Re: python 3.44 float addition bug?

Path	csiph.com!usenet.pasdenom.info!news.albasani.net!rt.uk.eu.org!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed3a.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!newsgate.cistron.nl!newsgate.news.xs4all.nl!post.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail
Return-Path	<python-python-list@m.gmane.org>
X-Original-To	python-list@python.org
Delivered-To	python-list@mail.python.org
X-Spam-Status	OK 0.000
X-Spam-Evidence	'H': 1.00; 'S': 0.00; 'example:': 0.03; 'value,': 0.04; 'yet.': 0.04; 'binary': 0.07; 'currency': 0.07; 'float': 0.07; 'subject:bug': 0.07; 'string': 0.09; 'is': 0.09; 'received:80.91': 0.09; 'received:80.91.229': 0.09; 'received:gmane.org': 0.09; 'received:list': 0.09; 'thread': 0.14; 'finite': 0.16; 'from:addr:behnel.de': 0.16; 'from:addr:stefan_ml': 0.16; 'from:name:stefan behnel': 0.16; 'is).': 0.16; 'operates': 0.16; 'received:80.91.229.3': 0.16; 'received:dip0.t-ipconnect.de': 0.16; 'received:plane.gmane.org': 0.16; 'received:t-ipconnect.de': 0.16; 'rounding': 0.16; 'surprises': 0.16; 'tweak': 0.16; 'subject:python': 0.16; 'applies': 0.16; 'prevent': 0.16; 'wrote:': 0.18; 'wed,': 0.18; 'module': 0.19; 'trying': 0.19; 'stefan': 0.19; 'solution.': 0.20; 'seems': 0.21; 'header:User-Agent:1': 0.23; 'supported': 0.26; 'values': 0.27; 'header:X-Complaints-To:1': 0.27; 'header:In- Reply-To:1': 0.27; 'point': 0.28; 'appear': 0.29; 'points': 0.29; 'skip:( 20': 0.30; 'along': 0.30; 'gives': 0.31; '(unless': 0.31; '-0700,': 0.31; 'decimal': 0.31; 'steven': 0.31; 'languages': 0.32; 'supposed': 0.32; 'quite': 0.32; 'url:python': 0.33; 'cases': 0.33; 'limitation': 0.33; 'skip:d 20': 0.34; 'except': 0.35; 'there': 0.35; 'false': 0.36; 'subject:?': 0.36; 'url:org': 0.36; 'example,': 0.37; 'loss': 0.38; 'represent': 0.38; 'saves': 0.38; 'url:library': 0.38; 'to:addr:python-list': 0.38; 'to:addr:python.org': 0.39; 'either': 0.39; 'received:org': 0.40; 'above,': 0.60; 'mentioned': 0.61; 'numbers': 0.61; 'url:3': 0.61; "you're": 0.61; 'guarantee': 0.63; 'real': 0.63; 'such': 0.63; 'account': 0.65; 'beat': 0.68; 'design.': 0.68; 'subject': 0.69; 'results': 0.69; 'limit': 0.70; 'calculations': 0.84; 'cpu.': 0.84; 'received:87.139': 0.84
X-Injected-Via-Gmane	http://gmane.org/
To	python-list@python.org
From	Stefan Behnel <stefan_ml@behnel.de>
Subject	Re: python 3.44 float addition bug?
Date	Thu, 26 Jun 2014 07:53:52 +0200
References	<XnsA35313E634BA0fraserlonggmailcom34@216.196.109.145> <645be4a7-2e1b-44a4-9c45-9184c6df5518@googlegroups.com> <53ab8bc4$0$11121$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com>
Mime-Version	1.0
Content-Type	text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding	7bit
X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host	p578ba676.dip0.t-ipconnect.de
User-Agent	Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.6.0
In-Reply-To	<53ab8bc4$0$11121$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com>
X-BeenThere	python-list@python.org
X-Mailman-Version	2.1.15
Precedence	list
List-Id	General discussion list for the Python programming language <python-list.python.org>
List-Unsubscribe	<https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-list>, <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive	<http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-list/>
List-Post	<mailto:python-list@python.org>
List-Help	<mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe	<https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list>, <mailto:python-list-request@python.org?subject=subscribe>
Newsgroups	comp.lang.python
Message-ID	<mailman.11253.1403762045.18130.python-list@python.org> (permalink)
Lines	44
NNTP-Posting-Host	2001:888:2000:d::a6
X-Trace	1403762045 news.xs4all.nl 2940 [2001:888:2000:d::a6]:53798
X-Complaints-To	abuse@xs4all.nl
Xref	csiph.com comp.lang.python:73607

