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Re: Forth on the Maximite

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On Wed, 20 Apr 2011 00:08:21 -0700 (PDT), rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
wrote:

>Now you are talking about something that is very real.  In trying to
>use Forth on various embedded processors a big problem is the lack of
>drivers.  The vendors often provide drivers for their peripherals, but
>in C, not Forth.  That is a steep uphill climb for anyone, even a
>company providing a Forth.

And the quality and structure of the C varies widely. Some silicon
vendors provide source code that is so over-factored (to fit some
framework) that the sample code obscures expanation of the operation
of the peripheral.

>Your paragraph above actually mentions external devices that need
>drivers, "keypads, displays, sensors".  These things won't be part of
>an MCU support package.

Not unless they are on a de-facto standard board.

>The hard ones are Ethernet, USB, etc. Even UARTS are pretty easy.

Ethernet is not so difficult. There's a very limited set of
functions that you need, and they can isolate the driver from
(say) the TCP/IP stack above it.

USB is much more difficult because there is much less commonality
between USB peripherals.

>What is your point?  You won't find this for any processor and Forth
>unless you look at a Forth vendor web site possibly.  How does the
>impact a decision on what processor to use?

In the context of Microchip and PIC32, MPE has had a MIPS compiler
since 1992/1993. Demand and sales have been minimal. Until PIC32
arrived there has been almost no discussion of Forth for MIPS.

Microchip give their software tools away. MPE cannot compete
with free (beer).

>I have no idea what you are talking about.  An orthogonal instruction
>set IS simple.

Microchip chose the cheapest core available, and so the compiler
developer has to deal with both branch and load delay slots. As is
common in the 32 bit world, you also have to deal with a number of
instruction sets. Doing a good modern Forth for PIC32 is going to be
a lot of work. Building a so-so threaded Forth is simple.

Stephen


-- 
Stephen Pelc, stephenXXX@mpeforth.com
MicroProcessor Engineering Ltd - More Real, Less Time
133 Hill Lane, Southampton SO15 5AF, England
tel: +44 (0)23 8063 1441, fax: +44 (0)23 8033 9691
web: http://www.mpeforth.com - free VFX Forth downloads

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Thread

Forth on the Maximite Andrew Reid <andrewreid69@gmail.com> - 2011-04-07 12:47 -0700
  Re: Forth on the Maximite Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2011-04-07 13:21 -0700
    Re: Forth on the Maximite Bluebee <visualforth@rocketmail.com> - 2011-04-10 20:32 -0700
      Re: Forth on the Maximite rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2011-04-11 08:13 -0700
        Re: Forth on the Maximite anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2011-04-11 15:37 +0000
          Re: Forth on the Maximite Bluebee <visualforth@rocketmail.com> - 2011-04-11 14:00 -0700
            Re: Forth on the Maximite rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2011-04-11 15:42 -0700
              Re: Forth on the Maximite Bluebee <visualforth@rocketmail.com> - 2011-04-11 21:35 -0700
            Re: Forth on the Maximite anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2011-04-12 11:20 +0000
              Re: Forth on the Maximite Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2011-04-12 18:07 +0200
        Re: Forth on the Maximite Bluebee <visualforth@rocketmail.com> - 2011-04-11 11:48 -0700
      Re: Forth on the Maximite Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2011-04-12 00:17 -0700
        Re: Forth on the Maximite Bluebee <visualforth@rocketmail.com> - 2011-04-12 10:19 -0700
          Re: Forth on the Maximite Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2011-04-16 12:50 -0700
            Re: Forth on the Maximite Bluebee <visualforth@rocketmail.com> - 2011-04-16 15:05 -0700
              Re: Forth on the Maximite rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2011-04-16 15:34 -0700
                Re: Forth on the Maximite Bluebee <visualforth@rocketmail.com> - 2011-04-16 16:37 -0700
                Re: Forth on the Maximite rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2011-04-16 16:55 -0700
                Re: Forth on the Maximite Bluebee <visualforth@rocketmail.com> - 2011-04-16 17:41 -0700
                Re: Forth on the Maximite rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2011-04-17 14:38 -0700
                Re: Forth on the Maximite Bluebee <visualforth@rocketmail.com> - 2011-04-17 21:08 -0700
                Re: Forth on the Maximite kenney@cix.compulink.co.uk - 2011-04-17 14:14 -0500
                Re: Forth on the Maximite Bluebee <visualforth@rocketmail.com> - 2011-04-17 14:08 -0700
                Re: Forth on the Maximite kenney@cix.compulink.co.uk - 2011-04-18 04:00 -0500
      Re: Forth on the Maximite Chris Baird <abuse@brushtail.apana.org.au> - 2011-04-16 20:12 +1000
        Re: Forth on the Maximite rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2011-04-16 15:36 -0700
          Re: Forth on the Maximite Bluebee <visualforth@rocketmail.com> - 2011-04-16 17:06 -0700
            Re: Forth on the Maximite rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2011-04-17 14:15 -0700
              Re: Forth on the Maximite Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2011-04-18 18:12 +0000
                Re: Forth on the Maximite Bluebee <visualforth@rocketmail.com> - 2011-04-18 11:15 -0700
                Re: Forth on the Maximite rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2011-04-18 21:44 -0700
                Re: Forth on the Maximite Bluebee <visualforth@rocketmail.com> - 2011-04-19 00:23 -0700
                Re: Forth on the Maximite rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2011-04-19 07:23 -0700
                Re: Forth on the Maximite Bluebee <visualforth@rocketmail.com> - 2011-04-19 10:24 -0700
                Re: Forth on the Maximite rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2011-04-19 12:22 -0700
                Re: Forth on the Maximite Bluebee <visualforth@rocketmail.com> - 2011-04-19 16:14 -0700
                Re: Forth on the Maximite rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2011-04-20 00:08 -0700
                Re: Forth on the Maximite stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2011-04-20 10:46 +0000
                Re: Forth on the Maximite Bluebee <visualforth@rocketmail.com> - 2011-04-20 14:55 -0700
                Re: Forth on the Maximite Bluebee <visualforth@rocketmail.com> - 2011-04-21 20:24 -0700
                Re: Forth on the Maximite BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2011-04-21 21:02 -0700
                Re: Forth on the Maximite Bluebee <visualforth@rocketmail.com> - 2011-04-21 23:09 -0700
                Re: Forth on the Maximite "David N. Williams" <williams@umich.edu> - 2011-04-22 08:42 -0400
                Re: Forth on the Maximite BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2011-04-22 07:06 -0700
                Re: Forth on the Maximite Bluebee <visualforth@rocketmail.com> - 2011-04-22 12:18 -0700
                Re: Forth on the Maximite Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2011-04-20 04:07 -0500
                Re: Forth on the Maximite Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2011-04-19 19:05 +0000
                Re: Forth on the Maximite Micke <oh2aun@gmail.com> - 2011-04-19 12:00 -0700
        Re: Forth on the Maximite Bluebee <visualforth@rocketmail.com> - 2011-04-16 15:52 -0700
          Re: Forth on the Maximite Chris Baird <abuse@brushtail.apana.org.au> - 2011-04-17 23:01 +1000
      Re: Forth on the Maximite Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2011-04-21 19:52 -0700
    Re: Forth on the Maximite Hugh Aguilar <hughaguilar96@yahoo.com> - 2011-04-10 21:58 -0700

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