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Groups > comp.lang.java.programmer > #5905 > unrolled thread
| Started by | rop rop <rop049@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2011-07-06 08:35 -0700 |
| Last post | 2011-07-09 12:16 -0700 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 277 — 46 participants |
Back to article view | Back to comp.lang.java.programmer
Arithmetic overflow checking rop rop <rop049@gmail.com> - 2011-07-06 08:35 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking markspace <-@.> - 2011-07-06 09:42 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking stefan@nyniva.se - 2011-07-06 11:30 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking markspace <-@.> - 2011-07-06 11:36 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-18 23:06 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-06 10:16 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "John B. Matthews" <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2011-07-07 02:26 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-18 23:07 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Peter Duniho <NpOeStPeAdM@NnOwSlPiAnMk.com> - 2011-07-07 07:11 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-07 10:02 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Peter Duniho <NpOeStPeAdM@NnOwSlPiAnMk.com> - 2011-07-07 17:51 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-07 20:04 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Peter Duniho <NpOeStPeAdM@NnOwSlPiAnMk.com> - 2011-07-07 20:29 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking rop rop <rop049@gmail.com> - 2011-07-08 15:52 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-18 23:12 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Tom Anderson <twic@urchin.earth.li> - 2011-07-09 10:31 +0100
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking rop rop <rop049@gmail.com> - 2011-07-09 02:58 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Eric Sosman <esosman@ieee-dot-org.invalid> - 2011-07-09 08:53 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking markspace <-@.> - 2011-07-09 07:46 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-18 23:17 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Peter Duniho <NpOeStPeAdM@NnOwSlPiAnMk.com> - 2011-07-18 23:22 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking tm <thomas.mertes@gmx.at> - 2011-07-10 01:47 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking China Blue Dolls <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2011-07-10 02:47 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking pete <pfiland@mindspring.com> - 2011-07-10 06:04 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking China Blue Dolls <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2011-07-10 03:29 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Phil Carmody <thefatphil_demunged@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-07-10 20:52 +0300
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking pete <pfiland@mindspring.com> - 2011-07-10 23:29 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking tm <thomas.mertes@gmx.at> - 2011-07-10 04:44 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2011-07-12 11:33 +0100
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking tm <thomas.mertes@gmx.at> - 2011-07-12 04:17 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2011-07-12 12:33 +0100
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking tm <thomas.mertes@gmx.at> - 2011-07-12 05:24 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Eric Sosman <esosman@ieee-dot-org.invalid> - 2011-07-12 21:45 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2011-07-12 05:25 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking tm <thomas.mertes@gmx.at> - 2011-07-12 10:21 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking tm <thomas.mertes@gmx.at> - 2011-07-12 23:54 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2011-07-12 19:14 +0100
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2011-07-13 00:20 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking markspace <-@.> - 2011-07-12 09:26 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> - 2011-07-12 10:52 -0600
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-07-12 10:48 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2011-07-12 16:54 +0000
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2011-07-12 11:35 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking tm <thomas.mertes@gmx.at> - 2011-07-12 10:13 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Eric Sosman <esosman@ieee-dot-org.invalid> - 2011-07-12 21:53 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "MikeP" <mp011011@some.org> - 2011-07-14 23:41 -0500
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2011-07-15 10:56 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "MikeP" <mp011011@some.org> - 2011-07-15 21:27 -0500
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking bugbear <bugbear@trim_papermule.co.uk_trim> - 2011-07-20 09:22 +0100
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking tm <thomas.mertes@gmx.at> - 2011-07-20 10:51 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking gordonb.3urm7@burditt.org (Gordon Burditt) - 2011-07-20 15:39 -0500
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2011-07-21 12:12 +0100
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Eric Sosman <esosman@ieee-dot-org.invalid> - 2011-07-10 09:28 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2011-07-10 06:52 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-07-10 14:47 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "MikeP" <mp011011@some.org> - 2011-07-14 23:07 -0500
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Joshua Cranmer <Pidgeot18@verizon.invalid> - 2011-07-10 12:25 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2011-07-10 10:47 -0500
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2011-07-11 07:58 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2011-07-11 10:48 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2011-07-11 14:40 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking tm <thomas.mertes@gmx.at> - 2011-07-11 14:54 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2011-07-11 15:55 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Eric Sosman <esosman@ieee-dot-org.invalid> - 2011-07-11 21:51 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2011-07-11 21:31 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2011-07-11 23:16 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-07-12 06:28 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking David Thompson <dave.thompson2@verizon.net> - 2011-07-24 22:13 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Lew Pitcher <lpitcher@teksavvy.com> - 2011-07-25 10:24 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2011-07-12 09:05 +0200
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking tm <thomas.mertes@gmx.at> - 2011-07-12 02:22 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2011-07-12 11:34 +0200
