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Groups > comp.sys.mac.system > #143272 > unrolled thread
| Started by | Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2024-02-15 10:11 -0500 |
| Last post | 2024-03-14 13:00 +0100 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 141 — 24 participants |
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European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-15 10:11 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2024-02-15 16:08 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-15 15:17 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2024-02-15 20:36 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Jörg Lorenz <hugybear@gmx.net> - 2024-02-17 09:29 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2024-02-17 10:46 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2024-02-18 15:58 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". badgolferman <REMOVETHISbadgolferman@gmail.com> - 2024-02-15 23:47 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2024-02-16 14:47 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Jörg Lorenz <hugybear@gmx.net> - 2024-02-17 09:35 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2024-02-17 15:26 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2024-02-18 18:40 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". "badgolferman" <REMOVETHISbadgolferman@gmail.com> - 2024-02-18 20:02 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2024-02-17 23:12 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Andrew <andrew@spam.net> - 2024-02-17 23:43 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-17 20:07 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2024-02-18 20:46 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2024-02-18 21:17 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-18 15:26 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2024-02-25 20:27 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". sms <scharf.steven@geemail.com> - 2024-02-18 19:44 -0800
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Andrew <andrew@spam.net> - 2024-02-19 05:28 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2024-02-19 06:16 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Andrew <andrew@spam.net> - 2024-02-19 17:14 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> - 2024-02-19 12:04 -0800
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". sms <scharf.steven@geemail.com> - 2024-02-19 15:07 -0800
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> - 2024-02-19 15:47 -0800
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2024-02-25 20:37 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-25 16:08 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". sms <scharf.steven@geemail.com> - 2024-02-26 10:53 -0800
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2024-02-25 20:31 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-25 16:05 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2024-02-26 19:52 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2024-02-26 20:38 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2024-02-26 22:49 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2024-02-27 10:56 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2024-02-27 13:38 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2024-02-28 07:36 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2024-03-01 13:17 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2024-03-01 13:17 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2024-03-01 23:41 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2024-03-02 22:32 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-26 19:01 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". badgolferman <REMOVETHISbadgolferman@gmail.com> - 2024-02-19 11:32 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2024-02-19 16:29 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". badgolferman <REMOVETHISbadgolferman@gmail.com> - 2024-02-19 16:59 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Andrew <andrew@spam.net> - 2024-02-19 17:23 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". "badgolferman" <REMOVETHISbadgolferman@gmail.com> - 2024-02-19 18:23 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Andrew <andrew@spam.net> - 2024-02-19 20:47 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". badgolferman <REMOVETHISbadgolferman@gmail.com> - 2024-02-19 21:07 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Andrew <andrew@spam.net> - 2024-02-19 22:11 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> - 2024-02-19 14:22 -0800
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Andrew <andrew@spam.net> - 2024-02-20 21:32 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> - 2024-02-20 13:55 -0800
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2024-02-20 09:57 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2024-02-20 14:41 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-20 10:45 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Oliver <ollie@invalid.net> - 2024-02-20 10:02 -0700
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-20 12:48 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2024-02-20 18:34 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-20 14:18 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2024-02-20 20:07 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-20 18:04 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2024-02-21 09:28 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-21 08:15 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2024-02-21 14:19 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2024-02-21 13:39 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-21 10:10 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Peter <confused@nospam.net> - 2024-02-20 20:11 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2024-02-20 18:23 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-20 14:16 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2024-02-20 20:52 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-20 18:11 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2024-02-21 10:12 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-21 08:24 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2024-02-21 15:49 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2024-02-21 16:36 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-21 20:19 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2024-02-22 10:43 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-22 09:00 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2024-02-22 14:40 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-22 14:06 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2024-02-22 20:15 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-21 08:32 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Wolf Greenblatt <wolf@greenblatt.net> - 2024-02-20 15:54 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> - 2024-02-20 14:02 -0800
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2024-02-21 17:27 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-20 18:11 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2024-02-20 20:23 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2024-02-20 20:20 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2024-02-20 20:05 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2024-02-20 21:22 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". david <this@is.invalid> - 2024-02-20 14:50 -0700
