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Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.

Message-ID <12142523.5odLL4G0Km@PointedEars.de> (permalink)
From Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de>
Organization PointedEars Software (PES)
Date 2011-07-17 21:44 +0200
Subject Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.
Newsgroups comp.lang.python
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Anders J. Munch wrote:

> Steven D'Aprano wrote:
>> I can't fathom why 8 position tabs were *ever* the default, let alone
>> why they are still the default.
> 
> That's because they were not invented as a means for programmers to vary
> indentation.
> 
> Originally, tabs were a navigation device: When you press the tab key, you
> skip ahead to the next tab column.

No, when you pressed the Tab key on a typewriter (BTDT), you advanced to the 
next tab _stop_.  This made it easier to write tables ("tab" from 
"tabulate") on a typewriter (the alternative was time-consuming and error-
prone use of the space and backspace keys).  With the evolution of the 
(personal) computer, its use in offices and at home, and peripheral devices 
like the dot matrix printer, typewriters fell out of common use, but the 
terms associated with them were incorporated into information technology 
language (cf. "TTY", originally "teletypewriter", e. g.).

> The reason the tab stop is a full 8 positions: for faster navigation.

No, the reason is that table columns should be as far enough away from each 
other to be distinguishable.

> If it were 3 positions, it would take forever to skip from the start of
> line to column 60.  You'd appreciate that, if you were e.g. writing a
> fiduciary report with some text to the left and two number columns to the
> right, back in the day before spreadsheets and word processor tables. 
> Skip a column or two too far?

I am getting the idea here that you mean the right thing, but that you 
explain it wrong.

-- 
PointedEars

Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail. / Please do not Cc: me.

