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Groups > alt.folklore.computers > #233213
| From | John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Newsgroups | comp.os.linux.misc, alt.folklore.computers |
| Subject | Re: naughty Pascal |
| Date | 2026-01-05 13:37 -0800 |
| Organization | A noiseless patient Spider |
| Message-ID | <20260105133755.00005e21@gmail.com> (permalink) |
| References | (19 earlier) <P9ucnVOvusaFtcX0nZ2dnZfqnPednZ2d@giganews.com> <qgpl2mx8dc.ln2@Telcontar.valinor> <10jak55$13ji1$2@dont-email.me> <10jh3n1$3644m$1@nntp.eternal-september.org> <20260105115058.000054fc@gmail.com> |
Cross-posted to 2 groups.
On Mon, 5 Jan 2026 11:50:58 -0800 John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> wrote: > > Actually, many systems programming languages have no I/O, the idea > > being that non-OS programs call the OS to do the I/O, and the OS > > interacts directly with the hardware. > > "Systems programming" usually implies implementation of an OS, though, > and IIRC that was the sense that Kernighan was using. Had to go back and double-check myself on this - his essay can be found at https://www.cs.virginia.edu/~evans/cs655/readings/bwk-on-pascal.html for those who want to read it. He doesn't use "systems programming" at all, and his cited examples have to do with general applications rather than OS implementation. (Of course, the same limitations that plagued vanilla Pascal for that do it no favors in anything lower-level.) What he actually says is: "Pascal's built-in I/O has a deservedly bad reputation. It believes strongly in record-oriented input and output." "The I/O design reflects the original operating system upon which Pascal was designed; even Wirth acknowledges that bias, though not its defects. It is assumed that text files consist of records, that is, lines of text. When the last character of a line is read, the built-in function 'eoln' becomes true; at that point, one must call 'readln' to initiate reading a new line and reset 'eoln'. Similarly, when the last character of the file is read, the built-in 'eof' becomes true. In both cases, 'eoln' and 'eof' must be tested before each 'read' rather than after." "There is no notion at all of access to a file system except for pre- defined files named by (in effect) logical unit number in the 'program' statement that begins each program. This apparently reflects the CDC batch system in which Pascal was originally developed. [...] Most imple- mentations of Pascal provide an escape hatch to allow access to files by name from the outside environment, but not conveniently and not standardly." "But 'reset' and 'rewrite' are procedures, not functions - there is no status return and no way to regain control if for some reason the att- empted access fails. [...] This straitjacket makes it essentially im- possible to write programs that recover from mis-spelled file names, etc." "There is no notion of access to command-line arguments, again probably reflecting Pascal's batch-processing origins." AFAICT some of those may have been solved by the time the ISO standard was finalized (the standard as I can find it online is much more of a "committee deciding on points of dispute" document than a language ref and I can't be bothered to dig that deep.) But none of these points are matters where the programmer is "helped" by delegating anything to the OS/runtime environment - indeed, if anything the opposite is true, and the programmer is needlessly bound to assumptions carried over from one specific environment (batch-oriented, record- or line-oriented.) And Kernighan's final summation certainly held true for the original flavor of the language, however many variants over the years have had their own (non-standard) fixes: "The language is inadequate but circumscribed, because there is no way to escape its limitations. There are no casts to disable the type- checking when necessary. There is no way to replace the defective run- time environment with a sensible one, unless one controls the compiler that defines the 'standard procedures.' The language is closed. [...] Because the language is so impotent, it must be extended. But each group extends Pascal in its own direction, to make it look like what- ever language they really want."