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-20 18:14 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2024-02-21 12:58 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2024-02-21 13:50 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2024-02-21 23:29 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Mickey D <mickeydavis078XX@ptd.net> - 2024-02-20 16:26 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2024-02-19 19:20 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Larry Wolff <larrywolff@larrywolff.net> - 2024-02-19 15:52 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". badgolferman <REMOVETHISbadgolferman@gmail.com> - 2024-02-19 21:02 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Larry Wolff <larrywolff@larrywolff.net> - 2024-02-19 17:27 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> - 2024-02-19 14:49 -0800
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". badgolferman <REMOVETHISbadgolferman@gmail.com> - 2024-02-19 21:01 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2024-02-20 09:40 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". David B. <bdb@nomail.afraid.org> - 2024-02-20 11:31 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". soyon <soyon@soyon.biz> - 2024-02-20 10:07 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-20 10:54 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". "badgolferman" <REMOVETHISbadgolferman@gmail.com> - 2024-02-20 16:43 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> - 2024-02-20 09:36 -0800
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2024-02-21 17:13 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Patrick <patrick@oleary.com> - 2024-02-20 11:13 -0600
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> - 2024-02-20 09:34 -0800
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-20 10:47 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Charlie <charlie@nospam.com> - 2024-02-20 10:43 -0700
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-20 12:53 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Gelato <gelato@.is.invalid> - 2024-02-20 16:57 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-20 18:15 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Gelato <gelato@.is.invalid> - 2024-02-20 20:48 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-21 08:12 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2024-02-21 17:24 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2024-02-21 17:21 +0000
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2024-02-19 13:09 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2024-02-25 20:30 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-25 15:56 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2024-02-26 19:54 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-02-26 19:02 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2024-03-01 13:19 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-03-02 09:00 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2024-03-02 22:33 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-03-04 09:31 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2024-03-05 20:18 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-03-05 14:22 -0500
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2024-03-06 15:08 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2024-03-06 20:03 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". "Jan K." <janicekoziol@nie.ma.spamu.prosze.com> - 2024-03-07 05:44 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2024-03-07 12:48 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2024-03-07 13:23 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2024-03-12 19:00 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2024-03-12 22:15 +0100
Re: European Commission sober! iMessage is not to be designated a "core platform service". Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> - 2024-03-14 13:00 +0100
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| From | Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-02-21 17:24 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <l3mpu3F1klmU3@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #143358 |
On 2024-02-21, Gelato <gelato@> wrote: > On Tue, 20 Feb 2024 18:15:27 -0500, Alan Browne wrote: > >>> https://www.tomsguide.com/news/icloud-backup-encryption >>> >>> "While data stored locally on iPhones and iPads are fully encrypted >>> by default, and communications over iMessage are end-to-end >>> encrypted as well, Apple has yet to extend the same security to >>> backups stored on iCloud." >> >> Re-read what you cite for comprehension v. what I wrote. > > The point was the article discussed what few people realize which is > the encryption key was known to Apple for all their iMessage data on > iCloud. Nope. Wrong again. IF you use the OPTIONAL iCloud Backups feature - as opposed to backing up to your own computer, and you don't enabled Advanced Data Protection, your backup contains a copy of your iMessage encryption key. Nuance is hard, y'all! 🤣 > End to end encryption means nothing when a company has the encryption > key. Don't back up to iCloud, or enable Advanced Data Protection. "Problem" solved, like magic! -- E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter. I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead. JR
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-02-21 17:21 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <l3mpoqF1klmU2@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #143351 |
On 2024-02-20, Gelato <gelato@> wrote: > On Tue, 20 Feb 2024 12:53:50 -0500, Alan Browne wrote: > >> iMessage has been end-to-end for a long time and messaging is the >> context of the present topic. > > That "long time" was only a short time ago. > https://www.tomsguide.com/news/icloud-backup-encryption > > "While data stored locally on iPhones and iPads are fully encrypted by > default, and communications over iMessage are end-to-end encrypted as > well, Apple has yet to extend the same security to backups stored on > iCloud." Tell me you aren't this dumb. iCloud Backups are not messages. iMessage has indeed been end-to-end encrypted for a long, long time. Backups are also end-to-end encrypted when you enable Advanced Data Protection which was introduced with iOS 16.2, iPadOS 16.2 and macOS 13.1. -- E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter. I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead. JR
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-02-19 13:09 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <60tbakxqdq.ln2@Telcontar.valinor> |
| In reply to | #143293 |
On 2024-02-19 04:44, sms wrote: > On 2/16/2024 5:47 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote: >> On 2024-02-16 00:47, badgolferman wrote: > > <snip> > >>> I guess Microsoft and Apple have more money to pass under the table than >>> Facebook does. >>> >> >> No. >> >> It is simply because usage of those platforms in the European Union is >> negligible, so they are not considered "core platforms". Not important >> enough. >> >> Notice that the decision means that the lesser platforms (like >> iMessage) can demand connectivity to the core plaforms (like >> WhatsApp). Not the other way round. > > Whatsapp gained acceptance in Europe and parts of Asia because of > Android's dominance. So everyone, including iPhone uses, use WhatsApp > and even thought it's owned by Meta, it's considered a core platform > (much like WeChat in China). > > Obviously Apple decided that the downside of making iMessage a core > platform outweighed the upside. At least in the U.S., iMessage is one of > the major reasons that consumers choose iPhones over Android devices. > Companies do not decide if a platform is core or not. Apple has no say in this. It is the EU who decides who is core, for the purpose of mandating to open their platform to competitors inside the EU. -- Cheers, Carlos.
