Groups | Search | Server Info | Login | Register

Groups > alt.dreams.castaneda > #18559

Re: and no religion too

Show all headers | View raw

On Wednesday, August 22, 2018 at 12:43:10 PM UTC-7, slider wrote:
> On Wed, 22 Aug 2018 17:23:15 +0100, Jeremy H. Denisovan  
>  wrote:
> 
> > On Wednesday, August 22, 2018 at 3:45:52 AM UTC-7, slider wrote:
> >> > I don't want gangsters in power.
> >>
> >> ### - probably nowhere left on the planet you can get away from that
> >> anymore...
> >>
> >> gangsters are 'running' the show!
> >>
> >> it's THEIR show! :)
> >>
> >> as for the Don of 'Dons' (heh) t'aint nada you can do about it pal,  
> >> might
> >> as well try to intimidate your local Cos mob hah! plus was 'put' in  
> >> there
> >> by the 1+19% to make things 'right' again (no pun intended...) what
> >> joe-public thinks being irrelevant to their aims/goals of getting  
> >> 'their'
> >> world (of money!) back in order again! they don't give 2-fucks about
> >> anything else! - meanwhile, they're back to demonising the left so the
> >> current don will have a better chance of getting a second term...
> >>
> >> same as it ever was really, only worse :)
> >
> > It's hard to believe you really believe all that. To me, it seems
> > like a lot of rationalizations designed to prove to yourself that
> > everything is futile.
> 
> ### - am merely trying to prove to you that everything you've done &  
> imagine you 'could' have done so far, is/was utterly futile, and is/was  
> ultimately just a lot of hissing & spitting on your part to absolutely no  
> real-world effect whatsoever, other than that of bombarding us all here  
> with complaints... at best you've merely added to (or tried to increase)  
> the emotional hysteria surrounding the whole thing but that's all, it's  
> just all in your head that you're even involved at all... and 'coz there  
> isn't a goddamn thing you can 'actually' do to change anything as you're  
> merely an emotional-engaged bystander that's actually playing-into the  
> whole frenzy thing 'they've' deliberately created!

Oh. Well, if that's it, then that's all completely wrong. :)
I do all kinds of things to help that you never see here at all.


> > The 8 Obama years were not very much like
> > what's happening now. The same forces existed, but they weren't
> > nearly as much in control. That proves things can swing the other way,
> > and since they can, then they could be swung even further that way.
> > And probably will be, eventually.
> 
> ### - obama had everything when he first took office (both houses) and  
> then they slowly tied his hands till there was almost nothing he could do  
> of any moment, that's the way it works! you've had left-wing governments  
> before and the world is 'still' a goddamn mess! the left don't control  
> anything! at best they can have 'maybe' as much as a 5% influence, and  
> that's when their in power!

Obama accomplished a lot. His 8 years were relatively stable ones.
Nothing even close to the circus-like nightmare we have now.

 
> > Yes, there has lately been a large worldwide swing back to the right.
> > But the advantage of that is that it should become apparent how
> > destructive it is. Then there will be another reactionary swing back
> > to the left. And yeah, government needs to be a bit left of center,
> > because it is a collective endeavor. We actually agree on that. :)
> 
> ### - a 'temporary' swing back to the left only heh, 'coz the right-wing  
> 'own' everything including the media! so it's never long before they're  
> back in and have everyone blaming all the then problems on the left!

But the right wing does not own everything, or the media.
There are many powerful progressive companies and media outlets.
You reason from incorrect premises.
 

> if people from the 80% were more 'politically' educated they would never  
> in a million years vote other than left every time, and i mean every time  
> without fail! and this because they'd realise the importance of voting the  
> right down at every opportunity who are, after all, only a minority group!  
> the right-wing should never ever win! 'they' do all, however, realise the  
> total importance of them all voting every time ('because' they're a  
> minority group!) and then collectively work at tipping & eroding the  
> balance by hook & by crook (with the emphasis on crook!) down from an  
> 80/20 split to more 50/50 where they then at least 'get' a chance to win!  
> plus just look at the trouble they go to to achieve exactly that??
> 
> if you (or anyone) really wants to DO something about the situation  
> 'for-real', then you'd have to educate the 80% majority accordingly (in  
> france, for example, their populace since the french revolution, has  
> always been traditionally more politically educated than most, thus the  
> far right-wing hardly ever get in there! people taking to the streets if  
> it even 'looks' that way lol, even so they still don't exactly have  
> perfect lives nor a perfect society, and are actually rather racist and  
> thus right-wing lol!)

