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how many lines you coded?

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  how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-23 10:29 -0700
    Re: how many lines you coded? Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2023-07-23 18:44 +0100
      Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-23 11:12 -0700
    Re: how many lines you coded? Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-07-23 20:32 +0200
      Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-23 11:51 -0700
        Re: how many lines you coded? Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-07-23 21:18 +0200
          Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-24 05:10 -0700
            Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-24 05:19 -0700
              Re: how many lines you coded? Richard Harnden <richard.nospam@gmail.com> - 2023-07-24 13:45 +0100
                Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-24 05:51 -0700
                  Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-24 06:44 -0700
                    Re: how many lines you coded? Richard Harnden <richard.nospam@gmail.com> - 2023-07-24 15:36 +0100
                      Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-24 07:40 -0700
                  Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-24 07:29 -0700
                    Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-24 07:39 -0700
                    Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-25 02:34 -0700
      Re: how many lines you coded? Vir Campestris <vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> - 2023-07-23 20:48 +0100
        Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-23 13:29 -0700
        Re: how many lines you coded? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2023-07-24 09:02 +0200
          Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-24 00:27 -0700
            Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-24 00:35 -0700
              Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-24 00:45 -0700
                Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-24 01:18 -0700
                  Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-24 01:19 -0700
          Re: how many lines you coded? Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2023-07-24 11:21 +0100
            Re: how many lines you coded? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2023-07-24 20:01 +0200
              Re: how many lines you coded? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2023-07-24 18:20 +0000
                Re: how many lines you coded? Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2023-07-24 20:49 +0100
                  Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-24 13:13 -0700
                    Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-24 13:22 -0700
            Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-25 08:51 -0700
              Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-25 09:16 -0700
              Re: how many lines you coded? Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2023-07-25 18:48 +0100
                Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-25 11:13 -0700
                  Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-25 11:26 -0700
                    Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-25 11:34 -0700
                      Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-25 11:46 -0700
                        Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-25 12:02 -0700
                  Re: how many lines you coded? Bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2023-07-25 22:14 +0100
                    Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-25 14:35 -0700
                      Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-25 15:31 -0700
    Re: how many lines you coded? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-07-23 12:42 -0700
      Re: how many lines you coded? "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-07-25 20:36 -0700
        Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-26 01:44 -0700
    Re: how many lines you coded? John McCue <jmccue@fuzzball.jmcunx.com> - 2023-07-25 20:26 +0000
      Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-25 14:52 -0700
    Re: how many lines you coded? Ed Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2023-07-26 08:04 -0700
      Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-27 01:16 -0700
        Re: how many lines you coded? Ed Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2023-07-30 21:38 -0700
    Re: how many lines you coded? Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2023-07-28 19:53 -0500
      Re: how many lines you coded? Ed Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2023-07-30 21:40 -0700
        Re: how many lines you coded? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2023-07-31 14:54 +0000
          Re: how many lines you coded? Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2023-07-31 23:22 -0500
    Re: how many lines you coded? aph@littlepinkcloud.invalid - 2023-07-31 09:29 +0000
      Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-31 05:10 -0700
        Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-31 05:16 -0700
          Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-31 05:36 -0700
            Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-31 07:00 -0700
        Re: how many lines you coded? Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2023-07-31 05:27 -0700
          Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-31 05:41 -0700
            Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-31 05:51 -0700
              Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-07-31 05:59 -0700
          Re: how many lines you coded? aph@littlepinkcloud.invalid - 2023-08-04 17:57 +0000
            Re: how many lines you coded? Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2023-08-04 11:05 -0700
              Re: how many lines you coded? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2023-08-04 19:03 +0000
                Re: how many lines you coded? Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2023-08-04 12:24 -0700
                  Re: how many lines you coded? gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2023-08-04 19:27 +0000
                Was Dijkstra a "lefty" ? (Was: how many lines you coded?) gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2023-08-04 19:26 +0000
                  Re: Was Dijkstra a "lefty" ? (Was: how many lines you coded?) Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2023-08-04 13:54 -0700
                Re: how many lines you coded? Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2023-08-04 19:47 -0700
                  Again, OT is OT! (Was: how many lines you coded?) gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2023-08-05 03:51 +0000
                  Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-08-05 03:39 -0700
              [OT, Sorry] Re: how many lines you coded? aph@littlepinkcloud.invalid - 2023-08-05 03:02 +0000
            Re: how many lines you coded? Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> - 2023-08-04 19:41 +0000
    Re: how many lines you coded? jak <nospam@please.ty> - 2023-08-01 18:09 +0200
      Re: how many lines you coded? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2023-08-01 10:17 -0700