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2011-07-12 03:04 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking tm <thomas.mertes@gmx.at> - 2011-07-12 03:33 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking David Lamb <dalamb@cs.queensu.ca> - 2011-07-12 08:29 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2011-07-12 13:18 +0200
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2011-07-12 11:39 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-12 12:38 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking markspace <-@.> - 2011-07-12 13:20 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2011-07-12 13:23 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2011-07-12 21:08 +0000
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-07-12 14:48 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2011-07-12 15:24 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-07-12 16:09 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2011-07-13 10:38 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-13 11:00 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-07-13 12:16 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2011-07-13 13:10 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking markspace <-@.> - 2011-07-13 13:21 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-07-13 13:41 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2011-07-14 21:10 -0500
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2011-07-15 11:57 +0200
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2011-07-15 04:36 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Niklas Holsti <niklas.holsti@tidorum.invalid> - 2011-08-13 21:54 +0300
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking tm <thomas.mertes@gmx.at> - 2011-07-13 00:52 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-13 07:45 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Wolfgang Draxinger <wdraxinger@darkstargames.de> - 2011-09-08 21:02 +0200
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Wolfgang Draxinger <wdraxinger@darkstargames.de> - 2011-09-08 21:12 +0200
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Willem <willem@toad.stack.nl> - 2011-09-08 19:15 +0000
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Wolfgang Draxinger <wdraxinger@darkstargames.de> - 2011-09-08 22:24 +0200
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Eric Sosman <esosman@ieee-dot-org.invalid> - 2011-07-08 00:30 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Peter Duniho <NpOeStPeAdM@NnOwSlPiAnMk.com> - 2011-07-08 01:29 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking markspace <-@.> - 2011-07-08 07:38 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Eric Sosman <esosman@ieee-dot-org.invalid> - 2011-07-08 20:40 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking markspace <-@.> - 2011-07-08 18:17 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Peter Duniho <NpOeStPeAdM@NnOwSlPiAnMk.com> - 2011-07-08 19:49 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking markspace <-@.> - 2011-07-08 22:26 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Peter Duniho <NpOeStPeAdM@NnOwSlPiAnMk.com> - 2011-07-08 17:42 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Tom Anderson <twic@urchin.earth.li> - 2011-07-09 10:21 +0100
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking David Lamb <dalamb@cs.queensu.ca> - 2011-07-10 10:53 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2011-07-10 18:07 +0000
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-10 11:29 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2011-07-10 19:22 +0000
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-21 16:40 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2011-07-21 23:06 +0000
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-21 19:38 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Henderson <h1@g1.f1> - 2011-07-22 00:27 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2011-07-22 13:00 +0000
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking markspace <-@.> - 2011-07-10 17:17 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2011-07-08 10:23 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "John B. Matthews" <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2011-07-08 19:30 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2011-07-11 08:04 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-21 16:43 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "MikeP" <mp011011@some.org> - 2011-07-15 00:28 -0500
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-18 23:09 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "MikeP" <mp011011@some.org> - 2011-07-15 00:14 -0500
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-15 07:00 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-07-15 08:09 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-20 22:07 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "MikeP" <mp011011@some.org> - 2011-07-15 23:29 -0500
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-15 22:26 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "MikeP" <mp011011@some.org> - 2011-07-16 00:32 -0500
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-07-16 11:00 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-16 11:15 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "MikeP" <mp011011@some.org> - 2011-07-16 15:41 -0500
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-07-16 23:18 +0000
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "MikeP" <mp011011@some.org> - 2011-07-17 00:30 -0500
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "John B. Matthews" <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2011-07-16 08:39 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-07-16 10:33 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "MikeP" <mp011011@some.org> - 2011-07-16 15:51 -0500
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-07-17 08:46 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "MikeP" <mp011011@some.org> - 2011-07-18 07:03 -0500
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-07-18 06:21 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "MikeP" <mp011011@some.org> - 2011-07-16 15:43 -0500
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "John B. Matthews" <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2011-07-17 09:50 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-17 08:15 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "John B. Matthews" <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2011-07-18 01:12 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-21 16:50 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "MikeP" <mp011011@some.org> - 2011-07-18 06:56 -0500
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking David Lamb <dalamb@cs.queensu.ca> - 2011-07-18 19:26 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2011-07-18 15:03 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-20 22:16 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Henderson <h1@g1.f1> - 2011-07-20 22:25 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking David Lamb <dalamb@cs.queensu.ca> - 2011-07-21 08:50 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-07-21 07:37 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-21 16:52 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2011-07-21 12:19 +0000