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| From | Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-02-25 20:30 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <l41ippFq7mcU3@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #143293 |
sms, 2024-02-19 04:44: [...] > Obviously Apple decided that the downside of making iMessage a core > platform outweighed the upside. At least in the U.S., iMessage is one of > the major reasons that consumers choose iPhones over Android devices. In the U.S. iPhones have a bigger market share in general. And since iMessage is only available on iOS there is of course no other way then getting an iPhone if you want to keep in touch with others using that platform. But that's not because iMessage is so great - there is just no other choice. -- Arno Welzel https://arnowelzel.de
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| From | Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-02-25 15:56 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <4QNCN.100133$GX69.74652@fx46.iad> |
| In reply to | #143400 |
On 2024-02-25 14:30, Arno Welzel wrote: > sms, 2024-02-19 04:44: > > [...] >> Obviously Apple decided that the downside of making iMessage a core >> platform outweighed the upside. At least in the U.S., iMessage is one of >> the major reasons that consumers choose iPhones over Android devices. > > In the U.S. iPhones have a bigger market share in general. And since > iMessage is only available on iOS there is of course no other way then > getting an iPhone if you want to keep in touch with others using that > platform. But that's not because iMessage is so great - there is just no > other choice. What do you mean "there is just no other choice"? -- “Markets can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent.” - John Maynard Keynes.
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| From | Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-02-26 19:54 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <l44532F7pr8U2@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #143403 |
Alan Browne, 2024-02-25 21:56: > On 2024-02-25 14:30, Arno Welzel wrote: >> sms, 2024-02-19 04:44: >> >> [...] >>> Obviously Apple decided that the downside of making iMessage a core >>> platform outweighed the upside. At least in the U.S., iMessage is one of >>> the major reasons that consumers choose iPhones over Android devices. >> >> In the U.S. iPhones have a bigger market share in general. And since >> iMessage is only available on iOS there is of course no other way then >> getting an iPhone if you want to keep in touch with others using that >> platform. But that's not because iMessage is so great - there is just no >> other choice. > > What do you mean "there is just no other choice"? How to join group conversions or use any of the other specific features of iMessage without using iMessage? -- Arno Welzel https://arnowelzel.de
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| From | Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-02-26 19:02 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <RE9DN.80325$5Hnd.36702@fx03.iad> |
| In reply to | #143408 |
On 2024-02-26 13:54, Arno Welzel wrote: > Alan Browne, 2024-02-25 21:56: > >> On 2024-02-25 14:30, Arno Welzel wrote: >>> sms, 2024-02-19 04:44: >>> >>> [...] >>>> Obviously Apple decided that the downside of making iMessage a core >>>> platform outweighed the upside. At least in the U.S., iMessage is one of >>>> the major reasons that consumers choose iPhones over Android devices. >>> >>> In the U.S. iPhones have a bigger market share in general. And since >>> iMessage is only available on iOS there is of course no other way then >>> getting an iPhone if you want to keep in touch with others using that >>> platform. But that's not because iMessage is so great - there is just no >>> other choice. >> >> What do you mean "there is just no other choice"? > > How to join group conversions or use any of the other specific features > of iMessage without using iMessage? Hard to "join", but if the SMS-er(s) is(are) on the first list of a group, then no big issue. Not elegant, mind you. -- “Markets can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent.” - John Maynard Keynes.