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Re: naughty Python The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-12-30 19:00 +0000
Re: naughty Python Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-12-30 19:06 +0000
Re: naughty Python "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-12-30 09:38 +0100
Re: naughty Python The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-12-30 11:11 +0000
Re: naughty Python Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2025-12-30 07:38 -0700
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Re: naughty Python c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-12-30 03:14 -0500
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Re: naughty Python c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-12-30 19:47 -0500
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Re: naughty Python c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-12-30 23:11 -0500
Re: naughty Python rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-12-31 07:57 +0000
Re: naughty Python c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-12-31 09:13 -0500
Re: naughty Python rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-12-31 19:13 +0000
Re: naughty Python Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2025-12-31 18:55 +0000
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Re: naughty Python Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-02 02:18 +0000
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Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-04 21:00 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-01-04 15:11 +0100
Re: naughty Pascal John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-01-05 10:49 -0800
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-05 19:57 -0500
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Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-06 06:28 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-06 18:57 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-06 16:04 -0500
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Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-06 20:47 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-07 02:00 +0000
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Re: naughty Pascal Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-08 04:57 +0000
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Re: Naughty Advertising (was Re: naughty Pascal) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-08 18:23 +0000
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Re: naughty Pascal Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-08 19:16 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-08 20:23 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-09 01:48 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Bobbie Sellers <bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.com> - 2026-01-08 19:32 -0800
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-08 23:36 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-09 06:44 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-01-08 18:46 -0800
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-08 22:15 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-01-08 20:13 -0800
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-08 23:40 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-01-08 22:23 -0800
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-09 07:04 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-01-09 07:58 -0800
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-09 18:47 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-09 20:08 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-09 10:00 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-01-09 08:06 -0800
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-09 18:51 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-01-09 10:54 -0800
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-09 20:36 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-01-09 13:24 -0800
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-10 10:27 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-10 07:42 -0700
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-10 19:44 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-10 13:03 -0700
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-10 23:56 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-11 11:02 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Bobbie Sellers <bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.com> - 2026-01-10 15:39 -0800
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-11 11:05 +0000
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Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-12 20:58 +0000
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Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-12 18:17 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-13 06:26 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-13 09:26 +0000
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Re: naughty Pascal "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-01-20 14:26 +0100
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-20 13:29 +0000
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Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-11 11:19 +0000
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Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-10 20:51 -0500
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Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-11 01:17 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-11 11:00 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-11 11:47 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-11 11:29 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Niklas Karlsson <nikke.karlsson@gmail.com> - 2026-01-11 17:44 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-11 19:46 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Niklas Karlsson <nikke.karlsson@gmail.com> - 2026-01-11 20:23 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-11 20:30 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Niklas Karlsson <nikke.karlsson@gmail.com> - 2026-01-11 21:17 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-11 18:05 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-11 17:58 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-12 03:47 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-12 23:41 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-12 22:58 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-13 05:40 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-13 07:41 -0700
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-13 12:38 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-13 18:00 +0000
Naughty Cat Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-01-13 14:29 -0500
Re: Naughty Cat rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-14 00:42 +0000
Re: Naughty Cat Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-14 07:27 -0700
Re: naughty Pascal scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-01-13 19:34 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-14 00:49 +0000
Tinned tuna [Was: naughty Pascal] "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-01-20 14:58 +0100
Oil down the drain [Was: naughty Pascal] "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-01-20 14:53 +0100
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-11 20:57 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-12 11:50 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-12 18:31 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-11 07:43 -0700