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-21 16:54 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2011-07-21 14:46 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-21 18:10 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2011-07-21 23:22 +0000
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "John B. Matthews" <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2011-07-21 21:47 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking David Lamb <dalamb@cs.queensu.ca> - 2011-07-23 10:15 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-07-16 10:46 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-16 11:13 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-20 22:09 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-07-20 21:01 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-07-21 07:05 -0300
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking supercalifragilisticexpialadiamaticonormalizeringelimatisticantations <supercalifragilisticexpialadiamaticonormalizeringelimatisticantations@averylongandannoyingdomainname.com> - 2011-07-21 06:28 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-07-21 12:32 +0000
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-21 16:58 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-21 15:58 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-21 19:14 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2011-07-22 13:07 +0000
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-07-22 17:33 +0000
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-07-22 13:36 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-07-22 23:16 +0000
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-22 16:50 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-07-23 20:09 +0000
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-24 08:56 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-07-23 09:37 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking David Lamb <dalamb@cs.queensu.ca> - 2011-07-23 11:23 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking supercalifragilisticexpialadiamaticonormalizeringelimatisticantations <supercalifragilisticexpialadiamaticonormalizeringelimatisticantations@averylongandannoyingdomainname.com> - 2011-07-23 12:04 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking David Lamb <dalamb@cs.queensu.ca> - 2011-07-23 14:45 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-07-23 11:51 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking supercalifragilisticexpialadiamaticonormalizeringelimatisticantations <supercalifragilisticexpialadiamaticonormalizeringelimatisticantations@averylongandannoyingdomainname.com> - 2011-07-23 22:39 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Joshua Cranmer <Pidgeot18@verizon.invalid> - 2011-07-25 10:20 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking supercalifragilisticexpialadiamaticonormalizeringelimatisticantations <supercalifragilisticexpialadiamaticonormalizeringelimatisticantations@averylongandannoyingdomainname.com> - 2011-07-25 13:29 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking David Lamb <dalamb@cs.queensu.ca> - 2011-07-25 13:35 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-07-23 09:39 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-07-23 21:09 +0000
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-07-23 21:24 +0000
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-21 16:57 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-20 22:12 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-07-21 06:41 -0300
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-21 16:38 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Wanja Gayk <brixomatic@yahoo.com> - 2011-07-06 22:28 +0200
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Wanja Gayk <brixomatic@yahoo.com> - 2011-07-06 22:30 +0200
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Tom Anderson <twic@urchin.earth.li> - 2011-07-06 22:32 +0100
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking rop rop <rop049@gmail.com> - 2011-07-07 00:30 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Eric Sosman <esosman@ieee-dot-org.invalid> - 2011-07-07 07:54 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking rop rop <rop049@gmail.com> - 2011-07-07 05:36 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Daniele Futtorovic <da.futt.news@laposte-dot-net.invalid> - 2011-07-07 19:11 +0200
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Tom Anderson <twic@urchin.earth.li> - 2011-07-07 14:21 +0100
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Stanimir Stamenkov <s7an10@netscape.net> - 2011-07-09 16:34 +0300
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2011-07-06 22:41 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2011-07-07 14:34 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-07 14:53 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2011-07-07 17:12 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-07-07 17:29 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2011-07-08 10:27 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-07-08 13:15 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-19 20:54 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking markspace <-@.> - 2011-07-19 18:07 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-19 21:31 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-07-20 07:36 -0300
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking RedGrittyBrick <RedGrittyBrick@spamweary.invalid> - 2011-07-20 11:58 +0100
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-07-20 09:51 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking RedGrittyBrick <RedGrittyBrick@spamweary.invalid> - 2011-07-21 12:11 +0100
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2011-07-21 12:43 +0000
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Tom McGlynn <taqmcglynn@googlemail.com> - 2011-07-21 07:15 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-07-21 07:35 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-07-21 15:38 +0000
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-07-21 09:03 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Joshua Cranmer <Pidgeot18@verizon.invalid> - 2011-07-21 12:00 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-07-22 17:16 +0000
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking David Lamb <dalamb@cs.queensu.ca> - 2011-07-23 11:28 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-07-23 21:03 +0000
