Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z

From	cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross)
Newsgroups	comp.arch
Subject	Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z
Date	2026-04-13 20:15 +0000
Organization	PANIX Public Access Internet and UNIX, NYC
Message-ID	<10rjis7$6un$1@reader1.panix.com> (permalink)
References	<10r6a2l$57g$1@gal.iecc.com> <177609726979.23618.242404470017862404@media.vsta.org> <10rj8mj$3fme6$1@dont-email.me> <10rje78$1d4f3$1@news.xmission.com>

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In article <10rje78$1d4f3$1@news.xmission.com>, Richard <> wrote:
>Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> spake the secret code
><10rj8mj$3fme6$1@dont-email.me> thusly:
>
>>Andy Valencia <vandys@vsta.org> schrieb:
>>
>>> I came up the SW ranks with an expectation of rigor and attention to detail.
>>> Since these show no sign of ever returning, perhaps it's this AI thing which
>>> will eventually be used to jump out of this pit.
>>
>>Right now, it seems people are managing to dig themselves deeper into
>>the pit, much faster, with the help of AI. 
>
>My take on the situation (and I've been using the AI tools more and
>more over time) is that the tools are great in the hands of someone
>with enough experience to "call the AI out on it's shit".  I'm not
>sure how well a n00b or junior engineer is able to spot the obvious
>bad decisions the AI sometimes makes.  The AI definitely acts like a
>"confident incompetent".  It will always admit failure when you point
>it out, but what happens if you don't?
>
>Also, crafting prompts and properly seeding the context is essential
>to getting the most out of the AI and this is a new skill that, while
>not difficult to obtain, you have to invest in.

I've been working with these things to get a sense of their
capabilities, and so far it seems like they work best when you
can constrain their behavior by pinning them to some set of
external criteria that they cannot fudge.  For example, I've
if you have a formal specification of a thing, and have checked
it with some automated system (e.g., expressed in a modeling
language like Promela, TLA+ or Alloy and checked using a tool
like SPIN or tlc or something) and you tell the LLM that the
model is both immutable and the basis for what they must do,
then you can get it to do a decent job.

On the other hand, prompts alone don't seem to be sufficient to
keep it honest, but maybe I am just not good at generating them.

	- Dan C.