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#171259

wtorek, 25 lipca 2023 o 23:36:03 UTC+2 fir napisał(a):
> wtorek, 25 lipca 2023 o 23:14:19 UTC+2 Bart napisał(a): 
> > On 25/07/2023 19:13, fir wrote: 
> > > wtorek, 25 lipca 2023 o 19:48:44 UTC+2 Bart napisał(a): 
> > >>> btw you once talked about compilations speed..could you give that 
> > numbers? as i dont remember which one thread it was.. 
> > >>> 
> > >>> i can do basic measuring of assembly speed 
> > >> My current static compiler on AMD Ryzen 3, can compile code at 0.5 to 
> > >> 0.7Mlps (or up to 1Mlps if optimised via C and gcc-O3, but I'd prefer 
> > >> not to do that). 
> > >> 
> > >> Another measure is being able to generate 5 to 10MB of executable code 
> > >> per second. 
> > >> 
> > >> My bytecode compiler for dynamic code can work at up to double those 
> > >> speeds (near 2Mlps max). 
> > >> 
> > >> My x64 assembler I think works at 2 to 3Mlps. 
> > >> 
> > >> On the same machine, Tiny C can compile C code at up to 1Mlps. (That is 
> > >> Tiny C compiled, probably, with gcc-O3; Tiny C compiled with itself 
> > >> would be half that speed.) 
> > > 
> > > by 1MLps you mean 20 MB/s ? better say in megabytes 
> > I don't measure source code in megabytes. 
> > 
> > 1 Mlps is one million lines of source per second. As MB, it depends on 
> > language, code density and coding style. But it correspond to roughly 
> > 5-10MB/second. 
> > 
> > Also, 1 line of lower-level HLL source code generates roughly 10 bytes 
> > of x64 machine code. 1 Mlps might be 10MB/s of generated binary code. 
> > 
> > So actually, the number of input MB and output MB are roughly 
> > equivalent, perhap within a factor of 2 for my HLL, code style, and 
> > compiler. 
> > > what you say and my results are coherent to what i see this 
> > things..imo this depends on 
> > > memory bandwidth and what you can obtain related to this ..if some 
> > computer have 10 GB/s 
> > If you're just loading and reading files, then sure. But compilation is 
> > a lot more complicated than that. On my compilers, loading source files 
> > and writing binaries is 1.5% of overall compile time (using SSD, but 
> > source code is nearly always already cached). 
> > 
> > So that is not the limiting factor in compilation. 
> > 
> > As I said, the Tiny C compiler manages nearly 1Mlps, so around 10MB of 
> > input and output per second, and that is VERY lean: it manages all with 
> > a single pass. My compiler has 5 or so passes. 
> > 
> > I think you suggested once you could manage 10Mlps, well good luck with 
> > that, if doing it with a real language, and not one contrived for the 
> > purpose. (Tiny C has to deal with real, brutal C code, and also lots of 
> > headers that do no contribute to the output binary, but still needs to 
> > be processed.)
> i vaguelly remember that but as i remember i not said that i could manege that 
> (not saying at this point) and not even im sure it is for syre to be managed but 
> was guessing and estimating possible top speeds on hardvare if its titally opyimised 
> i could say 200MB/s as a goal ..hard to estimate exactly but it would be sorta that 
> rank possibly 
> 
> you better count in MB/s this is becouse if you optimise code its often in just 
> thrtuoughput of tam pre seconds ...also im not sure if this sepcial sense of talkin on 
> output speed, in facyt there is probably sense on talking sum input and output, but maybe more on input
> > > it would be hard to obtain 1/10 or 1/30 of it (300MB/s) but 
> > something liek 1/90 could be possibly obtainable probably imo (100 MB/s) 
> > if hard optimised 
> > > 
> > > yet i assume we talk about rading file from aran and saving file to 
> > ram..as im not sure how saving things to file includes to time here 
> > (reading input adds somewhet but not terribly much as when someone 
> > compiles second time the file is in ram cahe, but im not sure as to saving) 
> > > 
> > > if thsio saving includes much it coud have semse to code in ramdisks, 
> > where you could run the output after compiletion before yet it is saved 
> > to disk)..im not sure is if i compile it is saved sorta asuynchronically 
> > and timer returns tiem before its finished..yet i doubt if i can run it 
> > from shel before it is finished this i doubt more 
> > Are you talking about 300MB/second compile speed? That would be pure 
> > fantasy unless you are running on a super computer with dozens of cores. 
> >
> the main factor is probably memory bandwidth and ifs/branchhing speed.. 
> ite depends on machine bandwidth and those branching speed, 
> note i talk on good optimisation and strightforward opmpilation..not 
> necessary thinking on many cores but typical 2 or 4 could be handy, 
> but i think with more cores you have chance maybe to beat it when in less 
> cores liek 1 core be below of that
> > But what would be the purpose? My 0.5Mlps compiler can build my biggest 
> > application in 0.1 seconds. Your imaginary one might do it in 0.003 
> > milliseconds, except that Windows process overheads means it will take 
> > at least 0.02 seconds anyway.

300 MB/s maybe can be itself to high but maybe something ina a rank 100-300MB/s depending on machine

with the assembler im somewhat satisfied/pleasd by the syntax i chosen,
it is not bad imo 
though i wonder what could be imptoved

its alows writing more lines in line with , and mixing data with code and put the data near place of suage with >>

jmp start

//////////////////////////////////////
//           >>   test: 1b 2b 3b 4b 5b 7b

//////////////////////////
count_mandelbrot_areafragment_coeficients:
//double man.LY = man.LX * frame_size_y/frame_size_x

//  man.start.x = man.OX - man.LX/2
//  man.start.y = man.OY - man.LY/2
// man.dx = man.LX/frame_size_x
// man.dy = man.Ly/frame_size_y

    mov eax -2
    cvt si2ss x2 eax

    mov ss x1 (man.lx),         >>  man.lx:       4.0
    div ss x1 x2
    add ss x1 (man.ox),         >>   man.ox:      -0.6
    mov ss (man.start.x) x1,    >>   man.start.x:  -0.0

    mov ss x1 (man.ly),         >>  man.ly:  3.0
    div ss x1 x2
    add ss x1 (man.oy),         >>  man.oy:  0.0
    mov ss (man.start.y) x1,    >>  man.start.y: -0.0

    mov eax ("green.fire.dll"->frame_size_x)
    mov ebx (eax)
    cvt si2ss x2 ebx
    mov ss x1 (man.lx)
    div ss x1 x2
    mov ss (man.dx) x1,        >> man.dx:   -0.0

    mov eax ("green.fire.dll"->frame_size_y)
    mov ebx (eax)
    cvt si2ss x2 ebx
    mov ss x1 (man.ly)
    div ss x1 x2
    mov ss (man.dy) x1,        >>   man.dy:  -0.0

ret

////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
//    double re = cRe;
//   double im = cIm;
//
//    for(int n=1; n<man.maxiter; n++)
//    {
//
//      if( re * re + im * im > 4.0 ) return n;
//
//      double re_n = re * re - im * im + cRe;
//      double im_n = 2 * re * im       + cIm;
//
//      re = re_n;
//      im = im_n;
//
//    }
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////



calc_mandelbtot_for_esi_edi:

