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Bundle JDK in my app

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  Bundle JDK in my app Iony <a.sfolcini@gmail.com> - 2013-03-13 05:13 -0700
    Re: Bundle JDK in my app markspace <markspace@nospam.nospam> - 2013-03-13 09:25 -0700
      Re: Bundle JDK in my app Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2013-03-13 11:34 -0700
        Re: Bundle JDK in my app Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2013-03-13 14:11 -0700
          Re: Bundle JDK in my app Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2013-03-14 08:26 -0700
            Re: Bundle JDK in my app Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2013-03-14 13:59 -0700
              Re: Bundle JDK in my app Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2013-03-17 11:02 -0700
      Re: Bundle JDK in my app Yoni <a.sfolcini@gmail.com> - 2013-03-14 01:48 -0700
        Re: Bundle JDK in my app "John B. Matthews" <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2013-03-14 07:12 -0400
          Re: Bundle JDK in my app Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2013-03-14 08:28 -0700
      Re: Bundle JDK in my app Nigel Wade <nmw@ion.le.ac.uk> - 2013-03-14 16:42 +0000
        Re: Bundle JDK in my app Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2013-03-15 17:24 -0700
          Re: Bundle JDK in my app Nigel Wade <nmw@ion.le.ac.uk> - 2013-03-18 09:15 +0000
    Re: Bundle JDK in my app Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2013-03-13 11:20 -0700
      Re: Bundle JDK in my app Yoni <a.sfolcini@gmail.com> - 2013-03-14 01:44 -0700
        Re: Bundle JDK in my app Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2013-03-14 08:24 -0700
        Re: Bundle JDK in my app markspace <markspace@nospam.nospam> - 2013-03-14 09:31 -0700
          Re: Bundle JDK in my app Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2013-03-14 17:00 -0700
    Re: Bundle JDK in my app Nigel Wade <nmw@ion.le.ac.uk> - 2013-03-14 09:30 +0000
    Re: Bundle JDK in my app Knute Johnson <nospam@knutejohnson.com> - 2013-03-14 10:20 -0700
      Re: Bundle JDK in my app Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2013-03-14 17:01 -0700
        Re: Bundle JDK in my app Joerg Meier <joergmmeier@arcor.de> - 2013-03-15 03:04 +0100

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#2575 — Bundle JDK in my app

Hello, 

Is it possible to bundle the full JDK7 (not JRE) in my application ?
Should I include the full JDK or am I allow to include only binaries in order to reduce the size ?

thank you

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#2576

On 3/13/2013 5:13 AM, Iony wrote:
> Hello,
>
> Is it possible to bundle the full JDK7 (not JRE) in my application ?

I'm honestly not sure what you mean by bundle here.  Care to elaborate?

> Should I include the full JDK or am I allow to include only binaries

Again I don't understand "allow" here, but you should certainly only 
include those components you actually need.  Why do otherwise?

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#2578

On Wed, 13 Mar 2013 09:25:07 -0700, markspace
<markspace@nospam.nospam> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone
who said :

>I'm honestly not sure what you mean by bundle here.  Care to elaborate?
 
bundle just means wrap pieces into a single download.
-- 
Roedy Green Canadian Mind Products http://mindprod.com
Software gets slower faster than hardware gets faster. 
 ~ Niklaus Wirth (born: 1934-02-15 age: 79) Wirth's Law

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#2579

Roedy Green wrote:
> markspace wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who said :
>> I'm honestly not sure what you mean by bundle here.  Care to elaborate?
> 
> bundle just means wrap pieces into a single download.

Was that what the OP meant?

Do you believe them incapable of speaking for themselves?

-- 
Lew

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#2585

On Wed, 13 Mar 2013 14:11:18 -0700 (PDT), Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com>
wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who said :

>
>Was that what the OP meant?

The usual meaning is relevant information whether no matter whan OP
intended.


>Do you believe them incapable of speaking for themselves?

I did nothing to block anyone from speaking.  You looking for excuses
to find fault.  You are like some character in a fairy tale.