Part of the reason I post about it so much is to educate.
Of course. And I do that in other forums as well, not just here.

 
> so ya see, there's nada you can 'really' do jeremy! you can make a lot of  
> noise and a fuss but it doesn't 'actually' DO anything, other than just  
> giving your peers a headache heh...
> 
> by rights (again no pun intended) the right should NEVER ever get into  
> government! EVER!
> 
> so they BUY their way in! every time! they're the gangsters with 'all' the  
> power remember?

You admitted people could stop it by becoming educated about
the issues. Gangsters can be put in jail. Two of Trump's gangsters
are going down right now.
 

> as for the 'current' don; he's just applying the age-old, time-tested  
> 'divide & rule' method globally! and because while everyone's at each  
> other's throats he's getting a window to do what he wants! (the brits  
> conquered/expanded the known world by applying just that principle alone!)
> 
> face it, there's absolutely 'nothing' you (or anyone) can do short of  
> shooting the fucker!
> 
> and then they'd just go-get another one anyway!?

Trump's position is *very* shaky now. And he hasn't even been in
power 2 years. I still think he'll go down. Even if he doesn't,
his political power will be severely undermined and blocked.
And if he does go down, the 'next one' - Pence - although he may
be 'worse' in some ways - won't be able to do much, because Trump
will have served as a bad example (and a warning) - and as another
terrible disgrace to the right wing.

Pence would then be an entirely different KIND of battle
if it comes to that. It's a battle that can also be won.

There are MANY severe problems, of course. I'm not blind to them.
For example, although the majority of the people are progressive,
the Supreme Court is far more right wing. That's because Republican
presidents have appointed 14 out of the last 18 justices.
But that merely means that the people - for the most part -
CANNOT rely on the courts right now. They MUST rely on the
ballot box until we can balance out the courts.

There are MANY other major problems. Huge problems. Since I remain
heavily involved I'm acutely aware of most of them. I wouldn't
discuss them with you for the most part since you just 'run away'. 

 
> thus futile!

You're only proving the point I originally made. :) It's a bunch
of rationalizations designed to prove to yourself that everything
is 'futile' and 'nothing can be done'. But it's all bad reasoning.

 
> the 'best' that can thus genuinely be done, being to 'realise' all that  
> (and the futility of getting involved) and then find some way to live  
> 'beside' it all without letting it drive you nuts hehe...

I already live beside it without letting it drive me nuts AND
get involved in fixing things. They're not mutually exclusive. :)
To believe that is just another error in reasoning.