Thread

Arm to run within IBM z Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-04-04 21:34 +0300
  Re: Arm to run within IBM z quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-04-04 20:39 +0000
    Re: Arm to run within IBM z Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-04-04 22:08 +0000
      Re: Arm to run within IBM z quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-04-04 23:32 +0000
        Re: Arm to run within IBM z David Schultz <david.schultz@earthlink.net> - 2026-04-04 20:12 -0500
          Re: Arm to run within IBM z George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2026-04-05 00:14 -0400
            Re: Arm to run within IBM z David Schultz <david.schultz@earthlink.net> - 2026-04-05 06:12 -0500
              Re: Arm to run within IBM z George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2026-04-06 13:09 -0400
          Re: Arm to run within IBM z anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-04-05 09:56 +0000
            Re: Arm to run within IBM z David Schultz <david.schultz@earthlink.net> - 2026-04-05 06:17 -0500
          Re: Arm to run within IBM z antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-04-05 16:09 +0000
  Re: Arm to run within IBM z antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-04-05 02:35 +0000
    Re: Arm to run within IBM z Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-04-05 02:56 +0000
      Re: Arm to run within IBM z Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-04-04 21:11 -0700
        Re: Arm to run within IBM z Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-04-05 04:34 +0000
          Re: Arm to run within IBM z Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-04-04 22:04 -0700
            Re: Arm to run within IBM z Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-04-06 00:30 +0000
          Re: Arm to run within IBM z Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-04-05 12:51 +0300
          Re: Arm to run within IBM z scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-04-05 15:04 +0000
      Re: Arm to run within IBM z antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-04-05 16:16 +0000
        Re: Arm to run within IBM z Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-04-06 00:31 +0000
        Re: Arm to run within IBM z quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-04-06 03:57 +0000
          Re: Arm to run within IBM z Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-04-06 07:04 +0000
            Re: Arm to run within IBM z MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-04-06 16:35 +0000
              Re: Arm to run within IBM z scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-04-06 16:48 +0000
                Re: Arm to run within IBM z MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-04-06 22:32 +0000
              Re: Arm to run within IBM z cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-04-06 18:41 +0000
                Re: Arm to run within IBM z MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-04-06 22:33 +0000
                Re: Arm to run within IBM z Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-04-07 02:31 +0300
                Re: Arm to run within IBM z cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-04-07 14:41 +0000
              Re: Arm to run within IBM z quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-04-07 02:16 +0000
                Re: Arm to run within IBM z Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-04-07 04:55 +0000
                Re: Arm to run within IBM z Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-04-07 05:44 +0000
                Re: Arm to run within IBM z Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-04-07 07:53 +0000
                Re: Arm to run within IBM z cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-04-07 14:44 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-04-07 19:39 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-04-08 11:39 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-04-08 19:25 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z David Schultz <david.schultz@earthlink.net> - 2026-04-08 15:48 -0500
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-04-08 20:54 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-04-09 00:07 +0300
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2026-04-09 17:51 -0400
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-04-10 11:47 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-04-11 15:09 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z MitchAlsup <user5857@newsgrouper.org.invalid> - 2026-04-11 17:53 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-04-11 19:20 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-04-11 21:37 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2026-04-11 14:49 -0700
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-04-11 23:37 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2026-04-12 23:03 -0400
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2026-04-15 12:55 -0700
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-04-12 20:22 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-04-12 20:17 +0000
                Re: library confusion, Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-04-13 03:36 +0000
                Re: library confusion, Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-04-13 11:27 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z jgd@cix.co.uk (John Dallman) - 2026-04-15 12:22 +0100
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-04-15 13:51 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-04-15 14:43 +0000
                Re: libraries, Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-04-16 01:24 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-04-16 00:49 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z Paul Clayton <paaronclayton@gmail.com> - 2026-04-18 22:35 -0400
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-04-19 03:04 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2026-04-19 00:34 -0400
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-04-19 06:03 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z Andy Valencia <vandys@vsta.org> - 2026-04-13 09:21 -0700
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-04-13 17:21 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z legalize+jeeves@mail.xmission.com (Richard) - 2026-04-13 18:55 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-04-13 20:15 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-04-13 20:20 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z legalize+jeeves@mail.xmission.com (Richard) - 2026-04-14 04:51 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-04-14 05:54 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z legalize+jeeves@mail.xmission.com (Richard) - 2026-04-14 16:23 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-04-13 19:56 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z jgd@cix.co.uk (John Dallman) - 2026-04-15 12:22 +0100
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-04-15 13:53 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-04-15 22:28 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-04-08 19:48 +0000
                Re: Windows, was Arm to run within IBM z Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2026-04-09 09:49 -0400
              Re: Arm to run within IBM z John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-04-07 19:35 +0000
    Re: Arm to run within IBM z Stephen Fuld <sfuld@alumni.cmu.edu.invalid> - 2026-04-04 20:56 -0700
      Re: Arm to run within IBM z Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-04-05 04:36 +0000
        Re: Arm to run within IBM z Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-04-05 13:41 +0300
      Re: Arm to run within IBM z antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-04-05 17:04 +0000
        Re: Arm to run within IBM z quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-04-06 04:04 +0000
          Re: Arm to run within IBM z Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-04-06 12:29 +0300
    Re: Arm to run within IBM z quadi <quadibloc@ca.invalid> - 2026-04-05 05:24 +0000
      Re: Arm to run within IBM z John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-04-05 19:14 +0000
  Re: Arm to run within IBM z jgd@cix.co.uk (John Dallman) - 2026-04-05 12:43 +0100
    Re: Arm to run within IBM z scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-04-05 15:12 +0000
      Re: Arm to run within IBM z cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-04-06 12:21 +0000
        Re: Arm to run within IBM z scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-04-06 16:46 +0000
        Re: Arm to run within IBM z "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2026-04-09 02:27 -0700
          Re: Arm to run within IBM z scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-04-09 14:49 +0000
    Re: Arm to run within IBM z Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-04-06 00:35 +0000
  Re: Arm to run within IBM z "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2026-04-08 18:41 -0700

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