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ftp problem

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  ftp problem Dieter Britz <dieterhansbritz@gmail.com> - 2020-06-29 14:15 +0000
    Re: ftp problem Pascal Hambourg <pascal@plouf.fr.eu.org> - 2020-06-29 19:45 +0200
      Re: ftp problem The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2020-06-30 09:16 +0100
        Re: ftp problem The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2020-06-30 09:19 +0100
        Re: ftp problem Pascal Hambourg <pascal@plouf.fr.eu.org> - 2020-06-30 16:51 +0200
          Re: ftp problem The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2020-06-30 17:05 +0100
            Re: ftp problem Grant Taylor <gtaylor@tnetconsulting.net> - 2020-06-30 12:03 -0600
            Re: ftp problem "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-06-30 20:33 +0200
              Re: ftp problem Pascal Hambourg <pascal@plouf.fr.eu.org> - 2020-06-30 23:05 +0200
                Re: ftp problem Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> - 2020-06-30 21:14 +0000
                  Re: ftp problem "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-07-01 03:39 +0200
                    Re: ftp problem Eric Pozharski <whynot@pozharski.name> - 2020-07-02 10:46 +0300
                      Re: ftp problem "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-07-02 11:47 +0200
                        Re: ftp problem "Anonymous Remailer (austria)" <mixmaster@remailer.privacy.at> - 2020-07-02 17:03 +0200
                          Re: ftp problem "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-07-02 22:04 +0200
                            Re: ftp problem Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2020-07-03 09:44 +0100
                              Re: ftp problem "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-07-03 11:03 +0200
                                Re: ftp problem Pascal Hambourg <pascal@plouf.fr.eu.org> - 2020-07-03 17:08 +0200
                                  Re: ftp problem "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-07-03 20:55 +0200
                Re: ftp problem The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2020-07-01 07:10 +0100
                  Re: ftp problem felix@palmen-it.de (Felix Palmen) - 2020-07-01 08:19 +0200
                    Re: ftp problem The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2020-07-01 07:23 +0100
                      Re: ftp problem felix@palmen-it.de (Felix Palmen) - 2020-07-01 08:46 +0200
                        Re: ftp problem The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2020-07-01 08:14 +0100
                          Re: ftp problem felix@palmen-it.de (Felix Palmen) - 2020-07-01 09:45 +0200
                            Re: ftp problem The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2020-07-01 10:53 +0100
                              Re: ftp problem "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-07-01 15:00 +0200
                                Re: ftp problem The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2020-07-01 15:06 +0100
                                  Re: ftp problem "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2020-07-01 21:59 +0200
                                    Re: ftp problem Pascal Hambourg <pascal@plouf.fr.eu.org> - 2020-07-02 00:08 +0200
                                    Re: ftp problem The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2020-07-02 03:18 +0100
                    Re: ftp problem Eli the Bearded <*@qaz.wtf> - 2020-07-01 17:51 +0000
                      Would it? (Was: ftp problem) gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2020-07-02 00:45 +0000
                        Re: Would it? (Was: ftp problem) Eli the Bearded <*@qaz.wtf> - 2020-07-02 00:49 +0000
                      Re: ftp problem The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2020-07-02 03:20 +0100
                        Re: ftp problem Eli the Bearded <*@qaz.wtf> - 2020-07-02 02:52 +0000
                          Re: ftp problem Grant Taylor <gtaylor@tnetconsulting.net> - 2020-07-01 21:56 -0600
                            Free cloud virtual servers (Re: ftp problem) Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> - 2020-07-03 19:41 +0000
                              Re: Free cloud virtual servers (Re: ftp problem) Grant Taylor <gtaylor@tnetconsulting.net> - 2020-07-06 19:36 -0600
    Re: ftp problem The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2020-06-30 09:15 +0100

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#30227

* The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>:
> On 30/06/2020 22:05, Pascal Hambourg wrote:
>> Right. Sounds like this server is part of a shared hosting service not 
>> owned by the OP.
> 
> they normally include ssh on those.

A "shared" hosting environemt, where files for multiple clients are
hosted on the same host (no vms, no containers) probably isn't as common
any more as it used to be. But on these, you'll never get shell access
for obvious reasons.

They *could* still provide sftp, but I don't think that's very
widespread either.

-- 
 Dipl.-Inform. Felix Palmen  <felix@palmen-it.de>   ,.//..........
 {web}  http://palmen-it.de  {jabber} [see email]   ,//palmen-it.de
 {pgp public key}     http://palmen-it.de/pub.txt   //   """""""""""
 {pgp fingerprint} A891 3D55 5F2E 3A74 3965 B997 3EF2 8B0A BC02 DA2A

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#30228

On 01/07/2020 07:19, Felix Palmen wrote:
> * The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>:
>> On 30/06/2020 22:05, Pascal Hambourg wrote:
>>> Right. Sounds like this server is part of a shared hosting service not
>>> owned by the OP.
>>
>> they normally include ssh on those.
> 
> A "shared" hosting environemt, where files for multiple clients are
> hosted on the same host (no vms, no containers) probably isn't as common
> any more as it used to be. But on these, you'll never get shell access
> for obvious reasons.

chroot?

