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Help System recommendation

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  Help System recommendation Novice <novice@example..com> - 2011-12-08 14:45 +0000
    Re: Help System recommendation "John B. Matthews" <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2011-12-08 20:37 -0500
      Re: Help System recommendation Novice <novice@example..com> - 2011-12-09 05:24 +0000
        Re: Help System recommendation "John B. Matthews" <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2011-12-09 12:05 -0500
          Re: Help System recommendation Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2011-12-09 10:25 -0800
            Re: Help System recommendation "John B. Matthews" <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2011-12-09 22:31 -0500
    Re: Help System recommendation Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2011-12-09 06:30 -0800
      Re: Help System recommendation Fredrik Jonson <fredrik@jonson.org> - 2011-12-11 16:03 +0000
        Re: Help System recommendation Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2011-12-12 03:36 -0800
    Re: Help System recommendation Jim Janney <jjanney@shell.xmission.com> - 2011-12-22 11:27 -0700

#10603 — Help System recommendation

I'm dusting off some old code with the intention of adding decent Help 
systems to them. Before I start writing though, I'm wondering what the 
preferred tools are for generating Help screens for Java programs these 
days. 

I've dabbled with Java Help back in the 2.01 days and it worked reasonably 
well but it looks like it's not very active in terms of development and 
improvements. In fact, when I tried to check out the current version number 
just now on the download page, http://java.net/projects/javahelp/downloads,  
it says there is no current version to download. I'm guessing that JavaHelp 
is no longer available.

So, what are people using these days? 

I'm seeing more and more cases where clicking on Help in an application 
menu brings the user to a website rather than windows on their desktops. Is 
it fair to say that's the preferred approach these days? If so, can anyone 
point me to information about how people are invoking those web-based help 
systems, preferably with examples that illustrate the technique? 

I'm already very familiar with web design, HTML, CSS, etc. I'm just unsure 
about what code goes into the application to direct the user of a desktop 
application to the website. Basically, I just need the code that gets 
executed in the application once the mouse click is detected and it is 
determined that it was Help which was clicked. I can build the website 
easily enough myself.

I'm also curious to know about preferred tools for building help systems 
that don't need an internet connection. In those cases, the application 
itself needs to display help screens without recourse to the web. 
-- 
Novice

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#10614

In article <Xns9FB563746CF5Ejpnasty@94.75.214.39>,
 Novice <novice@example..com> wrote:

> [...] 
> So, what are people using these days? 
> 
> I'm seeing more and more cases where clicking on Help in an 
> application menu brings the user to a website rather than windows on 
> their desktops. Is it fair to say that's the preferred approach these 
> days? If so, can anyone point me to information about how people are 
> invoking those web-based help systems, preferably with examples that 
> illustrate the technique? 
> 
> I'm already very familiar with web design, HTML, CSS, etc. I'm just 
> unsure about what code goes into the application to direct the user 
> of a desktop application to the website. Basically, I just need the 
> code that gets executed in the application once the mouse click is 
> detected and it is determined that it was Help which was clicked. I 
> can build the website easily enough myself.
> 
> I'm also curious to know about preferred tools for building help 
> systems that don't need an internet connection. In those cases, the 
> application itself needs to display help screens without recourse to 
> the web.

java.awt.Desktop, new in 1.6, is useful in both cases: browse() can 
accept a URI that references either a local or remote resource. 
Conveniently, it also leverages the user's chosen desktop browser.

The older javax.swing.JEditorPane is convenient, but it's limited to 
HTML 3.2 with a few extensions. There's an example here:

<http://robotchase.sourceforge.net/>

-- 
John B. Matthews
trashgod at gmail dot com
<http://sites.google.com/site/drjohnbmatthews>

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#10615

"John B. Matthews" <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote in news:nospam-
5BEFCD.20375308122011@news.aioe.org:

