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Groups > comp.lang.java.programmer > #2902

Re: java.lang vs java.util

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Patricia Shanahan wrote:
> You will never get fluent in Java if you think Python code is a
> reasonable specification for your Java code.
>
> This is a problem I've seen many times in people moving from language to
> language. Every language has its own idioms, its own ways of expressing
> things. Translation from code in language X to code in language Y leads
> to very stilted, awkward code in Y. In effect, the code is written in a
> dialect of Y that contains only those features of Y that correspond
> closely to features of X. Such a dialect can be very frustrating.
>
> It is not unique to Python and Java. I've seen it, for example, in

It's not even unique to computer languages.

> people moving from assembly language to C. I expect it would happen to
> someone who had got too locked in on Java who tried to write Python code
> from Java code, rather than by finding out what the code is intended
> to achieve.
>
> I've sometimes had to try to reconstruct a specification from code, but
> it is a messy process, liable to include things that are not required
> and miss other requirements. Why do that, when there is someone who
> presumably knows exactly what it is meant to do?
>
> Having a design document other than the code itself does not mean
> "filled out in tedious detail and no doubt signed off in triplicate". It
> means having one at about the level of detail you would have had in your
> own mind before writing the Python code.
>
> I do not think that you will be happy with Java if your main criterion
> for good code is short code. Java's main advantages to my mind are
> readability, portability, and a tendency to catch typos at compile time.
> It is not a compact language.

There is a perhaps apocryphal tale of an early natural-language translation 
program taking "out of sight, out of mind" from English to Russian, then back 
to English as "invisible and crazy".

-- 
Lew
Honi soit qui mal y pense.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/cf/Friz.jpg

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java.lang vs java.util Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-04-02 17:11 +1300
  Re: java.lang vs java.util Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-04-01 21:23 -0700
    Re: java.lang vs java.util Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-04-02 01:52 -0400
      Re: java.lang vs java.util Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-04-02 09:50 -0300
        Re: java.lang vs java.util David Lamb <dalamb@cs.queensu.ca> - 2011-04-02 09:12 -0400
          Re: java.lang vs java.util Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-04-03 12:37 +1200
            Re: java.lang vs java.util David Lamb <dalamb@cs.queensu.ca> - 2011-04-03 08:05 -0400
          Re: java.lang vs java.util Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-04-03 09:33 -0300
        Re: java.lang vs java.util "Mike Schilling" <mscottschilling@hotmail.com> - 2011-04-02 07:57 -0700
          Re: java.lang vs java.util Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-04-03 12:38 +1200
  Re: java.lang vs java.util Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2011-04-01 23:43 -0700
    Re: java.lang vs java.util Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-04-02 19:52 +1300
      Re: java.lang vs java.util David Lamb <dalamb@cs.queensu.ca> - 2011-04-03 08:05 -0400
        Re: java.lang vs java.util Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-04-04 10:11 +1200
          Re: java.lang vs java.util Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-04-03 19:25 -0300
            Re: java.lang vs java.util Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-04-04 12:49 +1200
              Re: java.lang vs java.util Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-04-03 22:50 -0300
                Re: java.lang vs java.util Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-04-04 16:05 +1200
                Re: java.lang vs java.util Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-04-04 07:06 -0300
                Re: java.lang vs java.util Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-04-04 23:10 +1200
                Re: java.lang vs java.util Leif Roar Moldskred <leifm@dimnakorr.com> - 2011-04-04 06:20 -0500
                Re: java.lang vs java.util rossum <rossum48@coldmail.com> - 2011-04-04 15:22 +0100
                Re: java.lang vs java.util Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-04-04 05:58 -0700
                Re: java.lang vs java.util Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-04-06 15:34 -0400
                Re: java.lang vs java.util rossum <rossum48@coldmail.com> - 2011-04-07 10:22 +0100
                Re: java.lang vs java.util David Lamb <dalamb@cs.queensu.ca> - 2011-04-04 18:41 -0400
                Re: java.lang vs java.util Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-04-04 07:04 -0300
                Re: java.lang vs java.util Joshua Cranmer <Pidgeot18@verizon.invalid> - 2011-04-04 07:58 -0400
                Re: java.lang vs java.util David Lamb <dalamb@cs.queensu.ca> - 2011-04-04 18:46 -0400
  Re: java.lang vs java.util Joshua Cranmer <Pidgeot18@verizon.invalid> - 2011-04-02 16:22 -0400

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