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Henderson <h1@g1.f1> - 2011-07-23 22:55 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-24 09:16 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking markspace <-@.> - 2011-07-24 10:40 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-24 10:54 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking markspace <-@.> - 2011-07-24 11:09 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-24 12:53 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking markspace <-@.> - 2011-07-24 15:15 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-24 15:41 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Henderson <h1@g1.f1> - 2011-07-25 03:21 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-25 00:56 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-07-25 07:03 -0300
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Thomas Richter <thor@math.tu-berlin.de> - 2011-07-26 09:43 +0200
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-07-25 11:06 +0000
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Henderson <h1@g1.f1> - 2011-07-25 11:12 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-25 09:09 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-25 09:30 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking David Lamb <dalamb@cs.queensu.ca> - 2011-07-25 13:33 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "John B. Matthews" <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2011-07-26 03:04 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Joshua Cranmer <Pidgeot18@verizon.invalid> - 2011-07-26 03:28 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Henderson <h1@g1.f1> - 2011-07-26 04:53 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Joshua Cranmer <Pidgeot18@verizon.invalid> - 2011-07-26 11:35 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-26 10:48 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-21 17:00 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-20 19:50 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-07-20 23:21 -0300
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2011-07-21 12:52 +0000
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Henderson <h1@g1.f1> - 2011-07-21 15:58 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-21 17:06 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2011-07-20 14:35 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-20 18:22 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2011-07-21 14:54 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking rop rop <rop049@gmail.com> - 2011-07-08 15:34 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2011-07-11 08:09 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Joshua Cranmer <Pidgeot18@verizon.invalid> - 2011-07-11 10:30 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2011-07-11 14:43 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Joshua Cranmer <Pidgeot18@verizon.invalid> - 2011-07-11 14:49 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Daniele Futtorovic <da.futt.news@laposte-dot-net.invalid> - 2011-07-17 17:14 +0200
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking David Lamb <dalamb@cs.queensu.ca> - 2011-07-18 19:28 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-07-18 16:36 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-19 21:33 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-19 20:56 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2011-07-20 14:36 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-07-20 18:24 -0400
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> - 2011-07-21 14:55 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2011-07-06 22:43 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking Jukka Lahtinen <jtfjdehf@hotmail.com.invalid> - 2011-07-07 14:56 +0300
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "Nasser M. Abbasi" <nma@12000.org> - 2011-07-08 21:27 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking "Nasser M. Abbasi" <nma@12000.org> - 2011-07-08 21:57 -0700
Re: Arithmetic overflow checking lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-07-09 12:16 -0700
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| From | Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2011-07-21 23:22 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <j0acb0$iem$2@localhost.localdomain> |
| In reply to | #6360 |
On Thu, 21 Jul 2011 14:46:04 -0700, Gene Wirchenko wrote: > On Thu, 21 Jul 2011 16:54:55 -0400, Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> wrote: > > [snip] > >>But I do know that the begin end family of languages are children of >>Algol. > > Block-structured languages are children of ALGOL. That includes > C et al. > C was the child of BCPL, a much more primitive language than Algol 60. For instance BCPL lacked any explicit variable typing: its only variable types were words and arrays of words. BCPL was the ancestor of all curly bracket languages. I have no idea what, if any, relationship there was between BCPL and Algol 60. BCPL was later (1966 vs 1960) but as quick scan of the Wikipedia article found no references to Algol, my guess is that there is no connection between the two. I once was able to read BCPL well enough to transcribe the General Purpose Macro Generator, which was written in it, into Algol 60 - the two languages were similar enough to make this a reasonably simple task. Eliott 503 Algol was my first computer language. -- martin@ | Martin Gregorie gregorie. | Essex, UK org |
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| From | "John B. Matthews" <nospam@nospam.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2011-07-21 21:47 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <nospam-1C800B.21473121072011@news.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #6360 |
In article <df7h27dk9n83fm5unmn7gpgvh1rl1gi3fi@4ax.com>, Gene Wirchenko <genew@ocis.net> wrote: > On Thu, 21 Jul 2011 16:54:55 -0400, Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> > wrote: > > [snip] > > >But I do know that the begin end family of languages are children of > >Algol. > > Block-structured languages are children of ALGOL. That includes C et > al. "In its semantic structure Scheme is as closely akin to Algol 60 as to early Lisps. Algol 60 … lives on in the genes of Scheme and Pascal."—Alan J. Perlis, Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs, Forward: <http://mitpress.mit.edu/sicp/full-text/book/book.html> -- John B. Matthews trashgod at gmail dot com <http://sites.google.com/site/drjohnbmatthews>
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| From | David Lamb <dalamb@cs.queensu.ca> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2011-07-23 10:15 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <vIAWp.406664$lW4.392799@newsfe07.iad> |
| In reply to | #6360 |
On 21/07/2011 5:46 PM, Gene Wirchenko wrote: > On Thu, 21 Jul 2011 16:54:55 -0400, Arne Vajhøj<arne@vajhoej.dk> > wrote: > > [snip] > >> But I do know that the begin end family of languages are children >> of Algol. > > Block-structured languages are children of ALGOL. That includes > C et al. I don't think "child" is quite the right word -- "inspiration" perhaps. The first papers about CPL, precursor to BCPL/B/C/C++/Java, came out in 1963, so definitely several years after Algol 58, but it didn't have "block structure" in the Algol sense where you could declare procedures within procedures ad nauseum. I think it's fair to call Pascal and Ada children of Algol.
