Groups > comp.sys.apple2.programmer > #5167 > unrolled thread

Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vs Merlin vs ???

Started by	"touvell@gmail.com" <touvell@gmail.com>
First post	2019-07-30 08:37 -0700
Last post	2019-08-02 09:26 -0700
Articles	20 on this page of 67 — 16 participants

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#5217 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

From	Dave Touvell <touvell@gmail.com>
Date	2019-08-10 05:45 -0700
Subject	Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???
Message-ID	<2277883a-adf7-4f89-8764-6a97af56f9f3@googlegroups.com>
In reply to	#5216

On Thursday, August 8, 2019 at 1:28:00 AM UTC-4, Steve Nickolas wrote:
> >
> > Thanks again, Andrew. I saw MiniBas and was going to look into that 
> > further, but haven't had time to do much with it. It does sound like it 
> > may do the trick, though.
> 
> It's just a tiny wedge that allows programs to be launched from Bitsy Bye 
> without requiring the full 21-sector BASIC.SYSTEM.
> 
> (Disclosure: I wrote it)
> 
> -uso.

Thanks, Steve. I like it. There have been several times when I wished I could get one more file on a floppy, but ran out of space.

It took me a while to figure out how to use MiniBas, though. When I ran it, it just went back to Bitsy Bye, and I couldn't figure out how you would pass the & commands to it. After reading and re-reading (several times) the description of it on prodos8.com, it finally dawned on me that it _replaces_ basic.system. That line  up near the top that said "this tiny program can be used instead of Basic.System" should have been a clue. Doh!

-Dave

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#5218 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

From	Steve Nickolas <usotsuki@buric.co>
Date	2019-08-12 17:53 -0400
Subject	Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???
Message-ID	<alpine.BSF.2.02.1908121752200.15441@frieza.hoshinet.org>
In reply to	#5217

On Sat, 10 Aug 2019, Dave Touvell wrote:

> On Thursday, August 8, 2019 at 1:28:00 AM UTC-4, Steve Nickolas wrote:
>>>
>>> Thanks again, Andrew. I saw MiniBas and was going to look into that
>>> further, but haven't had time to do much with it. It does sound like it
>>> may do the trick, though.
>>
>> It's just a tiny wedge that allows programs to be launched from Bitsy Bye
>> without requiring the full 21-sector BASIC.SYSTEM.
>>
>> (Disclosure: I wrote it)
>>
>> -uso.
>
> Thanks, Steve. I like it. There have been several times when I wished I 
> could get one more file on a floppy, but ran out of space.
>
> It took me a while to figure out how to use MiniBas, though. When I ran 
> it, it just went back to Bitsy Bye, and I couldn't figure out how you 
> would pass the & commands to it. After reading and re-reading (several 
> times) the description of it on prodos8.com, it finally dawned on me 
> that it _replaces_ basic.system. That line up near the top that said 
> "this tiny program can be used instead of Basic.System" should have been 
> a clue. Doh!
>
> -Dave
>

Yeah, it wasn't designed to exactly be easy to get working, but it was the 
first program specifically written for ProDOS 2.4. xD

-uso.

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#5219 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

From	Dave Touvell <touvell@gmail.com>
Date	2019-08-12 17:28 -0700
Subject	Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???
Message-ID	<396dbb21-7985-41f5-acd7-ea8a9f6428df@googlegroups.com>
In reply to	#5218

On Monday, August 12, 2019 at 5:53:16 PM UTC-4, Steve Nickolas wrote:
> On Sat, 10 Aug 2019, Dave Touvell wrote:
> 
> > On Thursday, August 8, 2019 at 1:28:00 AM UTC-4, Steve Nickolas wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Thanks again, Andrew. I saw MiniBas and was going to look into that
> >>> further, but haven't had time to do much with it. It does sound like it
> >>> may do the trick, though.
> >>
> >> It's just a tiny wedge that allows programs to be launched from Bitsy Bye
> >> without requiring the full 21-sector BASIC.SYSTEM.
> >>
> >> (Disclosure: I wrote it)
> >>
> >> -uso.
> >
> > Thanks, Steve. I like it. There have been several times when I wished I 
> > could get one more file on a floppy, but ran out of space.
> >
> > It took me a while to figure out how to use MiniBas, though. When I ran 
> > it, it just went back to Bitsy Bye, and I couldn't figure out how you 
> > would pass the & commands to it. After reading and re-reading (several 
> > times) the description of it on prodos8.com, it finally dawned on me 
> > that it _replaces_ basic.system. That line up near the top that said 
> > "this tiny program can be used instead of Basic.System" should have been 
> > a clue. Doh!
> >
> > -Dave
> >
> 
> Yeah, it wasn't designed to exactly be easy to get working, but it was the 
> first program specifically written for ProDOS 2.4. xD
> 
> -uso.