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| From | Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-03-01 13:19 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <l4dvefFn9aiU4@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #143412 |
Alan Browne, 2024-02-27 01:02: > On 2024-02-26 13:54, Arno Welzel wrote: >> Alan Browne, 2024-02-25 21:56: >> >>> On 2024-02-25 14:30, Arno Welzel wrote: >>>> sms, 2024-02-19 04:44: >>>> >>>> [...] >>>>> Obviously Apple decided that the downside of making iMessage a core >>>>> platform outweighed the upside. At least in the U.S., iMessage is one of >>>>> the major reasons that consumers choose iPhones over Android devices. >>>> >>>> In the U.S. iPhones have a bigger market share in general. And since >>>> iMessage is only available on iOS there is of course no other way then >>>> getting an iPhone if you want to keep in touch with others using that >>>> platform. But that's not because iMessage is so great - there is just no >>>> other choice. >>> >>> What do you mean "there is just no other choice"? >> >> How to join group conversions or use any of the other specific features >> of iMessage without using iMessage? > > Hard to "join", but if the SMS-er(s) is(are) on the first list of a > group, then no big issue. Not elegant, mind you. Not "hard" - impossible. With SMS you can only send a message to a phone number, not to a messenger group. -- Arno Welzel https://arnowelzel.de
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| From | Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-03-02 09:00 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <LhGEN.103732$GX69.84835@fx46.iad> |
| In reply to | #143434 |
On 2024-03-01 07:19, Arno Welzel wrote: > Alan Browne, 2024-02-27 01:02: > >> On 2024-02-26 13:54, Arno Welzel wrote: >>> Alan Browne, 2024-02-25 21:56: >>> >>>> On 2024-02-25 14:30, Arno Welzel wrote: >>>>> sms, 2024-02-19 04:44: >>>>> >>>>> [...] >>>>>> Obviously Apple decided that the downside of making iMessage a core >>>>>> platform outweighed the upside. At least in the U.S., iMessage is one of >>>>>> the major reasons that consumers choose iPhones over Android devices. >>>>> >>>>> In the U.S. iPhones have a bigger market share in general. And since >>>>> iMessage is only available on iOS there is of course no other way then >>>>> getting an iPhone if you want to keep in touch with others using that >>>>> platform. But that's not because iMessage is so great - there is just no >>>>> other choice. >>>> >>>> What do you mean "there is just no other choice"? >>> >>> How to join group conversions or use any of the other specific features >>> of iMessage without using iMessage? >> >> Hard to "join", but if the SMS-er(s) is(are) on the first list of a >> group, then no big issue. Not elegant, mind you. > > Not "hard" - impossible. With SMS you can only send a message to a phone > number, not to a messenger group. Look at it the other way around. If a group copies an SMS user with a message, his replies will go back to the group. This assumes the group were all enlisted by phone number, however. It's messy. -- “Markets can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent.” - John Maynard Keynes.
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| From | Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-03-02 22:33 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <l4hk9fFa27hU4@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #143443 |
Alan Browne, 2024-03-02 15:00: > On 2024-03-01 07:19, Arno Welzel wrote: >> Alan Browne, 2024-02-27 01:02: [...] >>>> How to join group conversions or use any of the other specific features >>>> of iMessage without using iMessage? >>> >>> Hard to "join", but if the SMS-er(s) is(are) on the first list of a >>> group, then no big issue. Not elegant, mind you. >> >> Not "hard" - impossible. With SMS you can only send a message to a phone >> number, not to a messenger group. > > Look at it the other way around. If a group copies an SMS user with a > message, his replies will go back to the group. This assumes the group > were all enlisted by phone number, however. If a user sends an SMS message, he can only send it to a phone number. There is no phone number which will address the whole group. So what did I miss here? -- Arno Welzel https://arnowelzel.de
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| From | Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-03-04 09:31 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <zXkFN.104245$Sf59.68436@fx48.iad> |
| In reply to | #143452 |
On 2024-03-02 16:33, Arno Welzel wrote: > Alan Browne, 2024-03-02 15:00: > >> On 2024-03-01 07:19, Arno Welzel wrote: >>> Alan Browne, 2024-02-27 01:02: > [...] >>>>> How to join group conversions or use any of the other specific features >>>>> of iMessage without using iMessage? >>>> >>>> Hard to "join", but if the SMS-er(s) is(are) on the first list of a >>>> group, then no big issue. Not elegant, mind you. >>> >>> Not "hard" - impossible. With SMS you can only send a message to a phone >>> number, not to a messenger group. >> >> Look at it the other way around. If a group copies an SMS user with a >> message, his replies will go back to the group. This assumes the group >> were all enlisted by phone number, however. > > If a user sends an SMS message, he can only send it to a phone number. > There is no phone number which will address the whole group. So what did > I miss here? I'd have to revisit it, but I do recall chats where a reply from SMS users appeared on two or more iPhones. -- “Markets can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent.” - John Maynard Keynes.
