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Python PygLatin

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  Python PygLatin Cai Gengyang <gengyangcai@gmail.com> - 2016-05-08 03:21 -0700
    Re: Python PygLatin Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2016-05-09 03:12 +1000
      Re: Python PygLatin alister <alister.ware@ntlworld.com> - 2016-05-08 17:53 +0000
        Re: Python PygLatin Christopher Reimer <christopher_reimer@icloud.com> - 2016-05-08 11:01 -0700
          Re: Python PygLatin alister <alister.ware@ntlworld.com> - 2016-05-09 08:52 +0000
        Re: Python PygLatin Cai Gengyang <gengyangcai@gmail.com> - 2016-05-08 21:51 -0700
          Re: Python PygLatin alister <alister.ware@ntlworld.com> - 2016-05-09 09:12 +0000
    Re: Python PygLatin Robin Koch <robin.koch@t-online.de> - 2016-05-09 12:21 +0200
    Re: Python PygLatin Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2016-05-09 07:54 -0700
    Re: Python PygLatin Michael Torrie <torriem@gmail.com> - 2016-05-09 09:01 -0600

#108345 — Python PygLatin

I just "clicked" through the lesson on Conditionals and Control Flows and am on the lesson "PygLatin" .

This will hopefully be a more interesting and interactive lesson because I will be building a PygLatin Translator ...

It seems to me like it will take a long time before I can reach the point where I can become a master of programming languages and even create new programming languages and technologies. This is a long road ahead, but I believe it is worth it because the power of a new technology does eventually translate into money. If one looks at the Forbes List, you will see that there are 4 programmers amongst the top ten richest people in the world (Bill Gates, Mark Zuckerberg, Larry Ellison and Jeff Bezos) , a very large percentage. Science and Technology is in a sense the most egalitarian field in the world, because it involves using your brains and creativity. You don't need to have a father who is a director at Goldman Sachs or a mother who is the admissions officer at Harvard to succeed in this line. All you need is have the ability to create something that many users love to use.

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#108372

On Sun, 8 May 2016 08:21 pm, Cai Gengyang wrote:

> If one looks at the Forbes List, you will 
> see that there are 4 programmers amongst the top ten richest people in the
> world (Bill Gates, Mark Zuckerberg, Larry Ellison and Jeff Bezos) , a very
> large percentage. Science and Technology is in a sense the most
> egalitarian field in the world, because it involves using your brains and
> creativity. You don't need to have a father who is a director at Goldman
> Sachs or a mother who is the admissions officer at Harvard to succeed in
> this line.

Bill Gates III's father was a prominent lawyer, his mother was on the board
of directors for First Interstate BancSystem and United Way, and one of his
grandfathers was a national bank president. Gates himself went to Harvard.

Zuckerberg's paternal grandparents were successful middle class, described
as  being the first on the block to own a colour TV. (This was back in the
days when colour TVs were an expensive toy that few could afford.) His
parents were also very successful professionals: a dentist and a
psychiatrist. And he too went to Harvard. Despite the jeans and tee-shirts
Zuckerberg is known for wearing, he's firmly from the professional/upper
class.

Bezos comes from a family of land-holders from Texas. His grandfather was
regional director of the U.S. Atomic Energy Commission, and was financially
successful enough to retire at an early age. He didn't go to Harvard, but
he did go to Princeton.

Ellison is the son of an unwed mother who gave him up for adoption by her
aunt and uncle, comfortably middle-class. That makes him the closest out of
the group as a "regular guy".



-- 
Steven

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#108377

On Mon, 09 May 2016 03:12:14 +1000, Steven D'Aprano wrote:

> On Sun, 8 May 2016 08:21 pm, Cai Gengyang wrote:
> 
>> If one looks at the Forbes List, you will see that there are 4
>> programmers amongst the top ten richest people in the world (Bill
>> Gates, Mark Zuckerberg, Larry Ellison and Jeff Bezos) , a very large
>> percentage. Science and Technology is in a sense the most egalitarian
>> field in the world, because it involves using your brains and
>> creativity. You don't need to have a father who is a director at
>> Goldman Sachs or a mother who is the admissions officer at Harvard to
>> succeed in this line.
> 
> Bill Gates III's father was a prominent lawyer, his mother was on the
> board of directors for First Interstate BancSystem and United Way, and
> one of his grandfathers was a national bank president. Gates himself
> went to Harvard.
> 
> Zuckerberg's paternal grandparents were successful middle class,
> described as  being the first on the block to own a colour TV. (This was
> back in the days when colour TVs were an expensive toy that few could
> afford.) His parents were also very successful professionals: a dentist
> and a psychiatrist. And he too went to Harvard. Despite the jeans and
> tee-shirts Zuckerberg is known for wearing, he's firmly from the
> professional/upper class.
> 
> Bezos comes from a family of land-holders from Texas. His grandfather
> was regional director of the U.S. Atomic Energy Commission, and was
> financially successful enough to retire at an early age. He didn't go to
> Harvard, but he did go to Princeton.
> 
> Ellison is the son of an unwed mother who gave him up for adoption by
> her aunt and uncle, comfortably middle-class. That makes him the closest
> out of the group as a "regular guy".

