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Groups > comp.misc > #26457 > unrolled thread
| Started by | Retrograde <fungus@amongus.com.invalid> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2025-02-16 16:55 +0000 |
| Last post | 2025-02-26 21:21 -0300 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 290 — 23 participants |
Back to article view | Back to comp.misc
Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Retrograde <fungus@amongus.com.invalid> - 2025-02-16 16:55 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-16 21:23 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-16 23:55 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-17 11:40 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Dave Yeo <dave.r.yeo@gmail.com> - 2025-02-17 09:26 -0800
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-17 22:42 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) - 2025-02-17 22:23 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-18 10:20 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy not@telling.you.invalid (Computer Nerd Kev) - 2025-02-19 07:32 +1000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> - 2025-02-18 23:47 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-19 09:42 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Ivan Shmakov <ivan@siamics.netREMOVE.invalid> - 2025-03-06 07:10 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-07 20:44 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-08 23:44 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy not@telling.you.invalid (Computer Nerd Kev) - 2025-02-20 08:23 +1000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-19 22:22 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-20 15:55 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-20 17:59 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-20 18:01 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-20 22:51 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-20 22:01 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-21 10:29 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-23 22:55 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2025-02-24 05:19 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-24 13:28 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-24 10:55 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-24 13:34 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-24 23:15 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2025-02-24 23:06 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-25 11:10 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-25 10:08 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-25 23:12 +0100
OT: walking and exercising (Was: Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy) Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-26 21:31 -0300
Re: OT: walking and exercising (Was: Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy) D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-27 14:52 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy candycanearter07 <candycanearter07@candycanearter07.nomail.afraid> - 2025-02-27 21:40 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-01 11:48 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy candycanearter07 <candycanearter07@candycanearter07.nomail.afraid> - 2025-03-05 06:40 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-05 13:39 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy candycanearter07 <candycanearter07@candycanearter07.nomail.afraid> - 2025-03-05 20:00 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-05 22:12 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2025-02-24 17:54 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-24 23:41 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2025-02-24 23:19 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-25 11:16 +0100
education Ivan Shmakov <ivan@siamics.netREMOVE.invalid> - 2025-03-06 07:55 +0000
Re: education Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-07 22:00 -0300
Re: education Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2025-03-08 03:47 +0000
Re: education Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-08 18:27 -0300
Re: education Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> - 2025-03-09 02:08 +0000
Re: education Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-10 02:58 -0300
Re: education Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> - 2025-03-10 18:38 +0000
Re: education cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2025-03-10 19:13 +0000
Re: education Ivan Shmakov <ivan@siamics.netREMOVE.invalid> - 2025-03-11 13:30 +0000
Re: education Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-14 11:17 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) - 2025-02-25 19:12 -0500
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2025-02-26 02:08 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D Finnigan <dog_cow@macgui.com> - 2025-02-26 09:06 -0600
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> - 2025-02-26 18:09 -0400
the command line is language (Was: Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy) Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-26 21:46 -0300
Re: the command line is language (Was: Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy) Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> - 2025-02-27 03:31 -0400
Re: the command line is language Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-27 08:10 -0300
Re: the command line is language D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-27 15:41 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-27 14:47 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-26 13:15 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) - 2025-02-26 16:34 -0500
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) - 2025-02-26 16:38 -0500
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2025-02-26 22:34 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) - 2025-02-26 18:50 -0500
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2025-02-27 03:11 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-27 08:18 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2025-02-27 17:04 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) - 2025-02-27 18:53 -0500
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2025-02-28 21:41 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-26 22:03 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2025-02-27 03:29 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-27 15:16 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-27 12:36 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-26 21:55 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-27 14:43 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2025-02-27 17:07 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) - 2025-02-27 19:05 -0500
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2025-03-01 15:06 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-01 11:47 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2025-03-01 16:31 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-26 21:52 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-27 15:15 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2025-03-01 16:51 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> - 2025-03-01 17:15 -0400
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-02 12:34 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Richmond <dnomhcir@gmx.com> - 2025-02-26 12:29 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) - 2025-02-26 16:34 -0500
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-26 22:04 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy candycanearter07 <candycanearter07@candycanearter07.nomail.afraid> - 2025-03-05 20:00 +0000
more on broken schools (Was: Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy) Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-26 21:38 -0300
Re: more on broken schools (Was: Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy) kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) - 2025-02-26 19:47 -0500
Re: more on broken schools Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-27 08:55 -0300
Re: more on broken schools kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) - 2025-02-27 19:00 -0500
OT: a personal note to Stefan Ram (Was: Re: more on broken schools) Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-27 09:31 -0300
Re: more on broken schools (Was: Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy) D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-27 15:03 +0100
Re: more on broken schools Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-07 20:30 -0300
Re: more on broken schools D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-08 23:43 +0100
Re: more on broken schools Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-08 21:33 -0300
Re: more on broken schools D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-09 13:30 +0100
Re: more on broken schools Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-10 03:00 -0300
Re: more on broken schools D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-10 10:50 +0100
Re: more on broken schools Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-10 08:46 -0300
Re: more on broken schools D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-11 23:05 +0100
Re: more on broken schools Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-14 11:31 -0300
Re: more on broken schools D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-14 23:46 +0100
Re: more on broken schools Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-16 22:43 -0300
Re: more on broken schools D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-17 23:44 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-20 22:50 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-20 22:21 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-21 17:06 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-23 23:28 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-24 11:12 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-24 14:08 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-24 23:32 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-24 22:22 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-25 11:34 +0100
fdm, paredit and systemd (Was: Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy) Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-25 13:18 -0300
Re: fdm, paredit and systemd (Was: Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy) D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-26 13:53 +0100
Re: fdm, paredit and systemd Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-27 06:23 -0300
Re: fdm, paredit and systemd D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-27 15:31 +0100
Re: fdm, paredit and systemd Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-07 21:10 -0300
Re: fdm, paredit and systemd D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-09 00:09 +0100
Re: fdm, paredit and systemd Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-08 21:41 -0300
Re: fdm, paredit and systemd D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-09 13:32 +0100
UNIX systems (Was: Re: fdm, paredit and systemd) Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-10 03:10 -0300
Re: UNIX systems (Was: Re: fdm, paredit and systemd) D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-10 10:54 +0100
Re: UNIX systems Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-10 09:08 -0300
Re: UNIX systems D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-11 23:09 +0100
Re: UNIX systems Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-13 18:17 -0300
Re: UNIX systems D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-16 00:03 +0100
Re: UNIX systems Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-16 22:41 -0300
Re: UNIX systems D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-18 10:50 +0100
Re: UNIX systems Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-21 16:26 -0300
Re: UNIX systems Matto Fransen <mattof@sdf.org> - 2025-03-21 19:53 +0000
Re: UNIX systems Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-24 00:11 -0300
Re: UNIX systems D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-21 23:37 +0100
Re: UNIX systems Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-24 00:34 -0300
Re: UNIX systems D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-25 21:49 +0100
Re: UNIX systems Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-26 23:24 -0300
Re: UNIX systems D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-29 22:31 +0100
Re: UNIX systems Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-29 20:40 -0300
Re: UNIX systems Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-22 10:11 -0300
Re: UNIX systems kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) - 2025-03-25 17:40 -0400
Re: UNIX systems D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-25 23:04 +0100
Re: UNIX systems Charles Dagny <1800@DEV.NULL> - 2025-03-28 21:41 -0300
Re: UNIX systems onion@anon.invalid (Mr Ön!on) - 2025-03-10 15:06 +0000
Re: UNIX systems Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-11 11:58 -0300
Re: UNIX systems yeti <yeti@tilde.institute> - 2025-03-11 15:49 +0042
Re: UNIX systems cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2025-03-11 15:25 +0000
Re: UNIX systems onion@anon.invalid (Mr Ön!on) - 2025-03-11 16:24 +0000
Re: UNIX systems cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2025-03-11 17:30 +0000
Re: UNIX systems candycanearter07 <candycanearter07@candycanearter07.nomail.afraid> - 2025-03-12 22:30 +0000
Re: UNIX systems yeti <yeti@tilde.institute> - 2025-03-12 23:23 +0042
Re: UNIX systems candycanearter07 <candycanearter07@candycanearter07.nomail.afraid> - 2025-03-13 20:40 +0000
Re: UNIX systems Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-13 18:04 -0300
