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Groups > comp.lang.forth > #13168
| From | mhx@iae.nl (Marcel Hendrix) |
|---|---|
| Subject | Re: Alternatives to S'' and TO |
| Newsgroups | comp.lang.forth |
| Message-ID | <85661513978435@frunobulax.edu> (permalink) |
| Date | 2012-06-22 20:37 +0200 |
| References | <2012Jun22.171947@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at> |
| Organization | Wanadoo |
anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) writes Re: Alternatives to S" and TO (was: ?EXEC) > Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> writes: >>I've been thinking the opposite. Maybe the problem with some of the >>modern techniques is that they're exposed to the programmer; they're >>too shallow. Perhaps the right solution is to let the Forth compiler >>generate tokens (just like a very trad Forth) and then let the >>optimizing compiler run over them. This is the approach taken by iForth. Almost every word has a tokenized form, and another form intended for ' ['] or direct execution. > That's an implementation issue, but it's the right approach. >> Let IMMEDIATE do what it used to >>do. Get rid of other ways of creating words that execute at compile >>time. I don't know the repercussions of all that. My approach would be to make the language as simple as possible, without worrying about speed or size. Alternatives can go. Hooks can go too. [..] > What is popular is the solution taken for numbers: The text > interpreter deals with them as appropriate and everyone is happy. We > don't use NUM 123 and [NUM] 123 for numbers, we let the text > interpreter deal with them. An interesting idea. Then we could maybe also have dotted notation and such. [..] > There are a few parsing words where the replacement requires its own > treatment in the text interpreter, in particular TO. Instead of > TO v > we could write > ->v Great. > and the text interpreter would do the appropriate thing with V. [..] > Many will cry out against this complication of the text interpreter. > Some may also find the idea bad because up to now the text interpreter > is a black box so any additions there are only done by the compiler > vendor. However: > 1) I think that this feature adds relatively little complexity to the > text interpreter, and it gets rid of a huge amount of baggage > elsewhere (STATE-smart words and the restrictions that their defenders > want to put upon us, or the complexities of the alternatives and their > ramifications). The iForth text interpreter is already hugely complicated by workarounds that are of no real benefit to the user. > 2) One could make it possible for "mere" users to add further > prefixes/denotations (or, as Gforth calls them, recognizers) to the > text interpreter, just like it is possible to add further words now. There is that old idea to factor the text interpreter, that would fit here. > Of course some people will fear giving this much power to the users, > and it's certainly a feature that should be used sparingly, but that's > a management issue. Who are these people? [..] -marcel
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?EXEC Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-06-15 20:40 +0000
Re: ?EXEC "Ed" <invalid@nospam.com> - 2012-06-16 11:14 +1000
Re: ?EXEC BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-06-16 07:10 -0700
Re: ?EXEC Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-06-17 03:01 +0000
Re: ?EXEC "Ed" <invalid@nospam.com> - 2012-06-17 13:36 +1000
Re: ?EXEC anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-17 12:27 +0000
Re: ?EXEC Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-06-17 20:45 +0000
Re: ?EXEC anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-18 13:31 +0000
Re: ?EXEC Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-06-18 18:29 +0000
Re: ?EXEC "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-06-18 08:01 -1000
Re: ?EXEC anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-19 14:09 +0000
Re: ?EXEC Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-06-19 10:51 -0500
Re: ?EXEC anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-19 16:04 +0000
Re: ?EXEC Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-06-19 12:45 -0500
Re: ?EXEC anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-20 10:50 +0000
Re: ?EXEC Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-06-20 07:10 -0500
Re: ?EXEC anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-20 12:47 +0000
Re: ?EXEC Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-06-19 22:52 +0000
Re: ?EXEC anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-20 10:59 +0000
Defining Compilation Behaviour - was Re: ?EXEC JennyB <jennybrien@googlemail.com> - 2012-06-21 04:58 -0700
Re: Defining Compilation Behaviour - was Re: ?EXEC anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-21 15:44 +0000
Re: ?EXEC Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2012-06-19 02:11 +0200
Re: ?EXEC "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-06-18 14:45 -1000
Re: ?EXEC Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-06-19 10:48 +0000
Re: ?EXEC anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-19 15:53 +0000
Re: ?EXEC Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-06-19 23:00 +0000
Re: ?EXEC anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-20 11:09 +0000
Re: ?EXEC BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-06-20 07:39 -0700
Re: ?EXEC anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-20 15:32 +0000
Re: ?EXEC BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-06-21 11:24 -0700
Re: ?EXEC Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-06-20 22:43 +0000