Re: naughty Pascal scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-01-11 16:44 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-11 21:34 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Niklas Karlsson <nikke.karlsson@gmail.com> - 2026-01-11 21:38 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-01-12 08:11 -0800
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-12 18:45 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-01-12 19:52 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-13 05:22 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-13 00:37 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-13 08:18 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-12 13:15 -0700
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-12 18:10 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-01-12 00:47 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-12 04:10 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-01-12 15:44 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-12 18:52 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-12 20:46 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-12 18:12 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-13 05:50 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-13 12:41 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-13 18:17 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-01-13 22:41 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-14 01:01 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-01-16 21:40 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Daniel <me@sc1f1dan.com> - 2026-01-18 12:30 -0800
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-18 21:08 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-01-19 16:22 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-13 09:23 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-01-12 08:25 -0800
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-12 18:22 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-11 11:26 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-11 21:35 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-12 11:57 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-12 23:41 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-13 06:32 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Harold Stevens <wookie@aspen.localdomain> - 2026-01-13 04:35 -0600
Re: naughty Pascal "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-01-20 15:38 +0100
Re: naughty Pascal John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-01-09 09:36 -0800
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-09 06:58 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Bobbie Sellers <bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.com> - 2026-01-09 09:19 -0800
Re: naughty Pascal Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-07 06:33 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-07 09:55 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-07 21:46 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-08 04:57 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-07 18:48 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-07 06:33 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-07 07:31 -0700
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-05 23:18 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-06 07:42 -0700
Re: naughty Pascal Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-06 20:01 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-07 07:27 -0700
Re: naughty Pascal antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-01-06 22:32 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-06 20:53 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-01-07 11:51 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-01-06 08:20 -0800
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-06 10:15 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-01-06 06:33 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-06 19:20 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-01-06 09:14 -0800
Re: naughty Pascal Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-05 12:33 -0700
Re: naughty Pascal John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-01-05 11:50 -0800
Re: naughty Pascal John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-01-05 13:37 -0800
Re: naughty Pascal "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-01-06 13:19 +0100
Re: naughty Pascal John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-01-06 08:30 -0800
Re: naughty Pascal cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-01-06 17:04 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-06 16:30 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-01-07 13:40 +0100
Re: naughty Pascal Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-07 07:47 -0700
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-07 20:08 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-07 20:18 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-08 04:57 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-08 00:36 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-08 07:00 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-01-08 08:33 -0800
Re: naughty Pascal Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-08 20:00 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-08 20:21 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-08 22:45 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-08 23:52 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-01-09 16:03 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-08 07:51 -0700
Re: naughty Pascal "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-01-07 13:38 +0100
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-07 22:03 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-07 19:21 -0700
Re: naughty Pascal Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-08 02:26 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-07 23:20 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-08 11:20 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-01-08 08:34 -0800
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-08 20:19 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-09 01:42 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-09 09:57 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-01-08 14:43 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-08 20:15 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-09 01:44 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-09 09:56 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-08 19:28 -0700
Re: naughty Pascal Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-08 07:47 -0700
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-08 19:52 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-08 22:45 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-09 01:35 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-09 10:02 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-09 08:16 -0700
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-09 18:46 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-09 20:40 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-09 20:38 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-09 20:56 -0700
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-10 10:58 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-01-10 03:12 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-10 19:39 +0000