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| From | lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2011-07-16 10:46 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <94b46e4a-0054-4d63-9b20-b6fd02fd1c5b@a2g2000prf.googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #6219 |
"MikeP" wrote: > C# will fit in a lot of places where Java does (or so I assume given what > I know about them, as I'm [sic] don't use either language other than for > You might want to know a little more about the languages before rendering judgment. C# and Java run on different platforms - C# far fewer than Java. What do you mean by "a lot"? > evaluation and case study). Pushing away programmers to other languages > instead of evolving the language according to the expectations (i.e., > what programmers have come to expect to be standard feature in a given > class of language) is surely a path to obsolescence. > "Surely"? Would you mind providing *any* evidence or logic for that claim? Over three decades as a professional programmer, I've had to know a zillion languages to avoid obsolescence. Those who stuck with Fortran when C became popular found themselves marginalized with frightening speed, although of course there is still Fortran work out there. C programmers had to know shell programming and assembler to get any work done. If you don't know SQL, you are so screwed. If you stayed with C when C++ and # and Java came out, you were dooming yourself to obsolescence, over the large segments of the market. C++ has become ivory tower and very competitive - unless you're one of the best in that world, failing to learn other languages "surely" doomed you to obsolescence. C# and Java are similar in a lot of ways, but language alone doth not make the program. Software is 1% programming and 99% deployment and operations. They run in different environments, and you cannot really use either one without SQL, HTML, Javascript and things like Python, and now, of course, JQL and other metalanguages. Don't speak XML? Hello, obsolescence! Can't use JSON? You're limited. Can't read bytecode? You're less of a Java programmer. You couldn't be more mistaken in your conclusions. A programmer needs to know a minimum of two full-fledged programming languages, one with the ability to create wild pointers, a database-query language, a shell and at least one scripting language just to be minimally competent. Please don't imagine that you're going to impress anyone if you respond to this post with more of your indirect, suggestive comments unsubstantiated by even the merest jot of reasoning and evidence. -- Lew
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| From | Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2011-07-16 11:13 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <bo-dnf3-7t0uSbzTnZ2dnUVZ_oqdnZ2d@earthlink.com> |
| In reply to | #6229 |
On 7/16/2011 10:46 AM, lewbloch wrote: ... > Over three decades as a professional programmer, I've had to know a > zillion languages to avoid obsolescence. Those who stuck with Fortran > when C became popular found themselves marginalized with frightening > speed, although of course there is still Fortran work out there. C > programmers had to know shell programming and assembler to get any > work done. ... If I had picked a couple of programming languages near the start of my career, they would have been Fortran and NEAT/3 Level 2 (the assembly language for the NCR Century computers). I don't believe I would have had anywhere near as long, or fun, a career without continuous willingness to learn programming languages. In my last professional project, I wrote code in Java, Verilog, Perl, and Forth. Patricia
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| From | Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2011-07-20 22:09 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <4e278a67$0$309$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> |
| In reply to | #6219 |
On 7/16/2011 12:29 AM, MikeP wrote: > Patricia Shanahan wrote: >> and then complain when there is a >> mismatch between that language's features and their current >> requirements. > > In another post, I said that I think that today (like in right now) the > awareness of the overflow issue (language support) has achieved critical > mass. Combine that with the alternatives that are available and more yet > to come, a language cannot afford to go the path of, say, C anymore for > it will lose relevance much more quickly. It's not complaining. It's > customer feedback (companies BEG their customers for such!). Companies > that don't recognize their customers needs and change with the times, go > out of business. Java is not C and can't afford to stagnate like C did > (OK, C++ gave it a "reconditioning"), or it won't last. It seems highly unlikely that the lack of overflow detection will have any impact on the usage of Java. The typical business app does not care. Arne
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| From | lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2011-07-20 21:01 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <c8c899b6-5cf4-4e0e-a7bd-f8211b01951e@y13g2000prb.googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #6320 |
On Jul 20, 7:09 pm, Arne Vajhøj <a...@vajhoej.dk> wrote: > On 7/16/2011 12:29 AM, MikeP wrote: > > > Patricia Shanahan wrote: > >> and then complain when there is a > >> mismatch between that language's features and their current > >> requirements. > > > In another post, I said that I think that today (like in right now) the > > awareness of the overflow issue (language support) has achieved critical > > mass. Combine that with the alternatives that are available and more yet > > to come, a language cannot afford to go the path of, say, C anymore for > > it will lose relevance much more quickly. It's not complaining. It's > > customer feedback (companies BEG their customers for such!). Companies > > that don't recognize their customers needs and change with the times, go > > out of business. Java is not C and can't afford to stagnate like C did > > (OK, C++ gave it a "reconditioning"), or it won't last. > > It seems highly unlikely that the lack of overflow detection > will have any impact on the usage of Java. > > The typical business app does not care. C has not lost all relevance, nor stagnated, despite "MikeP"'s unsubstantiated claims. Many places and applications use C still. -- Lew