> 
> They *could* still provide sftp, but I don't think that's very
> widespread either.
> 


-- 
I would rather have questions that cannot be answered...
...than to have answers that cannot be questioned

Richard Feynman

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#30229

* The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>:
> On 01/07/2020 07:19, Felix Palmen wrote:
>> A "shared" hosting environemt, where files for multiple clients are
>> hosted on the same host (no vms, no containers) probably isn't as common
>> any more as it used to be. But on these, you'll never get shell access
>> for obvious reasons.
> 
> chroot?

I hope you don't *really* think chroot is safe enough to give
potentially untrusted parties shell access.

-- 
 Dipl.-Inform. Felix Palmen  <felix@palmen-it.de>   ,.//..........
 {web}  http://palmen-it.de  {jabber} [see email]   ,//palmen-it.de
 {pgp public key}     http://palmen-it.de/pub.txt   //   """""""""""
 {pgp fingerprint} A891 3D55 5F2E 3A74 3965 B997 3EF2 8B0A BC02 DA2A

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#30230

On 01/07/2020 07:46, Felix Palmen wrote:
> * The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>:
>> On 01/07/2020 07:19, Felix Palmen wrote:
>>> A "shared" hosting environemt, where files for multiple clients are
>>> hosted on the same host (no vms, no containers) probably isn't as common
>>> any more as it used to be. But on these, you'll never get shell access
>>> for obvious reasons.
>>
>> chroot?
> 
> I hope you don't *really* think chroot is safe enough to give
> potentially untrusted parties shell access.
> 
https://www.tecmint.com/restrict-ssh-user-to-directory-using-chrooted-jail/

you dont need shell access to enable sftp

-- 
“The fundamental cause of the trouble in the modern world today is that 
the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt."

    - Bertrand Russell

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#30231

* The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>:
> you dont need shell access to enable sftp

Which is btw exactly what I said in my initial reply here. Still, it
would be uncommon for such a hoster to do that.

-- 
 Dipl.-Inform. Felix Palmen  <felix@palmen-it.de>   ,.//..........
 {web}  http://palmen-it.de  {jabber} [see email]   ,//palmen-it.de
 {pgp public key}     http://palmen-it.de/pub.txt   //   """""""""""
 {pgp fingerprint} A891 3D55 5F2E 3A74 3965 B997 3EF2 8B0A BC02 DA2A

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#30232

On 01/07/2020 08:45, Felix Palmen wrote:
> * The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>:
>> you dont need shell access to enable sftp
> 
> Which is btw exactly what I said in my initial reply here. Still, it
> would be uncommon for such a hoster to do that.
> 
Proof by assertion?

All the people I know who use shared hosting use sftp to upload files.


-- 
"I am inclined to tell the truth and dislike people who lie consistently.
This makes me unfit for the company of people of a Left persuasion, and 
all women"

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#30233

On 01/07/2020 11.53, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> On 01/07/2020 08:45, Felix Palmen wrote:
>> * The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>:
>>> you dont need shell access to enable sftp
>>
>> Which is btw exactly what I said in my initial reply here. Still, it
>> would be uncommon for such a hoster to do that.
>>
> Proof by assertion?
> 
> All the people I know who use shared hosting use sftp to upload files.

I know thousands that do not. And many do not offer upload for the 
public either.

Although most of them have moved to http instead.


-- 
Cheers, Carlos.

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#30234

On 01/07/2020 14:00, Carlos E.R. wrote:
> On 01/07/2020 11.53, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>> On 01/07/2020 08:45, Felix Palmen wrote:
>>> * The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>:
>>>> you dont need shell access to enable sftp
>>>
>>> Which is btw exactly what I said in my initial reply here. Still, it
>>> would be uncommon for such a hoster to do that.
>>>
>> Proof by assertion?
>>
>> All the people I know who use shared hosting use sftp to upload files.
> 
> I know thousands that do not. And many do not offer upload for the 
> public either.
> 
then how do their site maintainers maintain them?

> Although most of them have moved to http instead.
> 
> 
And that is 'secure'???



-- 
Truth welcomes investigation because truth knows investigation will lead 
to converts. It is deception that uses all the other techniques.