  >> c.re: 0.0  c.im: 0.0  four: 4.0

  cvt si2ss x0 esi,
    mov ss x1 (man.dx),
      mul ss x0 x1,
        add ss x0 (man.start.x),
          mov ss (c.re) x0

  cvt si2ss x0 edi,
     mov ss x1 (man.dy),
       mul ss x0 x1,
         add ss x0 (man.start.y),
           mov ss (c.im) x0

  //////////////////////
   mov ecx 0
   mov ss x3 (c.re)
   mov ss x4 (c.im)
   mov ss x0 x3
   mov ss x1 x4
   mov ss x2 (four)
   mov ss x5 x0  //re
 iterations:
   mov ss x6 x1   //im
   mul ss x5 x5                    //re * re
   mul ss x6 x6                    //im * im
   mov ss x7 x5,   add ss x7 x6,   // re*re + im*im
   comi ss x7 x2,   jae out
   sub ss x5 x6,   add ss x5 x3                  // re_n = re * re - im * im + cRe;
   mul ss  x1 x0,  add ss  x1 x1, add ss  x1 x4  //  im_n = 2 * re * im  + cIm;
   mov ss  x0 x5
   inc ecx, cmp ecx 256,  jl iterations
   mov ecx 0xff0000,   ret
out:
   push eax
   mov eax ecx
   shl eax 8
   add eax ecx
   shl eax 8
   add eax ecx
   mov ecx eax
   pop eax, 
   ret

//   mov ecx 0xffffff,   ret



print_eax:
                  >> note_eax: "\x0d\x0a eax = %d \x00"

  push eax
  push note_eax
  call (msvcrt.dll->printf)
  pop eax
  pop eax
  ret



ProcessKeyDown:

    >> last_key_pressed:   0
    >>          PAGE_UP:  32


    mov eax (esp+4)
    mov (last_key_pressed) eax
    mov eax (last_key_pressed)
    cmp eax (PAGE_UP)
    je if_0_end
    call print_eax

 if_0_end:

    ret

/////////////////////////////////////////////////////

ProcessRMBDown:
                        >> man.zoom.out: 1.25
    mov ss  x1 (man.lx)
    mov ss  x2 (man.zoom.out)
    mul ss  x1 x2
    mov ss  (man.lx) x1

    mov ss  x1 (man.ly)
    mov ss  x2 (man.zoom.out)
    mul ss  x1 x2
    mov ss  (man.ly) x1
ret


////////////////////////////

ProcessLMBDown:

    mov eax (esp+4),    mov (mouse_down_x) eax,  >> mouse_down_x:   0,     call print_eax
    mov eax (esp+8),    mov (mouse_down_y) eax,  >> mouse_down_y:   0,    call print_eax

    // man.ox = mouse_down_x/frame_size_x * man.lx + man.ox - man.lx/2
   // man.oy = mouse_down_y/frame_size_y * man.ly + man.oy - man.ly/2
   //  man.oy = mouse_down_y/frame_size_y * man.ly + man.oy - man.ly/2


    mov  eax (mouse_down_x)
    cvt si2ss x1 eax
    mov  eax ("green.fire.dll"->frame_size_x)
    mov  ebx (eax)

    cvt si2ss x2 ebx

    div ss x1 x2
    mul ss x1 (man.lx)
    add ss x1 (man.ox)

    mov ss x2 (man.lx)
    mov eax -2
    cvt si2ss x3 eax
    div ss x2 x3

    add ss x1 x2
    mov ss (man.ox) x1



    mov  eax (mouse_down_y)
    cvt si2ss x1 eax
    mov  eax (green.fire.dll->frame_size_y)
    mov  ebx (eax)

    cvt si2ss x2 ebx

    div ss x1 x2
    mul ss x1 (man.ly)
    add ss x1 (man.oy)

    mov ss x2 (man.ly)
    mov eax -2
    cvt si2ss x3 eax
    div ss x2 x3

    add ss x1 x2
    mov ss (man.oy) x1
                           >> man.zoom: 1.25

    mov ss  x1 (man.lx)
    mov ss  x2 (man.zoom)
    div ss  x1 x2
    mov ss  (man.lx) x1

    mov ss  x1 (man.ly)
    mov ss  x2 (man.zoom)
    div ss  x1 x2
    mov ss  (man.ly) x1

//        add ss x0 (man.start.x),
//          mov ss (c.re) x0

   ret
   


//
// unsigned background_color = 0x0;
//
// void RunFrame(int advance)
// {
//     ClearFrameData(background_color);
// }
//
//
// void ProcessMouseMove(int x, int y){}
// void ProcessKeyDown(int key){}
// void OnResize(){}
//
//
// int main(void)
// {
//
//         RegisterMouseMove( ProcessMouseMove );
//         RegisterKeyDown( ProcessKeyDown );
//         RegisterOnResize( OnResize );
//         RegisterRunFrame( RunFrame );
//         SetSleepValue(10);
//
//         SetupWindow2(" Example Green Fire App ",  20, 20,  560, 400 );
//
//         return 0;
// }
//////////////////////////////////////////////////////