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| From | Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2011-07-21 07:05 -0300 |
| Message-ID | <1SSVp.69032$_I7.18660@newsfe08.iad> |
| In reply to | #6320 |
On 11-07-20 11:09 PM, Arne Vajhøj wrote: > On 7/16/2011 12:29 AM, MikeP wrote: >> Patricia Shanahan wrote: >>> and then complain when there is a >>> mismatch between that language's features and their current >>> requirements. >> >> In another post, I said that I think that today (like in right now) the >> awareness of the overflow issue (language support) has achieved critical >> mass. Combine that with the alternatives that are available and more yet >> to come, a language cannot afford to go the path of, say, C anymore for >> it will lose relevance much more quickly. It's not complaining. It's >> customer feedback (companies BEG their customers for such!). Companies >> that don't recognize their customers needs and change with the times, go >> out of business. Java is not C and can't afford to stagnate like C did >> (OK, C++ gave it a "reconditioning"), or it won't last. > > It seems highly unlikely that the lack of overflow detection > will have any impact on the usage of Java. > > The typical business app does not care. > > Arne > I agree, with caveats. The larger issue is the proper treatment of numerical quantities in business applications. Leaving aside currency, which there is _some_ awareness of in terms of appropriate things to do, the expression of other numerical quantities in Java is typified by the use of unconstrained primitives, with haphazard and inconsistent bounds checking scattered over the code. Maybe it's just me, but wouldn't a better approach to a numerical data type be to write its own class, which is responsible for its own invariants (*) (**)? Hang the minor to moderate performance implications: what's more important, correct code or fast code? My questions to a Java programmer who wants (or thinks they want) overflow detection would include: are you using the correct primitive type (or wrapper for a primitive)? Do you even know the design ranges for your quantity? Why are you wanting to rely on overflow detection to save your program when 99 percent of the possible legal values for your chosen data type are also wrong for the design problem, and you're obviously not concerned about that at all? Why don't you write a proper class for your data type? AHS * Own class in an OOP language, that is. ** An acceptable approach in some circumstances is rules engines. I have not seen these widely adopted or even often considered.
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| From | supercalifragilisticexpialadiamaticonormalizeringelimatisticantations <supercalifragilisticexpialadiamaticonormalizeringelimatisticantations@averylongandannoyingdomainname.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2011-07-21 06:28 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <j08v14$brk$1@speranza.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #6331 |
On 21/07/2011 6:05 AM, Arved Sandstrom wrote: > I agree, with caveats. The larger issue is the proper treatment of > numerical quantities in business applications. Leaving aside currency, > which there is _some_ awareness of in terms of appropriate things to do, > the expression of other numerical quantities in Java is typified by the > use of unconstrained primitives, with haphazard and inconsistent bounds > checking scattered over the code. Maybe it's just me, but wouldn't a > better approach to a numerical data type be to write its own class, > which is responsible for its own invariants (*) (**)? ... Why don't you > write a proper class for your data type? In four words: Lack of operator overloading. Math on non-primitive types is *painful* in Java.
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| From | Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2011-07-21 12:32 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <slrnj2g735.6gl.avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> |
| In reply to | #6332 |
supercalifragilisticexpialadiamaticonormalizeringelimatisticantations <supercalifragilisticexpialadiamaticonormalizeringelimatisticantations@averylongandannoyingdomainname.com> wrote:
> On 21/07/2011 6:05 AM, Arved Sandstrom wrote:
>> ... Why don't you write a proper class for your data type?
> In four words: Lack of operator overloading.
> Math on non-primitive types is *painful* in Java.
agreeCount = agreeCount.plus(AgreeCount.ONE)
on painfulness of non-primitive math.
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| From | Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2011-07-21 16:58 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <4e2892f1$0$309$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> |
| In reply to | #6336 |
On 7/21/2011 8:32 AM, Andreas Leitgeb wrote: > supercalifragilisticexpialadiamaticonormalizeringelimatisticantations<supercalifragilisticexpialadiamaticonormalizeringelimatisticantations@averylongandannoyingdomainname.com> wrote: >> On 21/07/2011 6:05 AM, Arved Sandstrom wrote: >>> ... Why don't you write a proper class for your data type? >> In four words: Lack of operator overloading. >> Math on non-primitive types is *painful* in Java. > > agreeCount = agreeCount.plus(AgreeCount.ONE) > on painfulness of non-primitive math. It does not look good. But I find it hard to believe to be a significant problem in typical business apps. Arne
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| From | Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2011-07-21 15:58 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <heOdnWF5kt-7MrXTnZ2dnUVZ_u2dnZ2d@earthlink.com> |
| In reply to | #6355 |