So, does that mean it only works under ProDOS 2.4 and up, or will it work with older "official Apple" versions, too.

Not that it's an issue, since ProDOS 2.4 is pretty cool, but I was just wondering.

-Dave

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#5220 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

From	Steve Nickolas <usotsuki@buric.co>
Date	2019-08-14 04:43 -0400
Subject	Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???
Message-ID	<alpine.BSF.2.02.1908140443160.37596@frieza.hoshinet.org>
In reply to	#5219

On Mon, 12 Aug 2019, Dave Touvell wrote:

> On Monday, August 12, 2019 at 5:53:16 PM UTC-4, Steve Nickolas wrote:
>> On Sat, 10 Aug 2019, Dave Touvell wrote:
>>
>>> On Thursday, August 8, 2019 at 1:28:00 AM UTC-4, Steve Nickolas wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks again, Andrew. I saw MiniBas and was going to look into that
>>>>> further, but haven't had time to do much with it. It does sound like it
>>>>> may do the trick, though.
>>>>
>>>> It's just a tiny wedge that allows programs to be launched from Bitsy Bye
>>>> without requiring the full 21-sector BASIC.SYSTEM.
>>>>
>>>> (Disclosure: I wrote it)
>>>>
>>>> -uso.
>>>
>>> Thanks, Steve. I like it. There have been several times when I wished I
>>> could get one more file on a floppy, but ran out of space.
>>>
>>> It took me a while to figure out how to use MiniBas, though. When I ran
>>> it, it just went back to Bitsy Bye, and I couldn't figure out how you
>>> would pass the & commands to it. After reading and re-reading (several
>>> times) the description of it on prodos8.com, it finally dawned on me
>>> that it _replaces_ basic.system. That line up near the top that said
>>> "this tiny program can be used instead of Basic.System" should have been
>>> a clue. Doh!
>>>
>>> -Dave
>>>
>>
>> Yeah, it wasn't designed to exactly be easy to get working, but it was the
>> first program specifically written for ProDOS 2.4. xD
>>
>> -uso.
>
> So, does that mean it only works under ProDOS 2.4 and up, or will it work with older "official Apple" versions, too.
>
> Not that it's an issue, since ProDOS 2.4 is pretty cool, but I was just wondering.
>
> -Dave
>

It *works* on any, but it's only *useful* on 2.4.1 and 2.4.2.

-uso.

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#5214 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

From	Dave Touvell <touvell@gmail.com>
Date	2019-08-07 08:58 -0700
Subject	Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???
Message-ID	<f51d04ca-87ec-4a9a-a2ce-7d1f67940430@googlegroups.com>
In reply to	#5212

On Tuesday, August 6, 2019 at 10:09:09 PM UTC-4, Frank M. wrote:
> On Tuesday, August 6, 2019 at 5:17:10 PM UTC-7, tou...@gmail.com wrote:
> > I can't find basis.system, though. I downloaded all the versions, including 2.5a2 and all of the 2.4.x versions but didn't see it on any of the disks. 
> 
> 
> BASIS would be a program you wrote. It's a way to pass filenames selected in Bitsy Bye to your system file (that would then perform an action on the selected file). You put it inside the folder with the files.
> 
> I think this was posted here elsewhere...
> 
> "When a file is selected, Bitsy Bye launches /VOL/BASIS.SYSTEM with:
> 1) The ProDOS prefix set to the directory containing the selected file.
> 2) The filename of the selected file stored at $2006 (the 65 byte startup path buffer within BASIS.SYSTEM)
> 3) $280 is set to the name of the root volume
> 4) $380 is set to the name of the launched SYS file (ie, /VOL/BASIS.SYSTEM)"
> 
> f

Thanks Frank. That clears it up. Pretty neat idea.

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#5208 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA

From	kelvin@pro-kegs.uucp (Kelvin Sherlock)
Date	2019-08-06 22:28 -0500
Subject	Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA
Message-ID	<qid1v8$crk$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to	#5202

The IIgs version of ORCA/M can be used to generate 8-bit binaries.  It's
a multistep process, though.  (This applies to MPW IIgs as well).

1. assemble your code to generate OMF object files.
2. Link the object files to create an OMF executable file
(which, is neither fish nor fowl)
3. Run the makebin utility which converts the OMF executable into an
absolute load file (usually $2000 for ProDOS 8 executable).

