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Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language

From Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu>
Subject Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language
Date 2013-12-12 12:55 -0500
References (3 earlier) <CABicbJKoN9fV48yskd5wqE79vsb5=nPGfwgOTCO+fCFMG7g8qw@mail.gmail.com> <mailman.3872.1386751441.18130.python-list@python.org> <d0aef6f2-9091-4f27-b378-8e24257d3983@googlegroups.com> <mailman.3882.1386758747.18130.python-list@python.org> <f62baa3e-d286-4f7b-b6db-71cafb0523d3@googlegroups.com>
Newsgroups comp.lang.python
Message-ID <mailman.4005.1386870936.18130.python-list@python.org> (permalink)

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On 12/12/2013 4:17 AM, wxjmfauth@gmail.com wrote:

> Windows, Py3, unicode. It is is infortunate, but it is
> a fact Python has some problems with that platform (file
> sytem encoding), -> potential problems which should not
> exist for a beginner.

Some disappear if, for instance, one uses Idle.

> I am the first to recognize the win console is all but
> friendly.

Something we agree on. It is a piece crap. I believe that MS keeps it 
crippled to discourage use. (They apparently would like to remove it.)

> If one wishes to use a unicode code page, Python fails [*].

If you mean cp65xxx (I forget exact numbers), MS Command Prompt fails, 
not Python. One should not use any other code page, but only other code 
pages work.

Tk, and hence tkinter and idle work fine with the entire BMP. If one 
tells tk to use a font that can handle the entire BMP, it displays the 
entire BMP.

> Python has plenty of good qualities, you (and others)
> are discussing plenty of theoretical aspects.
> I'm pointing the fact, one may be stuck simply because
> one cannot display a piece of of text!

Most text display problems disappear if one avoids Command Prompt and 
uses a GUI that can handle at least the BMP. Idle works on Windows after 
Python is installed unless one tells the installer to not install tcl/tk.

-- 
Terry Jan Reedy

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Thread

Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2013-12-11 19:43 +1100
  Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2013-12-11 01:39 -0800
    Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-12-11 10:05 +0000
    Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2013-12-11 21:45 +1100
      Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language alex23 <wuwei23@gmail.com> - 2013-12-12 15:38 +1000
      Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2013-12-12 01:17 -0800
        Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2013-12-12 21:28 +1100
          Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2013-12-12 06:34 -0800
            Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2013-12-13 01:47 +1100
              Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2013-12-12 08:20 -0800
                Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Ned Batchelder <ned@nedbatchelder.com> - 2013-12-12 11:58 -0500
            Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-12-12 15:01 +0000
        Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Ned Batchelder <ned@nedbatchelder.com> - 2013-12-12 08:52 -0500
        Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-12-12 14:30 +0000
        Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2013-12-12 12:55 -0500
          Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2013-12-13 08:15 -0800
            Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2013-12-14 03:27 +1100
              Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2013-12-13 10:27 -0800
                Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2013-12-14 05:32 +1100
                Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2013-12-13 11:30 -0800
            Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-12-13 16:39 +0000
            Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2013-12-14 03:43 +1100
              Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language rusi <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2013-12-13 08:54 -0800
                Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2013-12-14 03:57 +1100
            Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-12-13 17:02 +0000
            Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2013-12-13 17:49 -0500
              Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2013-12-14 09:58 +0000
            Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-12-13 23:10 +0000
            Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2013-12-13 18:30 -0500
              Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2013-12-14 06:03 -0800
                Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2013-12-15 01:15 +1100
                Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-12-14 14:38 +0000
                CP65001 fails (was re: ...) Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2013-12-14 13:43 -0500
                Re: CP65001 fails (was re: ...) wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2013-12-14 12:48 -0800
                Re: CP65001 fails (was re: ...) Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-12-14 21:05 +0000
                Re: CP65001 fails (was re: ...) Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2013-12-14 22:51 +0000
                Re: CP65001 fails (was re: ...) Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-12-14 23:32 +0000
                Re: CP65001 fails (was re: ...) rusi <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2013-12-14 20:42 -0800
                Re: CP65001 fails (was re: ...) Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2013-12-15 05:00 +0000
                Re: CP65001 fails (was re: ...) rusi <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2013-12-14 21:24 -0800
                Re: CP65001 fails (was re: ...) Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2013-12-15 15:48 +1100
                Re: CP65001 fails (was re: ...) Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-12-15 14:25 +0000
                Re: CP65001 fails (was re: ...) Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2013-12-15 02:39 +0000
                Re: CP65001 fails (was re: ...) Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2013-12-15 00:07 -0500
                Re: CP65001 fails (was re: ...) wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2013-12-15 00:26 -0800
            Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2013-12-14 10:38 +1100
            Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Ethan Furman <ethan@stoneleaf.us> - 2013-12-13 15:17 -0800
            Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-12-13 23:58 +0000
              Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2013-12-14 10:00 +0000
                Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-12-14 13:21 +0000
    Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Steve Simmons <square.steve@gmail.com> - 2013-12-11 12:33 +0100
    Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2013-12-11 23:02 +1100
    Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Steve Simmons <square.steve@gmail.com> - 2013-12-11 13:30 +0100
  Re: Experiences/guidance on teaching Python as a first programming language Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2013-12-11 11:17 +0000

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