On 7/21/2011 1:58 PM, Arne Vajhøj wrote: > On 7/21/2011 8:32 AM, Andreas Leitgeb wrote: >> supercalifragilisticexpialadiamaticonormalizeringelimatisticantations<supercalifragilisticexpialadiamaticonormalizeringelimatisticantations@averylongandannoyingdomainname.com> >> wrote: >>> On 21/07/2011 6:05 AM, Arved Sandstrom wrote: >>>> ... Why don't you write a proper class for your data type? >>> In four words: Lack of operator overloading. >>> Math on non-primitive types is *painful* in Java. >> >> agreeCount = agreeCount.plus(AgreeCount.ONE) >> on painfulness of non-primitive math. > > It does not look good. > > But I find it hard to believe to be a significant problem in typical > business apps. I agree. After all, it is no worse than "ADD 1 TO AGREECOUNT GIVING AGREECOUNT.". I do have a serious concern with lack of either operator overloading or complex primitives as one of the barriers to use of Java for engineering and scientific programming. The problem is not just the keystrokes for typing the expressions. It is very important to be able to check that a lengthy expression in a program is a correct translation of the corresponding expression, in mathematical notation, in a textbook or paper. Patricia
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| From | Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2011-07-21 19:14 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <4e28b2c3$0$316$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> |
| In reply to | #6376 |
On 7/21/2011 6:58 PM, Patricia Shanahan wrote: > On 7/21/2011 1:58 PM, Arne Vajhøj wrote: >> On 7/21/2011 8:32 AM, Andreas Leitgeb wrote: >>> supercalifragilisticexpialadiamaticonormalizeringelimatisticantations<supercalifragilisticexpialadiamaticonormalizeringelimatisticantations@averylongandannoyingdomainname.com> >>> >>> wrote: >>>> On 21/07/2011 6:05 AM, Arved Sandstrom wrote: >>>>> ... Why don't you write a proper class for your data type? >>>> In four words: Lack of operator overloading. >>>> Math on non-primitive types is *painful* in Java. >>> >>> agreeCount = agreeCount.plus(AgreeCount.ONE) >>> on painfulness of non-primitive math. >> >> It does not look good. >> >> But I find it hard to believe to be a significant problem in typical >> business apps. > > I agree. After all, it is no worse than "ADD 1 TO AGREECOUNT GIVING > AGREECOUNT.". > > I do have a serious concern with lack of either operator overloading or > complex primitives as one of the barriers to use of Java for engineering > and scientific programming. > > The problem is not just the keystrokes for typing the expressions. It is > very important to be able to check that a lengthy expression in a > program is a correct translation of the corresponding expression, in > mathematical notation, in a textbook or paper. I perfectly understand that. And implementing basic operators for BigInteger, BigDecimal and Complex in Java would help that group. Or maybe they should switch to Scala. Somehow I think that group would like Scala. Arne
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| From | Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2011-07-22 13:07 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <j0bsn1$uuf$2@localhost.localdomain> |
| In reply to | #6376 |
On Thu, 21 Jul 2011 15:58:44 -0700, Patricia Shanahan wrote: > On 7/21/2011 1:58 PM, Arne Vajhøj wrote: >> But I find it hard to believe to be a significant problem in typical >> business apps. > > I agree. After all, it is no worse than "ADD 1 TO AGREECOUNT GIVING > AGREECOUNT.". > But if its critical that a number doesn't overflow, adding an "ON SIZE ERROR" clause to that sentence will catch arithmetic overflow and also check that the result fits in the receiving field while giving the programmer the ability specify the corrective action. -- martin@ | Martin Gregorie gregorie. | Essex, UK org |
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| From | Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2011-07-22 17:33 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <slrnj2jd39.6gl.avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> |
| In reply to | #6376 |
Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> wrote: > After all, it is no worse than "ADD 1 TO AGREECOUNT GIVING AGREECOUNT.". All Rejoice! There's still a language (like COBOL) that makes simple expressions more verbose. That really should keep us all happy about Java. (NOT!) [about lack of operator overloading for non-primitive arithmetic types] > The problem is not just the keystrokes for typing the expressions. > It is very important to be able to check that a lengthy expression > in a program is a correct translation of the corresponding expression, > in mathematical notation, in a textbook or paper. Lew?
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| From | lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2011-07-22 13:36 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <1f3f067f-1753-4f6b-876d-19f92059d9b8@e20g2000prf.googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #6407 |
On Jul 22, 10:33 am, Andreas Leitgeb <a...@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> wrote: > Patricia Shanahan <p...@acm.org> wrote: > > After all, it is no worse than "ADD 1 TO AGREECOUNT GIVING AGREECOUNT.". > > All Rejoice! There's still a language (like COBOL) that makes simple > expressions more verbose. That really should keep us all happy about > Java. (NOT!) > > [about lack of operator overloading for non-primitive arithmetic types] > > > The problem is not just the keystrokes for typing the expressions. > > It is very important to be able to check that a lengthy expression > > in a program is a correct translation of the corresponding expression, > > in mathematical notation, in a textbook or paper. > > Lew? Yes? -- Lew
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| From | Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2011-07-22 23:16 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <slrnj2k168.6gl.avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> |
| In reply to | #6415 |
lewbloch <lewbloch@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jul 22, 10:33 am, Andreas Leitgeb <a...@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at>
> wrote:
>> Patricia Shanahan <p...@acm.org> wrote:
>> [about lack of operator overloading for non-primitive arithmetic types]
>>> The problem is not just the keystrokes for typing the expressions.