 
> whatever ways ya looks at it all: we 'still' live in an almost totally  
> barbaric world of masters & brutalised slaves! the 'whole thing' no better  
> than one huge concentration camp! (albert camus said that too: slave camps  
> under the banner of freedom? spot-on!)
> 
> plus i don't mean to sound condescending, but don'tcha think i've maybe  
> stood at the exact same place you're standing now? (years ago i mean...)  
> and hated the fuckers! (laffing...) cursed them boodclaat! (jamaican  
> slang...) even despaired of the world and the horrible state of it! even  
> despised humanity for being such... cunts! :)
>
> heh, it was just after an election here that put the right-wing straight  
> back into power after 'years' of their crap making life harder for people!  
> i was sooo sure they were gone THIS time?? but nooo... the fucking  
> 'idiots' had only gone and voted them all back in??? lol i just couldn't  
> accept it!!! i'd stayed up all night watching the election results, and by  
> 6am in the morning it became clear we were all gonna get 'yet another'  
> 5-years of it, damn you! damn you all to hell! (laffing...) and i guess i  
> was pretty upset! (defo an understatement heh...)
> 
> i gots in my car and stormed-off, fuming basically hah! it was just  
> getting light and i headed up to an old piece of common land/open park and  
> the cafe they have at the top there, cussin' and spittin' the whole way  
> (lol...) only it was a bit early and the little cafe hadn't opened yet so  
> i sat on a nearby bench as far away as possible from anyone else while  
> keeping in eye-shot of the cafe; i definitely wasn't very pleased with  
> humanity today! :)))
> 
> fuming i was, sitting there on my bench, when i finally heard the sound of  
> shutters going up at around 7am, i'll go get me a tea and a sandwich, and  
> god help them if they even so much as 'look' at me sideways! heads will  
> roll! (so not exactly a happy camper that day huh lol...)
> 
> got up and wandered in there prolly looking like hell anyway (hah) maybe  
> even just hoping to start something! today i was NOT humanity's friend!  
> some young girl serving i was ready to bite her frickin' head-off mate,  
> and i don't care who she was! fucking humanity! bunch of cunts! ALL of 'em!
> 
> and then in a soft spanish accent i gets: good morning.. sir (nobody calls  
> me sir!?) what would you like this good morning? i was ready to savage  
> someone (whatdoifuckin'-want??? under my breath...) but something in her  
> soft tone halted me some, wrong-footed me, forced a terse/clipped reply  
> outta me, she was only very young, maybe only 17 or 18, very attractive  
> and softly spoken, only a kid! -tea and one of those (pointing at a cheese  
> sandwich) and i definitely wasn't going to say 'please'! fact of the  
> matter was, she didn't give me a chance, there wasn't even a single gap in  
> her behaviour that could possibly justify me being mean to her? mad as i  
> was i just couldn't let myself sully her or her mood in any way and she  
> wasn't doing anything wrong! so i bit my lip! still nodded instead of  
> saying thank you or anything (slider in a bad mood hehe) and headed back  
> to my bench... only it was a different slider that arrived back there...  
> and now there i am, sipping tea and munching on a fresh sandwich somewhat  
> mollified by just her acceptable behaviour & youth alone... i realised  
> then that i liked women, women are alright in their own way, they might be  
> totally ignorant just like the rest of 'em but they're still nice? 'she'  
> was nice! then considered that just over half the population of the world  
> are women! and with that i'd just let-off more than half of humanity! -the  
> last of my anger & despair drained away; i'd just forgiven/let-off more  
> than half of the cunts! i didn't really hate humanity after all! at least  
> not all of them, not the majority of them... i smiled prolly for the first  
> time in hours haha, and ate my sandwich and drank my tea, suddenly calm  
> now, everything was alright again! YES they really ARE a bunch of ignorant  
> cunts! damned ignorant! but their women ain't so bad... and i've indeed  
> met quite a few decent chaps in my time too... suddenly it was quite nice  
> sitting there on that bench, on that hill in the early morning, surrounded  
> by trees looking down over southern london at the early morning  
> rush-hour... finished my sandwich and my tea feeling like a weight had  
> just been lifted off of me... and went back home... bunch of cunts yes!  
> heh... but i still liked 'em even if they ARE all fucked up 'and' fucking  
> stupid to boot... they're all just a bit fucked up is all :)
> 
> and i haven't 'involved' myself in politics ever since!
> 
> the end. :)

Well, I've certainly felt that way many times over the decades,
going all the way back to Nixon, and I sympathize. But in practical
terms, you merely gave up after a bad loss - on the grounds of a
series of false premises.

More women could be elected to political office, you know. In general,
women might be more likely to treat our own mother (earth) and the
'children' of earth (people and animals) better. And yet some women
are raving right-wing loonies. You realize that I hope. And many men
are politically astute and conscious of what would benefit the world.
If that wasn't the case the world would already be destroyed.

I wonder if you have noticed: you are a man. :)  So am I.

The only real way to totally lose everything is to give up,
despairing that any constructive actions would be 'futile'.
Iow, 'your way' is just exactly how we could lose everything.
I'd urge you to reconsider. Of course, I already have many times. :)

.

