Re: Gove in a virtual world

From	Russell Hafter News <see.sig@walkingingermany.invalid>
Newsgroups	comp.sys.acorn.misc
Subject	Re: Gove in a virtual world
Date	2011-12-17 15:37 +0000
Organization	Russell Hafter Holidays
Message-ID	<52431100a7see.sig@walkingingermany.invalid> (permalink)
References	<52b8254252.c.n.l.f@virgin.net> <5242263d48alan_calder@o2.co.uk> <52422777dbdave@triffid.co.uk> <52422e1f31alan_calder@o2.co.uk> <5242746733riscos@mdharding.org.uk>

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In article <5242746733riscos@mdharding.org.uk>, M Harding
<riscos@mdharding.org.uk> wrote:

> The real point about Latin (though having Greek in
> addition could be a bit OTT - no emoticon!) is that it
> teaches the /structure/ of languages, including one's own
> English. Forgive me, those whom I'm teaching to suck
> eggs, because many others haven't an inkling.

At the age of 16 I took O-level exams in Latin, French and
German, following 4 yers of the first two, and two years of
the last. I got my two best marks in French and Latin, which
is presumably why I went on to study Sciences.
:-)

I could read some French (say Georges Simenon) and some
German (though I cannot remember any German author from that
time), but I could never read Julius Ceasar. Much more
tellingly, no one ever seemed to expect that we should be
able to! Studying a Latin text was always treated in exactly
the same way as solving a crossword clue (possibly due to
the head of the Department being Ximenes in the Observer.
His real name was also used by Colin Dexter for the name of
one of Morse's mentors)?

Equally, I could always imagine (at least in principle) me
chatting up someone in a bar in French or German, but not in
Latin. I have always had the feeling that written Latin was
not a spoken language - after all, in Latin we never learnt
the absolute basics of any language:- yes, no, please, thank
you, hallo and goodbye. Let alone the next set:- two glasses
of beer / red wine / white wine, bread / cheese / ham. And
what did the Romans drink in the way of hot drinks (given
the absence of tea, coffee and chocolate)?

> The English language is scarcely "inflected" at all. E.g.
> you don't write "to who this concerns" but instinctively
> write "to whom this concerns"

I do, you do, but I rather doubt that most of he, she or it
does.

> - in other words, for those who haven't encountered this
> concept of inflection, the word (usually its ending)
> changes according to context. Another example is "he/she"
> compared with "him/her". We scarcely notice that English
> has a few inflected plural words: rather than adding an
> "s" to form the plural, we say "children", "men", "women"
> - not childs, mans, womans.

These are not inflections, but non standard plurals,
immediately understandable to those who speak German, while
the standard plural ending -s (presumably) came from Norman
French. Neither have anything to do with Latin.

And we do have a possessive / genetive ending / inflection
in English

> Latin, however, is a highly inflected language: it has
> quite different endings in both singular and plural for
> each word.

If you want to expose langauge learners to complex case
endings, why use Latin which has only six (one of which is
irrelevant for most nouns) rather than Finnish which has
many more?

Or maybe we should all be learning Malay; no grammatical
gender, no case inflections, no plurals, no conjugations of
verbs, no tenses. And apparently the sounds are all simple
to make too.

> And so, whereas in English we put a "preposition" before
> a word to mean "of . . by . . with . . to . . from . . ",
> in Latin it changes by tacking a letter or two on to the
> end of the word.

I seem to remember plenty of prepositions in Latin, and
having to learn which case they took as well.

-- 
Russell
http://www.russell-hafter-holidays.co.uk
Russell Hafter Holidays         E-mail to enquiries at our domain
Need a hotel? <http://www.hrs.com/?client=en__blue&customerId=416873103>