-- 
Roedy Green Canadian Mind Products http://mindprod.com
Software gets slower faster than hardware gets faster. 
 ~ Niklaus Wirth (born: 1934-02-15 age: 79) Wirth's Law

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#2590

Roedy Green wrote:
> Lew wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who said :

>> Was that what the OP meant?
> 
> The usual meaning is relevant information whether no matter whan OP
> intended.

But it wasn't the OP's question you were answering.

>markspace wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who said : 
>> I'm honestly not sure what you mean by bundle here.  Care to elaborate? 

It was a request specifically for the OP's intent.

So in fact your answer was useless.

>> Do you believe them incapable of speaking for themselves?
> 
> I did nothing to block anyone from speaking. 

You did nothing to help the person who asked the question.

> You looking for excuses to find fault.  

You're looking for excuses to justify yourself and avoid responsibility.

>You are like some character in a fairy tale.

Prince Charming.

Thank you for the compliment.

-- 
Lew

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#2600

On Thu, 14 Mar 2013 13:59:05 -0700 (PDT), Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com>
wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who said :

>You did nothing to help the person who asked the question.

So what. This is not a help desk. We are talking to a much larger
audience.  All O.P. does is provide some fodder for discussion.
My model is more like a Q&A session at the PC User club. You don't
just answer the question.  Otherwise you audience falls asleep at the
irrelevancy to them. You provide background so everyone can understand
the question. You answer related question that may be of more general
interest. You use it as an excuse to explain the general area.

Do you really in think larding every response with an insult "helps"
people?  No. It just discourages them.  You have probably turned more
people off computer science than any other human.
-- 
Roedy Green Canadian Mind Products http://mindprod.com
The computer programmer is a creator of universes for which he alone
is the lawgiver. No playwright, no stage director, no emperor, however
powerful, has ever exercised such absolute authority to arrange a stage
or a field of battle and to command such unswervingly dutiful actors or
troops. 
 ~ Joseph Weizenbaum (born: 1923-01-08 died: 2008-03-05 at age: 85)

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#2581

> I'm honestly not sure what you mean by bundle here.  Care to elaborate?

I want to create a single package that contains JDK + libraries + my app.
The user download it and install it without have to care about JDK, external libraris etc... 
The only thing that the user has to do is "download and click".

Thank you

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#2583

In article <ff504030-dc80-4bb2-88fb-1feb5b1e9c3d@googlegroups.com>,
 Yoni <a.sfolcini@gmail.com> wrote:

> I want to create a single package that contains JDK + libraries + my 
> app. The user download it and install it without have to care about 
> JDK, external libraris etc... The only thing that the user has to do 
> is "download and click".

"Java Web Start software automatically downloads and installs the 
correct version of the Java platform as necessary based on the 
application's needs and the user's environment."

<http://docs.oracle.com/javase/tutorial/deployment/webstart/index.html>

-- 
John B. Matthews
trashgod at gmail dot com
<http://sites.google.com/site/drjohnbmatthews>

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#2586

On Thu, 14 Mar 2013 07:12:04 -0400, "John B. Matthews"
<nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who
said :

>"Java Web Start software automatically downloads and installs the 
>correct version of the Java platform as necessary based on the 
>application's needs and the user's environment."
>
><http://docs.oracle.com/javase/tutorial/deployment/webstart/index.html>

if you don't need javac.exe, this is by far the easiest approach. You
can think of JWS as a built in installer and updater.
-- 
Roedy Green Canadian Mind Products http://mindprod.com
Software gets slower faster than hardware gets faster. 
 ~ Niklaus Wirth (born: 1934-02-15 age: 79) Wirth's Law

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#2588

On 13/03/13 16:25, markspace wrote:
> On 3/13/2013 5:13 AM, Iony wrote:
>> Hello,
>>
>> Is it possible to bundle the full JDK7 (not JRE) in my application ?
>
> I'm honestly not sure what you mean by bundle here.  Care to elaborate?
>
>> Should I include the full JDK or am I allow to include only binaries
>
> Again I don't understand "allow" here, but you should certainly only include those components you actually need.  Why do
> otherwise?
>
>

Because the license terms for the Oracle JDK restrict what you are allowed to redistribute.

