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Bytes indexing returns an int

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  Bytes indexing returns an int Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-01-07 22:13 +1100
    Re: Bytes indexing returns an int Ervin Hegedüs <airween@gmail.com> - 2014-01-07 12:53 +0100
      Re: Bytes indexing returns an int Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-01-07 23:04 +1100
    Re: Bytes indexing returns an int Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2014-01-07 09:29 -0500
    Re: Bytes indexing returns an int David Robinow <drobinow@gmail.com> - 2014-01-07 10:19 -0500
      Re: Bytes indexing returns an int Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-01-08 03:12 +1100
        Re: Bytes indexing returns an int Serhiy Storchaka <storchaka@gmail.com> - 2014-01-07 21:48 +0200
        Re: Bytes indexing returns an int Robin Becker <robin@reportlab.com> - 2014-01-08 11:05 +0000
          Re: Bytes indexing returns an int wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2014-01-08 08:08 -0800
            Re: Bytes indexing returns an int Ned Batchelder <ned@nedbatchelder.com> - 2014-01-08 12:19 -0500
              Re: Bytes indexing returns an int Piet van Oostrum <piet@vanoostrum.org> - 2014-01-09 18:05 +0100
                Re: Bytes indexing returns an int Ethan Furman <ethan@stoneleaf.us> - 2014-01-09 09:28 -0800
                Re: Bytes indexing returns an int Serhiy Storchaka <storchaka@gmail.com> - 2014-01-09 21:36 +0200
            Re: Bytes indexing returns an int Michael Torrie <torriem@gmail.com> - 2014-01-08 10:25 -0700
    Re: Bytes indexing returns an int David Robinow <drobinow@gmail.com> - 2014-01-07 10:23 -0500
    Re: Bytes indexing returns an int Ethan Furman <ethan@stoneleaf.us> - 2014-01-07 09:02 -0800
      Re: Bytes indexing returns an int Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-01-08 11:15 +1100
        Re: Bytes indexing returns an int Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-01-08 11:30 +1100
          Re: Bytes indexing returns an int Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2014-01-08 02:34 +0000
            Re: Bytes indexing returns an int Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-01-08 14:46 +1100
        Re: Bytes indexing returns an int Ethan Furman <ethan@stoneleaf.us> - 2014-01-07 16:37 -0800

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#63458

On 01/07/2014 04:15 PM, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
> Ethan Furman wrote:
>> On 01/07/2014 07:19 AM, David Robinow wrote:
>>>
>>> Python 3 grudgingly allows the "abomination" of byte strings (is that
>>> what they're called?)
>>
>> No, that is *not* what they're called.  If you find any place in the
>> Python3 docs that does call them bytestrings please submit a bug report.
>
> The name of the class is "bytes", but what they represent *is* a string of
> bytes, hence "byte-string". It's a standard computer science term for
> distinguishing strings of text from strings of bytes.

I do not disagree with your statements, yet calling the bytes type a bytestring suggests things which are not true, such 
as indexing returning another bytestring.  The core-dev have thus agreed to not call it that in the documentation in 
hopes of lessening any confusion.


>> On 01/07/2014 08:12 AM, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
>>> People trying to port these libraries from 2.7 to 3 run into this
>>> problem, and it causes them grief. This little difference between bytes
>>> in 2.7 and bytes in 3.x is a point of friction which makes porting
>>> harder, and I'm trying to understand the reason for it.
>>
>> If I recall correctly the way it was explained to me:
>>
>> bytes (lists, arrays, etc.) is a container, and when a container is
>> indexed you get whatever the container held.  If you slice the container
>> you get a smaller container with the appropriate items.
>
> (There's also a bytearray type, which is best considered as an array. Hence
> the name.) Why decide that the bytes type is best considered as a list of
> bytes rather than a string of bytes? It doesn't have any list methods, it
> looks like a string and people use it as a string. As you have discovered,
> it is an inconvenient annoyance that indexing returns an int instead of a
> one-byte byte-string.
>
> I think that, in hindsight, this was a major screw-up in Python 3.

The general consensus seems to be agreement (more or less) with that feeling, but alas it is too late to change it now.

--
~Ethan~

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