In <812b6445-5461-4609-8fcb-9bd9aa35ec55@googlegroups.com>
"touvell@gmail.com" <touvell@gmail.com> writes:

>Does the same hold true for ORCA/M - use the 8-bit version for developing
>ProDOS 8 programs and the 16-bit version for making GS programs?  Or will
>the 16-bit version of ORCA/M do both?
>
>-Dave

-------
ProLine: kelvin@pro-kegs

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#5211 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA

From	"touvell@gmail.com" <touvell@gmail.com>
Date	2019-08-06 17:23 -0700
Subject	Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA
Message-ID	<d4bd5280-16bf-4f7b-90d3-55fe98a7578a@googlegroups.com>
In reply to	#5208

On Tuesday, August 6, 2019 at 7:20:09 PM UTC-4, Kelvin Sherlock wrote:
> The IIgs version of ORCA/M can be used to generate 8-bit binaries.  It's
> a multistep process, though.  (This applies to MPW IIgs as well).
> 
> 1. assemble your code to generate OMF object files.
> 2. Link the object files to create an OMF executable file
> (which, is neither fish nor fowl)
> 3. Run the makebin utility which converts the OMF executable into an
> absolute load file (usually $2000 for ProDOS 8 executable).
> 
> In <812b6445-5461-4609-8fcb-9bd9aa35ec55@googlegroups.com>
> "touvell@gmail.com" <touvell@gmail.com> writes:
> 
> >Does the same hold true for ORCA/M - use the 8-bit version for developing
> >ProDOS 8 programs and the 16-bit version for making GS programs?  Or will
> >the 16-bit version of ORCA/M do both?
> >
> >-Dave
> 
> -------
> ProLine: kelvin@pro-kegs

Thanks Kelvin. I'll try that. I'm still playing around with both Merlin and ORCA/M before concentrating my efforts on one over the other.

For the "Learning Assembly Language" stage it may just be easier to use the 8-bit versions of either one, but it would be nice to not have re-learn some things moving up to a more advanced version of the assembler when I get into the GS programs.

-Dave

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#5205 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

From	"touvell@gmail.com" <touvell@gmail.com>
Date	2019-08-05 21:41 -0700
Subject	Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???
Message-ID	<33f0f2c5-d364-4310-9e7e-c5aa862f7bef@googlegroups.com>
In reply to	#5178

On Thursday, August 1, 2019 at 12:17:07 AM UTC-4, Antoine Vignau wrote:
> * Dave,
> 
> mx %11
> org $800
> 
> ldx #0
> ]lp lda mySTR,x
> beq theEND
> jsr COUT
> inx
> bne ]lp
> theEND rts
> 
> mySTR asc "There is a 4.12 of Merlin 16+."00
> 
> * av

So now that I know there's a 4.12 version of Merlin 16+, but I can't seem to find it in any of the usual places. Anybody have a link to it?

Thanks,
-Dave

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#5206 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

From	Antoine Vignau <antoine.vignau@laposte.net>
Date	2019-08-06 13:12 -0700
Subject	Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???
Message-ID	<f956c3f7-2496-445e-9d86-c66032c9ed06@googlegroups.com>
In reply to	#5205

When I have an internet connection on my computer, I'll upload it, Dave,

av

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#5209 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

From	"touvell@gmail.com" <touvell@gmail.com>
Date	2019-08-06 17:11 -0700
Subject	Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???
Message-ID	<a7ccc6e3-7d9b-4085-8a1d-dc8b14e776b1@googlegroups.com>
In reply to	#5206

On Tuesday, August 6, 2019 at 4:12:30 PM UTC-4, Antoine Vignau wrote:
> When I have an internet connection on my computer, I'll upload it, Dave,
> 
> av

Thanks Antoine!

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#5221 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

From	Dave Touvell <touvell@gmail.com>
Date	2019-08-14 03:56 -0700
Subject	Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???
Message-ID	<943a0995-abb1-40bc-bc37-eaf8c09544f9@googlegroups.com>
In reply to	#5206

On Tuesday, August 6, 2019 at 4:12:30 PM UTC-4, Antoine Vignau wrote:
> When I have an internet connection on my computer, I'll upload it, Dave,
> 
> av

I went searching some more and found ftp.apple.asimov.net/images/gs/programming/assembler/MERLINGS_SOURCECODE.BXY, which appears to have a version 4.12 binary in it. I had overlooked it, probably because I wasn't looking for something called "MerlinGS" and something labeled "Source Code"

This has a bunch of .S and .L files intermingled with binary files, so my question now is there a "cleaner" version out there with just the files I need to use it, more like a "release version" or is this it?

I also found a file called "merlin.z08", which says it's Merlin 16+ v4.12 with custom modifications. But it only has a Merlin.sys16, readme, and custom.cfg file in it. The Read.me refers to a COMMAND.EXE that is not in the archive.

Any other/better versions out there that I haven't found?