Re: naughty useless code (was Re: naughty Pascal) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-10 20:52 +0000
Re: naughty useless code (was Re: naughty Pascal) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-11 00:02 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-01-09 16:04 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-08 20:54 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-09 06:36 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-09 08:13 -0700
Re: Naughty PL/I (was Re: naughty Pascal) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-09 18:38 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-01-10 14:40 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-10 20:50 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-11 02:00 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-11 16:55 +0000
Re: Naughty Fortran (was Re: naughty Pascal) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-11 20:24 +0000
Re: Naughty Fortran (was Re: naughty Pascal) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-11 18:00 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-11 21:31 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-08 19:49 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-08 20:43 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-10 19:39 +0000
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-10 20:47 +0000
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-11 00:27 +0000
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-01-10 18:41 -0800
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-10 20:06 -0700
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-10 22:44 -0500
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-11 07:40 -0700
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-11 03:50 +0000
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) Harold Stevens <wookie@aspen.localdomain> - 2026-01-11 05:55 -0600
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-01-11 14:18 +0000
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) Andreas Eder <a_eder_muc@web.de> - 2026-01-11 17:00 +0100
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-11 20:44 +0000
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-12 11:49 +0000
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-12 07:52 -0700
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-12 17:03 +0000
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-12 19:57 +0000
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-01-12 20:05 +0000
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) Niklas Karlsson <nikke.karlsson@gmail.com> - 2026-01-12 20:16 +0000
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-13 05:01 +0000
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) Niklas Karlsson <nikke.karlsson@gmail.com> - 2026-01-13 06:31 +0000
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-13 08:09 +0000
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) Niklas Karlsson <nikke.karlsson@gmail.com> - 2026-01-13 14:21 +0000
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-13 17:54 +0000
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-13 04:46 +0000
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-13 04:31 +0000
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-12 19:56 +0000
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-13 00:24 +0000
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-13 00:36 +0000
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-12 23:04 -0500
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-11 01:52 -0500
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-01-10 23:34 -0800
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-11 02:50 -0500
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-01-11 14:55 +0000
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-01-12 02:42 +0000
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-12 07:50 -0700
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-01-12 09:14 -0800
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-12 13:12 -0700
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) Harold Stevens <wookie@aspen.localdomain> - 2026-01-12 14:48 -0600
Re: naughty C (was Re: naughty Pascal) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-11 07:48 -0700
Re: naughty Pascal antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-01-11 01:32 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-11 11:21 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Bob Martin <bob.martin@excite.com> - 2026-01-09 06:20 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-09 08:09 -0700
Re: Naughty Python (was Re: naughty Pascal) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-09 18:37 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-09 20:17 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-06 19:22 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-01-07 13:41 +0100
Re: naughty Pascal Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-05 21:42 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-05 20:33 -0700
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-05 22:58 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-05 20:27 -0700
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-05 22:54 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-06 07:40 -0700
Re: naughty Pascal Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-06 04:09 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-06 10:10 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-06 07:46 -0700
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-06 17:19 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-06 12:39 -0700
Re: naughty Pascal cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-01-06 19:56 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-07 06:33 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-07 09:44 +0000
COBOL compilers (Re: naughty Pascal) Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2026-01-07 14:11 +0000
Re: COBOL compilers (Re: naughty Pascal) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-07 20:21 +0000
Re: COBOL compilers (Re: naughty Pascal) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-07 19:16 -0700
Re: COBOL compilers (Re: naughty Pascal) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-08 02:24 +0000
Re: COBOL compilers (Re: naughty Pascal) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-08 07:41 -0700
Re: COBOL compilers (Re: naughty Pascal) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-08 20:02 +0000
Re: COBOL compilers (Re: naughty Pascal) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-08 02:24 +0000
Re: COBOL compilers (Re: naughty Pascal) Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2026-01-09 14:22 -0500
Re: COBOL compilers (Re: naughty Pascal) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-09 22:12 +0000
Re: COBOL compilers (Re: naughty Pascal) Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2026-01-10 12:18 -0500
Re: COBOL compilers (Re: naughty Pascal) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-10 20:46 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-06 19:57 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-01-06 21:53 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-06 19:17 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-06 16:06 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-01-06 23:44 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-07 09:57 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-07 09:56 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-07 22:08 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-08 11:21 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-08 04:57 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-08 00:41 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-08 11:26 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-08 19:59 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-08 22:45 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-08 21:00 -0500