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Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. rantingrick <rantingrick@gmail.com> - 2011-07-16 09:51 -0700
  Re: feeding the troll (was: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.) Tim Chase <python.list@tim.thechases.com> - 2011-07-16 12:52 -0500
  Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Andrew Berg <bahamutzero8825@gmail.com> - 2011-07-16 17:59 -0500
  Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Tim Roberts <timr@probo.com> - 2011-07-16 16:06 -0700
    Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Andrew Berg <bahamutzero8825@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 02:29 -0500
      Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Tim Roberts <timr@probo.com> - 2011-07-18 22:36 -0700
    Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 01:39 -0600
  Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Cameron Simpson <cs@zip.com.au> - 2011-07-17 09:52 +1000
    Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2011-07-17 13:09 +1000
      Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. anand jeyahar <anand.ibmgsi@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 09:29 +0530
      Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Cameron Simpson <cs@zip.com.au> - 2011-07-17 14:12 +1000
      Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 01:32 -0600
        Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. TheSaint <no@nowhere.net.no> - 2011-07-17 21:12 +0800
        Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. rantingrick <rantingrick@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 08:15 -0700
          Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Tim Chase <python.list@tim.thechases.com> - 2011-07-17 13:22 -0500
            Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. rantingrick <rantingrick@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 12:49 -0700
          Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 12:48 -0600
            Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. rantingrick <rantingrick@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 12:54 -0700
              Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 16:02 -0600
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Roy Smith <roy@panix.com> - 2011-07-17 19:29 -0400
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Andrew Berg <bahamutzero8825@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 18:55 -0500
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Roy Smith <roy@panix.com> - 2011-07-17 20:28 -0400
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Andrew Berg <bahamutzero8825@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 19:48 -0500
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Andrew Berg <bahamutzero8825@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 19:50 -0500
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Mel <mwilson@the-wire.com> - 2011-07-17 21:06 -0400
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Mel <mwilson@the-wire.com> - 2011-07-17 21:06 -0400
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2011-07-18 11:01 +1000
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2011-07-18 11:12 +1000
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Ben Finney <ben+python@benfinney.id.au> - 2011-07-18 11:42 +1000
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Gregory Ewing <greg.ewing@canterbury.ac.nz> - 2011-07-18 18:26 +1200
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Tim Chase <python.list@tim.thechases.com> - 2011-07-18 05:52 -0500
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Duncan Booth <duncan.booth@invalid.invalid> - 2011-07-18 13:52 +0000
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. MRAB <python@mrabarnett.plus.com> - 2011-07-18 17:59 +0100
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Roy Smith <roy@panix.com> - 2011-07-18 19:07 -0400
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2011-07-19 00:59 +1000
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Dave Angel <davea@ieee.org> - 2011-07-18 13:11 -0400
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. python@bdurham.com - 2011-07-18 08:33 -0400
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. gene heskett <gheskett@wdtv.com> - 2011-07-18 10:12 -0400
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. tinnews@isbd.co.uk - 2011-07-18 10:49 +0100
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Dotan Cohen <dotancohen@gmail.com> - 2011-07-18 21:51 +0300
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Andrew Berg <bahamutzero8825@gmail.com> - 2011-07-18 14:06 -0500
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2011-07-19 05:15 +1000
      Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Andrew Berg <bahamutzero8825@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 02:52 -0500
      Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. "Anders J. Munch" <2011@jmunch.dk> - 2011-07-17 11:49 +0200
        Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. rantingrick <rantingrick@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 09:53 -0700
          Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2011-07-18 03:11 +1000
            Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. rantingrick <rantingrick@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 10:57 -0700
              Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2011-07-18 04:09 +1000
              Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Thorsten Kampe <thorsten@thorstenkampe.de> - 2011-07-17 20:20 +0200
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. rantingrick <rantingrick@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 12:22 -0700
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Dotan Cohen <dotancohen@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 22:38 +0300
              Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Dotan Cohen <dotancohen@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 22:36 +0300
            Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2011-07-18 10:54 +1000
              Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Andrew Berg <bahamutzero8825@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 20:26 -0500
              Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Teemu Likonen <tlikonen@iki.fi> - 2011-07-18 09:00 +0300
          Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Cameron Simpson <cs@zip.com.au> - 2011-07-18 08:14 +1000
        Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2011-07-17 21:44 +0200
          Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. "Anders J. Munch" <2011@jmunch.dk> - 2011-07-18 20:19 +0200
        Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Gregory Ewing <greg.ewing@canterbury.ac.nz> - 2011-07-18 10:06 +1200
          Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2011-07-18 18:58 +0200
  Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Andrew Berg <bahamutzero8825@gmail.com> - 2011-07-16 19:29 -0500
    Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2011-07-17 13:07 +1000
      Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Andrew Berg <bahamutzero8825@gmail.com> - 2011-07-16 22:20 -0500
    Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Thorsten Kampe <thorsten@thorstenkampe.de> - 2011-07-17 09:56 +0200
      Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Andrew Berg <bahamutzero8825@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 03:36 -0500
        Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Thorsten Kampe <thorsten@thorstenkampe.de> - 2011-07-17 11:33 +0200
          Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Andrew Berg <bahamutzero8825@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 05:02 -0500
            Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Thorsten Kampe <thorsten@thorstenkampe.de> - 2011-07-17 12:42 +0200
              Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2011-07-17 14:35 +0200
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Thorsten Kampe <thorsten@thorstenkampe.de> - 2011-07-17 17:03 +0200
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2011-07-17 21:10 +0200
              Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. rantingrick <rantingrick@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 09:46 -0700
                Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Andrew Berg <bahamutzero8825@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 18:21 -0500
  Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 10:31 +1000
  Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Dennis Lee Bieber <wlfraed@ix.netcom.com> - 2011-07-16 19:27 -0700
  Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Thorsten Kampe <thorsten@thorstenkampe.de> - 2011-07-17 09:35 +0200
    Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. rantingrick <rantingrick@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 09:29 -0700
      Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2011-07-18 02:50 +1000
      Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 12:54 -0600
        Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. rantingrick <rantingrick@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 13:12 -0700
          Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 16:39 -0600
          Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Andrew Berg <bahamutzero8825@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 18:18 -0500
  Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Dotan Cohen <dotancohen@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 11:15 +0300
    Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2011-07-17 14:53 +0200
      Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Dotan Cohen <dotancohen@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 22:26 +0300
        Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2011-07-17 21:53 +0200
          Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Dotan Cohen <dotancohen@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 23:46 +0300
  Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Andrew Berg <bahamutzero8825@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 03:35 -0500
  Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Dotan Cohen <dotancohen@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 14:11 +0300
    Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. rusi <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 04:21 -0700
    Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Thorsten Kampe <thorsten@thorstenkampe.de> - 2011-07-17 13:51 +0200
      Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Dotan Cohen <dotancohen@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 22:20 +0300
        Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Thorsten Kampe <thorsten@thorstenkampe.de> - 2011-07-17 21:34 +0200
          Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. rantingrick <rantingrick@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 13:22 -0700
  Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. gene heskett <gheskett@wdtv.com> - 2011-07-17 10:29 -0400
    Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Thorsten Kampe <thorsten@thorstenkampe.de> - 2011-07-17 17:10 +0200
      Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Corey Richardson <kb1pkl@aim.com> - 2011-07-17 12:28 -0400
      Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Anssi Saari <as@sci.fi> - 2011-07-18 19:28 +0300
        Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Thorsten Kampe <thorsten@thorstenkampe.de> - 2011-07-18 18:51 +0200
        Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2011-07-18 19:07 +0200
    Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. "Waldek M." <wm@localhost.localdomain> - 2011-07-17 21:39 +0200
  Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. Dotan Cohen <dotancohen@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 22:28 +0300
  Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won. gene heskett <gheskett@wdtv.com> - 2011-07-17 20:35 -0400

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