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Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain)

Cross-posted to 2 groups.

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Am 01.10.2012 12:05, schrieb Markus Elfring:
>> The problem here is that this is not an interface that I/we design,
>> but that this is supposed to emulate a C library interface. The
>> description there is extremely concise, and in particular it doesn't
>> foresee the possibility of failure of the call. (For other functions
>> the standard would have some generic phrase "if you pass invalid input
>> to the function the behavior is undefined".)
> 
> I would appreciate if members of the involved standardisation committees will
> share their advices for proper and unambiguous interpretation of the discussed
> specification and corresponding implementation details.

You probably could have a point here, in issuing a defect report on
the standard. I think it would certainly be a good idea if the
standard would have such a phrase, this then would allow an
implementation to do what pleases, e.g raise an exception.


>>> Is the completion of error detection and corresponding exception handling an
>>> open issue also in the affected wrapper implementation?
>>
>> No, I don't think that this is a general problem, since most of the
>> C11 function foresee a mechanism to return error conditions. There are
>> only a few functions like this one that don't have any at all.
>>
>> What is generally happening, though, is that the error conditions that
>> C11 foresees are only a subset of what POSIX provides. So sometimes
>> there might be a loss of information.
> 
> I guess that this feature difference in the programming interfaces will lead to
> a lot of more discussions between software developers, reviewers and testers. I
> am curious on further clarifications.

By programming with these thinks myself (and translating code that had
been written for pthread to C11 threads) I found that most of the
differences are minor and can be easily dealt with.

The main difference is really the starting point of this discussion,
the differing function types for threads. And this one is well
justified from the POV of C, int is the type that you'd have to expect
as a return from a thread, just as main returns an int to the
environment.

On my page for possible defects/improvements for C

p99.gforge.inria.fr/defects-and-improvements

I already have a list of useless incompatibilities between C and
C++. Perhaps it would be good to add the same sort of discussion for C
versus POSIX. Since POSIX always tries (or tried so far) to be
compatible with the current C standard, they probably will want to
deal with these new interfaces and try to explain how they work
together.

Jens

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Thread

Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) John Tsiombikas <nuclear@member.fsf.org> - 2012-09-27 03:38 +0000
  Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2012-09-26 20:50 -0700
    Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) John Tsiombikas <nuclear@member.fsf.org> - 2012-09-27 04:15 +0000
      Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Lorenzo Beretta <lory.fulgi@infinito.it> - 2012-09-27 16:35 +0200
        Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) John Tsiombikas <nuclear@member.fsf.org> - 2012-09-27 15:58 +0000
          Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Lorenzo Beretta <lory.fulgi@infinito.it> - 2012-09-27 18:27 +0200
          Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) William Ahern <william@wilbur.25thandClement.com> - 2012-09-28 12:08 -0700
          Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2012-09-28 19:38 +0000
          Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Eric Sosman <esosman@ieee-dot-org.invalid> - 2012-09-28 15:50 -0400
            Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Lorenzo Beretta <lory.fulgi@infinito.it> - 2012-09-29 18:41 +0200
  Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Markus Elfring <Markus.Elfring@web.de> - 2012-09-27 13:45 +0200
    Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) John Tsiombikas <nuclear@member.fsf.org> - 2012-09-27 16:14 +0000
      Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Markus Elfring <Markus.Elfring@web.de> - 2012-09-28 12:05 +0200
        Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2012-09-28 03:39 -0700
        Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-09-28 08:23 -0400
          Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) John Tsiombikas <nuclear@member.fsf.org> - 2012-09-28 19:48 +0000
    Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Toby Douglass <a@b.com> - 2012-10-01 20:19 +0200
      Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-10-01 14:37 -0400
      Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Eric Sosman <esosman@ieee-dot-org.invalid> - 2012-10-01 14:38 -0400
      Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2012-10-01 14:58 -0700
  Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Jens Gustedt <jens.gustedt@loria.fr> - 2012-09-28 20:22 +0200
    Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Markus Elfring <Markus.Elfring@web.de> - 2012-09-30 23:13 +0200
      Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2012-09-30 14:28 -0700
        Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Jens Gustedt <jens.gustedt@loria.fr> - 2012-10-01 00:37 +0200
          Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Jens Gustedt <jens.gustedt@loria.fr> - 2012-10-01 00:44 +0200
            Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Eric Sosman <esosman@ieee-dot-org.invalid> - 2012-09-30 19:48 -0400
              Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Jens Gustedt <jens.gustedt@loria.fr> - 2012-10-01 08:26 +0200
          Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Markus Elfring <Markus.Elfring@web.de> - 2012-10-01 11:25 +0200
            Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Jens Gustedt <jens.gustedt@loria.fr> - 2012-10-01 11:47 +0200
              Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Markus Elfring <Markus.Elfring@web.de> - 2012-10-01 12:05 +0200
                Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Jens Gustedt <jens.gustedt@loria.fr> - 2012-10-01 13:15 +0200
                Clarification for interface specification "C11 threads.h" Markus Elfring <Markus.Elfring@web.de> - 2012-10-03 11:02 +0200
                Re: Clarification for interface specification "C11 threads.h" Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2012-10-03 13:29 -0700
                Re: Clarification for interface specification "C11 threads.h" Jens Gustedt <jens.gustedt@loria.fr> - 2012-10-04 13:35 +0200
                Re: Clarification for interface specification "C11 threads.h" Markus Elfring <Markus.Elfring@web.de> - 2012-10-12 17:45 +0200
                Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Noob <root@127.0.0.1> - 2012-10-01 18:10 +0200
              Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Nick Bowler <nbowler@draconx.ca> - 2012-10-01 19:28 +0000
              Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2012-10-01 15:19 -0700
                Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2012-10-01 23:57 +0000
      Re: Trivial C11 threads.h wrapper (public domain) Jens Gustedt <jens.gustedt@loria.fr> - 2012-10-02 14:48 +0200

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