> In article <Xns9FB563746CF5Ejpnasty@94.75.214.39>,
>  Novice <novice@example..com> wrote:
> 
>> [...] 
>> So, what are people using these days? 
>> 
>> I'm seeing more and more cases where clicking on Help in an 
>> application menu brings the user to a website rather than windows on 
>> their desktops. Is it fair to say that's the preferred approach these 
>> days? If so, can anyone point me to information about how people are 
>> invoking those web-based help systems, preferably with examples that 
>> illustrate the technique? 
>> 
>> I'm already very familiar with web design, HTML, CSS, etc. I'm just 
>> unsure about what code goes into the application to direct the user 
>> of a desktop application to the website. Basically, I just need the 
>> code that gets executed in the application once the mouse click is 
>> detected and it is determined that it was Help which was clicked. I 
>> can build the website easily enough myself.
>> 
>> I'm also curious to know about preferred tools for building help 
>> systems that don't need an internet connection. In those cases, the 
>> application itself needs to display help screens without recourse to 
>> the web.
> 
> java.awt.Desktop, new in 1.6, is useful in both cases: browse() can 
> accept a URI that references either a local or remote resource. 
> Conveniently, it also leverages the user's chosen desktop browser.
> 
> The older javax.swing.JEditorPane is convenient, but it's limited to 
> HTML 3.2 with a few extensions. There's an example here:
> 
> <http://robotchase.sourceforge.net/>
> 

java.awt.Desktop sounds like it may be just what I want. I could deal with 
JEditorPane too but Desktop sounds like it is a better fit for what I want 
without the limitations of HTML 3.2. Is it just me or is it odd that they 
aren't gradually updating JEditorPane to accomodate newer versions of HTML?

Thanks John!

-- 
Novice

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#10626

In article <Xns9FB6419D68C9jpnasty@94.75.214.39>,
 Novice <novice@example..com> wrote:

> Is it just me or is it odd that they aren't gradually updating 
> JEditorPane to accomodate newer versions of HTML?

Pure speculation: I'm guessing the developers see diminishing returns on 
trying to support a browser-in-a-box, when the component level support 
is good enough:

<http://docs.oracle.com/javase/tutorial/uiswing/components/html.html>

-- 
John B. Matthews
trashgod at gmail dot com
<http://sites.google.com/site/drjohnbmatthews>

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#10628

On Fri, 09 Dec 2011 12:05:46 -0500, "John B. Matthews"
<nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who
said :

>
>> Is it just me or is it odd that they aren't gradually updating 
>> JEditorPane to accomodate newer versions of HTML?
>
>Pure speculation: I'm guessing the developers see diminishing returns on 
>trying to support a browser-in-a-box, when the component level support 
>is good enough:

I first took your post to mean the claim JEditorPane was stalled was
speculation. However, now I think you meant "diminishing returns" was
speculation.

The HTML that JEDitorPane supports is pretty primtive and fragile and
it has not changed in years.

It is also very slow.  I think for any volume, you want ot fire up a
browser to render.
-- 
Roedy Green Canadian Mind Products
http://mindprod.com
For me, the appeal of computer programming is that
even though I am quite a klutz,
I can still produce something, in a sense
perfect, because the computer gives me as many
chances as I please to get it right.
 

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#10638

In article <hbk4e7t9ehdpv8kn0s3l8sd4urhn2i29i1@4ax.com>,
 Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> wrote:

> On Fri, 09 Dec 2011 12:05:46 -0500, "John B. Matthews"
> <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who
> said :
> 
> >
> >> Is it just me or is it odd that they aren't gradually updating 
> >> JEditorPane to accomodate newer versions of HTML?
> >
> >Pure speculation: I'm guessing the developers see diminishing 
> >returns on trying to support a browser-in-a-box, when the component 
> >level support is good enough:
> 
> I first took your post to mean the claim JEditorPane was stalled was 
> speculation. However, now I think you meant "diminishing returns" was 
> speculation.

Exactly. I originally wrote, "Pure speculation on my part," but 
shortened it as too wordy. Concise became elliptical. The colon was 
meant to introduce an appositive independent clause, but an "—" (em 
dash) might have been more clear.

> The HTML that JEDitorPane supports is pretty primtive and fragile and 
> it has not changed in years.
> 
> It is also very slow.  I think for any volume, you want ot fire up a 
> browser to render.

Yes. Primitive, fragile and slow; but perfect for enriching the odd 
explanatory dialog.

-- 
John B. Matthews
trashgod at gmail dot com
<http://sites.google.com/site/drjohnbmatthews>

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#10621

On Thu, 8 Dec 2011 14:45:58 +0000 (UTC), Novice <novice@example..com>
wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who said :

>I'm dusting off some old code with the intention of adding decent Help 
>systems to them. Before I start writing though, I'm wondering what the 
>preferred tools are for generating Help screens for Java programs these 
>days. 

