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Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions

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On 11-05-09 10:50 PM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
> In message <92r02mF24dU1@mid.individual.net>, Robert Klemme wrote:
> 
>> That's called an "inline view".
> 
> The only reason there’s a special term for it is because SQL doesn’t treat 
> tables/views as first-class objects.

Using 'object' in 'first-class object' in the abstract sense - as
opposed to the narrower definition of 'object' in OOP - I find it
difficult to see how first-class objects aren't involved in modern SQL.

Leaving aside the fact that we have imperfect relations in most SQL
databases, the issue at hand is not whether tables/views are first-class
objects but whether _relations_ are.

Inline views are actually one example of runtime creation of relations.
We can store relations as tables. And the simple SELECT clause itself,
where tables/subqueries/inline views etc feature as input, and another
relation is produced, exhibits relations as both parameters and return
values.

It's close enough that I'm not losing sleep over it. Of more relevance,
how are _your_ forays into SQL hampered by the supposed fact that
tables/views aren't FCOs?

> This is an example of a situation where a little bit more orthogonality 
> could have made the language much simpler.

There's a statement that could mean just about anything. Which means
that it means nothing, without qualification.

If you mean orthogonality as in this quote taken from Michael Scott:

"Orthogonality means that features can be used in any combination, that
the combinations all make sense, and that the meaning of a given feature
is consistent, regardless of the other features with which it is combined".

then practically no programming language, SQL included, is highly
orthogonal. So there's always room for change. But often the lack of
this kind of orthogonality is because the programming language also has
to be pragmatic.

AHS

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Thread

SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Zapanaz <http://joecosby.com/code/mail.pl@foo.com> - 2011-05-07 16:13 -0700
  Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-08 14:00 +1200
    Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Robert Klemme <shortcutter@googlemail.com> - 2011-05-08 13:08 +0200
      Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-09 00:01 +1200
        Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-05-08 08:08 -0400
  Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-05-08 01:02 -0300
    Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Robert Klemme <shortcutter@googlemail.com> - 2011-05-08 13:03 +0200
      Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-05-08 11:14 -0300
        Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Robert Klemme <shortcutter@googlemail.com> - 2011-05-08 23:37 +0200
    Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Zapanaz <http://joecosby.com/code/mail.pl@foo.com> - 2011-05-08 16:06 -0700
      Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Robert Klemme <shortcutter@googlemail.com> - 2011-05-09 22:10 +0200
        Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-10 13:50 +1200
          Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Robert Klemme <shortcutter@googlemail.com> - 2011-05-10 00:06 -0700
            Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-13 22:55 +1200
              Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Robert Klemme <shortcutter@googlemail.com> - 2011-05-15 18:52 +0200
          Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-05-10 06:35 -0300
            Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-13 22:57 +1200
              Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-05-13 07:45 -0400
              Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-05-15 13:09 -0300
                Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Robert Klemme <shortcutter@googlemail.com> - 2011-05-15 18:56 +0200
  Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2011-05-07 23:32 -0700
    Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2011-05-07 23:36 -0700
      Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@geek-central.gen.new_zealand> - 2011-05-08 20:43 +1200
        Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Robert Klemme <shortcutter@googlemail.com> - 2011-05-09 01:27 -0700
  Re: SQL Puzzle - too many dimensions Lew <noone@lewscanon.com> - 2011-05-08 07:45 -0400

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