Back to alt.dreams.castaneda | Previous | Next — Previous in thread | Next in thread | Find similar

Thread

Re: and no religion too "Jeremy H. Denisovan" <david.j.worrell@gmail.com> - 2018-07-21 14:40 -0700
  Re: and no religion too "Jeremy H. Denisovan" <david.j.worrell@gmail.com> - 2018-07-23 15:47 -0700
    Re: and no religion too "Jeremy H. Denisovan" <david.j.worrell@gmail.com> - 2018-07-31 13:18 -0700
      Re: and no religion too slider <slider@anashram.com> - 2018-07-31 21:43 +0100
        Re: and no religion too "Jeremy H. Denisovan" <david.j.worrell@gmail.com> - 2018-08-21 15:22 -0700
          Re: and no religion too feewilly <allreadydun@gmail.com> - 2018-08-21 16:25 -0700
          Re: and no religion too slider <slider@anashram.org> - 2018-08-22 11:45 +0100
            Re: and no religion too "Jeremy H. Denisovan" <david.j.worrell@gmail.com> - 2018-08-22 09:23 -0700
              Re: and no religion too "Jeremy H. Denisovan" <david.j.worrell@gmail.com> - 2018-08-22 09:57 -0700
              Re: and no religion too slider <slider@anashram.com> - 2018-08-22 20:43 +0100
                Re: and no religion too "Jeremy H. Denisovan" <david.j.worrell@gmail.com> - 2018-08-22 14:03 -0700
                Re: and no religion too slider <slider@anashram.com> - 2018-08-22 23:07 +0100
                Re: and no religion too LowRider44M <intraphase@gmail.com> - 2018-08-22 17:39 -0700
                Re: and no religion too slider <slider@anashram.com> - 2018-08-23 02:53 +0100
                Re: and no religion too "Jeremy H. Denisovan" <david.j.worrell@gmail.com> - 2018-08-22 19:44 -0700
                Re: and no religion too slider <slider@anashram.com> - 2018-08-23 04:37 +0100
                Re: and no religion too LowRider44M <intraphase@gmail.com> - 2018-08-22 21:31 -0700
                Re: and no religion too LowRider44M <intraphase@gmail.com> - 2018-08-22 22:28 -0700
                Re: and no religion too slider <slider@anashram.com> - 2018-08-23 14:42 +0100
                the dumbest shit ever chorro <allreadydun@gmail.com> - 2018-08-23 08:13 -0700
                Re: the dumbest shit ever slider <slider@anashram.com> - 2018-08-23 16:53 +0100
                Re: the dumbest shit ever "Jeremy H. Denisovan" <david.j.worrell@gmail.com> - 2018-08-23 12:24 -0700
                Re: the dumbest shit ever slider <slider@anashram.com> - 2018-08-23 21:35 +0100
                Re: the dumbest shit ever chorro <allreadydun@gmail.com> - 2018-08-23 13:38 -0700
                Re: the dumbest shit ever "Jeremy H. Denisovan" <david.j.worrell@gmail.com> - 2018-08-24 09:54 -0700
                Re: the dumbest shit ever slider <slider@anashram.com> - 2018-08-24 18:40 +0100
                Re: the dumbest shit ever "Jeremy H. Denisovan" <david.j.worrell@gmail.com> - 2018-08-24 11:37 -0700
                Re: the dumbest shit ever slider <slider@anashram.com> - 2018-08-24 20:05 +0100
                fuck that puto chorro <allreadydun@gmail.com> - 2018-08-24 11:41 -0700
                Re: fuck that puto slider <slider@anashram.com> - 2018-08-24 19:49 +0100
                Re: what's that you say, puto? You don't like the Trump talk? "Jeremy H. Denisovan" <david.j.worrell@gmail.com> - 2018-08-24 14:34 -0700
                nice try gas boy chorro <allreadydun@gmail.com> - 2018-08-24 15:25 -0700