OnResize:           ret
ProcessMouseMove:   ret

RunFrame:

   push 0x007000,    call (green.fire.dll->ClearFrameData),        pop eax ;

   call count_mandelbrot_areafragment_coeficients

   mov eax (green.fire.dll->frame_bitmap),   mov ebp (eax)
   mov eax (green.fire.dll->frame_size_x),   mov ebx (eax)
   mov eax (green.fire.dll->frame_size_y),   mov edx (eax)

   mov edi 0, 
   loop_y: 
   mov esi 0, 
   loop_x: 
    push edx
   mov eax edi,  mul eax ebx, add eax esi, shl eax 2, add eax ebp
   pop edx
   call calc_mandelbtot_for_esi_edi
   mov (eax) ecx
   inc esi ,   cmp esi ebx,   jl loop_x
   inc edi ,   cmp edi edx,   jl loop_y
   ret


//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
start:
    push ProcessMouseMove,  call (green.fire.dll->RegisterMouseMove),   pop eax
    push ProcessLMBDown,    call (green.fire.dll->RegisterLeftMouseButtonDown),   pop eax
    push ProcessRMBDown,    call (green.fire.dll->RegisterRightMouseButtonDown),   pop eax
    push ProcessKeyDown,    call (green.fire.dll->RegisterKeyDown),     pop eax
    push OnResize,          call (green.fire.dll->RegisterOnResize),    pop eax
    push RunFrame,          call (green.fire.dll->RegisterRunFrame),    pop eax
    push 10,                call (green.fire.dll->SetSleepValue),       pop eax

    push 480, push 640,  push 480, push 640, push 20, push 20,  push title,  [ title: "example assembler app \x00" ]
     call (green.fire.dll->SetupWindow3),   add esp 20

    mov eax 0
    ret
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

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#171182

On 7/23/2023 10:29 AM, fir wrote:
> how many lines you coded in your life? if you give an answer try to be real

God damn. Millions? Maybe more? Good question.


> (and not count data and duplicates)
> i myself estimated 200-300k hovever after thinking i think it may be closer to 200k (my newer projects take about 130k or something more but i also got some older i coand count now.. i would say for sure it was no less than 170k but how many above this thios one i can count/memorize now)
> 
> are you able to estimate?

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#171266

On 7/23/2023 12:42 PM, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
> On 7/23/2023 10:29 AM, fir wrote:
>> how many lines you coded in your life? if you give an answer try to be 
>> real
> 
> God damn. Millions? Maybe more? Good question.
> 
> 
>> (and not count data and duplicates)
>> i myself estimated 200-300k hovever after thinking i think it may be 
>> closer to 200k (my newer projects take about 130k or something more 
>> but i also got some older i coand count now.. i would say for sure it 
>> was no less than 170k but how many above this thios one i can 
>> count/memorize now)
>>
>> are you able to estimate?
> 

Some of that code was pure experimentation. I treated my some of my code 
like it was some sort of god damn lab rat. Nasty!

https://youtu.be/SsAFen9b2Qg

How many lines of hyper experimental code have you created before? 
Treating your existing working code like a weird science experiment?

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#171272

środa, 26 lipca 2023 o 05:36:57 UTC+2 Chris M. Thomasson napisał(a):
> On 7/23/2023 12:42 PM, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
> > On 7/23/2023 10:29 AM, fir wrote: 
> >> how many lines you coded in your life? if you give an answer try to be 
> >> real 
> >
> > God damn. Millions? Maybe more? Good question. 
> > 
> > 
> >> (and not count data and duplicates) 
> >> i myself estimated 200-300k hovever after thinking i think it may be 
> >> closer to 200k (my newer projects take about 130k or something more 
> >> but i also got some older i coand count now.. i would say for sure it 
> >> was no less than 170k but how many above this thios one i can 
> >> count/memorize now)
> >> 
> >> are you able to estimate? 
> >
> Some of that code was pure experimentation. I treated my some of my code 
> like it was some sort of god damn lab rat. Nasty! 
> 
> https://youtu.be/SsAFen9b2Qg 
> 
> How many lines of hyper experimental code have you created before? 
> Treating your existing working code like a weird science experiment?

not so much as i dont write so much experimental code it just to be dleted,
its ratcher simple unfinished projects, but not finished becouse lack of time
(sad becouse many of them would be good but im avare i got no 2 years on each)

i uploaded somewhat newer version of assembler

https://fastupload.io/zU29wbmaRh2o3et/file

thouch not much changed i added this marking opcodes in log and
terat things like 0 1 2 200 as ints in data section (before they were treated as chars but
ints probebly better)

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#171254

fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> wrote:
> how many lines you coded in your life? if you give an answer try to be real 

A gentle push, please learn to format your lines,
you have been posting longer enough to know this :)
http://www.mugsy.org/asa_faq/getting_along/usenet.shtml

<snip>
> are you able to estimate?

I have no idea, as someone else said, I guess around million ?
Most of these programs are lost "like tears in the rain" :)

My first program was written on punch cards, then on to CTR, then
PCs. I was able to avoid any type of to management "promotions".

Regards,
John

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#171257

wtorek, 25 lipca 2023 o 22:27:00 UTC+2 John McCue napisał(a):
> fir <profes...@gmail.com> wrote: 
> > how many lines you coded in your life? if you give an answer try to be real
> A gentle push, please learn to format your lines, 
> you have been posting longer enough to know this :) 
> http://www.mugsy.org/asa_faq/getting_along/usenet.shtml 
> 
> <snip> 
> > are you able to estimate? 
> 
> I have no idea, as someone else said, I guess around million ? 
> Most of these programs are lost "like tears in the rain" :) 
> 
> My first program was written on punch cards, then on to CTR, then 
> PCs. I was able to avoid any type of to management "promotions". 
> 

ok, milion is maybe not terribly big amount (o0btainable) if i think but it is rathed for smeone who coded
most of life... 