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| From | Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-03-05 20:18 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <l4p9grFg8pdU2@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #143453 |
Alan Browne, 2024-03-04 15:31: > On 2024-03-02 16:33, Arno Welzel wrote: >> Alan Browne, 2024-03-02 15:00: >> >>> On 2024-03-01 07:19, Arno Welzel wrote: >>>> Alan Browne, 2024-02-27 01:02: >> [...] >>>>>> How to join group conversions or use any of the other specific features >>>>>> of iMessage without using iMessage? >>>>> >>>>> Hard to "join", but if the SMS-er(s) is(are) on the first list of a >>>>> group, then no big issue. Not elegant, mind you. >>>> >>>> Not "hard" - impossible. With SMS you can only send a message to a phone >>>> number, not to a messenger group. >>> >>> Look at it the other way around. If a group copies an SMS user with a >>> message, his replies will go back to the group. This assumes the group >>> were all enlisted by phone number, however. >> >> If a user sends an SMS message, he can only send it to a phone number. >> There is no phone number which will address the whole group. So what did >> I miss here? > > I'd have to revisit it, but I do recall chats where a reply from SMS > users appeared on two or more iPhones. Again: SMS is only to a phone number. It is technically impossible to determine, if an incoming SMS message on *one* phone (the phone number, the SMS was addressed to) was intended for a iMessage group. It will only be displayed as what it is: an incoming SMS message from one user to another user. -- Arno Welzel https://arnowelzel.de
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| From | Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-03-05 14:22 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <liKFN.358552$q3F7.74826@fx45.iad> |
| In reply to | #143460 |
On 2024-03-05 14:18, Arno Welzel wrote: > Alan Browne, 2024-03-04 15:31: > >> On 2024-03-02 16:33, Arno Welzel wrote: >>> Alan Browne, 2024-03-02 15:00: >>> >>>> On 2024-03-01 07:19, Arno Welzel wrote: >>>>> Alan Browne, 2024-02-27 01:02: >>> [...] >>>>>>> How to join group conversions or use any of the other specific features >>>>>>> of iMessage without using iMessage? >>>>>> >>>>>> Hard to "join", but if the SMS-er(s) is(are) on the first list of a >>>>>> group, then no big issue. Not elegant, mind you. >>>>> >>>>> Not "hard" - impossible. With SMS you can only send a message to a phone >>>>> number, not to a messenger group. >>>> >>>> Look at it the other way around. If a group copies an SMS user with a >>>> message, his replies will go back to the group. This assumes the group >>>> were all enlisted by phone number, however. >>> >>> If a user sends an SMS message, he can only send it to a phone number. >>> There is no phone number which will address the whole group. So what did >>> I miss here? >> >> I'd have to revisit it, but I do recall chats where a reply from SMS >> users appeared on two or more iPhones. > > Again: SMS is only to a phone number. It's not like I don't understand that. I just recall being on text groups where the SMS user remained in the loop over multiple replies. Maybe I missed something. -- “Markets can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent.” - John Maynard Keynes.
