boxing if you boxing program runs too
>>>> slowly, but until you have written it, tested it and profiled it
>>>>  to show that boxing is the problem then you have no reason to
>>>> avoid boxing.
>>>
>>> Just to interject gently here:  It seems to me that the OP has
>>> stated that he did experiment with Objects, and confirmed that the
>>>  overhead was too high for his purposes.
>>
>> Just to reply bluntly here, but what the OP stated was, "since I do
>> not want to incur the boxing overhead of Objects", not that he had
>> measured that overhead or even knew that it was real.
>>
>> He's confirmed nothing insofar as he's told us.
>>
>
>
> About 1/3 of the way through his post he says:
>
> "Here if there are many parts to arg, I may fun.apply(tmp, arg.get(...))
> many many times. In my benchmarks, this seems to be much slower than what I
> could get without this abstraction.  I am trying to reduce this
> overhead as much as possible."

I read "this abstraction" as applying to his funky 'fun.apply()' idiom, not to 
autoboxing. Are you sure that referred to autoboxing?

Even if it did, and the grammar of his post suggests otherwise, there aren't 
any numbers there at all, and no clue if idiomatic Java would permit the 
optimizer to eliminate such overhead if it does exist.

Nothing is confirmed there, no matter how you slice it.

> That and everything below it seems to imply actual prototyping, especially
> later on where me mentions comparing benchmarks between Java and C.

"Seems" is weasel wording for "you interpreted it that way". There's no 
seeming without an observer. I didn't interpret it to have anything to do with 
autoboxing. You did. OP - would you please tell us if you have measured the 
effect of autoboxing?

I'm not going to argue with someone who has an equal chance with me of 
misunderstanding your vague and unclear, unsubstantiated and ununderstandable 
claims.

> OTOH his code is kind of sloppy.  For example, his implementation of his
> recursive sum overflows Java's int and gives the wrong answer.  This might be
> a reason why his Java is fast, if other languages are dealing with infinite
> precision and promoting ints to a higher precision format.

SHOW US THE CODE, OP!

-- 
Lew
Honi soit qui mal y pense.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/cf/Friz.jpg

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Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives "Aaron W. Hsu" <arcfide@sacrideo.us> - 2012-06-21 22:08 -0500
  Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives Gina Engli <gengli239777@gmail.com> - 2012-06-21 23:17 -0400
    Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives "Aaron W. Hsu" <arcfide@sacrideo.us> - 2012-06-22 15:13 -0500
  Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives markspace <-@.> - 2012-06-21 21:32 -0700
    Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives Gina Engli <gengli239777@gmail.com> - 2012-06-22 02:31 -0400
      Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives Fred Greer <fggreer@nospam.invalid> - 2012-06-22 06:36 +0000
        Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives Gina Engli <gengli239777@gmail.com> - 2012-06-22 02:43 -0400
          Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2012-06-22 12:45 -0700
            Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives Sixteen of Seventeen <sseventeen@gmail.com> - 2012-06-22 18:24 -0400
              Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2012-06-22 19:59 -0700
                Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives Sixteen of Seventeen <sseventeen@gmail.com> - 2012-06-22 23:16 -0400
                Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2012-06-22 22:13 -0700
                Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives Borg Queen <queen@unimatrix.zero> - 2012-06-23 01:18 -0400
                Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2012-06-23 07:59 -0700
                Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives Borg Queen <queen@unimatrix.zero> - 2012-06-23 12:12 -0400
    Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives "Aaron W. Hsu" <arcfide@sacrideo.us> - 2012-06-22 15:28 -0500
      Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives Gina Engli <gengli239777@gmail.com> - 2012-06-22 18:25 -0400
  Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2012-06-22 00:33 -0700
    Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives "Aaron W. Hsu" <arcfide@sacrideo.us> - 2012-06-22 15:31 -0500
  Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives rossum <rossum48@coldmail.com> - 2012-06-22 13:00 +0100
    Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives markspace <-@.> - 2012-06-22 07:45 -0700
      Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2012-06-22 12:45 -0700
        Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives markspace <-@.> - 2012-06-22 13:34 -0700
          Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2012-06-22 20:04 -0700
    Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives "Aaron W. Hsu" <arcfide@sacrideo.us> - 2012-06-22 15:22 -0500
      Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2012-06-22 14:27 -0700
  Re: Dealing with higher order operations coupled with primitives "Aaron W. Hsu" <arcfide@sacrideo.us> - 2012-06-22 15:14 -0500

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