Re: UNIX systems cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2025-03-13 21:26 +0000
Re: UNIX systems Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-14 12:23 -0300
Re: UNIX systems cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2025-03-13 01:24 +0000
Re: UNIX systems Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> - 2025-03-12 01:38 -0300
Re: UNIX systems snipeco.2@gmail.com (Sn!pe) - 2025-03-12 14:03 +0000
Re: UNIX systems D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-12 22:19 +0100
Re: UNIX systems kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) - 2025-03-11 19:09 -0400
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> - 2025-03-04 02:44 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy scott@alfter.diespammersdie.us (Scott Alfter) - 2025-03-04 17:50 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-19 09:40 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy not@telling.you.invalid (Computer Nerd Kev) - 2025-02-20 08:29 +1000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-20 15:56 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-19 21:45 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-20 16:01 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-20 18:22 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-20 23:02 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-20 22:44 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-21 10:43 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-23 23:04 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-24 11:01 +0100
broken schools (Was: Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy) Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-24 13:46 -0300
Re: broken schools (Was: Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy) D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-24 23:18 +0100
Re: broken schools Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-24 22:34 -0300
Re: broken schools D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-25 11:38 +0100
Re: broken schools Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-25 15:45 -0300
Re: broken schools D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-26 14:05 +0100
Re: broken schools Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2025-02-26 13:15 +0000
Re: broken schools D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-26 23:10 +0100
Re: broken schools Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-27 06:49 -0300
Re: broken schools Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-27 07:41 -0300
Re: broken schools D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-27 19:52 +0100
Re: broken schools Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-07 21:41 -0300
Re: broken schools yeti <yeti@tilde.institute> - 2025-03-08 02:59 +0042
Re: broken schools D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-09 00:14 +0100
Re: broken schools Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-08 22:26 -0300
Re: broken schools D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-09 22:52 +0100
Re: broken schools Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-10 08:39 -0300
Re: broken schools D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-11 22:59 +0100
Re: broken schools Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-14 12:10 -0300
Re: broken schools D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-15 23:58 +0100
Re: broken schools Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-17 00:02 -0300
Re: broken schools Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2025-03-18 03:00 +0000
Re: broken schools Eva Lu <evalu@tor.soy> - 2025-03-18 21:20 -0300
Re: broken schools D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-18 11:17 +0100
OT: totally off-topic (Was: Re: broken schools) Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-19 13:51 -0300
Re: OT: totally off-topic (Was: Re: broken schools) D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-19 23:20 +0100
Re: OT: totally off-topic Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-21 11:52 -0300
Re: OT: totally off-topic D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-23 00:31 +0100
Re: OT: totally off-topic Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-29 20:50 -0300
Re: OT: totally off-topic D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-04-01 16:43 +0200
Re: OT: totally off-topic Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-04-04 11:20 -0300
Re: OT: totally off-topic D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-04-06 23:17 +0200
Re: OT: totally off-topic Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-04-10 15:19 -0300
Re: OT: totally off-topic D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-04-12 21:05 +0200
Re: OT: totally off-topic Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-04-13 13:10 -0300
lifestyles Ivan Shmakov <ivan@siamics.netREMOVE.invalid> - 2025-03-11 20:20 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-19 21:40 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-20 15:57 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Adrian <bulleid@ku.gro.lioff> - 2025-02-17 18:30 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-17 22:44 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Adrian <bulleid@ku.gro.lioff> - 2025-02-18 00:08 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy snipeco.2@gmail.com (Sn!pe) - 2025-02-18 00:30 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-18 10:23 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-19 21:52 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy snipeco.2@gmail.com (Sn!pe) - 2025-02-20 01:09 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-19 22:27 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) - 2025-02-20 21:51 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-20 23:22 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-21 10:23 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-20 16:07 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-20 18:35 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-20 23:31 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-20 23:06 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-21 11:01 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Adrian <bulleid@ku.gro.lioff> - 2025-02-18 13:48 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-19 21:56 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-18 10:22 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Adrian <bulleid@ku.gro.lioff> - 2025-02-18 14:05 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-19 22:03 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-20 16:14 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-20 18:47 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy snipeco.2@gmail.com (Sn!pe) - 2025-02-20 22:12 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-20 23:15 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-21 11:04 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-21 10:21 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-23 22:46 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-24 10:43 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.moc> - 2025-02-25 14:20 +0300
small communities, nntp server (Was: Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy) Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-25 15:20 -0300
Re: small communities, nntp server (Was: Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy) D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-26 13:57 +0100
Re: small communities, nntp server Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-26 21:20 -0300
Re: small communities, nntp server D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-27 14:49 +0100
Re: small communities, nntp server yeti <yeti@tilde.institute> - 2025-02-26 13:50 +0042
Re: small communities, nntp server D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-26 23:08 +0100
Re: small communities, nntp server D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-26 23:08 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-19 21:59 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-20 16:13 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-20 18:41 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-20 23:33 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-20 23:12 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-21 11:03 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-19 21:51 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) - 2025-02-20 21:49 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-20 23:21 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-21 10:22 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) - 2025-02-22 17:09 +0000
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-23 00:23 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-19 21:49 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-20 16:05 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-20 18:24 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-20 23:05 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-20 22:56 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-21 10:51 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-23 23:21 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-24 11:10 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-24 14:04 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-24 23:28 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-24 21:58 -0300
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-25 11:26 +0100
OT: personal stories (Was: Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy) Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-25 11:58 -0300
Re: OT: personal stories (Was: Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy) D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-26 13:21 +0100
Re: OT: personal stories Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-27 06:04 -0300
Re: OT: personal stories D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-02-27 15:21 +0100
Re: OT: personal stories Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-07 20:49 -0300
Re: OT: personal stories yeti <yeti@tilde.institute> - 2025-03-08 00:43 +0042
Re: OT: personal stories D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-08 23:46 +0100
Re: OT: personal stories D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-08 23:45 +0100
Re: OT: personal stories Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-03-08 21:37 -0300
Re: OT: personal stories D <nospam@example.net> - 2025-03-09 13:30 +0100
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy D Finnigan <dog_cow@macgui.com> - 2025-02-25 13:17 -0600
Re: Schneier, Data and Goliath: no hope for privacy Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> - 2025-02-26 21:21 -0300
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| From | D <nospam@example.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-03-08 23:43 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: more on broken schools |
| Message-ID | <61986dab-6a03-b266-0cd4-da95bcce70bd@example.net> |
| In reply to | #26825 |
On Fri, 7 Mar 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: > D <nospam@example.net> writes: > >> On Wed, 26 Feb 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: >> >>> These days, even computer science departments are completely based on >>> Google services, say. Students don't even have the chance to run the >>> local mail server. It's appalling. >> >> Not all hope is lost! ;) My courses are based on linux and for the cloud part, >> they are based on our own OpenStack environment! =D > > Yay---a 4-leaf clover. :P Seriously, though: good job. Thank you! =) I'm hoping that I will be able to convince another school to dump Azure in favour of our OpenStack environment. Would be wonderful to have combatted the forces of darkness, and won, at two schools! =) They like the fact that I can give them a fixed price per student and month, instead of the shitshow that is Azure pricing. They also like that the school gets a dedicated server, so should someone break in and do crypto mining, they won't get a large bill like they do with Azure. More often than you would think, do student credentials leak to github and then they pay for someone crypto mining. That problem they won't have with my environment. =)
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| From | Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-03-08 21:33 -0300 |
| Subject | Re: more on broken schools |
| Message-ID | <878qpf9h59.fsf@example.com> |
| In reply to | #26836 |
D <nospam@example.net> writes: > On Fri, 7 Mar 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: > >> D <nospam@example.net> writes: >> >>> On Wed, 26 Feb 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: >>> >>>> These days, even computer science departments are completely based on >>>> Google services, say. Students don't even have the chance to run the >>>> local mail server. It's appalling. >>> >>> Not all hope is lost! ;) My courses are based on linux and for the >>> cloud part, they are based on our own OpenStack environment! =D >> >> Yay---a 4-leaf clover. :P Seriously, though: good job. > > Thank you! =) I'm hoping that I will be able to convince another > school to dump Azure in favour of our OpenStack environment. Would be > wonderful to have combatted the forces of darkness, and won, at two > schools! =) > > They like the fact that I can give them a fixed price per student and > month, instead of the shitshow that is Azure pricing. They also like > that the school gets a dedicated server, so should someone break in > and do crypto mining, they won't get a large bill like they do with > Azure. > > More often than you would think, do student credentials leak to github > and then they pay for someone crypto mining. That problem they won't > have with my environment. =) Wait---is that service you provide yourself for a price?