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| From | "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-03-06 15:08 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <qv9mbkx69h.ln2@Telcontar.valinor> |
| In reply to | #143461 |
On 2024-03-05 20:22, Alan Browne wrote: > On 2024-03-05 14:18, Arno Welzel wrote: >> Alan Browne, 2024-03-04 15:31: >> >>> On 2024-03-02 16:33, Arno Welzel wrote: >>>> Alan Browne, 2024-03-02 15:00: >>>> >>>>> On 2024-03-01 07:19, Arno Welzel wrote: >>>>>> Alan Browne, 2024-02-27 01:02: >>>> [...] >>>>>>>> How to join group conversions or use any of the other specific >>>>>>>> features >>>>>>>> of iMessage without using iMessage? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hard to "join", but if the SMS-er(s) is(are) on the first list of a >>>>>>> group, then no big issue. Not elegant, mind you. >>>>>> >>>>>> Not "hard" - impossible. With SMS you can only send a message to a >>>>>> phone >>>>>> number, not to a messenger group. >>>>> >>>>> Look at it the other way around. If a group copies an SMS user with a >>>>> message, his replies will go back to the group. This assumes the >>>>> group >>>>> were all enlisted by phone number, however. >>>> >>>> If a user sends an SMS message, he can only send it to a phone number. >>>> There is no phone number which will address the whole group. So what >>>> did >>>> I miss here? >>> >>> I'd have to revisit it, but I do recall chats where a reply from SMS >>> users appeared on two or more iPhones. >> >> Again: SMS is only to a phone number. > > It's not like I don't understand that. I just recall being on text > groups where the SMS user remained in the loop over multiple replies. > Maybe I missed something. The software has to internally keep track of all recipients, and send an SMS to all, ie, multiple SMS with some tracking information. Another method would be to send an SMS to a master phone in the list, which then forwards to the rest. I have seen group messaging with SMS, it can be done. The SMS first appeared in my phone as a message from one of the members, and seconds later appeared in the group. With RCS, it is supported. -- Cheers, Carlos.
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| From | Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-03-06 20:03 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <l4rsvuFsps1U1@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #143479 |
Carlos E.R., 2024-03-06 15:08: > On 2024-03-05 20:22, Alan Browne wrote: >> On 2024-03-05 14:18, Arno Welzel wrote: >>> Alan Browne, 2024-03-04 15:31: >>> >>>> On 2024-03-02 16:33, Arno Welzel wrote: >>>>> Alan Browne, 2024-03-02 15:00: >>>>> >>>>>> On 2024-03-01 07:19, Arno Welzel wrote: >>>>>>> Alan Browne, 2024-02-27 01:02: >>>>> [...] >>>>>>>>> How to join group conversions or use any of the other specific >>>>>>>>> features >>>>>>>>> of iMessage without using iMessage? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hard to "join", but if the SMS-er(s) is(are) on the first list of a >>>>>>>> group, then no big issue. Not elegant, mind you. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Not "hard" - impossible. With SMS you can only send a message to a >>>>>>> phone >>>>>>> number, not to a messenger group. >>>>>> >>>>>> Look at it the other way around. If a group copies an SMS user with a >>>>>> message, his replies will go back to the group. This assumes the >>>>>> group >>>>>> were all enlisted by phone number, however. >>>>> >>>>> If a user sends an SMS message, he can only send it to a phone number. >>>>> There is no phone number which will address the whole group. So what >>>>> did >>>>> I miss here? >>>> >>>> I'd have to revisit it, but I do recall chats where a reply from SMS >>>> users appeared on two or more iPhones. >>> >>> Again: SMS is only to a phone number. >> >> It's not like I don't understand that. I just recall being on text >> groups where the SMS user remained in the loop over multiple replies. >> Maybe I missed something. > > The software has to internally keep track of all recipients, and send an > SMS to all, ie, multiple SMS with some tracking information. Which is impossible. A SMS message has only this: 1) Recipient phone number 2) Content 3) Ask for delivery report yes/no You can not distinguish between a SMS message which is only addressed in private to the phone owner or if it is OK to forward it via iMessage to a group. > Another method would be to send an SMS to a master phone in the list, > which then forwards to the rest. See above: you can not really decide wether the SMS message is only for the owner of the phone who recieves it or if it should be forwarded to an iMessage group. The iMessage group would need to have it's own phone number - but I doubt, that Apple runs a service which creates new phone numbers for every iMessage group and accepts SMS messages to that phone numbers. > I have seen group messaging with SMS, it can be done. The SMS first > appeared in my phone as a message from one of the members, and seconds > later appeared in the group. In this case you should ask the sender to send a message only to you and not to the group. I wonder how this should be possible, if the group has not it's own number. > With RCS, it is supported. Yes, but RCS is not SMS. -- Arno Welzel https://arnowelzel.de
