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Re: Python

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On 12/14/25 06:56, Stéphane CARPENTIER wrote:
> Le 14-12-2025, c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> a écrit :
>>
>>     NOT sure why so many people want to trash Python.
> 
> My issues with python are:
> - It's using indentations, so when I comment a block of code to see
>    what happens, it breaks everything and I have to manage the
>    indentations. I can't just comment/uncomment a block of code as I do
>    with other programming languages.

   You CAN do block comments BTW ... use triple-quote at
   the beginning/end. The double and single quote char
   work.

   Indents ... well ... those have been good programming
   practice since forever. With Python they are also
   functional, not just 'decorative'. I do pref the 'C'
   start/end brackets or Pascal Begin/End ... but Python
   isn't THAT hard to deal with. Typically use just TWO
   space indents to keep line-lengths shorter. A few
   editors put in vertical guide lines to help keep
   Python code right. IDLE is the most common with that,
   but more elaborate editors like PyCharm can be had.
   I *think* geany can be set to do that also.

> - It's sold as an easy programming language. Which is true for
>    discovering it. And once I'm using it in the real life, I
>    discover the hard reality. A lot of things that should just work don't
>    because it's an exception.

   Umm ... haven't had many problems myself - and I came
   from COBOL, FORTRAN, Pascal, C .......

> - The version management is awful. There are a lot of ways to be able to
>    use different packages than the ones used by the system. But not two
>    people are using the same. It looks like venv is going a little bit
>    forward, but only for new programs.

   I'll agree about the version issue. This is an especial
   annoyance if you're using a 'compiler'. It's best to use
   the 'include all libs' option - but you get a rather
   fat executable as a result. However in interpreted mode
   it rarely matters if the sub-version number changes
   unless you're trying to back-port some brand new feature
   to a much older version.

> It's not the worse, mind you. For me there is nothing more horrible than
> cacascript.
> 
>>     At this juncture it's good for basically ANYTHING.
> 
> That's what I said: a lot of libraries. I agree with that.
> 
>>     sometimes returned by systems work. Depending on
>>     future uses you may have to convert them to "real"
>>     strings.
> 
> Exactly why I don't like python. "Sometimes", "depending on", "you may
> have to" and other things that habitually work except when they don't.

   Well ... EVERY lang has its little gotchas and special rules ...

>>     Yea yea ... it's "interpreted" ...
> 
> No. That I don't care. It's not that slow on a modern computer and when
> it's slow, it's often more related with the network or the environment.
> 
>>     It's readable,
> 
> Yes, that I agree with and that's a reason why I don't like Haskell.
> Haskell has lot of very good ideas, but they are trying as much as
> possible to avoid parenthesis and it's awful to read.
> 
> My issue with python is not about understanding what it does. It's about
> understanding why it doesn't as expected. The error messages aren't that
> bad neither.

   All I can say is that in MY experience it works "as expected".
   When in doubt, look it up.

   Python was kind of the LAST lang I learned (ok dabbled
   very briefly with ADA - aka (A)wful (D)espair (A)lways)).
   Looked at Py2, but waited until Py3 was up to speed.

   Python now the most common lang I use for apps of any size
   or type. On occasion I'll re-make a Python app into 'C'
   or Pascal - but not that often anymore.

   No, NOT going to re-make into COBOL !

   FORTRAN ... umm ... maybe for fun :-)

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Re: Recent history of vi Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2025-12-13 11:55 +0000
  Re: Recent history of vi Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2025-12-13 14:44 +0000
  Python "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-12-13 23:35 +0100
    Re: Python rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-12-14 01:48 +0000
      Re: Python drb@ihatespam.msu.edu (Dennis Boone) - 2025-12-14 20:00 +0000
        Re: Python rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-12-14 20:43 +0000
        Re: Python c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-12-15 02:40 -0500
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        Re: Python rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-12-15 22:17 +0000
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    Re: Python c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-12-13 23:27 -0500
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        Re: Python Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-12-14 23:29 +0000
          Re: Python mm0fmf <none@invalid.com> - 2025-12-15 12:57 +0000
            Re: Python Alexander Schreiber <als@usenet.thangorodrim.de> - 2025-12-15 22:57 +0100
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                Re: Python c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-12-17 03:11 -0500
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                Re: Python c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-12-17 22:10 -0500
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                Re: Python c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-12-18 04:25 -0500
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                Re: Python c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-12-19 01:14 -0500
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                Re: Python Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-12-17 22:11 +0000
                Re: Python c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-12-17 22:18 -0500
                Re: Python rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-12-18 07:07 +0000
                Re: Python Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2025-12-17 22:13 +0000
                Re: Python rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-12-18 00:52 +0000
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                Re: Python rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-12-18 07:39 +0000
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                Re: Python c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-12-20 04:01 -0500
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                Re: Python The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-12-18 09:55 +0000
                Re: Python Marc Haber <mh+usenetspam1118@zugschl.us> - 2025-12-18 11:19 +0100
                Re: Python The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-12-18 12:36 +0000
        Re: Python c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-12-14 23:36 -0500
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            Re: Python rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-12-19 19:50 +0000
              Re: Python scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2025-12-19 20:03 +0000
                Re: Python Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2025-12-19 21:00 +0000
                Re: Python c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-12-20 04:16 -0500
                Re: Python c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-12-20 04:15 -0500
            Re: Python c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-12-20 02:52 -0500
              Re: Python rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-12-21 04:00 +0000
          Re: Python Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2025-12-19 20:57 +0000
            Re: Python Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2025-12-19 22:09 +0000
              Re: Python rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-12-20 05:37 +0000
              Re: Python Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2025-12-20 10:34 +0000
              Re: Python Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2025-12-20 11:45 +0000
                Re: Python Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2025-12-20 13:32 +0000
                Re: Python Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2025-12-20 16:36 +0000
                Re: Python Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2025-12-20 16:37 +0000
      Re: Python "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-12-14 13:16 +0100
        Re: Python c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-12-15 00:45 -0500
      Re: Python The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-12-15 18:55 +0000
        Re: Python rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-12-15 22:39 +0000
        Re: Python Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-12-15 23:53 +0000
  Re: Python (was Re: Recent history of vi) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-12-14 02:05 +0000
    Re: Python (was Re: Recent history of vi) candycanearter07 <candycanearter07@candycanearter07.nomail.afraid> - 2025-12-19 13:30 +0000
      Re: Python (was Re: Recent history of vi) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-12-19 20:58 +0000
        Re: Python (was Re: Recent history of vi) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-12-20 05:48 +0000
      Re: Python (was Re: Recent history of vi) Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2025-12-20 10:12 +0000
        Re: Python (was Re: Recent history of vi) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-12-20 05:25 -0500
        Re: Python (was Re: Recent history of vi) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-12-20 22:28 +0000
  Re: Recent history of vi The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-12-15 18:39 +0000
    Re: Recent history of vi John Bokma <contact@johnbokma.com> - 2025-12-15 19:46 +0100
    Re: Recent history of vi Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-12-15 23:54 +0000

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