-- 
Nigel Wade

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#2595

On Thu, 14 Mar 2013 16:42:10 +0000, Nigel Wade <nmw@ion.le.ac.uk>
wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who said :

>
>Because the license terms for the Oracle JDK restrict what you are allowed to redistribute.

 One of the advantages of distributing an installer that goes and gets
the JVM is you bypass any restrictions on what you can bundle.  All
you are doing is an assisted install.  It also ensures you don't
pollute the universe with obsolete JVMs.

-- 
Roedy Green Canadian Mind Products http://mindprod.com
The computer programmer is a creator of universes for which he alone
is the lawgiver. No playwright, no stage director, no emperor, however
powerful, has ever exercised such absolute authority to arrange a stage
or a field of battle and to command such unswervingly dutiful actors or
troops. 
 ~ Joseph Weizenbaum (born: 1923-01-08 died: 2008-03-05 at age: 85)

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#2604

On 16/03/13 00:24, Roedy Green wrote:
> On Thu, 14 Mar 2013 16:42:10 +0000, Nigel Wade <nmw@ion.le.ac.uk>
> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who said :
>
>>
>> Because the license terms for the Oracle JDK restrict what you are allowed to redistribute.
>
>   One of the advantages of distributing an installer that goes and gets
> the JVM is you bypass any restrictions on what you can bundle.  All
> you are doing is an assisted install.  It also ensures you don't
> pollute the universe with obsolete JVMs.
>

If you bothered to read the thread you'd have known that the issue is components of the JDK, not the JVM. If you'd even 
read my post properly you should have realized that.

JDK != JVM

and has different re-distribution rights.

-- 
Nigel Wade

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#2577

On Wed, 13 Mar 2013 05:13:28 -0700 (PDT), Iony <a.sfolcini@gmail.com>
wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who said :

>Is it possible to bundle the full JDK7 (not JRE) in my application ?
>Should I include the full JDK or am I allow to include only binaries in order to reduce the size ?

You might distribute an installer than downloads and installs the JRE
if it is not already installed.  There would be no reason to bundle
the JDK. You only need that if you are a developer, and you would not
want anyone installing a JDK on you.

see http://mindprod.com/jgloss/jdk.html
http://mindprod.com/jgloss/jre.html

Also see JET
http://mindprod.com/jgloss/jet.html

It can bundle just the machine code equivalent of the parts of the JRE
you use.
-- 
Roedy Green Canadian Mind Products http://mindprod.com
Software gets slower faster than hardware gets faster. 
 ~ Niklaus Wirth (born: 1934-02-15 age: 79) Wirth's Law

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#2580

On Wednesday, March 13, 2013 7:20:15 PM UTC+1, Roedy Green wrote:
> You might distribute an installer than downloads and installs the JRE
> if it is not already installed.  There would be no reason to bundle
> the JDK. You only need that if you are a developer, and you would not

Hello Roedy,

Thank you for your answer.
Actually my application permits to create some java code and compile it, to compile I need JDK not JRE, this is the reason I would like to bundle it.

thank you

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#2584

On Thu, 14 Mar 2013 01:44:21 -0700 (PDT), Yoni <a.sfolcini@gmail.com>
wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who said :

>Actually my application permits to create some java code and compile it, to compile I need JDK not JRE, this is the reason I would like to bundle it.

I trust you are aware of http://mindprod.com/jgloss/javacompiler.html

You must be careful about installing a JDK.  Make sure you have the
user's informed consent. It is big.  It needs go to the drive when he
wants it. You should be installing the latest.  You should not be
downloading or installing if it is already there.  It has some user
interaction.  I have heard of "silent" installs but I have no
experience with them.

My preference would be to decide if my current JDK was acceptable. If
not, ask me permission to upgrade/install.  Download, exec, hand over
control to me to run the JDK install. When done ask me if it worked
and check yourself if it worked by checking for the presence of key
files and some registry entries. Then carry on with the rest of the
install.