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | D <nospam@example.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-03-09 13:30 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: more on broken schools |
| Message-ID | <c4dc80b0-2c3e-f25c-4035-fd7e4c876be9@example.net> |
| In reply to | #26844 |
On Sat, 8 Mar 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: >> Thank you! =) I'm hoping that I will be able to convince another >> school to dump Azure in favour of our OpenStack environment. Would be >> wonderful to have combatted the forces of darkness, and won, at two >> schools! =) >> >> They like the fact that I can give them a fixed price per student and >> month, instead of the shitshow that is Azure pricing. They also like >> that the school gets a dedicated server, so should someone break in >> and do crypto mining, they won't get a large bill like they do with >> Azure. >> >> More often than you would think, do student credentials leak to github >> and then they pay for someone crypto mining. That problem they won't >> have with my environment. =) > > Wait---is that service you provide yourself for a price? > Yes, I do. =) Are you interested? ;)
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-03-10 03:00 -0300 |
| Subject | Re: more on broken schools |
| Message-ID | <874j015stb.fsf@example.com> |
| In reply to | #26849 |
D <nospam@example.net> writes: > On Sat, 8 Mar 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: > >>> Thank you! =) I'm hoping that I will be able to convince another >>> school to dump Azure in favour of our OpenStack environment. Would be >>> wonderful to have combatted the forces of darkness, and won, at two >>> schools! =) >>> >>> They like the fact that I can give them a fixed price per student and >>> month, instead of the shitshow that is Azure pricing. They also like >>> that the school gets a dedicated server, so should someone break in >>> and do crypto mining, they won't get a large bill like they do with >>> Azure. >>> >>> More often than you would think, do student credentials leak to github >>> and then they pay for someone crypto mining. That problem they won't >>> have with my environment. =) >> >> Wait---is that service you provide yourself for a price? >> > > Yes, I do. =) Are you interested? ;) Not quite. :) I like to run my own stuff. But I'm happy to see that it works over there. It seems like a pretty nice business. I would really love to run a business like that. And I would be able to if I we were back in the 90s, I guess. Am I too off the facts?
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | D <nospam@example.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-03-10 10:50 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: more on broken schools |
| Message-ID | <a8333697-2704-2cd0-27f3-5915a9f44bd9@example.net> |
| In reply to | #26857 |
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: >>> >> >> Yes, I do. =) Are you interested? ;) > > Not quite. :) I like to run my own stuff. But I'm happy to see that it What a shame. =( Would have been great to add a Brazilian school to my customers! > works over there. It seems like a pretty nice business. I would really It's alright. It's more of a side business actually. The main business is consulting as teachers, and we then have the lab environment as a nice value add service that we sell when we get the consulting gig as teachers. The challenge is inertia and trust. There are a lot of schools who run azure, are unhappy, and refuse to change because the alterantive is not azure. So they end up paying 10x or more, because they do not trust small business. It is very sad. =( > love to run a business like that. And I would be able to if I we were > back in the 90s, I guess. Am I too off the facts? I think you could do it today if you dedicated a couple of months to building up the environment. OpenStack has come a _long_ way and is no longer the enormous beast to setup that it once was.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-03-10 08:46 -0300 |
| Subject | Re: more on broken schools |
| Message-ID | <87y0xd2jn4.fsf@example.com> |
| In reply to | #26864 |
D <nospam@example.net> writes: > On Mon, 10 Mar 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: > >>>> >>> >>> Yes, I do. =) Are you interested? ;) >> >> Not quite. :) I like to run my own stuff. But I'm happy to see that it > > What a shame. =( Would have been great to add a Brazilian school to my > customers! You can still add a Brazilian school to your clientele. I'm just not a school. :) >> works over there. It seems like a pretty nice business. I would really > > It's alright. It's more of a side business actually. The main business > is consulting as teachers, and we then have the lab environment as a > nice value add service that we sell when we get the consulting gig as > teachers. So the main service is what? A set of teachers to give a school the ability to teach computer courses? Suppose I'm a high school. How do would you offer to me your services? I currently have a single teacher who teaches a Python course---the teacher is a math teacher. > The challenge is inertia and trust. There are a lot of schools who run > azure, are unhappy, and refuse to change because the alterantive is > not azure. So they end up paying 10x or more, because they do not > trust small business. It is very sad. =( That made me think your service is just a cloud-like service---storage, office-like web applications, mail, calendar, video conference et cetera. Are there teachers involved? >> love to run a business like that. And I would be able to if I we were >> back in the 90s, I guess. Am I too off the facts? > > I think you could do it today if you dedicated a couple of months to > building up the environment. OpenStack has come a _long_ way and is no > longer the enormous beast to setup that it once was. That's interesting. But tell me about the teachers because I didn't get the whole thing yet. I would think a service like that would require a 24-7 support as the most challenging part.