Thread

Gove in a virtual world ChrisF <c.n.l.f@virgin.net> - 2011-12-15 20:47 +0000
  Re: Gove in a virtual world Alan Calder <alan_calder@o2.co.uk> - 2011-12-15 20:53 +0000
    Re: Gove in a virtual world Dave Symes <dave@triffid.co.uk> - 2011-12-15 21:06 +0000
      Re: Gove in a virtual world Alan Calder <alan_calder@o2.co.uk> - 2011-12-15 22:19 +0000
        Re: Gove in a virtual world Dave Symes <dave@triffid.co.uk> - 2011-12-16 07:18 +0000
        Re: Gove in a virtual world Rick Murray <heyrickmail-usenet@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-12-16 09:14 +0100
          Re: Gove in a virtual world charles <charles@charleshope.demon.co.uk> - 2011-12-16 09:34 +0000
          Re: Gove in a virtual world Alan Calder <alan_calder@o2.co.uk> - 2011-12-16 10:46 +0000
            Re: Gove in a virtual world Russell Hafter News <see.sig@walkingingermany.invalid> - 2011-12-17 14:48 +0000
              Re: Gove in a virtual world Alan Calder <alan_calder@o2.co.uk> - 2011-12-17 15:10 +0000
            Re: Gove in a virtual world Jess <phantasm_39@hotmail.com> - 2011-12-18 09:20 +0000
              Re: Gove in a virtual world Alan Calder <alan_calder@o2.co.uk> - 2011-12-19 11:36 +0000
          Re: Gove in a virtual world jgharston <jgh@arcade.demon.co.uk> - 2011-12-16 07:04 -0800
            Re: Gove in a virtual world Rick Murray <heyrickmail-usenet@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-12-17 08:46 +0100
        Re: Gove in a virtual world M Harding <riscos@mdharding.org.uk> - 2011-12-16 11:07 +0000
          Re: Gove in a virtual world Alan Calder <alan_calder@o2.co.uk> - 2011-12-16 13:44 +0000
            Re: Gove in a virtual world M Harding <riscos@mdharding.org.uk> - 2011-12-16 17:02 +0000
              Re: Gove in a virtual world Alan Calder <alan_calder@o2.co.uk> - 2011-12-16 19:20 +0000
              Re: Gove in a virtual world Rick Murray <heyrickmail-usenet@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-12-17 10:17 +0100
                Re: Gove in a virtual world "John Williams (News)" <UCEbin@tiscali.co.uk> - 2011-12-17 10:35 +0100
            Re: Gove in a virtual world Russell Hafter News <see.sig@walkingingermany.invalid> - 2011-12-17 14:57 +0000
          Re: Gove in a virtual world workstuff@mail.com - 2011-12-16 21:12 +0100
            Re: Gove in a virtual world M Harding <riscos@mdharding.org.uk> - 2011-12-17 13:04 +0000
              Re: Gove in a virtual world Tim Hill <tim@invalid.org.uk> - 2011-12-18 07:50 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world M Harding <riscos@mdharding.org.uk> - 2011-12-18 15:31 +0000
              Re: Gove in a virtual world workstuff@mail.com - 2011-12-18 22:27 +0100
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Patric Albutat <albutat@gmx.de> - 2011-12-19 01:32 +0100
                Re: Gove in a virtual world M Harding <riscos@mdharding.org.uk> - 2011-12-19 12:32 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world workstuff@mail.com - 2011-12-19 14:22 +0100
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Russell Hafter News <see.sig@walkingingermany.invalid> - 2011-12-19 14:00 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world nervus <nervus@spam.nl> - 2011-12-19 19:59 +0100
                Re: Gove in a virtual world M Harding <riscos@mdharding.org.uk> - 2011-12-19 20:13 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world nervus <nervus@spam.nl> - 2011-12-19 21:35 +0100
                Re: Gove in a virtual world M Harding <riscos@mdharding.org.uk> - 2011-12-19 21:05 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world nervus <nervus@spam.nl> - 2011-12-19 22:10 +0100
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Bryn Evans <d@a.invalid> - 2011-12-20 16:42 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Barry Gray <barrygray@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2011-12-20 23:12 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Rick Murray <heyrickmail-usenet@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-12-21 08:07 +0100
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Barry Gray <barrygray@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2011-12-21 09:33 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Rick Murray <heyrickmail-usenet@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-12-21 18:10 +0100
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Patric Albutat <albutat@gmx.de> - 2011-12-21 20:46 +0100
                Re: Gove in a virtual world SG nws <nwsgrp@ntlworld.com> - 2011-12-21 21:21 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world John <newsmcc@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2011-12-21 14:00 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Chris <decordova@ukgateway.net> - 2011-12-24 19:46 +0100
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Rick Murray <heyrickmail-usenet@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-12-20 06:26 +0100
            Re: Gove in a virtual world Tim Hill <tim@invalid.org.uk> - 2011-12-18 08:15 +0000
          Re: Gove in a virtual world Rick Murray <heyrickmail-usenet@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-12-17 09:41 +0100
            Re: Gove in a virtual world M Harding <riscos@mdharding.org.uk> - 2011-12-17 15:21 +0000
            Re: Gove in a virtual world Matthew Phillips <spam2011m@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-12-17 21:24 +0000
              Re: Gove in a virtual world Rick Murray <heyrickmail-usenet@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-12-18 08:09 +0100
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Russell Hafter News <see.sig@walkingingermany.invalid> - 2011-12-18 10:32 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world trevj <trevj@cwazy.co.uk> - 2011-12-20 07:45 -0800