Re: ?EXEC Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2012-06-21 21:39 +0200
Re: ?EXEC Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-06-22 02:33 -0500
Re: ?EXEC anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-22 11:12 +0000
Re: ?EXEC Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2012-06-22 21:34 +0200
Re: ?EXEC anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-24 14:58 +0000
Re: ?EXEC Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2012-06-24 23:53 +0200
Re: ?EXEC anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-19 15:43 +0000
Re: ?EXEC anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-19 14:52 +0000
Re: ?EXEC Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2012-06-21 22:15 +0200
Re: ?EXEC stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2012-06-22 10:32 +0000
Re: ?EXEC Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-06-22 05:49 -0500
Alternatives to S" and TO (was: ?EXEC) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-22 15:19 +0000
Re: Alternatives to S'' and TO mhx@iae.nl (Marcel Hendrix) - 2012-06-22 20:37 +0200
Re: Alternatives to S'' and TO anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-23 14:46 +0000
Re: Alternatives to S" and TO (was: ?EXEC) BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-06-22 12:32 -0700
Re: Alternatives to S" and TO Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-06-23 03:07 -0500
Re: Alternatives to S" and TO anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-23 13:32 +0000
Re: Alternatives to S" and TO Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-06-24 08:50 -0500
Re: Alternatives to S" and TO anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-24 15:39 +0000
Re: Alternatives to S" and TO Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-06-25 04:49 -0500
Re: Alternatives to S" and TO BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-06-25 07:17 -0700
Re: Alternatives to S" and TO Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-06-25 10:13 -0500
Re: Alternatives to S" and TO (was: ?EXEC) Alex McDonald <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2012-06-23 16:01 -0700
Re: Alternatives to S" and TO (was: ?EXEC) Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2012-06-24 01:59 +0200
Re: Alternatives to S" and TO (was: ?EXEC) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-24 13:21 +0000
Re: Alternatives to S" and TO (was: ?EXEC) Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-06-24 16:50 +0000
Re: Alternatives to S" and TO (was: ?EXEC) Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2012-06-27 23:30 +0200
Re: Alternatives to S" and TO (was: ?EXEC) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-24 13:15 +0000
Re: Alternatives to S" and TO (was: ?EXEC) Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-06-24 16:47 +0000
Re: ?EXEC Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-06-22 20:34 +0000
Re: ?EXEC Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2012-06-22 21:46 +0200
Re: ?EXEC "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-06-22 10:16 -1000
Re: ?EXEC Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2012-06-22 22:43 +0200
Re: ?EXEC "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-06-22 11:18 -1000
Re: ?EXEC anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-23 13:50 +0000
Re: ?EXEC BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-06-17 10:41 -0700
Re: ?EXEC anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-17 12:52 +0000
Re: ?EXEC "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-06-17 08:03 -1000
Re: ?EXEC "Ed" <invalid@nospam.com> - 2012-06-18 15:06 +1000
Re: ?EXEC "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-06-17 20:31 -1000
Re: ?EXEC "Ed" <invalid@nospam.com> - 2012-06-21 13:07 +1000
Re: ?EXEC Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-06-21 14:00 +0000
Re: ?EXEC BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-06-21 07:51 -0700
Re: ?EXEC anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-21 15:39 +0000
Re: ?EXEC Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-06-21 20:28 +0000
Re: ?EXEC "Ed" <invalid@nospam.com> - 2012-06-28 14:22 +1000
Re: ?EXEC Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-06-28 04:00 -0500
Re: ?EXEC anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-21 16:09 +0000
Re: ?EXEC Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-06-21 11:51 -0500
Re: ?EXEC BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-06-21 11:21 -0700
Re: ?EXEC Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-06-22 01:42 -0500
Re: ?EXEC "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-06-21 21:47 -1000
Re: ?EXEC anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-06-22 15:10 +0000
Re: ?EXEC Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-06-22 20:39 +0000
Re: ?EXEC BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-06-22 12:47 -0700
Re: ?EXEC BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-06-22 12:53 -0700
Re: ?EXEC stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2012-06-21 08:39 +0000
Re: ?EXEC "Ed" <invalid@nospam.com> - 2012-06-23 15:36 +1000
Re: ?EXEC stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2012-06-23 10:58 +0000
Re: ?EXEC "Ed" <invalid@nospam.com> - 2012-06-25 14:26 +1000
Re: ?EXEC stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2012-06-25 08:37 +0000
Re: ?EXEC Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-06-18 10:34 +0000
Re: ?EXEC Coos Haak <chforth@hccnet.nl> - 2012-06-18 17:47 +0200
Re: ?EXEC Coos Haak <chforth@hccnet.nl> - 2012-06-18 17:49 +0200
Re: ?EXEC jacko <jackokring@gmail.com> - 2012-06-22 15:43 -0700
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