Most people are just linking to an ordinary web page.  This lets you
compose it with your usual tools, not needing to learn new skills.

The HTML validator people used one. I complained there was no inpage
search which I would have with any browser.  They could not supply it
because such support did not come with the help engine. 

Another advantage of HTML is the help is likely to say more up to
date.

Another advantage is if your vendor goes belly up, your code still
works without having to write a translator.

See http://mindprod.com/jgloss/javahelp.html

Another possibility is an ebook. There are ebook preparation tools to
create the index.  Creating an index is not hard using a custom regex
extracting program.
-- 
Roedy Green Canadian Mind Products
http://mindprod.com
For me, the appeal of computer programming is that
even though I am quite a klutz,
I can still produce something, in a sense
perfect, because the computer gives me as many
chances as I please to get it right.
 

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#10655

Roedy Green wrote:

>  Most people are just linking to an ordinary web page.  This lets you
>  compose it with your usual tools, not needing to learn new skills.

Yes, this must be the preferred alternative today when every user has
a browser they know better than any other tool on the system and
a favourite search engine.

I like how orac^Wsun as an option also offer you to download the entire
html documentation in a ordinary zip file. Very cross platform and
ideal when the supplier is bought by another company and the documentation
vanishes from the internet.

And please spare your users from the ajax experience. When publishing
documentation quick-loading cacheable static plain old html rules.

--
Fredrik Jonson

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#10663

On 11 Dec 2011 16:03:42 GMT, Fredrik Jonson <fredrik@jonson.org>
wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who said :

>I like how orac^Wsun as an option also offer you to download the entire
>html documentation in a ordinary zip file. Very cross platform and
>ideal when the supplier is bought by another company and the documentation
>vanishes from the internet.

If the set of documents is large, or changes frequently, you might use
the Replicator to efficiently maintain a local mirror.

See http://mindprod.com/products1.html#REPLICATOR

Another reason to use online HTML is that you can use google with a
site: qualifier to help you find stuff you can't find in the index.
-- 
Roedy Green Canadian Mind Products
http://mindprod.com
For me, the appeal of computer programming is that
even though I am quite a klutz,
I can still produce something, in a sense
perfect, because the computer gives me as many
chances as I please to get it right.
 

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#10956

Novice <novice@example..com> writes:

> I'm dusting off some old code with the intention of adding decent Help 
> systems to them. Before I start writing though, I'm wondering what the 
> preferred tools are for generating Help screens for Java programs these 
> days. 
>
> I've dabbled with Java Help back in the 2.01 days and it worked reasonably 
> well but it looks like it's not very active in terms of development and 
> improvements. In fact, when I tried to check out the current version number 
> just now on the download page, http://java.net/projects/javahelp/downloads,  
> it says there is no current version to download. I'm guessing that JavaHelp 
> is no longer available.
>
> So, what are people using these days? 
>
> I'm seeing more and more cases where clicking on Help in an application 
> menu brings the user to a website rather than windows on their desktops. Is 
> it fair to say that's the preferred approach these days? If so, can anyone 
> point me to information about how people are invoking those web-based help 
> systems, preferably with examples that illustrate the technique? 
>
> I'm already very familiar with web design, HTML, CSS, etc. I'm just unsure 
> about what code goes into the application to direct the user of a desktop 
> application to the website. Basically, I just need the code that gets 
> executed in the application once the mouse click is detected and it is 
> determined that it was Help which was clicked. I can build the website 
> easily enough myself.
>
> I'm also curious to know about preferred tools for building help systems 
> that don't need an internet connection. In those cases, the application 
> itself needs to display help screens without recourse to the web. 

Displaying HTML in a browser is probably the best option, and it doesn't
limit you to using an external web site.  Other options are:

1) distribute static HTML files with your application, and point the
   browser at them using the file:// protocol.  Javahelp supports this
   method.

2) generate HTML files in a temporary directory when help is requested,
   and point the browser at them.

3) embed a little HTTP server in your application (I believe this is how
   Eclipse provides its online help).

1) is the simplest method if static help is good enough.  3) is probably
the best if you need more control at run time.  I don't particularly
recommend 2) even though I'm doing it -- I can only say that the project
was already very late and learning how to embed a server would have
delayed it even further.

-- 
Jim Janney

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