-Dave

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#5222 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

From	Antoine Vignau <antoine.vignau@laposte.net>
Date	2019-08-14 12:15 -0700
Subject	Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???
Message-ID	<aa085c43-ad39-4350-9c5e-73de35c4af6f@googlegroups.com>
In reply to	#5221

I'll be at home in a couple of days, Dave, and I'll share my 4.12 with you!

av

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#5223 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

From	Dave Touvell <touvell@gmail.com>
Date	2019-08-14 14:38 -0700
Subject	Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???
Message-ID	<65851dfc-95d0-478e-8d0b-782cd3bde666@googlegroups.com>
In reply to	#5222

On Wednesday, August 14, 2019 at 3:15:20 PM UTC-4, Antoine Vignau wrote:
> I'll be at home in a couple of days, Dave, and I'll share my 4.12 with you!
> 
> av

That would be great. Thanks, Antoine!

-Dave

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#5235 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

From	Antoine Vignau <antoine.vignau@laposte.net>
Date	2019-08-19 22:12 -0700
Subject	Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???
Message-ID	<29ccc94b-ad1b-4f2c-b891-bcfbcc524187@googlegroups.com>
In reply to	#5223

Dave,
Merlin 4.12 @ http://www.brutaldeluxe.fr/public/merlin412/

Copy the contents of the two disks in the same folder onto your HDD, or use d1. d2 is the help directory.

Antoine

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#5236 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

From	Dave Touvell <touvell@gmail.com>
Date	2019-08-20 04:58 -0700
Subject	Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???
Message-ID	<ce77b959-edcf-4d10-9b95-48928105add0@googlegroups.com>
In reply to	#5235

On Tuesday, August 20, 2019 at 1:12:49 AM UTC-4, Antoine Vignau wrote:
> Dave,
> Merlin 4.12 @ http://www.brutaldeluxe.fr/public/merlin412/
> 
> Copy the contents of the two disks in the same folder onto your HDD, or use d1. d2 is the help directory.
> 
> Antoine

Thanks, Antoine! I'll grab that and check it out this evening.
-Dave

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#5238 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

From	Dave Touvell <touvell@gmail.com>
Date	2019-08-20 15:43 -0700
Subject	Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???
Message-ID	<ecd6f707-064d-4e05-aa83-86f87be391d5@googlegroups.com>
In reply to	#5235

On Tuesday, August 20, 2019 at 1:12:49 AM UTC-4, Antoine Vignau wrote:
> Dave,
> Merlin 4.12 @ http://www.brutaldeluxe.fr/public/merlin412/
> 
> Copy the contents of the two disks in the same folder onto your HDD, or use d1. d2 is the help directory.
> 
> Antoine

Thanks again, Antoine. I grabbed the files and put them on my HD image for GSport. It's nice to have the latest version. 

Now, to continue working through Assembly Lines: The Book...

-Dave

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#5239 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

From	Antoine Vignau <antoine.vignau@laposte.net>
Date	2019-08-20 22:49 -0700
Subject	Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???
Message-ID	<2d4e8094-5f60-49f2-b2fd-f4d9423d1e30@googlegroups.com>
In reply to	#5238

Great, keep up the good work.
Note that my default setting for assembly is 16-bit, so put a MX %11 on the first lines of your code to assemble in 8-bit.

Antoine

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#5240 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

From	denisbytezone@gmail.com
Date	2019-08-21 14:28 -0700
Subject	Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???
Message-ID	<8af62728-4b6c-4509-bd06-d97e07d0f2fb@googlegroups.com>
In reply to	#5239

Antoine

I think the MERLIN.ICONS file on merlin16plus412d1.po is corrupt. I found a valid copy of the same file on MERLIN 16+ 4.68 prog.2mg. The last three blocks are completely different.

Denis

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#5241 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

From	Antoine Vignau <antoine.vignau@laposte.net>
Date	2019-08-21 18:08 -0700
Subject	Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???
Message-ID	<c9580f58-a36f-4cc1-ab73-94391aa70844@googlegroups.com>
In reply to	#5240

OK Denis. I never used the Merlin icons :-)
Antoine

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#5242 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

From	Dave Touvell <touvell@gmail.com>
Date	2019-08-21 18:23 -0700
Subject	Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???
Message-ID	<51c82eea-5b73-442b-ac2e-793f8473d5cd@googlegroups.com>
In reply to	#5241

On Wednesday, August 21, 2019 at 9:08:42 PM UTC-4, Antoine Vignau wrote:
> OK Denis. I never used the Merlin icons :-)
> Antoine

Denis is right, the file is apparently corrupt. I used DicEd to open the files and the icon for Converter is corrupt and for the Interals CDA is missing. The v4.08 icons file is fine, so I just used it.

Thanks again for making the package available, though!

-Dave

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Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vs Merlin vs ???

Contents

#5217 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

#5218 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

#5219 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

#5220 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

#5214 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

#5208 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA

#5211 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA

#5205 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

#5206 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

#5209 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

#5221 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

#5222 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

#5223 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

#5235 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

#5236 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

#5238 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

#5239 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

#5240 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

#5241 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???

#5242 — Re: Assembler for Learning Assembly Language Programming ORCA vsMerlin vs ???