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| From | D <nospam@example.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-03-11 23:05 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: more on broken schools |
| Message-ID | <7ea9afe3-da06-ed4a-4160-399d2888cc15@example.net> |
| In reply to | #26867 |
On Mon, 10 Mar 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: >> What a shame. =( Would have been great to add a Brazilian school to my >> customers! > > You can still add a Brazilian school to your clientele. I'm just not a > school. :) True. But too much time and trouble when there are plenty of potential customers close by. >>> works over there. It seems like a pretty nice business. I would really >> >> It's alright. It's more of a side business actually. The main business >> is consulting as teachers, and we then have the lab environment as a >> nice value add service that we sell when we get the consulting gig as >> teachers. > > So the main service is what? A set of teachers to give a school the > ability to teach computer courses? Suppose I'm a high school. How do > would you offer to me your services? I currently have a single teacher > who teaches a Python course---the teacher is a math teacher. The main service is teachers who work as consultants teaching IT. Value add services are lab environments in "the cloud", a piece of software automating grade reporting to the government web site which is close to being unusable, and a platform for online tests. >> The challenge is inertia and trust. There are a lot of schools who run >> azure, are unhappy, and refuse to change because the alterantive is >> not azure. So they end up paying 10x or more, because they do not >> trust small business. It is very sad. =( > > That made me think your service is just a cloud-like service---storage, > office-like web applications, mail, calendar, video conference et > cetera. Are there teachers involved? No, just virtual machines. Too much trouble and too little profit in delivering office 365 equivalents, calendar and email. We could if we wanted to, but that would probably require an entire school shifting from Microsoft to us, and I doubt it will happen. It also probably would mean that we would need to hire another person to spread the admin and support load, and that would probably not make it worth it. I'm not ruling it out, but I'm not actively selling it either. >>> love to run a business like that. And I would be able to if I we were >>> back in the 90s, I guess. Am I too off the facts? >> >> I think you could do it today if you dedicated a couple of months to >> building up the environment. OpenStack has come a _long_ way and is no >> longer the enormous beast to setup that it once was. > > That's interesting. But tell me about the teachers because I didn't get > the whole thing yet. I would think a service like that would require a > 24-7 support as the most challenging part. No, the lab environment has no SLA:s, since it is just a lab environment, so if it goes down for 15 minutes the students just shrug their shoulders and try again later. But, to be honest, there is very little downtime, and we also have 3 regions/servers. So in case of downtime, first fix is to shift a student to another region/server. That usually solves the problem 9 out of 10 times. If that doesn't work, reboot the 3 servers and wait for 5-10 minutes. If that doesn't work, reinstall the enviroment which might take 20-40 minutes.
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| From | Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-03-14 11:31 -0300 |
| Subject | Re: more on broken schools |
| Message-ID | <878qp7u1in.fsf@example.com> |
| In reply to | #26886 |
D <nospam@example.net> writes: > On Mon, 10 Mar 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: >>> The challenge is inertia and trust. There are a lot of schools who run >>> azure, are unhappy, and refuse to change because the alterantive is >>> not azure. So they end up paying 10x or more, because they do not >>> trust small business. It is very sad. =( >> >> That made me think your service is just a cloud-like service---storage, >> office-like web applications, mail, calendar, video conference et >> cetera. Are there teachers involved? > > No, just virtual machines. Too much trouble and too little profit in delivering > office 365 equivalents, calendar and email. We could if we wanted to, but that > would probably require an entire school shifting from Microsoft to us, and I > doubt it will happen. It also probably would mean that we would need to hire > another person to spread the admin and support load, and that would probably not > make it worth it. I'm not ruling it out, but I'm not actively selling it either. [...] >> That's interesting. But tell me about the teachers because I didn't get >> the whole thing yet. I would think a service like that would require a >> 24-7 support as the most challenging part. > > No, the lab environment has no SLA:s, since it is just a lab environment, so if > it goes down for 15 minutes the students just shrug their shoulders and try > again later. But, to be honest, there is very little downtime, and we also have > 3 regions/servers. So in case of downtime, first fix is to shift a > student to another > region/server. That usually solves the problem 9 out of 10 times. If that > doesn't work, reboot the 3 servers and wait for 5-10 minutes. If that doesn't > work, reinstall the enviroment which might take 20-40 minutes. Oh, I see; now I got a better view of the business. Congrats---I think that's a pretty nice job. I would like to have a job like that.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | D <nospam@example.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-03-14 23:46 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: more on broken schools |
| Message-ID | <eca15842-f01d-4e2d-4420-10f2aac60546@example.net> |
| In reply to | #26901 |
On Fri, 14 Mar 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: >> >> No, the lab environment has no SLA:s, since it is just a lab environment, so if >> it goes down for 15 minutes the students just shrug their shoulders and try >> again later. But, to be honest, there is very little downtime, and we also have >> 3 regions/servers. So in case of downtime, first fix is to shift a >> student to another >> region/server. That usually solves the problem 9 out of 10 times. If that >> doesn't work, reboot the 3 servers and wait for 5-10 minutes. If that doesn't >> work, reinstall the enviroment which might take 20-40 minutes. > > Oh, I see; now I got a better view of the business. Congrats---I think > that's a pretty nice job. I would like to have a job like that. Yes, it is quite a nice job! =) Well, you could have a job like that! Maybe you could start looking around your school for opportunities to sell teacher consultants? I'd say that would probably be the easiest place to start looking for opportunities. =)
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-03-16 22:43 -0300 |
| Subject | Re: more on broken schools |
| Message-ID | <87o6y0jut6.fsf@example.com> |
| In reply to | #26906 |
D <nospam@example.net> writes: > On Fri, 14 Mar 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: > >>> No, the lab environment has no SLA:s, since it is just a lab >>> environment, so if it goes down for 15 minutes the students just >>> shrug their shoulders and try again later. But, to be honest, there >>> is very little downtime, and we also have 3 regions/servers. So in >>> case of downtime, first fix is to shift a student to another >>> region/server. That usually solves the problem 9 out of 10 times. If >>> that doesn't work, reboot the 3 servers and wait for 5-10 >>> minutes. If that doesn't work, reinstall the enviroment which might >>> take 20-40 minutes. >> >> Oh, I see; now I got a better view of the business. Congrats---I think >> that's a pretty nice job. I would like to have a job like that. > > Yes, it is quite a nice job! =) Well, you could have a job like that! > Maybe you could start looking around your school for opportunities to > sell teacher consultants? I'd say that would probably be the easiest > place to start looking for opportunities. =) I'll keep that in mind. :)
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | D <nospam@example.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-03-17 23:44 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: more on broken schools |
| Message-ID | <91caf114-8b4c-e38c-2658-97471dfb5dd0@example.net> |
| In reply to | #26923 |
On Sun, 16 Mar 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: > D <nospam@example.net> writes: > >> On Fri, 14 Mar 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: >> >>>> No, the lab environment has no SLA:s, since it is just a lab >>>> environment, so if it goes down for 15 minutes the students just >>>> shrug their shoulders and try again later. But, to be honest, there >>>> is very little downtime, and we also have 3 regions/servers. So in >>>> case of downtime, first fix is to shift a student to another >>>> region/server. That usually solves the problem 9 out of 10 times. If >>>> that doesn't work, reboot the 3 servers and wait for 5-10 >>>> minutes. If that doesn't work, reinstall the enviroment which might >>>> take 20-40 minutes. >>> >>> Oh, I see; now I got a better view of the business. Congrats---I think >>> that's a pretty nice job. I would like to have a job like that. >> >> Yes, it is quite a nice job! =) Well, you could have a job like that! >> Maybe you could start looking around your school for opportunities to >> sell teacher consultants? I'd say that would probably be the easiest >> place to start looking for opportunities. =) > > I'll keep that in mind. :) > I'll keep my fingers crossed! =)
