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DPT ideas to organize

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  DPT ideas to organize Emmanuel Arias <eamanu@yaerobi.com> - 2024-06-14 15:30 +0200
    Re: DPT ideas to organize Louis-Philippe Véronneau <pollo@debian.org> - 2024-06-17 08:10 +0200
      Re: DPT ideas to organize Andreas Tille <andreas@an3as.eu> - 2024-06-18 08:20 +0200
        Re: DPT ideas to organize Emmanuel Arias <eamanu@debian.org> - 2024-06-20 07:00 +0200

#15924 — DPT ideas to organize

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Hi team,

Sorry for the subject, this mail is more like questions than given ideas
:-).

After reading the DPL's contact and its responses, it got me
thinking - and this is also a personal feeling - that the DPT is a
place where I can seek help. This is beneficial because we understand
that if we encounter a Debian packaging issue specific to Python, we
can expect a prompt response from experienced people within the team.

However, it's true that each one maintains their own packages, while
some others fix RC bugs. But IMHO we lack like clear direction to follow
as a team. While ultimately, we just need to ensure that the packages
under the DPT umbrella are up-to-date with upstream and free of RC bugs as
much as possible. I don't know if that 'direction' is needed.

I understand that our team's priority is to address 3.12 bugs [0], as
mentioned in the irc topic. I know that some people  are already
working on this, and they don't necessarily need to seek permission
before tackling an RC bug. However, perhaps we could attempt to organize
our efforts better. Maybe we could identify packages that are candidates
for removal like [1] and try to reduce the list of RC bugs. Another
question is: what should we do with packages that are not under the
team's umbrella but are affecting Python 3.12?

On the other hand, we could assess if there are any improvements needed
in our tools, such as pybuild, or determine which packages require, for
instance, autopkgtests, lintian, etc. Or maybe we can start making short
IRC meetings once a week or every two weeks? Experienced members
of the team, do you think this is feasible given the DPT workflow? I
would like to hear the opinion from the team :-)


[0] https://deb.li/3T4QN
[1] https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=1025181


cheers,
        Emmanuel Arias

 ⢀⣴⠾⠻⢶⣦⠀
 ⣾⠁⢠⠒⠀⣿⡁  eamanu@debian.org
 ⢿⡄⠘⠷⠚⠋⠀  OpenPGP: FA9DEC5DE11C63F1
 ⠈⠳⣄

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#15946

On 2024-06-14 9 h 25 a.m., Emmanuel Arias wrote:
> Hi team,
> 
> Sorry for the subject, this mail is more like questions than given ideas
> :-).
> 
> After reading the DPL's contact and its responses, it got me
> thinking - and this is also a personal feeling - that the DPT is a
> place where I can seek help. This is beneficial because we understand
> that if we encounter a Debian packaging issue specific to Python, we
> can expect a prompt response from experienced people within the team.
> 
> However, it's true that each one maintains their own packages, while
> some others fix RC bugs. But IMHO we lack like clear direction to follow
> as a team. While ultimately, we just need to ensure that the packages
> under the DPT umbrella are up-to-date with upstream and free of RC bugs as
> much as possible. I don't know if that 'direction' is needed.
> 
> I understand that our team's priority is to address 3.12 bugs [0], as
> mentioned in the irc topic. I know that some people  are already
> working on this, and they don't necessarily need to seek permission
> before tackling an RC bug. However, perhaps we could attempt to organize
> our efforts better. Maybe we could identify packages that are candidates
> for removal like [1] and try to reduce the list of RC bugs. Another
> question is: what should we do with packages that are not under the
> team's umbrella but are affecting Python 3.12?
> 
> On the other hand, we could assess if there are any improvements needed
> in our tools, such as pybuild, or determine which packages require, for
> instance, autopkgtests, lintian, etc. Or maybe we can start making short
> IRC meetings once a week or every two weeks? Experienced members
> of the team, do you think this is feasible given the DPT workflow? I
> would like to hear the opinion from the team :-)
> 
> 
> [0] https://deb.li/3T4QN
> [1] https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=1025181

I agree with the points you raise. It's true the DPT isn't a very 
organised entity (although there's much worse teams in Debian :9).

I think more would be possible if we were more organised. Having regular 
meetings would surely help.

On my side though, I sadly don't have time for that. I'm already part of 
plenty of Teams in Debian (some of which do have regular meetings, like 
the DebConf Videoteam) and I only have so many spoons... If others want 
to push this way, I'll root for you!