And at least 2 of the above reached their position using business 
practices that could be described as less than 100% honorable & above 
board.




-- 
Wait ... is this a FUN THING or the END of LIFE in Petticoat Junction??

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#108381

On 5/8/2016 10:53 AM, alister wrote:
> On Mon, 09 May 2016 03:12:14 +1000, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
>
>> On Sun, 8 May 2016 08:21 pm, Cai Gengyang wrote:
>>
>>> If one looks at the Forbes List, you will see that there are 4
>>> programmers amongst the top ten richest people in the world (Bill
>>> Gates, Mark Zuckerberg, Larry Ellison and Jeff Bezos) , a very large
>>> percentage. Science and Technology is in a sense the most egalitarian
>>> field in the world, because it involves using your brains and
>>> creativity. You don't need to have a father who is a director at
>>> Goldman Sachs or a mother who is the admissions officer at Harvard to
>>> succeed in this line.
>> Bill Gates III's father was a prominent lawyer, his mother was on the
>> board of directors for First Interstate BancSystem and United Way, and
>> one of his grandfathers was a national bank president. Gates himself
>> went to Harvard.
>>
>> Zuckerberg's paternal grandparents were successful middle class,
>> described as  being the first on the block to own a colour TV. (This was
>> back in the days when colour TVs were an expensive toy that few could
>> afford.) His parents were also very successful professionals: a dentist
>> and a psychiatrist. And he too went to Harvard. Despite the jeans and
>> tee-shirts Zuckerberg is known for wearing, he's firmly from the
>> professional/upper class.
>>
>> Bezos comes from a family of land-holders from Texas. His grandfather
>> was regional director of the U.S. Atomic Energy Commission, and was
>> financially successful enough to retire at an early age. He didn't go to
>> Harvard, but he did go to Princeton.
>>
>> Ellison is the son of an unwed mother who gave him up for adoption by
>> her aunt and uncle, comfortably middle-class. That makes him the closest
>> out of the group as a "regular guy".
> And at least 2 of the above reached their position using business
> practices that could be described as less than 100% honorable & above
> board.

What do you expect from people who haven't graduated from Harvard? :P

Thank you,

Chris R.

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#108419

On Sun, 08 May 2016 11:01:58 -0700, Christopher Reimer wrote:

> On 5/8/2016 10:53 AM, alister wrote:
>> On Mon, 09 May 2016 03:12:14 +1000, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
>>
>>> On Sun, 8 May 2016 08:21 pm, Cai Gengyang wrote:
>>>
>>>> If one looks at the Forbes List, you will see that there are 4
>>>> programmers amongst the top ten richest people in the world (Bill
>>>> Gates, Mark Zuckerberg, Larry Ellison and Jeff Bezos) , a very large
>>>> percentage. Science and Technology is in a sense the most egalitarian
>>>> field in the world, because it involves using your brains and
>>>> creativity. You don't need to have a father who is a director at
>>>> Goldman Sachs or a mother who is the admissions officer at Harvard to
>>>> succeed in this line.
>>> Bill Gates III's father was a prominent lawyer, his mother was on the
>>> board of directors for First Interstate BancSystem and United Way, and
>>> one of his grandfathers was a national bank president. Gates himself
>>> went to Harvard.
>>>
>>> Zuckerberg's paternal grandparents were successful middle class,
>>> described as  being the first on the block to own a colour TV. (This
>>> was back in the days when colour TVs were an expensive toy that few
>>> could afford.) His parents were also very successful professionals: a
>>> dentist and a psychiatrist. And he too went to Harvard. Despite the
>>> jeans and tee-shirts Zuckerberg is known for wearing, he's firmly from
>>> the professional/upper class.
>>>
>>> Bezos comes from a family of land-holders from Texas. His grandfather
>>> was regional director of the U.S. Atomic Energy Commission, and was
>>> financially successful enough to retire at an early age. He didn't go
>>> to Harvard, but he did go to Princeton.
>>>
>>> Ellison is the son of an unwed mother who gave him up for adoption by
>>> her aunt and uncle, comfortably middle-class. That makes him the
>>> closest out of the group as a "regular guy".
>> And at least 2 of the above reached their position using business
>> practices that could be described as less than 100% honorable & above
>> board.
> 
> What do you expect from people who haven't graduated from Harvard? :P
> 
> Thank you,
> 
> Chris R.