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| From | D <nospam@example.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-20 22:50 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <a535e148-7649-7298-ff8d-7d3669852177@example.net> |
| In reply to | #26527 |
On Thu, 20 Feb 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: > D <nospam@example.net> writes: > >> On Wed, 20 Feb 2025, Computer Nerd Kev wrote: >> >>> Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> wrote: >>>> In comp.misc, Computer Nerd Kev <not@telling.you.invalid> wrote: >>>>> Indeed, so long as you block all FB's scripts and images on >>>>> otherwise unrelated websites. Although I don't tend to make close >>>>> friends so I don't need to worry about controlling their FB usage. >>>> >>>> Doesn't stop people from posting about you on FB. (Or worse, posting >>>> photos of you on there.) >>> >>> What I don't tell, they can't post, and the same with what they >>> don't photograph. Although I guess that does leave a bit of an >>> information vacuum there which some nutcase could exploit to make >>> up missing personal info/photos on me if they so desired. >>> >>>>> Quite mysteriously, all sorts of otherwise respectable open-source >>>>> software developers are happy to use GitHub even though it's owned >>>>> by M$. So even having ditched their software long ago, M$ are now >>>>> very hard to avoid online if, ironically, you want to use, and >>>>> especially work on, open-source software. I find that truely >>>>> unfathomable, but others barely seem to see my problem with it. >>>> >>>> Many, I suspect, started using Github before Microsoft bought them in >>>> 2018. >>> >>> For software projects I use, many more seem to have moved to there >>> since 2018 than before. You'd think they like the M$ acquisition. >>> Occasionally I object and am ignored. >> >> You have been heard! I will not be hosting my stuff on github. On the >> other hand, I have nothing interesting to host, so perhaps a moot >> point. ;) My home made scripts and little utilities live on my laptop >> and sometimes on my server, and are shared upon request. > > I think most little scripts should be documented (with a manual) and put > online. It will make it easier for others to use and it will certainly > encourage others to improve it and share the improvement. So you could > see your little script turn into a nice polished program simply because > someone saw the idea and knew what to do to make it a lot better. Could > be a good source of joy. You have a point! Sigh... so much one wants to do, so little time. =( Let met tell you about my little scripts. I have my old backup script utilizing rsync and replicating over tor, so it can go through firewalls, and uses a hidden service for a permanent global address, so it is not dependent on DNS or domain names. I once had delusions of grandeur and thought about rewriting a small part of tor to remove all hops since I do not need anonymity for that use case. I have my calendar sync scripts. They pull in ics from corporate calendar and converts it to remind format. Then I have a slightly rewritten leafnode that pulls down usenet articles and stores them in Maildir format so I can read and write offline news in my favourite email client alpine. I also have some custom rss2email scripts, and a script that allows me to take any url in an email, and fetch the page and email it to me. Now... do you seriously think anyone would ever be interested in that? ;) > One time I wrote a function---just a function---and added to some > archive online. This was a pretty niche programming language. Years > later, I looked it up---I was still called the author of the function, > but the code was completely rewritten, with much more expertise > knowledge. I thought it was ironic that my name was still there. We > value the pioneer perhaps too much. This is very inspirational! Thank you! >>>> Lately I've been seeing people advocating for a switch to >>>> Codeberg. >>> >>> I don't know about Codeberg, but there have been lots of >>> alternatives all along. Tons of projects switched from SourceForge >>> to GitHub. Many projects have their own websites too, so why not >>> self-host? GitHub do offer a lot of extra features for free, but >>> that's dealing with the devil IMHO. Especially as the more tied in >>> to GitHub-specific systems a project gets, the less practical it is >>> to move away if M$ get more greedy later on. >> >> I have heard about gitea. It seems as if it allows you to setup >> graphical git hosting yourself. I personally use a fossil repository >> accessible only over ssh. I don't use any of the wiki/ticket/chat >> functionality included in it. > > There's Forgejo, too. It looks very good. Like in Github, you can > disable all such modules---wiki, ticket system et cetera. > Thank you. Will check out, haven't heard about it!
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| From | Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-20 22:21 -0300 |
| Message-ID | <87frk8drdb.fsf@example.com> |
| In reply to | #26535 |
D <nospam@example.net> writes:
> On Thu, 20 Feb 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote:
>
>> D <nospam@example.net> writes:
>>
>>> On Wed, 20 Feb 2025, Computer Nerd Kev wrote:
>>>
>>>> Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> wrote:
>>>>> In comp.misc, Computer Nerd Kev <not@telling.you.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>> Indeed, so long as you block all FB's scripts and images on
>>>>>> otherwise unrelated websites. Although I don't tend to make close
>>>>>> friends so I don't need to worry about controlling their FB usage.
>>>>>
>>>>> Doesn't stop people from posting about you on FB. (Or worse, posting
>>>>> photos of you on there.)
>>>>
>>>> What I don't tell, they can't post, and the same with what they
>>>> don't photograph. Although I guess that does leave a bit of an
>>>> information vacuum there which some nutcase could exploit to make
>>>> up missing personal info/photos on me if they so desired.
>>>>
>>>>>> Quite mysteriously, all sorts of otherwise respectable open-source
>>>>>> software developers are happy to use GitHub even though it's owned
>>>>>> by M$. So even having ditched their software long ago, M$ are now
>>>>>> very hard to avoid online if, ironically, you want to use, and
>>>>>> especially work on, open-source software. I find that truely
>>>>>> unfathomable, but others barely seem to see my problem with it.
>>>>>
>>>>> Many, I suspect, started using Github before Microsoft bought them in
>>>>> 2018.
>>>>
>>>> For software projects I use, many more seem to have moved to there
>>>> since 2018 than before. You'd think they like the M$ acquisition.
>>>> Occasionally I object and am ignored.
>>>
>>> You have been heard! I will not be hosting my stuff on github. On the
>>> other hand, I have nothing interesting to host, so perhaps a moot
>>> point. ;) My home made scripts and little utilities live on my laptop
>>> and sometimes on my server, and are shared upon request.
>>
>> I think most little scripts should be documented (with a manual) and put
>> online. It will make it easier for others to use and it will certainly
>> encourage others to improve it and share the improvement. So you could
>> see your little script turn into a nice polished program simply because
>> someone saw the idea and knew what to do to make it a lot better. Could
>> be a good source of joy.
>
> You have a point! Sigh... so much one wants to do, so little time. =(
> Let met tell you about my little scripts. I have my old backup script
> utilizing rsync and replicating over tor, so it can go through
> firewalls, and uses a hidden service for a permanent global address,
> so it is not dependent on DNS or domain names. I once had delusions of
> grandeur and thought about rewriting a small part of tor to remove all
> hops since I do not need anonymity for that use case.
>
> I have my calendar sync scripts. They pull in ics from corporate
> calendar and converts it to remind format.
>
> Then I have a slightly rewritten leafnode that pulls down usenet
> articles and stores them in Maildir format so I can read and write
> offline news in my favourite email client alpine.
>
> I also have some custom rss2email scripts, and a script that allows me
> to take any url in an email, and fetch the page and email it to me.
>
> Now... do you seriously think anyone would ever be interested in that? ;)
LOL! It turns out I'm *highly* interested in your leafnode. Please,
can you put a package somewhere and let me look at it, try it out et
cetera? I've been thinking about doing something like that myself. I
can probably just live with your changes.
I think I once packaged noffle (and not leafnode) for myself, but I
think I stopped using noffle for a news server, too. I think I use
leafnode now, but I use it only as a local news server. I'd like to
have an NNTP server that's simple to use, easily hosts local news server
and also easily peers with a USENET server for just a non-huge list of
groups. I actually would like to write this server myself.
Let me share with you an upload script to https://0x0.st. This is a no
nonsense temporary file uploader. It works well as a paste bin, too.
The script below takes a series of files from the command line and
uploads each one to 0x0.st. If you specify no file, then it will read
from the standard in. The webserver at 0x0.st will print a URL for each
file uploaded, which is the address where you file is then stored.