>>> It is very important to be able to check that a lengthy expression
>>> in a program is a correct translation of the corresponding expression,
>>> in mathematical notation, in a textbook or paper.
>> Lew?
> Yes?
So here are arguments (admittedly not mine) that include ("... not just...")
but also go beyond the complaint about the number of keystrokes. I was just
wondering, if you had any expert-opinion about them, that you'd care to share.
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| From | Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2011-07-22 16:50 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <qfadnTTv37FXkbfTnZ2dnUVZ_qWdnZ2d@earthlink.com> |
| In reply to | #6435 |
On 7/22/2011 4:16 PM, Andreas Leitgeb wrote:
> lewbloch<lewbloch@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Jul 22, 10:33 am, Andreas Leitgeb<a...@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at>
>> wrote:
>>> Patricia Shanahan<p...@acm.org> wrote:
>>> [about lack of operator overloading for non-primitive arithmetic types]
>>>> The problem is not just the keystrokes for typing the expressions.
>>>> It is very important to be able to check that a lengthy expression
>>>> in a program is a correct translation of the corresponding expression,
>>>> in mathematical notation, in a textbook or paper.
>>> Lew?
>> Yes?
>
> So here are arguments (admittedly not mine) that include ("... not just...")
> but also go beyond the complaint about the number of keystrokes. I was just
> wondering, if you had any expert-opinion about them, that you'd care to share.
>
Some of the context has been dropped in editing. My remarks were
specific to the complex, in every sense of the word, expressions I've
seen in scientific and engineering programs.
Patricia
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| From | Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2011-07-23 20:09 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <slrnj2mak5.6gl.avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> |
| In reply to | #6438 |
Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> wrote:
> On 7/22/2011 4:16 PM, Andreas Leitgeb wrote:
>> lewbloch<lewbloch@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Jul 22, 10:33 am, Andreas Leitgeb<a...@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at>
>>> wrote:
>>>> Patricia Shanahan<p...@acm.org> wrote:
>>>> [about lack of operator overloading for non-primitive arithmetic types]
>>>>> The problem is not just the keystrokes for typing the expressions.
>>>>> It is very important to be able to check that a lengthy expression
>>>>> in a program is a correct translation of the corresponding expression,
>>>>> in mathematical notation, in a textbook or paper.
>>>> Lew?
>>> Yes?
>> So here are arguments (admittedly not mine) that include ("... not just...")
>> but also go beyond the complaint about the number of keystrokes. I was just
>> wondering, if you had any expert-opinion about them, that you'd care to share.
> Some of the context has been dropped in editing. My remarks were
> specific to the complex, in every sense of the word, expressions I've
> seen in scientific and engineering programs.
You meant only complex expressions on complex numbers? (Is that every sense
of "complex", or did I even miss some more?)
If so, then sorry, I obviously understood your remarks as more general than they
were. It's not my intention to misquote contexts and all that. I apologize
if it happened.
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| From | Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2011-07-24 08:56 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <R7-dnWhMlr4_3bHTnZ2dnUVZ_gWdnZ2d@earthlink.com> |
| In reply to | #6477 |
On 7/23/2011 1:09 PM, Andreas Leitgeb wrote:
> Patricia Shanahan<pats@acm.org> wrote:
>> On 7/22/2011 4:16 PM, Andreas Leitgeb wrote:
>>> lewbloch<lewbloch@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On Jul 22, 10:33 am, Andreas Leitgeb<a...@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> Patricia Shanahan<p...@acm.org> wrote:
>>>>> [about lack of operator overloading for non-primitive arithmetic types]
>>>>>> The problem is not just the keystrokes for typing the expressions.
>>>>>> It is very important to be able to check that a lengthy expression
>>>>>> in a program is a correct translation of the corresponding expression,
>>>>>> in mathematical notation, in a textbook or paper.
>>>>> Lew?
>>>> Yes?
>>> So here are arguments (admittedly not mine) that include ("... not just...")
>>> but also go beyond the complaint about the number of keystrokes. I was just
>>> wondering, if you had any expert-opinion about them, that you'd care to share.
>> Some of the context has been dropped in editing. My remarks were
>> specific to the complex, in every sense of the word, expressions I've
>> seen in scientific and engineering programs.
>
> You meant only complex expressions on complex numbers? (Is that every sense
> of "complex", or did I even miss some more?)
> If so, then sorry, I obviously understood your remarks as more general than they
> were. It's not my intention to misquote contexts and all that. I apologize
> if it happened.
>
No problem. My practical experience of cases in which I think
representing expressions in method calls would be disastrous is
complicated expressions in complex numbers. It seems reasonable to me
that it might also be a problem e.g. for a rational type or for
BigDecimal, but I don't have direct observations to back that up.
Patricia
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