i think the two people i am thinking of both did go to Harvard, i don't 
know if they graduated or not



-- 
Old MacDonald had an agricultural real estate tax abatement.

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#108413

I am guessing that the 2 you mentioned are Bill Gates and Larry Ellison ? I heard that they have tons of lawsuits against them in their career (anti-monopoly, anti-competitive laws filed against them both from the government and from individuals) ?

Paul Graham has this very interesting related essay on meanness and success ----------------------http://paulgraham.com/mean.html






On Monday, May 9, 2016 at 1:53:31 AM UTC+8, alister wrote:
> On Mon, 09 May 2016 03:12:14 +1000, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
> 
> > On Sun, 8 May 2016 08:21 pm, Cai Gengyang wrote:
> > 
> >> If one looks at the Forbes List, you will see that there are 4
> >> programmers amongst the top ten richest people in the world (Bill
> >> Gates, Mark Zuckerberg, Larry Ellison and Jeff Bezos) , a very large
> >> percentage. Science and Technology is in a sense the most egalitarian
> >> field in the world, because it involves using your brains and
> >> creativity. You don't need to have a father who is a director at
> >> Goldman Sachs or a mother who is the admissions officer at Harvard to
> >> succeed in this line.
> > 
> > Bill Gates III's father was a prominent lawyer, his mother was on the
> > board of directors for First Interstate BancSystem and United Way, and
> > one of his grandfathers was a national bank president. Gates himself
> > went to Harvard.
> > 
> > Zuckerberg's paternal grandparents were successful middle class,
> > described as  being the first on the block to own a colour TV. (This was
> > back in the days when colour TVs were an expensive toy that few could
> > afford.) His parents were also very successful professionals: a dentist
> > and a psychiatrist. And he too went to Harvard. Despite the jeans and
> > tee-shirts Zuckerberg is known for wearing, he's firmly from the
> > professional/upper class.
> > 
> > Bezos comes from a family of land-holders from Texas. His grandfather
> > was regional director of the U.S. Atomic Energy Commission, and was
> > financially successful enough to retire at an early age. He didn't go to
> > Harvard, but he did go to Princeton.
> > 
> > Ellison is the son of an unwed mother who gave him up for adoption by
> > her aunt and uncle, comfortably middle-class. That makes him the closest
> > out of the group as a "regular guy".
> 
> And at least 2 of the above reached their position using business 
> practices that could be described as less than 100% honorable & above 
> board.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Wait ... is this a FUN THING or the END of LIFE in Petticoat Junction??

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#108420

On Sun, 08 May 2016 21:51:18 -0700, Cai Gengyang wrote:

> I am guessing that the 2 you mentioned are Bill Gates and Larry Ellison
> ? I heard that they have tons of lawsuits against them in their career
> (anti-monopoly, anti-competitive laws filed against them both from the
> government and from individuals) ?
> 
> Paul Graham has this very interesting related essay on meanness and
> success ----------------------http://paulgraham.com/mean.html
> 
50% correct, although I was thinking more of "borrowed code/ip", 
doublespace is one term that springs to mind.

Also it is the accepted practice to use interleaved posting on this 
mailing list/newsgroup please do not  top post

 

-- 
  Goes (Went) over like a lead balloon.

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#108425

Am 08.05.2016 um 12:21 schrieb Cai Gengyang:

 > If one looks at the Forbes List, you will see that there are 4
 > programmers amongst the top ten richest people in the world (Bill
 > Gates, Mark Zuckerberg, Larry Ellison and Jeff Bezos) , a very large
 > percentage.

You might elaborate your knowledge about conditional probability as well.