--8<-------------------------------------------------------->8---
#!/bin/sh
args="$@"; test $# -lt 1 && args='-'
for f in $args; do
curl --silent --show-error -X POST -F "file=@$f" https://0x0.st
done
--8<-------------------------------------------------------->8---
The next script uses upload to invoke scrot, which is a screen shot
taker. It will take the URL printed by upload and store it in X's
primary selection area, which you can paste anywhere with your mouse or
with a keyboard shortcut. (This is done by xsel.)
--8<-------------------------------------------------------->8---
#!/bin/sh
usage()
{
printf 'usage: %s [options]\n' $(basename "$0")
}
test "$1" = '-h' && usage && exit 0
scrot --border -F- "$@" | upload | tr -d '\n' | xsel
--8<-------------------------------------------------------->8---
So if you call this script as /screenshot/ then all you need to do is to
invoke it and wait a moment then press the mouse middle button to paste
the URL somewhere. The bug in it is that you don't know when /upload/
finishes. It would be nice if somehow we could get a sign somewhere
that the URL is already in X's primary selection.
For the upload script, I would also like to write a GNU EMACS procedure
that takes a region of text and feeds upload's standard input. That's a
nice way to share a bit of code or output or something. I'm sure these
things exist already somewhere. But it's nice to do them and perhaps
it's easier to do then to actually find where they are and then learn to
use them.
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| From | D <nospam@example.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-21 17:06 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <2d9b3f1c-c742-e47f-84cf-599e01f9a044@example.net> |
| In reply to | #26551 |
On Thu, 20 Feb 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote:
>> Now... do you seriously think anyone would ever be interested in that? ;)
>
> LOL! It turns out I'm *highly* interested in your leafnode. Please,
> can you put a package somewhere and let me look at it, try it out et
> cetera? I've been thinking about doing something like that myself. I
> can probably just live with your changes.
Of course!
Please grab a copy here:
https://send.vis.ee/download/749384a5de2f4f33/#6ZgrL_j_qwmhqBNuXenoJA
It is very rough, not documented, but in the package you have the leafnode
source. My mod is in the file validatefqdn.c and if memory serves, I just
inverted a test for the fqdn from false to true, and that got rid of the check
for a fqdn. Before the mod leafnode would complain about the domain name and now
I think anything goes.
Also note that in order to run it in "server mode" you need to put the .socket
and .service files in /etc/systemd/system and start them.
In addition, there's my python script nntp2imap.py which takes care of copying
the downloaded news posts to my local Maildir directory "News" and names the
files and puts them in the right directories.
I found leafnode to be very simple to compile, and easy to get going.
> I think I once packaged noffle (and not leafnode) for myself, but I
> think I stopped using noffle for a news server, too. I think I use
> leafnode now, but I use it only as a local news server. I'd like to
> have an NNTP server that's simple to use, easily hosts local news server
> and also easily peers with a USENET server for just a non-huge list of
> groups. I actually would like to write this server myself.
Why did you not use noffle in the end? Never heard of it before, but seems to be
similar perhaps to leafnode.
> Let me share with you an upload script to https://0x0.st. This is a no
> nonsense temporary file uploader. It works well as a paste bin, too.
> The script below takes a series of files from the command line and
> uploads each one to 0x0.st. If you specify no file, then it will read
> from the standard in. The webserver at 0x0.st will print a URL for each
> file uploaded, which is the address where you file is then stored.
Ahh... got it. Thank you very much!
> --8<-------------------------------------------------------->8---
> #!/bin/sh
> args="$@"; test $# -lt 1 && args='-'
>
> for f in $args; do
> curl --silent --show-error -X POST -F "file=@$f" https://0x0.st
> done
> --8<-------------------------------------------------------->8---
>
> The next script uses upload to invoke scrot, which is a screen shot
> taker. It will take the URL printed by upload and store it in X's
> primary selection area, which you can paste anywhere with your mouse or
> with a keyboard shortcut. (This is done by xsel.)
>
> --8<-------------------------------------------------------->8---
> #!/bin/sh
> usage()
> {
> printf 'usage: %s [options]\n' $(basename "$0")
> }
> test "$1" = '-h' && usage && exit 0
> scrot --border -F- "$@" | upload | tr -d '\n' | xsel
> --8<-------------------------------------------------------->8---
>
> So if you call this script as /screenshot/ then all you need to do is to
> invoke it and wait a moment then press the mouse middle button to paste
> the URL somewhere. The bug in it is that you don't know when /upload/
> finishes. It would be nice if somehow we could get a sign somewhere
> that the URL is already in X's primary selection.
>
> For the upload script, I would also like to write a GNU EMACS procedure
> that takes a region of text and feeds upload's standard input. That's a
> nice way to share a bit of code or output or something. I'm sure these
> things exist already somewhere. But it's nice to do them and perhaps
> it's easier to do then to actually find where they are and then learn to
> use them.
>
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| From | Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-23 23:28 -0300 |
| Message-ID | <87ikp02i0x.fsf@example.com> |
| In reply to | #26585 |
D <nospam@example.net> writes: > On Thu, 20 Feb 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: > >>> Now... do you seriously think anyone would ever be interested in that? ;) >> >> LOL! It turns out I'm *highly* interested in your leafnode. Please, >> can you put a package somewhere and let me look at it, try it out et >> cetera? I've been thinking about doing something like that myself. I >> can probably just live with your changes. > > Of course! > > Please grab a copy here: > https://send.vis.ee/download/749384a5de2f4f33/#6ZgrL_j_qwmhqBNuXenoJA Thanks! Got the package and unpacked it fine. By the way, fdm is already pulling my mail and I know it's able to download NNTP articles too, so chances are it can do what leafnode has been doing for you. I'll keep you posted. Thanks very much for providing the package. >> I think I once packaged noffle (and not leafnode) for myself, but I >> think I stopped using noffle for a news server, too. I think I use >> leafnode now, but I use it only as a local news server. I'd like to >> have an NNTP server that's simple to use, easily hosts local news server >> and also easily peers with a USENET server for just a non-huge list of >> groups. I actually would like to write this server myself. > > Why did you not use noffle in the end? Never heard of it before, but seems to be > similar perhaps to leafnode. When I used noffle I didn't know leafnode. :) I got to know leafnode because I started asking people for something more my way than noffle. I complained that I preferred articles written on the file system than stored in a database, so someone pointed out leafnode. Let me see which I'm still running. It's leafnode-2.0.0.alpha20140727b. So I must have really stopped noffle. But I did not package leafnode with my customizations---that I did to noffle only. And by now I am willing to write a new one from scratch, so I intend to make leafnode obsolete as well.