                no cigar dull boy "Jeremy H. Donovan" <jeremyhdonovan@gmail.com> - 2018-08-24 16:48 -0700
                fuck yourself chorro <allreadydun@gmail.com> - 2018-08-24 17:00 -0700
                Dumbo... "Jeremy H. Donovan" <jeremyhdonovan@gmail.com> - 2018-08-24 17:25 -0700
                Re: what's that you say, puto? You don't like the Trump talk? thang ornerythinchus <thangolossus@gmail.com> - 2018-09-06 10:28 +0800
                Re: fuck that puto thang ornerythinchus <thangolossus@gmail.com> - 2018-09-06 10:31 +0800
                Re: fuck that puto slider <slider@anashram.com> - 2018-09-07 00:59 +0100
                my 'take' on the election alreadygone <allreadydun@gmail.com> - 2018-09-07 11:50 -0700
                Re: my 'take' on the election thang ornerythinchus <thangolossus@gmail.com> - 2018-09-08 19:05 +0800
                Re: my 'take' on the election "Jeremy H. Donovan" <jeremyhdonovan@gmail.com> - 2018-09-11 09:33 -0700
                Re: my 'take' on the election "Jeremy H. Donovan" <jeremyhdonovan@gmail.com> - 2018-09-11 16:26 -0700
                Re: my 'take' on the election "Jeremy H. Donovan" <jeremyhdonovan@gmail.com> - 2018-09-16 12:09 -0700
                Re: the dumbest shit ever LowRider44M <intraphase@gmail.com> - 2018-08-25 21:40 -0700
                Re: the dumbest shit ever LowRider44M <intraphase@gmail.com> - 2018-08-25 21:59 -0700
                Re: the dumbest shit ever LowRider44M <intraphase@gmail.com> - 2018-08-25 22:36 -0700
                Re: the dumbest shit ever LowRider44M <intraphase@gmail.com> - 2018-08-25 23:51 -0700
                Re: the dumbest shit ever chorro <allreadydun@gmail.com> - 2018-08-26 05:36 -0700
                Re: the dumbest shit ever LowRider44M <intraphase@gmail.com> - 2018-08-26 18:53 -0700
                Re: the dumbest shit ever LowRider44M <intraphase@gmail.com> - 2018-08-26 19:24 -0700
                Re: the dumbest shit ever LowRider44M <intraphase@gmail.com> - 2018-08-25 21:23 -0700
                Re: the dumbest shit ever "Jeremy H. Denisovan" <david.j.worrell@gmail.com> - 2018-08-27 15:12 -0700
                Re: the dumbest shit ever LowRider44M <intraphase@gmail.com> - 2018-08-28 21:12 -0700
                Re: moving on from all that gaslighting bs... "Jeremy H. Donovan" <jeremyhdonovan@gmail.com> - 2018-09-03 13:47 -0700
                same ole, same ole jewedus <allreadydun@gmail.com> - 2018-09-03 14:26 -0700
                Re: same ole, same ole "Jeremy H. Donovan" <jeremyhdonovan@gmail.com> - 2018-09-03 14:46 -0700
                Re: same ole, same ole jewedus <allreadydun@gmail.com> - 2018-09-03 15:36 -0700
                Re: same ole, same ole "Jeremy H. Donovan" <jeremyhdonovan@gmail.com> - 2018-09-03 16:08 -0700
                Re: same ole, same ole slider <slider@anashram.com> - 2018-09-04 00:14 +0100
                Re: same ole, same ole "Jeremy H. Donovan" <jeremyhdonovan@gmail.com> - 2018-09-03 16:44 -0700
                Re: same ole, same ole jewedus <allreadydun@gmail.com> - 2018-09-03 16:57 -0700
                Re: same ole, same ole "Jeremy H. Donovan" <jeremyhdonovan@gmail.com> - 2018-09-03 17:26 -0700
                Re: same ole, same ole slider <slider@anashram.com> - 2018-09-04 01:31 +0100
                Re: same ole, same ole "Jeremy H. Donovan" <jeremyhdonovan@gmail.com> - 2018-09-03 17:43 -0700