Show key headers only | View raw

Steven D'Aprano, 26.06.2014 04:56:
> On Wed, 25 Jun 2014 14:12:31 -0700, Maciej Dziardziel wrote:
> 
>> Floating points values use finite amount of memory, and  cannot
>> accurately represent infinite amount of numbers, they are only
>> approximations. This is limitation of float type and applies to any
>> languages that uses types supported directly by cpu. To deal with it you
>> can either use decimal.Decimal type that operates using decimal system
>> and saves you from such surprises
> 
> That's a myth. decimal.Decimal *is* a floating point value, and is 
> subject to *exactly* the same surprises as binary floats, except for one: 
> which Decimal, you can guarantee that any decimal string you enter will 
> appear exactly the same (up to the limit of the current precision).
> 
> For example:
> 
> py> x = Decimal(1)/Decimal(23)
> py> x
> Decimal('0.04347826086956521739130434783')
> py> x*23 == 1
> True
> py> sum( [x]*23 ) == 1  # Surprise!
> False
> 
> py> (Decimal(19)/Decimal(17))*Decimal(17) == 19  # Surprise!
> False

It seems that no-one has mentioned the "fractions" module in this thread
yet. It gives you rational numbers (enumerator/denominator), as supposed to
the limited real numbers that floating point numbers represent.

https://docs.python.org/3/library/fractions.html

There are quite a number of use cases for exact calculations where rational
numbers beat any other solution. For the cases above, for example, you'd
get exact results by design. Or in currency calculations, where you want to
move the rounding to the very end and prevent any loss of precision along
the way (unless you're trying to tweak your account in the right direction,
that is).

Stefan

Back to comp.lang.python | Previous | Next — Previous in thread | Find similar | Unroll thread

Thread

python 3.44 float addition bug? FraserL <fraser.long+usenet@NOSPAMgmail.com> - 2014-06-20 19:57 -0500
  Re: python 3.44 float addition bug? FraserL <fraser.long+usenet@gmail.com> - 2014-06-20 20:11 -0500
    Re: python 3.44 float addition bug? Gary Herron <gary.herron@islandtraining.com> - 2014-06-20 18:19 -0700
  Re: python 3.44 float addition bug? Gary Herron <gary.herron@islandtraining.com> - 2014-06-20 18:07 -0700
  Re: python 3.44 float addition bug? Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-06-21 11:33 +1000
  Re: python 3.44 float addition bug? INADA Naoki <songofacandy@gmail.com> - 2014-06-21 10:06 +0900
  Re: python 3.44 float addition bug? Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2014-06-21 14:25 +0000
  Re: python 3.44 float addition bug? Ned Deily <nad@acm.org> - 2014-06-21 12:24 -0700
    Re: python 3.44 float addition bug? buck <workitharder@gmail.com> - 2014-06-23 17:55 -0700
      Re: python 3.44 float addition bug? Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-06-24 13:26 +1000
      Re: python 3.44 float addition bug? Gregory Ewing <greg.ewing@canterbury.ac.nz> - 2014-06-24 17:30 +1200
      Re: python 3.44 float addition bug? Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-06-24 06:34 +0000
  Re: python 3.44 float addition bug? Maciej Dziardziel <fiedzia@gmail.com> - 2014-06-25 14:12 -0700
    Re: python 3.44 float addition bug? Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-06-26 02:56 +0000
      Re: python 3.44 float addition bug? Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-06-26 13:13 +1000
        Re: python 3.44 float addition bug? Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-06-26 04:17 +0000
          Re: python 3.44 float addition bug? Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-06-26 14:41 +1000
      Re: python 3.44 float addition bug? Ben Finney <ben@benfinney.id.au> - 2014-06-26 13:39 +1000
        Re: python 3.44 float addition bug? Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2014-06-26 09:15 +0000
          Re: python 3.44 float addition bug? Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-06-26 19:38 +1000
            Re: python 3.44 float addition bug? Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-06-27 02:51 +0000
              Re: python 3.44 float addition bug? Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-06-27 13:24 +1000
              Re: python 3.44 float addition bug? Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2014-06-27 10:18 -0600
      Re: python 3.44 float addition bug? Stefan Behnel <stefan_ml@behnel.de> - 2014-06-26 07:53 +0200

csiph-web