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#171287

On Sunday, July 23, 2023 at 1:29:49 PM UTC-4, fir wrote:
> how many lines you coded in your life? if you give an answer try to be real 
> (and not count data and duplicates) 
> i myself estimated 200-300k hovever after thinking i think it may be closer to 200k (my newer projects take about 130k or something more but i also got some older i coand count now.. i would say for sure it was no less than 170k but how many above this thios one i can count/memorize now) 
> 
> are you able to estimate?

Context: software development for a little over 40 years
Initial estimate:
One of 3 original developers at a startup company.
At working prototype stage we counted 6 million lines
of C & C# code. I estimate I produced about 1 million of that.
That took 4 years of work with a team growing to 12.
I also developed code there for build and install scripts,
custom controller languages and more.

So I also have noted that the number of lines of design
and other documentation I produced exceeds the code
by a factor of 5 or so.

Other places I produced much less code, but I think
I can claim a couple million lines over 40 years.

Ed

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#171327

środa, 26 lipca 2023 o 17:04:09 UTC+2 Ed Prochak napisał(a):
> On Sunday, July 23, 2023 at 1:29:49 PM UTC-4, fir wrote: 
> > how many lines you coded in your life? if you give an answer try to be real
> > (and not count data and duplicates) 
> > i myself estimated 200-300k hovever after thinking i think it may be closer to 200k (my newer projects take about 130k or something more but i also got some older i coand count now.. i would say for sure it was no less than 170k but how many above this thios one i can count/memorize now) 
> > 
> > are you able to estimate?
> Context: software development for a little over 40 years 
> Initial estimate: 
> One of 3 original developers at a startup company. 
> At working prototype stage we counted 6 million lines 
> of C & C# code. I estimate I produced about 1 million of that. 
> That took 4 years of work with a team growing to 12. 
> I also developed code there for build and install scripts, 
> custom controller languages and more. 
> 
> So I also have noted that the number of lines of design 
> and other documentation I produced exceeds the code 
> by a factor of 5 or so. 
> 
> Other places I produced much less code, but I think 
> I can claim a couple million lines over 40 years. 
> 

saying couple milion i think is inprecise as imo it would be reallu nlike to 
write more than 2 milions

saying realistically one writes 50k a year x40 years = 2 milions

*i would be able writing 50k a year (very intensive month is 10k but need to rest)
but i not code year by year... also not sure if not beoin 45+ people not code slower

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#171454

On Thursday, July 27, 2023 at 4:16:24 AM UTC-4, fir wrote:
> środa, 26 lipca 2023 o 17:04:09 UTC+2 Ed Prochak napisał(a): 
> > On Sunday, July 23, 2023 at 1:29:49 PM UTC-4, fir wrote: 
> > > how many lines you coded in your life? if you give an answer try to be real 
> > > (and not count data and duplicates) 
[]
> > > 
> > > are you able to estimate? 
> >
> > Context: software development for a little over 40 years 
> > Initial estimate: 
> > One of 3 original developers at a startup company. 
> > At working prototype stage we counted 6 million lines 
> > of C & C# code. I estimate I produced about 1 million of that. 
> > That took 4 years of work with a team growing to 12. 
> > I also developed code there for build and install scripts, 
> > custom controller languages and more. 
> > 
> > So I also have noted that the number of lines of design 
> > and other documentation I produced exceeds the code 
> > by a factor of 5 or so. 
> > 
> > Other places I produced much less code, but I think 
> > I can claim a couple million lines over 40 years. 
> >
> saying couple milion i think is inprecise as imo it would be reallu nlike to 
> write more than 2 milions 

Just a matter of grammar, and I prefer to be conservative.
> 
> saying realistically one writes 50k a year x40 years = 2 milions 

yes that could be right. Some years more some years less.
Years with less code are likely occupied with design or other
documentation required.
> 
> *i would be able writing 50k a year (very intensive month is 10k but need to rest) 
> but i not code year by year... also not sure if not beoin 45+ people not code slower

And how well is your code documented? Both design and operation?
Ed

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#171387

On 7/23/2023 12:29 PM, fir wrote:
> how many lines you coded in your life? if you give an answer try to be real
> (and not count data and duplicates)
> i myself estimated 200-300k hovever after thinking i think it may be closer to 200k (my newer projects take about 130k or something more but i also got some older i coand count now.. i would say for sure it was no less than 170k but how many above this thios one i can count/memorize now)
> 
> are you able to estimate?

That is a very hard number to quantify.  And in just C code or all codes 
?  At least a half million LOC since 1975 in Fortran 66, Fortran 77, IBM 
370 Assembler, Basic, Pascal, C, C++, HTML, Perl.

I am the chief shepherd for 730,000 lines of Fortran 77 code and 600,000 
lines of C and mostly C++ code for a Windows desktop engineering 
software product sold commercially.

Lynn

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#171455

On Friday, July 28, 2023 at 8:53:24 PM UTC-4, Lynn McGuire wrote:
[]
> That is a very hard number to quantify. And in just C code or all codes 
> ? At least a half million LOC since 1975 in Fortran 66, Fortran 77, IBM 
> 370 Assembler, Basic, Pascal, C, C++, HTML, Perl. 
> 
> I am the chief shepherd for 730,000 lines of Fortran 77 code and 600,000 
> lines of C and mostly C++ code for a Windows desktop engineering 
> software product sold commercially. 
> 
> Lynn

Wow, you've been at it longer than I was.
(I'm semi-retired now.)
Ed

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#171472

Ed Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> writes:
>On Friday, July 28, 2023 at 8:53:24=E2=80=AFPM UTC-4, Lynn McGuire wrote:
>[]
>> That is a very hard number to quantify. And in just C code or all codes=
>=20
>> ? At least a half million LOC since 1975 in Fortran 66, Fortran 77, IBM=
>=20
>> 370 Assembler, Basic, Pascal, C, C++, HTML, Perl.=20
>>=20
>> I am the chief shepherd for 730,000 lines of Fortran 77 code and 600,000=
>=20
>> lines of C and mostly C++ code for a Windows desktop engineering=20
>> software product sold commercially.=20
>>=20
>> Lynn
>
>Wow, you've been at it longer than I was.
>(I'm semi-retired now.)