That said, if I had more time, I would probably prioritise reviewing and 
sponsoring more DPT packages, something I haven't done in a while.

-- 
   ⢀⣴⠾⠻⢶⣦⠀
   ⣾⠁⢠⠒⠀⣿⡁  Louis-Philippe Véronneau
   ⢿⡄⠘⠷⠚⠋   pollo@debian.org / veronneau.org
   ⠈⠳⣄

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#15952

Hi,

Am Mon, Jun 17, 2024 at 02:07:55AM -0400 schrieb Louis-Philippe Véronneau:
> > Another
> > question is: what should we do with packages that are not under the
> > team's umbrella but are affecting Python 3.12?

Salvage[2] those packages?

> > On the other hand, we could assess if there are any improvements needed
> > in our tools, such as pybuild, or determine which packages require, for
> > instance, autopkgtests, lintian, etc. Or maybe we can start making short
> > IRC meetings once a week or every two weeks? Experienced members
> > of the team, do you think this is feasible given the DPT workflow? I
> > would like to hear the opinion from the team :-)
> > 
> > 
> > [0] https://deb.li/3T4QN
> > [1] https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=1025181
> 
> I agree with the points you raise. It's true the DPT isn't a very organised
> entity (although there's much worse teams in Debian :9).

I agree as well (with both ;-) )

> I think more would be possible if we were more organised. Having regular
> meetings would surely help.

Possibly IRC meetings (as far as I know Perl team is doing so) might be
some first step.

> On my side though, I sadly don't have time for that. I'm already part of
> plenty of Teams in Debian (some of which do have regular meetings, like the
> DebConf Videoteam) and I only have so many spoons... If others want to push
> this way, I'll root for you!

+1

> That said, if I had more time, I would probably prioritise reviewing and
> sponsoring more DPT packages, something I haven't done in a while.

I'd also recommend the "advent bug squashing party" done by the Debian
Med team.  We do team wide bug squashing from Dezember 1st - 24th and
everybody tries to squash a personal bug of the day (no matter who is
Uploader of the package).

Kind regards
   Andreas.

[2] https://wiki.debian.org/PackageSalvaging 

-- 
https://fam-tille.de

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#15955

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On Tue, Jun 18, 2024 at 08:13:57AM +0200, Andreas Tille wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Am Mon, Jun 17, 2024 at 02:07:55AM -0400 schrieb Louis-Philippe Véronneau:
> > > Another
> > > question is: what should we do with packages that are not under the
> > > team's umbrella but are affecting Python 3.12?
> 
> Salvage[2] those packages?
> 
> > > On the other hand, we could assess if there are any improvements needed
> > > in our tools, such as pybuild, or determine which packages require, for
> > > instance, autopkgtests, lintian, etc. Or maybe we can start making short
> > > IRC meetings once a week or every two weeks? Experienced members
> > > of the team, do you think this is feasible given the DPT workflow? I
> > > would like to hear the opinion from the team :-)
> > > 
> > > 
> > > [0] https://deb.li/3T4QN
> > > [1] https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=1025181
> > 
> > I agree with the points you raise. It's true the DPT isn't a very organised
> > entity (although there's much worse teams in Debian :9).
> 
> I agree as well (with both ;-) )
> 
> > I think more would be possible if we were more organised. Having regular
> > meetings would surely help.
> 
> Possibly IRC meetings (as far as I know Perl team is doing so) might be
> some first step.

Thanks both. Let's try it :-)
> 
> > On my side though, I sadly don't have time for that. I'm already part of
> > plenty of Teams in Debian (some of which do have regular meetings, like the
> > DebConf Videoteam) and I only have so many spoons... If others want to push
> > this way, I'll root for you!
> 
> +1
> 
> > That said, if I had more time, I would probably prioritise reviewing and
> > sponsoring more DPT packages, something I haven't done in a while.
> 
> I'd also recommend the "advent bug squashing party" done by the Debian
> Med team.  We do team wide bug squashing from Dezember 1st - 24th and
> everybody tries to squash a personal bug of the day (no matter who is
> Uploader of the package).
> 
> Kind regards
>    Andreas.
> 
> [2] https://wiki.debian.org/PackageSalvaging 
> 
> -- 
> https://fam-tille.de
> 

Cheers,
Emmanuel

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