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| From | D <nospam@example.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-24 11:12 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <d3d32047-7d0e-6386-6a7e-ebcfac2007bf@example.net> |
| In reply to | #26622 |
On Sun, 23 Feb 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: > D <nospam@example.net> writes: > >> On Thu, 20 Feb 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: >> >>>> Now... do you seriously think anyone would ever be interested in that? ;) >>> >>> LOL! It turns out I'm *highly* interested in your leafnode. Please, >>> can you put a package somewhere and let me look at it, try it out et >>> cetera? I've been thinking about doing something like that myself. I >>> can probably just live with your changes. >> >> Of course! >> >> Please grab a copy here: >> https://send.vis.ee/download/749384a5de2f4f33/#6ZgrL_j_qwmhqBNuXenoJA > > Thanks! Got the package and unpacked it fine. By the way, fdm is > already pulling my mail and I know it's able to download NNTP articles > too, so chances are it can do what leafnode has been doing for you. > I'll keep you posted. Thanks very much for providing the package. Really?? I had no idea! Maybe I can scrap my leafnode setup then and move to fdm? I think fdm (well I guess, I haven't actually checked) might be more minimal even than leafnode, so thank you for the pointer! I will definitely have to check out the fdm manual today! =) >>> I think I once packaged noffle (and not leafnode) for myself, but I >>> think I stopped using noffle for a news server, too. I think I use >>> leafnode now, but I use it only as a local news server. I'd like to >>> have an NNTP server that's simple to use, easily hosts local news server >>> and also easily peers with a USENET server for just a non-huge list of >>> groups. I actually would like to write this server myself. >> >> Why did you not use noffle in the end? Never heard of it before, but seems to be >> similar perhaps to leafnode. > > When I used noffle I didn't know leafnode. :) I got to know leafnode > because I started asking people for something more my way than noffle. > I complained that I preferred articles written on the file system than > stored in a database, so someone pointed out leafnode. Let me see which > I'm still running. It's leafnode-2.0.0.alpha20140727b. So I must have > really stopped noffle. But I did not package leafnode with my > customizations---that I did to noffle only. Ahh got it. Yes, I do not want to have a database for text based articles only for my personal use. > And by now I am willing to write a new one from scratch, so I intend to > make leafnode obsolete as well. Best of luck! =) Sounds like a nice project!
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| From | Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-24 14:08 -0300 |
| Message-ID | <87msebw9sa.fsf@example.com> |
| In reply to | #26637 |
D <nospam@example.net> writes: > On Sun, 23 Feb 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: > >> D <nospam@example.net> writes: >> >>> On Thu, 20 Feb 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: >>> >>>>> Now... do you seriously think anyone would ever be interested in that? ;) >>>> >>>> LOL! It turns out I'm *highly* interested in your leafnode. Please, >>>> can you put a package somewhere and let me look at it, try it out et >>>> cetera? I've been thinking about doing something like that myself. I >>>> can probably just live with your changes. >>> >>> Of course! >>> >>> Please grab a copy here: >>> https://send.vis.ee/download/749384a5de2f4f33/#6ZgrL_j_qwmhqBNuXenoJA >> >> Thanks! Got the package and unpacked it fine. By the way, fdm is >> already pulling my mail and I know it's able to download NNTP articles >> too, so chances are it can do what leafnode has been doing for you. >> I'll keep you posted. Thanks very much for providing the package. > > Really?? I had no idea! Maybe I can scrap my leafnode setup then and > move to fdm? I think fdm (well I guess, I haven't actually checked) > might be more minimal even than leafnode, so thank you for the > pointer! I will definitely have to check out the fdm manual today! =) Precisely---fdm is minimal. The reason I am not yet setting it up for news is because fdm all by itself is not enough. You need to reply to articles and fdm will not send articles out for you. It will only download'em, so you can read them. (I assume this. I haven't tried it.) So for fdm to work with Gnus, say, (which is what I use), Gnus will need to somehow know to which NNTP server to post my follow-ups. If I use Gnus in its traditional sense, then this work is already done. If I change to fdm, Gnus will likely see all messages as mail. So it's not a complete solution. It's a hacker thing. It always takes various modules and need to work together to work. It's the price we pay. >> And by now I am willing to write a new one from scratch, so I intend to >> make leafnode obsolete as well. > > Best of luck! =) Sounds like a nice project! It is. :) It's the most fun I've ever had with programming. I think Common Lisp is a big part of it. I tried Racket before Common Lisp. Common Lisp is so much my way than Racket is.
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| From | D <nospam@example.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-24 23:32 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <c583f55c-69a6-ee48-70f2-edadc9e3c3a3@example.net> |
| In reply to | #26644 |
On Mon, 24 Feb 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: > D <nospam@example.net> writes: > >> On Sun, 23 Feb 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: >> >>> D <nospam@example.net> writes: >>> >>>> On Thu, 20 Feb 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: >>>> >>>>>> Now... do you seriously think anyone would ever be interested in that? ;) >>>>> >>>>> LOL! It turns out I'm *highly* interested in your leafnode. Please, >>>>> can you put a package somewhere and let me look at it, try it out et >>>>> cetera? I've been thinking about doing something like that myself. I >>>>> can probably just live with your changes. >>>> >>>> Of course! >>>> >>>> Please grab a copy here: >>>> https://send.vis.ee/download/749384a5de2f4f33/#6ZgrL_j_qwmhqBNuXenoJA >>> >>> Thanks! Got the package and unpacked it fine. By the way, fdm is >>> already pulling my mail and I know it's able to download NNTP articles >>> too, so chances are it can do what leafnode has been doing for you. >>> I'll keep you posted. Thanks very much for providing the package. >> >> Really?? I had no idea! Maybe I can scrap my leafnode setup then and >> move to fdm? I think fdm (well I guess, I haven't actually checked) >> might be more minimal even than leafnode, so thank you for the >> pointer! I will definitely have to check out the fdm manual today! =) > > Precisely---fdm is minimal. The reason I am not yet setting it up for > news is because fdm all by itself is not enough. You need to reply to > articles and fdm will not send articles out for you. It will only > download'em, so you can read them. (I assume this. I haven't tried > it.) Sounds perfect for my needs. Alpine, my email client, has built in news functionality. The thing is that you can activate it by turning on "rich headers" and if you do that a Newgrp: field pops up. If you fill in the newsgroup there, alpine then magically takes care of posting it to the group. So if fdm can download the files in a nice spool folder format, I might even be able to apply my small python script to copy the news posting into Maildir folders, and there I can read, and alpine then posts. > So for fdm to work with Gnus, say, (which is what I use), Gnus will need > to somehow know to which NNTP server to post my follow-ups. If I use > Gnus in its traditional sense, then this work is already done. If I > change to fdm, Gnus will likely see all messages as mail. So it's not a > complete solution. It's a hacker thing. It always takes various > modules and need to work together to work. It's the price we pay. True! >>> And by now I am willing to write a new one from scratch, so I intend to >>> make leafnode obsolete as well. >> >> Best of luck! =) Sounds like a nice project! > > It is. :) It's the most fun I've ever had with programming. I think > Common Lisp is a big part of it. I tried Racket before Common Lisp. > Common Lisp is so much my way than Racket is. Go is the next on my list. What is it that makes you like lisp so much? I have never considered it, so I am curious. Doesn't it wear out the () keys on your keyboard? ;)
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| From | Salvador Mirzo <smirzo@example.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-24 22:22 -0300 |
| Message-ID | <87a5aau8bz.fsf@example.com> |
| In reply to | #26652 |