My current working tree has close to three million lines of code.  Two
thirds are generated header files; the reset is about 700,000 SLOC of C++
written by a half dozen engineers over a decade.

There are also third party libraries not counted in the above.

It's worth noting that while both Lynn and I started programming
in 1975, we were both in high school at the time.

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#171495

On 7/31/2023 9:54 AM, Scott Lurndal wrote:
> Ed Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> writes:
>> On Friday, July 28, 2023 at 8:53:24=E2=80=AFPM UTC-4, Lynn McGuire wrote:
>> []
>>> That is a very hard number to quantify. And in just C code or all codes=
>> =20
>>> ? At least a half million LOC since 1975 in Fortran 66, Fortran 77, IBM=
>> =20
>>> 370 Assembler, Basic, Pascal, C, C++, HTML, Perl.=20
>>> =20
>>> I am the chief shepherd for 730,000 lines of Fortran 77 code and 600,000=
>> =20
>>> lines of C and mostly C++ code for a Windows desktop engineering=20
>>> software product sold commercially.=20
>>> =20
>>> Lynn
>>
>> Wow, you've been at it longer than I was.
>> (I'm semi-retired now.)
> 
> My current working tree has close to three million lines of code.  Two
> thirds are generated header files; the reset is about 700,000 SLOC of C++
> written by a half dozen engineers over a decade.
> 
> There are also third party libraries not counted in the above.
> 
> It's worth noting that while both Lynn and I started programming
> in 1975, we were both in high school at the time.

Yup, I was 14 when I started programming in Fortran 66 in June of 1975. 
I took a PhD's hand scribbled algorithms, converted them to Fortran 66, 
keypunched them, and got the subroutine card deck to compile on the 
Univac 1108.

Lynn

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#171459

fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> wrote:
> how many lines you coded in your life? if you give an answer try to be real 
> (and not count data and duplicates)

I have no idea. However, I do know it paid for everything, so I guess
it was enough.

  The willingness to accept what is known to be wrong as if it were
  right was displayed very explicitly by Hamming... As so many others,
  he expressed in one of his talks programmer productivity in terms of
  "numbers of lines of code produced". During the discussion I pointed
  out that a programmer should produce solutions, and that, therefore,
  we should not talk about the number of lines of code produced, but
  the number of lines of code used, and that this number ought to be
  booked on the other side of the ledger. His answer was "Well, I know
  that it is inadequate, but it is the only thing we can measure." As
  if this undeniable fact also determines the side of the ledger...

  EWD 513. Dijkstra, Newcastle, 1975. 

Andrew.

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#171461

poniedziałek, 31 lipca 2023 o 11:29:44 UTC+2 a...@littlepinkcloud.invalid napisał(a):
> fir <profes...@gmail.com> wrote: 
> > how many lines you coded in your life? if you give an answer try to be real 
> > (and not count data and duplicates)
> I have no idea. However, I do know it paid for everything, so I guess 
> it was enough. 
> 
> The willingness to accept what is known to be wrong as if it were 
> right was displayed very explicitly by Hamming... As so many others, 
> he expressed in one of his talks programmer productivity in terms of 
> "numbers of lines of code produced". During the discussion I pointed 
> out that a programmer should produce solutions, and that, therefore, 
> we should not talk about the number of lines of code produced, but 
> the number of lines of code used, and that this number ought to be 
> booked on the other side of the ledger. His answer was "Well, I know 
> that it is inadequate, but it is the only thing we can measure." As 
> if this undeniable fact also determines the side of the ledger... 
> 
> EWD 513. Dijkstra, Newcastle, 1975. 
> 
> Andrew.

honestly beliving in capitalism too much is imo somewhat demential..
i recently was thinking what makes many people stupid and thase were
assumptions (especially false assumptions) ..and this way code that is
capitalistic is good is imo such way asumption that make stupid

btw pure programing and capitalism is not quite on a way..its rather capitalism
parasitize on programming..

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#171463

poniedziałek, 31 lipca 2023 o 14:10:40 UTC+2 fir napisał(a):
> poniedziałek, 31 lipca 2023 o 11:29:44 UTC+2 a...@littlepinkcloud.invalid napisał(a): 
> > fir <profes...@gmail.com> wrote: 
> > > how many lines you coded in your life? if you give an answer try to be real 
> > > (and not count data and duplicates) 
> > I have no idea. However, I do know it paid for everything, so I guess 
> > it was enough. 
> > 
> > The willingness to accept what is known to be wrong as if it were 
> > right was displayed very explicitly by Hamming... As so many others, 
> > he expressed in one of his talks programmer productivity in terms of 
> > "numbers of lines of code produced". During the discussion I pointed 
> > out that a programmer should produce solutions, and that, therefore, 
> > we should not talk about the number of lines of code produced, but 
> > the number of lines of code used, and that this number ought to be 
> > booked on the other side of the ledger. His answer was "Well, I know 
> > that it is inadequate, but it is the only thing we can measure." As 
> > if this undeniable fact also determines the side of the ledger... 
> > 
> > EWD 513. Dijkstra, Newcastle, 1975. 
> > 
> > Andrew.
> honestly beliving in capitalism too much is imo somewhat demential.. 
> i recently was thinking what makes many people stupid and thase were 
> assumptions (especially false assumptions) ..and this way code that is 
> capitalistic is good is imo such way asumption that make stupid 
> 
> btw pure programing and capitalism is not quite on a way..its rather capitalism 
> parasitize on programming..