P("X is programmer" | "X is in Forbes Top 10")

                     !=

P("X is in Forbes Top 10" | "X is programmer")

-- 
Robin Koch

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#108429

On Sunday, May 8, 2016 at 3:52:12 PM UTC+5:30, Cai Gengyang wrote:
> I just "clicked" through the lesson on Conditionals and Control Flows and am on the lesson "PygLatin" .
> 
> This will hopefully be a more interesting and interactive lesson because I will be building a PygLatin Translator ...
> 
> It seems to me like it will take a long time before I can reach the point where I can become a master of programming languages and even create new programming languages and technologies. This is a long road ahead, but I believe it is worth it because the power of a new technology does eventually translate into money. If one looks at the Forbes List, you will see that there are 4 programmers amongst the top ten richest people in the world (Bill Gates, Mark Zuckerberg, Larry Ellison and Jeff Bezos) , a very large percentage. Science and Technology is in a sense the most egalitarian field in the world, because it involves using your brains and creativity. You don't need to have a father who is a director at Goldman Sachs or a mother who is the admissions officer at Harvard to succeed in this line. All you need is have the ability to create something that many users love to use.



Here are some physical creations which humans have made:
  1. Petronas [1]
  2. Chartres [2]
  3. Egypt pyramids [3]
  4. Arunachala temple [4]

What do you think is the ratio of those that designed/conceptualized
these to those who laid stone/bricks/steel? My estimate 1:100 to
1:10000.

Software is no different.  If you train as a pilot you have a better
chance of landing the lead position on the Mars-mission than if you
train as a programmer and hope to become Bill Gates II.

Helpful to read "It doesnt matter" [5] in this respect. Dont get fooled by the
title. What it really says is that as IT transitions from innovation
to utility, it matters more and more but only in a negative sense. eg
if the power or the water or the roads are bad we get very
indignant. When they are fine the so-called 'blue-collar-workers' who
provide them are faceless, invisible.

Cost gravity [6] explains the mechanics of how that happens

In other words we IT-professionals are the blue-collar workers of the
21st century.  Why is this not more widely undersood? Because
CS-education is grossly out of sync with IT-practice. See [7] -- CS
education is habitually taught as though only only the first column
exists. In the IT world its mostly the second that counts.

Steven reminds of the caste-system that the super-rich are usually
sons of the rich in our field like anywhere else.

This is true but misunderstood.  It is not that money begets more
money like some kind of magnet.  Its rather that the rich have a
certain freedom to their thinking/outlook.  An outlook that others too
can with some effort emulate.  Triune brain [8] explains that we have
3 brains corresponding to our evolutionary stages:
  - reptilian
  - mammalian
  - specifically human (cortex)

When we are in survive/sex mode we are essentially reptiles. When we
are in emotional mode we are a bit better -- mammals.  If we can get
beyond both we can be truly human.  This is hard for anyone, but for
the poor the survival needs predominate so its harder. For some
thoughts on switching from the more animal to the more human aspects
of our functioning see [9]
[I guess the advantage the rich have with survival is lost to sex]

2 Refs
======

1. https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/6d/Petronas_Twin_Towers_2010_April.jpg

2. http://whc.unesco.org/uploads/thumbs/site_0081_0001-750-0-20151104132433.jpg
3. https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/af/All_Gizah_Pyramids.jpg
4. https://arunachaleshwarar.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/tem.jpg
5. https://hbr.org/2003/05/it-doesnt-matter
6. http://content.cultureandempire.com/preface.html
7. http://blog.languager.org/2010/02/service-and-product-mindsets.html
8. http://www.kheper.net/topics/intelligence/MacLean.htm
9. http://blog.languager.org/2010/05/declaration-imperation-and-language.html

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#108430

On 05/08/2016 04:21 AM, Cai Gengyang wrote:
> This is a long
> road ahead, but I believe it is worth it because the power of a new
> technology does eventually translate into money. 

If this is your prime motivation, I think you'll be very disappointed.
A good programmer certainly can make a good salary.  But the road to
riches? Well that's actually relatively rare. Just look at the the Apple
Store or Google Play Store.  Thousands of games and apps and very few
small developers making the big dollars through it.  Some manage to get
lucky but most do not.

Really good programmers do it because they enjoy doing it, whether it's
the problem solving aspects, or maybe because they enjoy creating a
product that is useful to others.  While computer programming is a
learned skill, some have more aptitude and intuition for it than others.
 If you honestly enjoy it then you'll do fine.  If you don't find it
intellectually stimulating then you'll definitely struggle as far as a
career path goes.

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