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| From | "Jan K." <janicekoziol@nie.ma.spamu.prosze.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-03-07 05:44 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <usbgni$6i8$1$koziolja@news.chmurka.net> |
| In reply to | #143482 |
W Wed, 6 Mar 2024 20:03:26 +0100, Arno Welzel napisal: >> With RCS, it is supported. > > Yes, but RCS is not SMS. RCS isn't supported in this app, but is the group SMS message supported? <https://home.pulsesms.app/overview/>
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| From | Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-03-07 12:48 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <l4tnsoF6s1oU1@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #143500 |
Jan K., 2024-03-07 05:44: > W Wed, 6 Mar 2024 20:03:26 +0100, Arno Welzel napisal: > >>> With RCS, it is supported. >> >> Yes, but RCS is not SMS. > > RCS isn't supported in this app, but is the group SMS message supported? > <https://home.pulsesms.app/overview/> There is no "group SMS" - it is just a SMS message to multiple numbers. Depending on the SMS app you can of course you can create "groups" which just contain multiple recipients for your message. But everybody will still just get a single message by you and can not see if the SMS message was sent to other people as well. -- Arno Welzel https://arnowelzel.de
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| From | "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-03-07 13:23 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <76oobkxcb8.ln2@Telcontar.valinor> |
| In reply to | #143502 |
On 2024-03-07 12:48, Arno Welzel wrote: > Jan K., 2024-03-07 05:44: > >> W Wed, 6 Mar 2024 20:03:26 +0100, Arno Welzel napisal: >> >>>> With RCS, it is supported. >>> >>> Yes, but RCS is not SMS. >> >> RCS isn't supported in this app, but is the group SMS message supported? >> <https://home.pulsesms.app/overview/> > > There is no "group SMS" - it is just a SMS message to multiple numbers. > Depending on the SMS app you can of course you can create "groups" which > just contain multiple recipients for your message. But everybody will > still just get a single message by you and can not see if the SMS > message was sent to other people as well. The recipient of the SMS sent to the group can reply to the group. However it works, it does work. -- Cheers, Carlos.
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| From | Arno Welzel <usenet@arnowelzel.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-03-12 19:00 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <l5bji0FatupU1@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #143503 |
Carlos E.R., 2024-03-07 13:23: > On 2024-03-07 12:48, Arno Welzel wrote: >> Jan K., 2024-03-07 05:44: >> >>> W Wed, 6 Mar 2024 20:03:26 +0100, Arno Welzel napisal: >>> >>>>> With RCS, it is supported. >>>> >>>> Yes, but RCS is not SMS. >>> >>> RCS isn't supported in this app, but is the group SMS message supported? >>> <https://home.pulsesms.app/overview/> >> >> There is no "group SMS" - it is just a SMS message to multiple numbers. >> Depending on the SMS app you can of course you can create "groups" which >> just contain multiple recipients for your message. But everybody will >> still just get a single message by you and can not see if the SMS >> message was sent to other people as well. > > The recipient of the SMS sent to the group can reply to the group. > However it works, it does work. So - if an user get's an SMS(!) from an iMessage group - what number is then used as the "Sender" number? -- Arno Welzel https://arnowelzel.de
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| From | "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-03-12 22:15 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <18t6ckx95b.ln2@Telcontar.valinor> |
| In reply to | #143631 |
On 2024-03-12 19:00, Arno Welzel wrote: > Carlos E.R., 2024-03-07 13:23: > >> On 2024-03-07 12:48, Arno Welzel wrote: >>> Jan K., 2024-03-07 05:44: >>> >>>> W Wed, 6 Mar 2024 20:03:26 +0100, Arno Welzel napisal: >>>> >>>>>> With RCS, it is supported. >>>>> >>>>> Yes, but RCS is not SMS. >>>> >>>> RCS isn't supported in this app, but is the group SMS message supported? >>>> <https://home.pulsesms.app/overview/> >>> >>> There is no "group SMS" - it is just a SMS message to multiple numbers. >>> Depending on the SMS app you can of course you can create "groups" which >>> just contain multiple recipients for your message. But everybody will >>> still just get a single message by you and can not see if the SMS >>> message was sent to other people as well. >> >> The recipient of the SMS sent to the group can reply to the group. >> However it works, it does work. > > So - if an user get's an SMS(!) from an iMessage group - what number is > then used as the "Sender" number? The time I saw this, most of us were using Androids, I don't remember if anyone was using an iphone. But I was in Canada, so people just used SMS, not WhatsApp. Some of us had RCS activated, not all. When I got an SMS, it appeared first as an SMS coming from an individual, and moments later, it moved to the group. And for sending, I sent to the group, but it was in fact sent to every phone in the group. Another person commented this same behaviour on their phone. But it appeared as if sending/receiving from the group. I was probably using Google Messages App. -- Cheers, Carlos.
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