D <nospam@example.net> writes: > On Mon, 24 Feb 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: > >> D <nospam@example.net> writes: >> >>> On Sun, 23 Feb 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: >>> >>>> D <nospam@example.net> writes: >>>> >>>>> On Thu, 20 Feb 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>> Now... do you seriously think anyone would ever be interested in that? ;) >>>>>> >>>>>> LOL! It turns out I'm *highly* interested in your leafnode. Please, >>>>>> can you put a package somewhere and let me look at it, try it out et >>>>>> cetera? I've been thinking about doing something like that myself. I >>>>>> can probably just live with your changes. >>>>> >>>>> Of course! >>>>> >>>>> Please grab a copy here: >>>>> https://send.vis.ee/download/749384a5de2f4f33/#6ZgrL_j_qwmhqBNuXenoJA >>>> >>>> Thanks! Got the package and unpacked it fine. By the way, fdm is >>>> already pulling my mail and I know it's able to download NNTP articles >>>> too, so chances are it can do what leafnode has been doing for you. >>>> I'll keep you posted. Thanks very much for providing the package. >>> >>> Really?? I had no idea! Maybe I can scrap my leafnode setup then and >>> move to fdm? I think fdm (well I guess, I haven't actually checked) >>> might be more minimal even than leafnode, so thank you for the >>> pointer! I will definitely have to check out the fdm manual today! =) >> >> Precisely---fdm is minimal. The reason I am not yet setting it up for >> news is because fdm all by itself is not enough. You need to reply to >> articles and fdm will not send articles out for you. It will only >> download'em, so you can read them. (I assume this. I haven't tried >> it.) > > Sounds perfect for my needs. Alpine, my email client, has built in > news functionality. The thing is that you can activate it by turning > on "rich headers" and if you do that a Newgrp: field pops up. If you > fill in the newsgroup there, alpine then magically takes care of > posting it to the group. Interesting! > So if fdm can download the files in a nice spool folder format, I > might even be able to apply my small python script to copy the news > posting into Maildir folders, and there I can read, and alpine then > posts. I'm sure fdm can download and write them to a Maildir: it's how I use it. >>>> And by now I am willing to write a new one from scratch, so I intend to >>>> make leafnode obsolete as well. >>> >>> Best of luck! =) Sounds like a nice project! >> >> It is. :) It's the most fun I've ever had with programming. I think >> Common Lisp is a big part of it. I tried Racket before Common Lisp. >> Common Lisp is so much my way than Racket is. > > Go is the next on my list. What is it that makes you like lisp so > much? I have never considered it, so I am curious. Doesn't it wear out > the () keys on your keyboard? ;) Lol. [L]ots of [S]tupid, [I]rritating [P]arenthesis. Have you ever used paredit-mode in the GNU EMACS? It makes you love the parenthesis. You're a vim user, so you likely never heard of paredit. If you have the energy, the time and the curiosity, you could watch a 3-minute demo at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D6h5dFyyUX0 A few seconds will be enough to get the spirit, but I don't care if you watch it---just skip it. It's a pleasure to use paredit-mode. Let me quote Donald Norman. I'm gonna show a larger quote, but my point here is on pleasure of use and a ``feeling of control''. ``The details of the interaction matter, ease of use matters, but I want more than correct details, more than a system that is easy to learn or to use: I want a system that is enjoyable to use. This is an important, dominating design philosophy, easier to say than to do. It implies developing systems that provide a strong sense of understanding and control. This means tools that reveal their underlying conceptual model and allow for interaction, tools that emphasize comfort, ease, and pleasure of use [...]. A major factor in this debate is the feeling of control that the user has over the operations that are being performed. A `powerful,' `intelligent' system can lead to the well documented problems of `overautomation,' causing the user to be a passive observer of operations, no longer in control of either what operations take place, or of how they are done. On the other hand, systems that are not sufficiently powerful or intelligent can leave too large a gap in the mappings from intention to action execution and from system state to psychological interpretation. The result is that operation and interpretation are complex and difficult, and the user again feels out of control, distanced from the system.'' -- ``User Centered System Design'', capítulo 3, ``cognitive engineering'', ``on the quality of human-computer interaction'', pages 48--49, Donald A. Norman, CRC Press, 1986, ISBN 0-89859-872-9. When we use software, we like to feel in control. I personally say that every command I give to a software should come with a very easy to make prediction of what's going to happen. When I press the A-key, I know the letter ``a'' will appear and where. That gives me a feeling of control. The GNU EMACS is a program that I can very easily read the source code of the command I give, so I can find out exactly what it does, which helps me to predict what will happen when I say something. That's a feeling of control. Paredit-mode gives you control over the parenthesis with very little effort, so it's pleasurable to use because we like the control. What about Lisp itself? That's harder to say. It's easier to tell the story. The USENET is part of the story. I first fell in love with UNIX and the USENET helped me to learn a lot. Barry Margolin was an active presence in comp.unix.programmer and many others. I always learned so much from him. I then decided to see where else I could find him. I then found him in comp.lang.lisp. I was intrigued---I thought Lisp was an old, archaic language. But then I started seeing how they did things with small bits of code that I could hardly do with other languages and back then my language was mainly C. I then decided to learn Lisp. I couldn't. It was difficult. I had no clue about recursion and so on. I almost gave up. Eventually I found the book HtDP (at htdp.org). That book was awesome to me. But then I went towards Racket, which is a very different Lisp than, say, Common Lisp. Only more recently I realized Racket was a mistake for me. I decided to give Common Lisp a try in a weekend. I had so much fun with the language. Why? I think it begins with macros. Macros in Common Lisp are so much easier to write than in Racket. They're simpler. They may have less academic elegance or whatever, but it has the awesome beauty of being extremely simple and practical and getting the job done and being perfect in the practical sense. Also, Common Lisp has all of its years with a lot of smart people having perfected the tools (and they're still doing it). As a result, you have awesome compilers such as SBCL. It produces fast native code, which is a pleasure to see running. Racket, on the other hand, doesn't have the same amount of years for optimization, say. I think another thing about Common Lisp is that I developed a confidence that what I do at the REPL will work exactly the same at run time, when loaded by the OS directly. In other words, there's a sense of control that I get with Common Lisp that I never got with Racket. So Donald Norman nailed it. Another point I can make, which other people have made in comp.lang.lisp before is that Racket adds a thick layer on top of POSIX. I studied the POSIX interface, so when I use a language that doesn't let me guide myself by way of the POSIX interface, I'm already at a loss. For instance, you'll find no select(2) call in Racket because it's /likely/ buried in their completely different interface called events. But then I don't know if they're using select(2) or poll(2) or what. I would expect them considering this an advantage. Of course, Common Lisp has nothing to do with select(2), but you can the calls you need in the UNIX packages of your compiler. I couldn't find such things in Racket.
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| From | D <nospam@example.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-02-25 11:34 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <8a7e56c9-779d-2250-2e9c-6dd67af88570@example.net> |
| In reply to | #26659 |
On Mon, 24 Feb 2025, Salvador Mirzo wrote: >> So if fdm can download the files in a nice spool folder format, I >> might even be able to apply my small python script to copy the news >> posting into Maildir folders, and there I can read, and alpine then >> posts. > > I'm sure fdm can download and write them to a Maildir: it's how I use > it. Oh, that might even make my python script redundant! This gets more interesting by the minute! >> Go is the next on my list. What is it that makes you like lisp so >> much? I have never considered it, so I am curious. Doesn't it wear out >> the () keys on your keyboard? ;) > > Lol. [L]ots of [S]tupid, [I]rritating [P]arenthesis. > > Have you ever used paredit-mode in the GNU EMACS? It makes you love the > parenthesis. You're a vim user, so you likely never heard of paredit. > If you have the energy, the time and the curiosity, you could watch a > 3-minute demo at > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D6h5dFyyUX0 > > A few seconds will be enough to get the spirit, but I don't care if you > watch it---just skip it. Never heard of. It was a bit too quick, so I'm still not quite sure what it does. Some of that jumping around can be achieved in vim, but since I'm not familiar with lisp nor with exactly what he was doing, it is difficult to say. > It's a pleasure to use paredit-mode. Let me quote Donald Norman. I'm > gonna show a larger quote, but my point here is on pleasure of use and a > ``feeling of control''. This is true. I like the idea that everything is a file, and that log files are plain text. It increases my feeling of control over the system. That is why I do not like systemd. It moves away from this philosophy and frankly, I still have not experienced anything that I need systemd for, that could not have been solved without it. Sad!
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