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Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11?

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Le 18/08/12 22:48, Keith Thompson a écrit :

I wrote:
>> o Microsoft doesn't like the C language at all. Let's close shop then.
>> >    Microsoft may have a point. There is no need for a C committee if we
>> >    have Microsoft.
>> >
>> >    WHAT?
>> >
>> >    You are again MICROSOFT, the software giant? You must be nuts.

Then Mr Thompson answered:

> This isn't about anybody being against anybody.

That's your opinion. I am definitely against the policy of microsoft
of degrading the support of standard C and against their opinion
that is they that rule what windows users should use as a language.

> Microsoft exists

I am not denying that... :-)

> and
> is significant.

I am just denying that. 640K should be OK for everyone said someone
years ago. No, that opinion wasn't significant even if microsoft was
a software giant then. For me having a lot of money doesn't make you 
right, sorry. You snipped all other arguments (declarations at any
place, making the whole standard C library "deprecated") how convenient
for you.

> There are other C compilers for Windows, but using
> one of them may not be an option for some projects (for example,
> management might insist on using only Microsoft development tools).

And so what?

If management insists on using "MICROSOFT ONLY" why should be
declare that ALL OTHERS even those users that do not use Microsoft
(Apple programmers, iOS programmers, Android programmers,
Sun programmers, and a VERY long list) should have a language
that is defined by Microsoft?

> Conclusion:*some*  C programmers (those who need to use Microsoft
> C compilers) are unable to use most C99 and C11 features.

Life is tough when you have to use Microsoft, I know. But if life
is tough for people using Microsoft, at least do not generalize and
make it tough for everyone!

> I don't
> like it any more than you do, but sarcasm isn't going to change it --
> and it may be quite relevant to this discussion.
>

I believe that there is nothing about Microsoft that is relevant here
since WHATEVER WE DO Microsoft will NOT follow it since it has given
up supporting C as a language. That is a fact, that doesn't change if
they say somewhere in a blog that if they would have more resources
they *could* implement some standard C feature from a standard that is
12 years old.

The committee tried to please Microsoft and declared VLA's optional.

Great.

The result?

Has Microsoft changed anything about its C99 support?

Please, let's get real.

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Thread

Why are VLAs optional in C11? Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2012-08-17 15:42 -0700
  Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? Jens Gustedt <jens.gustedt@loria.fr> - 2012-08-18 01:19 +0200
    Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2012-08-17 16:23 -0700
      Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? Jens Gustedt <jens.gustedt@loria.fr> - 2012-08-18 10:12 +0200
    Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? John Nagle <nagle@animats.com> - 2012-08-17 21:04 -0700
      Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? pacman@kosh.dhis.org (Alan Curry) - 2012-08-18 05:34 +0000
        Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? John Nagle <nagle@animats.com> - 2012-08-17 23:07 -0700
          Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? pacman@kosh.dhis.org (Alan Curry) - 2012-08-18 08:29 +0000
            Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? John Nagle <nagle@animats.com> - 2012-08-18 09:37 -0700
              Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? pa@see.signature.invalid (Pierre Asselin) - 2012-08-19 02:27 +0000
            Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? Ike Naar <ike@sverige.freeshell.org> - 2012-08-18 17:49 +0000
      Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? Jens Gustedt <jens.gustedt@loria.fr> - 2012-08-18 08:32 +0200
      Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2012-08-18 02:50 -0700
      Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-08-18 14:33 +0200
        Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? Ike Naar <ike@sverige.freeshell.org> - 2012-08-18 13:23 +0000
        Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2012-08-18 13:48 -0700
          Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-08-18 23:31 +0200
            Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2012-08-18 18:14 -0700
              Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-08-19 09:38 +0200
                Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2012-08-19 03:07 -0700
                Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-08-19 12:29 +0200
                Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? John Nagle <nagle@animats.com> - 2012-08-19 10:38 -0700
                Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2012-08-19 13:14 -0700
                Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2012-08-19 13:59 -0700
                Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? Owen Shepherd <nntp@owenshepherd.net> - 2012-08-27 22:17 +0100
                Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? Jens Gustedt <jens.gustedt@loria.fr> - 2012-08-28 00:34 +0200
                Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? John Nagle <nagle@animats.com> - 2012-08-27 19:36 -0700
                Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-08-27 22:54 -0400
                Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? John Nagle <nagle@animats.com> - 2012-08-27 22:39 -0700
        Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? "pdx_scooter@yahoo.com" <pdx_scooter@yahoo.com> - 2022-10-01 13:15 -0700
          Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2022-10-01 14:33 -0700
          Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? Tomasz Stanislawski <stanislawski.tomasz@googlemail.com> - 2023-01-25 04:21 -0800
  Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? Eric Sosman <esosman@ieee-dot-org.invalid> - 2012-08-17 20:54 -0400
  Re: Why are VLAs optional in C11? John Nagle <nagle@animats.com> - 2012-08-17 20:56 -0700

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