                Re: same ole, same ole slider <slider@anashram.com> - 2018-09-04 13:46 +0100
                Re: same ole, same ole "Jeremy H. Donovan" <jeremyhdonovan@gmail.com> - 2018-09-03 17:47 -0700
                Re: same ole, same ole thang ornerythinchus <thangolossus@gmail.com> - 2018-09-06 10:44 +0800
                Re: same ole, same ole slider <slider@anashram.com> - 2018-09-07 00:16 +0100
                Re: same ole, same ole "Jeremy H. Donovan" <jeremyhdonovan@gmail.com> - 2018-09-06 16:50 -0700
                Re: same ole, same ole thang ornerythinchus <thangolossus@gmail.com> - 2018-09-06 10:43 +0800
                Re: same ole, same ole slider <slider@anashram.com> - 2018-09-04 13:51 +0100
                Re: same ole, same ole "Jeremy H. Donovan" <jeremyhdonovan@gmail.com> - 2018-09-04 10:45 -0700
                Re: same ole, same ole slider <slider@anashram.com> - 2018-09-04 19:13 +0100
                Re: same ole, same ole "Jeremy H. Donovan" <jeremyhdonovan@gmail.com> - 2018-09-04 11:19 -0700
                bogus man jewedus <allreadydun@gmail.com> - 2018-09-04 11:26 -0700
                don't push your luck jewedus <allreadydun@gmail.com> - 2018-09-04 11:28 -0700
                Re: don't push your luck "Jeremy H. Donovan" <jeremyhdonovan@gmail.com> - 2018-09-04 11:44 -0700
                Re: don't push your luck thang ornerythinchus <thangolossus@gmail.com> - 2018-09-06 11:01 +0800
                Re: Hopefully you guys can look at a few pictures "Jeremy H. Donovan" <jeremyhdonovan@gmail.com> - 2018-09-06 14:57 -0700
                Re: same ole, same ole "Jeremy H. Donovan" <jeremyhdonovan@gmail.com> - 2018-09-04 11:34 -0700
                Re: same ole, same ole slider <slider@anashram.com> - 2018-09-04 19:43 +0100
                Re: same ole, same ole "Jeremy H. Donovan" <jeremyhdonovan@gmail.com> - 2018-09-04 12:18 -0700
                Re: same ole, same ole thang ornerythinchus <thangolossus@gmail.com> - 2018-09-06 10:55 +0800
                cricketts jewedus <allreadydun@gmail.com> - 2018-09-04 11:22 -0700
                Re: cricketts slider <slider@anashram.org> - 2018-09-04 19:52 +0100
                i like peanut butter jewedus <allreadydun@gmail.com> - 2018-09-04 11:57 -0700
                Re: i like peanut butter slider <slider@anashram.com> - 2018-09-04 20:29 +0100
                Re: i like peanut butter "Jeremy H. Donovan" <jeremyhdonovan@gmail.com> - 2018-09-04 12:49 -0700
                Re: same ole, same ole thang ornerythinchus <thangolossus@gmail.com> - 2018-09-06 10:45 +0800
                Re: same ole, same ole slider <slider@anashram.com> - 2018-09-07 00:10 +0100
                Re: and no religion too LowRider44M <intraphase@gmail.com> - 2018-08-22 19:48 -0700
                Re: and no religion too "Jeremy H. Denisovan" <david.j.worrell@gmail.com> - 2018-08-22 20:02 -0700
                Re: and no religion too LowRider44M <intraphase@gmail.com> - 2018-08-22 20:39 -0700
                Re: and no religion too "Jeremy H. Denisovan" <david.j.worrell@gmail.com> - 2018-08-22 19:41 -0700
                Re: and no religion too LowRider44M <intraphase@gmail.com> - 2018-08-22 19:51 -0700
                Re: and no religion too "Jeremy H. Denisovan" <david.j.worrell@gmail.com> - 2018-08-22 20:08 -0700
                Re: and no religion too LowRider44M <intraphase@gmail.com> - 2018-08-22 20:14 -0700

csiph-web