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#30237

On 01/07/2020 16.06, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> On 01/07/2020 14:00, Carlos E.R. wrote:
>> On 01/07/2020 11.53, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>> On 01/07/2020 08:45, Felix Palmen wrote:
>>>> * The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>:
>>>>> you dont need shell access to enable sftp
>>>>
>>>> Which is btw exactly what I said in my initial reply here. Still, it
>>>> would be uncommon for such a hoster to do that.
>>>>
>>> Proof by assertion?
>>>
>>> All the people I know who use shared hosting use sftp to upload files.
>>
>> I know thousands that do not. And many do not offer upload for the 
>> public either.
>>
> then how do their site maintainers maintain them?

They have different access. The millions of clients do not have that 
access, only a few.


> 
>> Although most of them have moved to http instead.
>>
>>
> And that is 'secure'???

Why would that matter?

We are talking of file download sites.


-- 
Cheers, Carlos.

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#30238

Le 01/07/2020 à 21:59, Carlos E.R. a écrit :
> 
> We are talking of file download sites.

No, we are talking about shared hosting, not file sharing.

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#30241

On 01/07/2020 20:59, Carlos E.R. wrote:
> On 01/07/2020 16.06, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>> On 01/07/2020 14:00, Carlos E.R. wrote:
>>> On 01/07/2020 11.53, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>> On 01/07/2020 08:45, Felix Palmen wrote:
>>>>> * The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>:
>>>>>> you dont need shell access to enable sftp
>>>>>
>>>>> Which is btw exactly what I said in my initial reply here. Still, it
>>>>> would be uncommon for such a hoster to do that.
>>>>>
>>>> Proof by assertion?
>>>>
>>>> All the people I know who use shared hosting use sftp to upload files.
>>>
>>> I know thousands that do not. And many do not offer upload for the 
>>> public either.
>>>
>> then how do their site maintainers maintain them?
> 
> They have different access. The millions of clients do not have that 
> access, only a few.
> 
> 
>>
>>> Although most of them have moved to http instead.
>>>
>>>
>> And that is 'secure'???
> 
> Why would that matter?
> 
> We are talking of file download sites.
> 
> 
Count me out. I was talking about co hosted single IP address web sites.



-- 
Climate is what you expect but weather is what you get.
Mark Twain

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#30236

In comp.os.linux.misc, Felix Palmen <felix@palmen-it.de> wrote:
> A "shared" hosting environemt, where files for multiple clients are
> hosted on the same host (no vms, no containers) probably isn't as common
> any more as it used to be. But on these, you'll never get shell access
> for obvious reasons.

Depending on your definitions, not true. Shared unix shell access is
still available with shared web hosting. I pay $200 a year for a pair
of accounts (myself and my wife) on a shared unix shell system and put
my web files in ~/public_html/ . I can go and poke around the
public_html directories of other users with `ls` and `cat`. It is true
that the actual web servers I can't log in to, the files are shared
between the shell hosts and the web hosts via NFS.

Elijah
------
uses that same shell account for reading news

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#30239 — Would it? (Was: ftp problem)

In article <eli$2007011351@qaz.wtf>, Eli the Bearded  <*@qaz.wtf> wrote:
...
>Elijah
>------
>uses that same shell account for reading news

That wouldn't happen to be the same shell account that I use, would it?

-- 
"Women should not be enlightened or educated in any way. They should be
segregated because they are the cause of unholy erections in holy men.

    -- Saint Augustine (354-430) --

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#30240 — Re: Would it? (Was: ftp problem)

In comp.os.linux.misc, Kenny McCormack <gazelle@shell.xmission.com> wrote:
> In article <eli$2007011351@qaz.wtf>, Eli the Bearded <*@qaz.wtf> wrote:
>> uses that same shell account for reading news
> That wouldn't happen to be the same shell account that I use, would it?

Not if your shell matches the Path: on your post.

Elijah
------
or your domainname

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#30242

On 01/07/2020 18:51, Eli the Bearded wrote:
> In comp.os.linux.misc, Felix Palmen <felix@palmen-it.de> wrote:
>> A "shared" hosting environemt, where files for multiple clients are
>> hosted on the same host (no vms, no containers) probably isn't as common
>> any more as it used to be. But on these, you'll never get shell access
>> for obvious reasons.
> 
> Depending on your definitions, not true. Shared unix shell access is
> still available with shared web hosting. I pay $200 a year

I pay less than that for one of  my own virtual private servers.
Full access to my own OS...I suggest you take a look at just how cheap a 
VPS has become.

  for a pair
> of accounts (myself and my wife) on a shared unix shell system and put
> my web files in ~/public_html/ . I can go and poke around the
> public_html directories of other users with `ls` and `cat`. It is true
> that the actual web servers I can't log in to, the files are shared
> between the shell hosts and the web hosts via NFS.
> 
> Elijah
> ------
> uses that same shell account for reading news
> 


-- 
Climate is what you expect but weather is what you get.
Mark Twain

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#30243

In comp.os.linux.misc, The Natural Philosopher  <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> On 01/07/2020 18:51, Eli the Bearded wrote:
>> Depending on your definitions, not true. Shared unix shell access is
>> still available with shared web hosting. I pay $200 a year
> I pay less than that for one of  my own virtual private servers.
> Full access to my own OS...I suggest you take a look at just how cheap a 
> VPS has become.