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Rick Murray <heyrickmail-usenet@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-12-21 08:08 +0100
          Re: Gove in a virtual world Matthew Phillips <spam2011m@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-12-17 10:33 +0000
            Re: Gove in a virtual world M Harding <riscos@mdharding.org.uk> - 2011-12-17 15:46 +0000
          Re: Gove in a virtual world Russell Hafter News <see.sig@walkingingermany.invalid> - 2011-12-17 15:37 +0000
          Re: Gove in a virtual world Tim Hill <tim@invalid.org.uk> - 2011-12-18 08:23 +0000
            Re: Gove in a virtual world "Bruce Goatly" <ss4@goatly.co.uk> - 2011-12-18 10:42 +0000
              Re: Gove in a virtual world M Harding <riscos@mdharding.org.uk> - 2011-12-18 15:58 +0000
        Re: Gove in a virtual world druck <news@druck.org.uk> - 2011-12-17 12:17 +0000
          Re: Gove in a virtual world Alan Calder <alan_calder@o2.co.uk> - 2011-12-17 12:47 +0000
            Re: Gove in a virtual world charles <charles@charleshope.demon.co.uk> - 2011-12-17 12:57 +0000
              Re: Gove in a virtual world Rick Murray <heyrickmail-usenet@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-12-17 19:08 +0100
          Re: Gove in a virtual world M Harding <riscos@mdharding.org.uk> - 2011-12-17 12:51 +0000
            Re: Gove in a virtual world Alan Calder <alan_calder@o2.co.uk> - 2011-12-17 15:17 +0000
            Re: Gove in a virtual world druck <news@druck.org.uk> - 2011-12-17 18:02 +0000
              Re: Gove in a virtual world NedA <news@ned.uk.invalid> - 2011-12-18 10:18 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world druck <news@druck.org.uk> - 2011-12-18 18:25 +0000
              Re: Gove in a virtual world Steve Drain <steve@kappa.me.uk> - 2011-12-19 11:40 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world druck <news@druck.org.uk> - 2011-12-20 23:17 +0000
              Re: Gove in a virtual world Rick Murray <heyrickmail-usenet@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-12-20 06:51 +0100
                Re: Gove in a virtual world cferris@freeRemoveuk.com.invalid - 2011-12-20 10:07 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world druck <news@druck.org.uk> - 2011-12-20 23:20 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Brian Jordan <brian.jordan9@btinternet.com> - 2011-12-21 00:43 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Rick Murray <heyrickmail-usenet@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-12-21 08:16 +0100
                Re: Gove in a virtual world druck <news@druck.org.uk> - 2011-12-21 12:22 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Chris Evans <chris@cjemicros.co.uk> - 2011-12-21 17:20 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world cferris@freeRemoveuk.com.invalid - 2011-12-22 10:36 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Rick Murray <heyrickmail-usenet@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-12-23 07:19 +0100
                Re: Gove in a virtual world cferris@freeRemoveuk.com.invalid - 2011-12-21 11:00 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world druck <news@druck.org.uk> - 2011-12-21 12:25 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Brian Jordan <brian.jordan9@btinternet.com> - 2011-12-21 13:23 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world  <cujimmy@nospam.co.uk> - 2011-12-21 19:50 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world druck <news@druck.org.uk> - 2011-12-21 22:13 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world cferris@freeRemoveuk.com.invalid - 2011-12-26 10:50 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world druck <news@druck.org.uk> - 2011-12-21 11:58 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Rick Murray <heyrickmail-usenet@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-12-21 19:11 +0100
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Steve Drain <steve@kappa.me.uk> - 2011-12-21 22:18 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Rick Murray <heyrickmail-usenet@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-12-23 07:38 +0100
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Steve Drain <steve@kappa.me.uk> - 2011-12-23 12:31 +0000
                APOLOGY to Steve Drain Rick Murray <heyrickmail-usenet@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-12-24 05:52 +0100
                Structures in BASIC Steve Drain <steve@kappa.me.uk> - 2011-12-24 11:38 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Alan Calder <alan_calder@o2.co.uk> - 2011-12-21 18:35 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Rick Murray <heyrickmail-usenet@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-12-23 07:32 +0100
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Alan Calder <alan_calder@o2.co.uk> - 2011-12-23 09:58 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Brian Howlett <news-spamtrap@brianhowlett.me.uk> - 2011-12-23 10:12 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Alan Calder <alan_calder@o2.co.uk> - 2011-12-23 10:31 +0000
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Rick Murray <heyrickmail-usenet@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-12-24 05:55 +0100
                Re: Gove in a virtual world Rick Murray <heyrickmail-usenet@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-12-24 05:56 +0100
          Re: Gove in a virtual world M Harding <riscos@mdharding.org.uk> - 2011-12-18 16:17 +0000
            Re: Gove in a virtual world Rick Murray <heyrickmail-usenet@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-12-20 07:24 +0100

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