capitalism is sorta 'unreal' term as when i think of coding (and what is important here)
capitallism at all not exist here..real terms are like 'logic' or 'tiredness' even 'age' (condition)
and many inside things but putting capitalism to all that is sorta weird

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#171465

poniedziałek, 31 lipca 2023 o 14:16:17 UTC+2 fir napisał(a):
> poniedziałek, 31 lipca 2023 o 14:10:40 UTC+2 fir napisał(a): 
> > poniedziałek, 31 lipca 2023 o 11:29:44 UTC+2 a...@littlepinkcloud.invalid napisał(a): 
> > > fir <profes...@gmail.com> wrote: 
> > > > how many lines you coded in your life? if you give an answer try to be real 
> > > > (and not count data and duplicates) 
> > > I have no idea. However, I do know it paid for everything, so I guess 
> > > it was enough. 
> > > 
> > > The willingness to accept what is known to be wrong as if it were 
> > > right was displayed very explicitly by Hamming... As so many others, 
> > > he expressed in one of his talks programmer productivity in terms of 
> > > "numbers of lines of code produced". During the discussion I pointed 
> > > out that a programmer should produce solutions, and that, therefore, 
> > > we should not talk about the number of lines of code produced, but 
> > > the number of lines of code used, and that this number ought to be 
> > > booked on the other side of the ledger. His answer was "Well, I know 
> > > that it is inadequate, but it is the only thing we can measure." As 
> > > if this undeniable fact also determines the side of the ledger... 
> > > 
> > > EWD 513. Dijkstra, Newcastle, 1975. 
> > > 
> > > Andrew. 
> > honestly beliving in capitalism too much is imo somewhat demential.. 
> > i recently was thinking what makes many people stupid and thase were 
> > assumptions (especially false assumptions) ..and this way code that is 
> > capitalistic is good is imo such way asumption that make stupid 
> > 
> > btw pure programing and capitalism is not quite on a way..its rather capitalism 
> > parasitize on programming..
> capitalism is sorta 'unreal' term as when i think of coding (and what is important here) 
> capitallism at all not exist here..real terms are like 'logic' or 'tiredness' even 'age' (condition) 
> and many inside things but putting capitalism to all that is sorta weird

if dijkstra means 'used' not in capitalistic way i also could not agree (unles fore example he hea not general programming but some specific project on mind etc)

for example in recent years i discovered what in (at elast my) programing is important
are soemthing like 'ideas' (something liek 'milestones') discovery that something (soem elements) plays well.. tehre are potential heavy thousands of this ideas to discover -
it emans if you obtain and ide the code could be deleted at all but the idea is still 
discovered
(by the ide i mean sometimes quite small things but you need some experience to discover them and then note this was good/this was important.. for example my notice (what is interesting but i guess many people dont relise) is  that 3D graphics engine /3D graphics is in fact
one function (FillTriangle3D) (eventually yet one entity of camera location which this function takes into consideration, though you can also make this on your side)...another example is
for exampel my experience with my library for games that you can base it on 2d bitmap of pixels
and frame_size_x, frame_size_y, providing rescaling this (stretching) when user drags and resize 
window but you also may add cose for changing thex/y bitmap size from keyboard thus allowing
dynamic rescaling of this bitmap output in games (thsi also work well)

such pack of ideas is imo what makes real value in coding (the bigest problem is age - i could make so much fukin good content of this if i would live 1000 years not more like 25 and then get old and die)

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#171471

poniedziałek, 31 lipca 2023 o 14:36:19 UTC+2 fir napisał(a):
> poniedziałek, 31 lipca 2023 o 14:16:17 UTC+2 fir napisał(a):
> > poniedziałek, 31 lipca 2023 o 14:10:40 UTC+2 fir napisał(a): 
> > > poniedziałek, 31 lipca 2023 o 11:29:44 UTC+2 a...@littlepinkcloud.invalid napisał(a): 
> > > > fir <profes...@gmail.com> wrote: 
> > > > > how many lines you coded in your life? if you give an answer try to be real 
> > > > > (and not count data and duplicates) 
> > > > I have no idea. However, I do know it paid for everything, so I guess 
> > > > it was enough. 
> > > > 
> > > > The willingness to accept what is known to be wrong as if it were 
> > > > right was displayed very explicitly by Hamming... As so many others, 
> > > > he expressed in one of his talks programmer productivity in terms of 
> > > > "numbers of lines of code produced". During the discussion I pointed 
> > > > out that a programmer should produce solutions, and that, therefore, 
> > > > we should not talk about the number of lines of code produced, but 
> > > > the number of lines of code used, and that this number ought to be 
> > > > booked on the other side of the ledger. His answer was "Well, I know 
> > > > that it is inadequate, but it is the only thing we can measure." As 
> > > > if this undeniable fact also determines the side of the ledger... 
> > > > 
> > > > EWD 513. Dijkstra, Newcastle, 1975. 
> > > > 
> > > > Andrew. 
> > > honestly beliving in capitalism too much is imo somewhat demential.. 
> > > i recently was thinking what makes many people stupid and thase were 
> > > assumptions (especially false assumptions) ..and this way code that is 
> > > capitalistic is good is imo such way asumption that make stupid 
> > > 
> > > btw pure programing and capitalism is not quite on a way..its rather capitalism 
> > > parasitize on programming.. 
> > capitalism is sorta 'unreal' term as when i think of coding (and what is important here) 
> > capitallism at all not exist here..real terms are like 'logic' or 'tiredness' even 'age' (condition) 
> > and many inside things but putting capitalism to all that is sorta weird
> if dijkstra means 'used' not in capitalistic way i also could not agree (unles fore example he hea not general programming but some specific project on mind etc) 
> 
> for example in recent years i discovered what in (at elast my) programing is important 
> are soemthing like 'ideas' (something liek 'milestones') discovery that something (soem elements) plays well.. tehre are potential heavy thousands of this ideas to discover - 
> it emans if you obtain and ide the code could be deleted at all but the idea is still 
> discovered 
> (by the ide i mean sometimes quite small things but you need some experience to discover them and then note this was good/this was important.. for example my notice (what is interesting but i guess many people dont relise) is that 3D graphics engine /3D graphics is in fact 
> one function (FillTriangle3D) (eventually yet one entity of camera location which this function takes into consideration, though you can also make this on your side)...another example is 
> for exampel my experience with my library for games that you can base it on 2d bitmap of pixels 
> and frame_size_x, frame_size_y, providing rescaling this (stretching) when user drags and resize 
> window but you also may add cose for changing thex/y bitmap size from keyboard thus allowing 
> dynamic rescaling of this bitmap output in games (thsi also work well) 
> 
> such pack of ideas is imo what makes real value in coding (the bigest problem is age - i could make so much fukin good content of this if i would live 1000 years not more like 25 and then get old and die)

