Groups > comp.lang.java.programmer > #4934

Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ...

From	Paul Cager <paul.cager@googlemail.com>
Newsgroups	comp.lang.java.programmer
Subject	Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ...
Date	2011-06-03 04:21 -0700
Organization	http://groups.google.com
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On Jun 3, 10:56 am, Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3min...@eastlink.ca>
wrote:
> OK, fair enough. I understand the distinction, it's just that it's
> irritating me enormously to see anyone even bothering to discuss the
> license part.

I can understand your irritation, and I didn't intend to add to it. I
just like the idea of Free Software and I sometimes get carried away.

I agree that adding that notice to a Hello World program seems
ridiculous and I probably wouldn't have bothered with it myself. But
that type of notice (or its absence) is very important in Free
Software; misunderstandings about it in a "Hello World" program can
lead to real problems when developing "real" software.

Think of my position like this. Suppose someone posts a Hello World
program that does:

    System.out.println(new String("Hello World"));

That spurious "new String()" might be considered totally harmless in a
Hello World program, but you'd still probably want to call attention
to it, so it doesn't lead to bad habits in real programs.

> There is no license if there is no copyright, and for this
> example (although there are many others out there) NO copyright exists.

Unfortunately unless something is in the public domain (which has its
own set of problems) copyright exists even if the author doesn't want
it ("copyright arises upon fixation"). That's why the safest route is
usually to grant a license.

> Oracle *copied* that code - they have no copyright. They can't license
> that software because they don't have copyright. It's not up to them to
> "explicitly give us permission to use their work", because in this case
> it's not their bloody work.

Certainly no argument there - if they copied it then it's not theirs
to license.

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Thread

And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-06-02 15:12 +1200
  Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Paul Cager <paul.cager@googlemail.com> - 2011-06-02 02:11 -0700
    Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-06-02 22:42 +1200
      Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Paul Cager <paul.cager@googlemail.com> - 2011-06-02 04:34 -0700
        Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-06-03 00:08 +1200
          Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Paul Cager <paul.cager@googlemail.com> - 2011-06-02 06:20 -0700
            Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-06-03 15:10 +1200
              Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2011-06-02 21:47 -0700
                Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-06-03 17:05 +1200
              Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Joshua Cranmer <Pidgeot18@verizon.invalid> - 2011-06-03 02:50 -0400
                Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-06-03 19:49 +1200
                Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Joshua Cranmer <Pidgeot18@verizon.invalid> - 2011-06-03 11:16 -0400
                Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-06-04 12:28 +1200
                Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Joshua Cranmer <Pidgeot18@verizon.invalid> - 2011-06-04 02:54 -0400
                Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-06-05 11:05 +1200
        Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-06-02 17:22 -0300
          Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2011-06-02 14:21 -0700
            Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-06-02 19:19 -0300
              Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2011-06-02 15:42 -0700
                Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-06-02 20:14 -0300
                Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-06-03 17:07 +1200
                Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2011-06-03 01:01 -0700
              Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2011-06-02 15:56 -0700
                Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Joshua Cranmer <Pidgeot18@verizon.invalid> - 2011-06-02 22:21 -0400
                Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2011-06-02 21:36 -0700
                Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-06-03 19:48 +1200
              Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered Hello World Program ... rossum <rossum48@coldmail.com> - 2011-06-03 00:33 +0100
            Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-06-03 17:06 +1200
          Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Paul Cager <paul.cager@googlemail.com> - 2011-06-02 17:50 -0700
            Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-06-03 15:10 +1200
              Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Daniele Futtorovic <da.futt.news@laposte-dot-net.invalid> - 2011-06-03 18:15 +0200
            Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-06-03 06:56 -0300
              Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Paul Cager <paul.cager@googlemail.com> - 2011-06-03 04:21 -0700
                Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-06-04 12:26 +1200
    Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered “Hello World” Program ... BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2011-06-02 03:53 -0700
  Re: And The Award For Most Legally-Encumbered ?Hello World? Program ... Steve Sobol <sjsobol@JustThe.net> - 2011-06-02 11:00 -0700

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