I find more value to the account than mere shell server access. I also
have one virtual server with them, two virtual servers at Digital Ocean,
one virtual server at Dreamhost, and one virtual server at Oracle Cloud.

The Oracle Cloud one is interesting in that it is 100% free. The others
I pay money for.

Elijah
------
Oracle gives out bigger 100% free servers than other cloud providers

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#30244

On 7/1/20 8:52 PM, Eli the Bearded wrote:
> The Oracle Cloud one is interesting in that it is 100% free.
Would you please provide a 30-90 second elaboration?



-- 
Grant. . . .
unix || die

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#30255 — Free cloud virtual servers (Re: ftp problem)

(Posted and mailed; change of subject may obscured the follow-up)

In comp.os.linux.misc, Grant Taylor  <gtaylor@tnetconsulting.net> wrote:
> On 7/1/20 8:52 PM, Eli the Bearded wrote:
>> The Oracle Cloud one is interesting in that it is 100% free.
> Would you please provide a 30-90 second elaboration?

Several of the cloud providers offer a "free tier" of service. Looking
at the "compute" options:

https://aws.amazon.com/free/

12 Months Free of 750 hours a month or a t2.micro or t3.micro
("depending on region"). t2.micro: 1 vcpu, 1 gib ram, 8gb disk; t3.micro
has 2 vcpu. 

https://cloud.google.com/free/docs/gcp-free-tier

"Always free" one f.micro with 30 GB-months HDD (which Google appears to
define as something like "averaging to 30GB continuous for 30 days") 0.2
vcpu, 0.6 gb ram. I think. The google specs for always free are quite
hard to read.

https://docs.cloud.oracle.com/en-us/iaas/Content/FreeTier/resourceref.htm

"Always free" TWO VM.Standard.E2.1.Micro, 1/8th OCPU (defined as "CPU
capacity equivalent of one physical core of an Intel Xeon processor with
hyper threading enabled"), 1 gb ram, 50 gb disk (in a 40 gb / and 10 gb
swap config by default).

I use my Oracle cloud instance to run Discourse, roughly set up
according to this blog post:

https://blogs.oracle.com/developers/install-run-discourse-for-free-in-the-oracle-cloud

The mail service from Oracle is *not* on always free tier, so I'm using
Mailjet instead. Mailjet offers up to 300 a day (pretty sure) for free.
Signing up for Oracle has been difficult for some people outside the US,
and using their cloud web portal requires Chrome for me, whereas Firefox
is my default browser.

I would have never tried Oracle Cloud except for finding a post about
using it for free Discourse hosting:

https://meta.discourse.org/t/self-hosting-for-free-with-oracle-cloud/139184/

Elijah
------
has about fifty users on the discourse forum

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#30269 — Re: Free cloud virtual servers (Re: ftp problem)

Thank you for the list Eli.

I look forward to reading more about them as time permits.



-- 
Grant. . . .
unix || die

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#30216

On 29/06/2020 15:15, Dieter Britz wrote:
> A few days ago, I started having problems with ftp. I always
> prefer to type in my ftp commands, rather than use Filzilla.
> Here is what happens when I log in and ask for a directory listing:
> 
> ~> ftp ftp.dieterbritz.dk
> Connected to accessproxy.webpod10-cph3.one.com.
> 220 Welcome to One.com FTP.
> Name (ftp.dieterbritz.dk:db): dieterbritz.dk
> 331 User dieterbritz.dk OK. Password required
> Password:
> 230 OK. Current restricted directory is /
> Remote system type is UNIX.
> Using binary mode to transfer files.
> ftp> ls
> 501 PORT address does not match originator.
> ftp: bind: Address already in use
> ftp>
> 
> I used to just get that listing but not now. What are
> those last lines telling me?
> I run Kubuntu.
> 
ahh....have you changed router?
FTP uses a comms port and a data transfer port.
Routers need to masquerade that correctly if using NAT..
Took me for ever to get NFS working over the internet with my new 
router. My router insisted on using ports > 1000 as the translated 
source port, and the NFS server considered that insecure till I told it 
to Foxtrot Oscar.

There is always sftp. A cleaner protocol.And IIRC there are tools to let 
you 'mount' remote filesystems using it to look like part of your file 
system to GUI tools

If you have ssh access its worth considering



-- 
“Some people like to travel by train because it combines the slowness of 
a car with the cramped public exposure of 
an airplane.”

Dennis Miller

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