thus death is imo the main problem in programming (or maybe not death but short  lifaspan)
- i got no idea hovever what to do with that (second (or another as im not sure if it is strictly
second is bad condition, health and getting old)

it is also to see imo that probably popular mass of people dont see what is best in programming (those ideas) at all (and probably in other domains like physics which is also probably containing of ideas).. they probably see only soem outcome of this

this is probably related to this golden age where people are near such ideas and pop-state where pop-people dissolves them (and flod the world with terrible mass amopunts of stupidity)

(i often feel like im poisoned by this mass stupidity  and wonder how i much time in my life i lost on this (90%?) this stupidity flow is  then third-case problem, more worse is short life-span)

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#171464

On Monday, 31 July 2023 at 13:10:40 UTC+1, fir wrote:
> poniedziałek, 31 lipca 2023 o 11:29:44 UTC+2 a...@littlepinkcloud.invalid napisał(a): 
> > fir <profes...@gmail.com> wrote: 
> > > how many lines you coded in your life? if you give an answer try to be real 
> > > (and not count data and duplicates) 
> > I have no idea. However, I do know it paid for everything, so I guess 
> > it was enough. 
> > 
> > The willingness to accept what is known to be wrong as if it were 
> > right was displayed very explicitly by Hamming... As so many others, 
> > he expressed in one of his talks programmer productivity in terms of 
> > "numbers of lines of code produced". During the discussion I pointed 
> > out that a programmer should produce solutions, and that, therefore, 
> > we should not talk about the number of lines of code produced, but 
> > the number of lines of code used, and that this number ought to be 
> > booked on the other side of the ledger. His answer was "Well, I know 
> > that it is inadequate, but it is the only thing we can measure." As 
> > if this undeniable fact also determines the side of the ledger... 
> > 
> > EWD 513. Dijkstra, Newcastle, 1975. 
> > 
> > Andrew.
> honestly beliving in capitalism too much is imo somewhat demential.. 
> i recently was thinking what makes many people stupid and thase were 
> assumptions (especially false assumptions) ..and this way code that is 
> capitalistic is good is imo such way asumption that make stupid 
> 
> btw pure programing and capitalism is not quite on a way..its rather capitalism 
> parasitize on programming..
>
Dijkstra was a notorious leftie. He was also a very clever man, and of
course he right that trying to measure programming productivity by
counting lines written is idiotic.

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#171466

poniedziałek, 31 lipca 2023 o 14:27:23 UTC+2 Malcolm McLean napisał(a):
> On Monday, 31 July 2023 at 13:10:40 UTC+1, fir wrote: 
> > poniedziałek, 31 lipca 2023 o 11:29:44 UTC+2 a...@littlepinkcloud.invalid napisał(a): 
> > > fir <profes...@gmail.com> wrote: 
> > > > how many lines you coded in your life? if you give an answer try to be real 
> > > > (and not count data and duplicates) 
> > > I have no idea. However, I do know it paid for everything, so I guess 
> > > it was enough. 
> > > 
> > > The willingness to accept what is known to be wrong as if it were 
> > > right was displayed very explicitly by Hamming... As so many others, 
> > > he expressed in one of his talks programmer productivity in terms of 
> > > "numbers of lines of code produced". During the discussion I pointed 
> > > out that a programmer should produce solutions, and that, therefore, 
> > > we should not talk about the number of lines of code produced, but 
> > > the number of lines of code used, and that this number ought to be 
> > > booked on the other side of the ledger. His answer was "Well, I know 
> > > that it is inadequate, but it is the only thing we can measure." As 
> > > if this undeniable fact also determines the side of the ledger... 
> > > 
> > > EWD 513. Dijkstra, Newcastle, 1975. 
> > > 
> > > Andrew. 
> > honestly beliving in capitalism too much is imo somewhat demential.. 
> > i recently was thinking what makes many people stupid and thase were 
> > assumptions (especially false assumptions) ..and this way code that is 
> > capitalistic is good is imo such way asumption that make stupid 
> > 
> > btw pure programing and capitalism is not quite on a way..its rather capitalism 
> > parasitize on programming.. 
> >
> Dijkstra was a notorious leftie. He was also a very clever man, and of 
> course he right that trying to measure programming productivity by 
> counting lines written is idiotic.

its absolutly not idiotic..its absolutely right...
weird is so many people has tendency to oppose obvious things like 2+2=4

measuring code by lines is very good.. its not full measure ofc becouse one could write 20k lines in whole life that is much more valuable than much more of something other - but its totally good in some very much important aspect

(if dijkstra was leftie it seem to be not as much leftie as I ;c thout i am in a way of rejecting assumptions (which is true leftic imo) sad im getting old and lost form

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