See http://mindprod.com/jgloss/installer.html
-- 
Roedy Green Canadian Mind Products http://mindprod.com
Software gets slower faster than hardware gets faster. 
 ~ Niklaus Wirth (born: 1934-02-15 age: 79) Wirth's Law

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#2587

On 3/14/2013 1:44 AM, Yoni wrote:

> Thank you for your answer. Actually my application permits to create
> some java code and compile it, to compile I need JDK not JRE, this is
> the reason I would like to bundle it.


Have you looked at the compiler API?  That requires the tools.jar in 
your classpath;  much easier I think than trying to install the JDK.

<http://docs.oracle.com/javase/7/docs/api/javax/tools/JavaCompiler.html>

<http://stackoverflow.com/questions/5600213/using-java-compiler-api-without-requiring-install-of-jdk>

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#2591

On Thu, 14 Mar 2013 09:31:20 -0700, markspace
<markspace@nospam.nospam> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone
who said :

>Have you looked at the compiler API?  That requires the tools.jar in 
>your classpath;  much easier I think than trying to install the JDK.

Tools.jar is part of the JRE automatically.  One easy way to
effectively put it on the classpath is to put a copy in the ext dir.

I am quite astounded to learn that API just requires the JRE. I would
have thought it needed javac.exe.
-- 
Roedy Green Canadian Mind Products http://mindprod.com
The computer programmer is a creator of universes for which he alone
is the lawgiver. No playwright, no stage director, no emperor, however
powerful, has ever exercised such absolute authority to arrange a stage
or a field of battle and to command such unswervingly dutiful actors or
troops. 
 ~ Joseph Weizenbaum (born: 1923-01-08 died: 2008-03-05 at age: 85)

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#2582

On 13/03/13 12:13, Iony wrote:
> Hello,
>
> Is it possible to bundle the full JDK7 (not JRE) in my application ?

You should abide by the conditions set out in the license for the JDK.

> Should I include the full JDK or am I allow to include only binaries in order to reduce the size ?
>

The terms for the Oracle JDK are here:

http://www.oracle.com/technetwork/java/javase/readme-142177.html#redistribution

The license terms for other JDK will probably be different. I expect OpenJDK will be more "open".

-- 
Nigel Wade

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#2589

On 3/13/2013 5:13 AM, Iony wrote:
> Hello,
>
> Is it possible to bundle the full JDK7 (not JRE) in my application ?
> Should I include the full JDK or am I allow to include only binaries in order to reduce the size ?
>
> thank you
>

Just read the license agreement:

C. LICENSE TO DISTRIBUTE SOFTWARE. Subject to the terms and conditions 
of this Agreement and restrictions and exceptions set forth in the 
README File, including, but not limited to the Java Technology 
Restrictions and Limitations on Redistribution of these Supplemental 
Terms, Oracle grants you a non-exclusive, non-transferable, limited 
license without fees to reproduce and distribute the Software, provided 
that (i) you distribute the Software complete and unmodified and only 
bundled as part of, and for the sole purpose of running, your Programs, 
(ii) the Programs add significant and primary functionality to the 
Software, (iii) you do not distribute additional software intended to 
replace any component(s) of the Software, (iv) you do not remove or 
alter any proprietary legends or notices contained in the Software, (v) 
you only distribute the Software subject to a license agreement that: 
(a) is a complete, unmodified reproduction of this Agreement; or (b) 
protects Oracle's interests consistent with the terms contained in this 
Agreement and that includes the notice set forth in Section H, and (vi) 
you agree to defend and indemnify Oracle and its licensors from and 
against any damages, costs, liabilities, settlement amounts and/or 
expenses (including attorneys' fees) incurred in connection with any 
claim, lawsuit or action by any third party that arises or results from 
the use or distribution of any and all Programs and/or Software. The 
license set forth in this Section C does not extend to the Software 
identified in Section G.

-- 

Knute Johnson

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