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-08 20:00 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-01-08 20:09 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-09 02:02 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-09 10:05 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-01-09 16:02 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-09 18:48 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-09 20:27 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-10 10:15 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-01-06 15:31 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-06 10:39 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-01-06 09:25 -0800
Re: naughty Pascal scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-01-05 20:35 +0000
Re: naughty Pascal "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-01-06 13:25 +0100
Re: naughty Pascal Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-06 20:00 +0000
Re: naughty Python Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-02 14:51 -0700
Re: naughty Python Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2026-01-02 22:50 +0000
Re: old Algol, was naughty Python John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-01-03 02:45 +0000
Re: naughty Python Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-02 19:47 -0700
Re: naughty Python The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-01 21:00 +0000
Re: naughty Python rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-01 21:43 +0000
Re: naughty Python antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-01-01 23:54 +0000
Re: naughty Python Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-01-01 20:14 -0700
Re: naughty Python rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-02 06:03 +0000
Re: naughty Python The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-02 11:02 +0000
Re: naughty Python rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-02 05:59 +0000
Re: naughty Python ted@loft.tnolan.com (Ted Nolan <tednolan>) - 2026-01-02 06:01 +0000
Re: naughty Python Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-02 06:58 +0000
Re: naughty Python ted@loft.tnolan.com (Ted Nolan <tednolan>) - 2026-01-02 17:14 +0000
Re: naughty Python c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-02 14:58 -0500
Re: naughty Python ted@loft.tnolan.com (Ted Nolan <tednolan>) - 2026-01-02 21:11 +0000
Re: naughty Python c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-02 05:37 -0500
Re: naughty Python The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-02 11:04 +0000
Re: naughty Python "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-01-02 12:24 +0100
Re: naughty Python c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-02 06:51 -0500
Re: naughty Python rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-02 19:56 +0000
Re: naughty Python The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-02 10:59 +0000
Re: naughty Python "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-01-02 12:27 +0100
Re: naughty Python c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-02 06:54 -0500
Re: naughty Python The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-02 11:57 +0000
Re: naughty Python c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-02 07:10 -0500
Re: naughty Python "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-01-02 14:34 +0100
Re: naughty Python "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-01-02 14:38 +0100
Re: naughty Python John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-01-02 08:49 -0800
Re: C structure portability, naughty Python John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-01-02 18:26 +0000
Re: C structure portability, naughty Python c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-02 15:08 -0500
Re: C structure portability, naughty Python John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-01-02 20:32 +0000
Re: C structure portability, naughty Python rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-03 00:08 +0000
Re: C structure portability, naughty Python John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-01-03 02:47 +0000
Re: C structure portability, naughty Python Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-01-03 07:03 -0500
Re: C structure portability, naughty Python rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-03 19:43 +0000
Re: C structure portability, naughty Python Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-01-04 06:42 -0500
Re: C structure portability, naughty Python rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-04 20:29 +0000
Re: C structure portability, naughty Python "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-01-04 15:14 +0100
Re: C structure portability, naughty Python Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-01-04 09:43 -0500
Re: C structure portability, naughty Python Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-04 19:41 +0000
Re: Naughty C♯ Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-04 21:18 +0000
Re: Naughty C♯ c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-04 19:04 -0500
Re: Naughty C♯ rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-05 03:55 +0000
Re: Naughty C♯ The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-05 11:29 +0000
Re: Naughty C♯ Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-01-05 06:59 -0500
Re: Naughty C♯ Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-01-05 06:55 -0500
Re: Naughty C♯ rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-05 17:43 +0000
Re: Naughty C♯ Niklas Karlsson <nikke.karlsson@gmail.com> - 2026-01-05 18:08 +0000
Re: Naughty C♯ rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-05 20:32 +0000
Re: Naughty C♯ Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-01-05 17:25 -0500
Re: Naughty C♯ Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-01-06 07:55 +0000
Re: Naughty C♯ Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-01-06 06:19 -0500
Re: Naughty C♯ c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-05 08:26 -0500
Re: Naughty C♯ rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-05 18:09 +0000
Re: Naughty C♯ Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-05 18:16 +0000
Re: Naughty C♯ Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-05 05:57 +0000
Re: Naughty C♯ rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-01-05 17:48 +0000
Re: Naughty C♯ The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-01-05 18:09 +0000
Re: Naughty C♯ Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-05 18:20 +0000
Re: Naughty C♯ Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-01-05 18:24 +0000
Re: Naughty C♯ Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-01-05 21:44 +0000
Re: Naughty C♯ c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-01-05 19:31 -0500
Re: Naughty C♯ antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-01-06 12:16 +0000
Re: Naughty C♯ Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-01-06 11:12 -0500
Re: Naughty C♯ cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-01-06 16:25 +0000
Re: Naughty C♯ scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-01-06 17:59 +0000
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