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Groups > comp.lang.forth > #12458
| Date | 2012-05-25 10:05 -1000 |
|---|---|
| From | "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> |
| Organization | FORTH, Inc. |
| Newsgroups | comp.lang.forth |
| Subject | Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. |
| References | (1 earlier) <if-dnfnhuZ63EiHSnZ2dnUVZ_hmdnZ2d@supernews.com> <9dOdnS-FfKqwlyLSnZ2dnUVZ_r-dnZ2d@supernews.com> <jpndsd$jhj$1@speranza.aioe.org> <Wu-dnalYGvM9XiLSnZ2dnUVZ_radnZ2d@supernews.com> <jpolqg$t03$1@speranza.aioe.org> |
| Message-ID | <mLednTYtI8m0eyLSnZ2dnUVZ_qmdnZ2d@supernews.com> (permalink) |
On 5/25/12 9:17 AM, Rod Pemberton wrote: > "Elizabeth D. Rather"<erather@forth.com> wrote in message > news:Wu-dnalYGvM9XiLSnZ2dnUVZ_radnZ2d@supernews.com... ... >>> >>> Firstly, in my original post, DUP>R was two words: >>> >>> DUP<space> >R >>> >>> It seems you or your newsreader software removed a space (?) ... >>> (That's not important to me, but you might check.) >> >> Dunno. I use Thunderbird, which has never been known to alter spacing. >> > > Well, it did it again above. I suspect what's going on is a difference between html and text. I use text only for these emails, and if you're working in a browser you're doing html. Anyway, not important. ... >>> It just seems that Forth inserts words or operations directly >>> into the middle of various common sequences. >> >> ??? News to me! >> What version of Forth are you accusing of doing this? >> > > That would be most of everything I attempt to code in my Forth ... :) No, > it's not that bad. The issue of wrappers to come up every now and then. > The less specific issue of repeated sequence seems to comes up more > frequently. Is OVER + SWAP in loop words common enough to define another > word for it? Anyone for O+S ? The sequence OVER + SWAP is often defined as the word BOUNDS. Tastes vary as to whether this improves or impedes readability. A good clue as to whether a sequence is worth naming is whether it makes logical sense that could be captured in an English name, as opposed to some functional jargon such as O+S. This one is marginal :-) >>> So, I'm wanting to create "wrappers" for everything at >>> this point, i.e., a word before and a word after. Or, I'm wanting to >>> create a single word that inserts the difference, e.g., passed an XT >>> and using EXECUTE. I've not tried that yet. It shouldn't be too >>> difficult. I wouldn't know if it was ANS compliant... Although, >>> perhaps more "generic," I can "see" that definition becoming a bit >>> larger ... >> >> Why would you want to do any of these things? >> > > It seems ... useful? Well, looking at the code you originally posted (putting the spaces back in): : AND! ( x addr -- ) DUP >R @ AND R> ! ; \ C's&= : OR! ( x addr -- ) DUP >R @ OR R> ! ; \ C's |= : XOR! ( x addr -- ) DUP >R @ XOR R> ! ; \ C's ^= : +! ( x addr -- ) DUP >R @ + R> ! ; \ C's += : -! ( x addr -- ) DUP >R @ - R> ! ; \ C's -= : *! ( x addr -- ) DUP >R @ * R> ! ; \ C's *= : /! ( x addr -- ) SWAP OVER @ SWAP / SWAP ! ; \ C's /= : MOD! ( x addr -- ) SWAP OVER @ SWAP MOD SWAP ! \ C's %= : LSHIFT! ( x addr -- ) SWAP OVER @ SWAP LSHIFT SWAP ! ; \ C's<<= : RSHIFT! ( x addr -- ) SWAP OVER @ SWAP RSHIFT SWAP ! ; \ C's>>= ...I do see a lot of what you're calling "wrappers". But I'm disagreeing with the style of programming that would use *any* of these words, with the exception of +! (which is normally defined as a code sequence, both shorter and simpler than the high-level mess above). >> This sounds like a lot of unnecessary machinery, to me. It's as though >> you are wanting to take Forth, which is a very simple language, and make >> it as complicated as others you're more familiar with. > > Ok. If you want to program in C, that's fine. If you want to program in Forth, you should accept that Forth is a very different language from C, both in ideomatic style and in economics (what's efficient both for the programmer and for runtime). Trying to make equivalences to functions you're accustomed to in C and then using them to write programs will lead to code which is tortuously inefficient to run and very much more difficult to maintain. Cheers, Elizabeth -- ================================================== Elizabeth D. Rather (US & Canada) 800-55-FORTH FORTH Inc. +1 310.999.6784 5959 West Century Blvd. Suite 700 Los Angeles, CA 90045 http://www.forth.com "Forth-based products and Services for real-time applications since 1973." ==================================================
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Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailntt.cmm> - 2012-05-22 16:01 -0400
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. Mark Wills <markrobertwills@yahoo.co.uk> - 2012-05-22 14:58 -0700
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. "Ed" <invalid@nospam.com> - 2012-05-23 13:19 +1000
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-22 23:44 -0700
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. Nomen Nescio <nobody@dizum.com> - 2012-05-23 12:30 +0200
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-23 08:37 -0700
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-23 23:32 -0700
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2012-05-24 13:24 +0000
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-24 09:40 -0700
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2012-05-24 20:52 +0000
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-24 14:17 -0700
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2012-05-25 08:10 +0000
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-25 01:50 -0700
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. Fritz Wuehler <fritz@spamexpire-201205.rodent.frell.theremailer.net> - 2012-05-25 22:39 +0200
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2012-05-26 22:02 -0700
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. Nomen Nescio <nobody@dizum.com> - 2012-05-25 14:33 +0200
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2012-05-25 16:50 +0000
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2012-05-25 20:30 +0000
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. hwfwguy@gmail.com - 2012-05-30 11:23 -0700
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. "Peter Knaggs" <pjk@bcs.org.uk> - 2012-05-29 20:00 +0100
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailntt.cmm> - 2012-05-24 07:39 -0400
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2012-05-24 15:37 +0000
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-05-22 21:18 -1000
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-05-24 18:27 -1000
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailntt.cmm> - 2012-05-25 03:55 -0400
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-05-25 07:38 -1000
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailntt.cmm> - 2012-05-25 15:17 -0400
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-05-25 10:05 -1000
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailntt.cmm> - 2012-05-26 08:02 -0400
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. Coos Haak <chforth@hccnet.nl> - 2012-05-26 14:31 +0200
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. Doug Hoffman <glidedog@gmail.com> - 2012-05-26 09:55 -0400
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. BruceMcF <agila61@netscape.net> - 2012-05-26 07:04 -0700
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-05-26 09:41 -1000
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailntt.cmm> - 2012-05-26 19:52 -0400
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-05-26 19:49 -1000
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. "Ed" <invalid@nospam.com> - 2012-06-01 13:39 +1000
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-05-31 19:27 -1000
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailntt.cmm> - 2012-06-01 18:24 -0400
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-06-02 03:09 -0500
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2012-05-27 02:23 -0500
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. "Harry Vaderchi" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2012-05-27 11:54 +0100
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2012-05-27 07:25 -1000
Re: Use of VARIABLEs frequent or infrequent? And, C style operators. Alex McDonald <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2012-05-27 11:13 -0700
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