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Groups > comp.lang.c > #384794 > unrolled thread

C23 thoughts and opinions

Started byDavid Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no>
First post2024-05-22 18:55 +0200
Last post2024-05-25 16:05 -0500
Articles 20 on this page of 542 — 23 participants

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Contents

  C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-22 18:55 +0200
    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2024-05-22 14:42 -0300
      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-22 22:11 +0200
        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2024-05-22 17:26 -0300
          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-23 14:17 +0200
            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2024-05-23 09:38 -0300
              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-05-23 17:08 +0000
                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2024-05-23 16:06 -0300
              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-23 15:11 +0200
                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2024-05-23 13:21 -0300
                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-23 14:49 -0700
                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-24 11:03 +0200
                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2024-05-24 14:17 -0300
                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-24 12:45 -0700
                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2024-05-24 17:06 -0300
                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-24 13:19 -0700
                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2024-05-24 21:27 -0300
                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-24 17:46 -0700
                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2024-05-25 08:33 -0300
                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-25 16:51 +0200
                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-25 16:34 -0700
                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-25 13:05 +0200
                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2024-05-25 08:19 -0300
                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-25 17:14 +0200
                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-26 02:09 +0100
                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2024-06-06 15:01 -0300
        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-22 15:53 -0700
          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2024-05-22 22:21 -0300
            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-23 13:11 +0100
              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-23 09:43 -0700
                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-24 16:19 +0200
              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-23 15:25 +0200
                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-23 13:06 -0700
                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-24 15:45 +0200
                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-24 18:29 -0700
                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-25 13:11 +0200
                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-25 15:58 -0700
                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-26 13:09 +0200
                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-26 12:51 +0100
                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-26 16:18 +0300
                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-26 16:25 +0100
                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-26 19:35 +0300
                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-26 19:01 +0100
                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-26 23:26 +0300
                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-26 22:27 +0100
                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-05-26 19:19 +0100
                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-26 23:06 +0300
                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-05-27 00:49 +0000
                                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-05-26 19:54 -0700
                                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-27 11:10 +0200
                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-26 23:59 +0300
                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-26 22:52 +0100
                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-26 16:20 -0700
                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-05-27 00:48 +0000
                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-27 11:05 +0300
                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2024-05-26 10:12 -0300
                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-26 16:17 -0700
                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-27 13:42 +0200
                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-27 17:33 -0700
                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-28 13:52 +0200
                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-28 13:21 -0700
                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-28 23:37 +0300
                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-29 10:02 +0200
                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-06-14 14:30 -0700
                                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-14 23:39 +0100
                                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-15 19:17 +0200
                                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-15 20:27 +0100
                                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-15 22:39 +0000
                                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-16 00:20 +0100
                                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-16 01:16 +0000
                                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-06-16 12:31 -0700
                                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-17 00:03 +0000
                                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-16 16:54 +0200
                                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-16 20:00 +0100
                                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-17 10:49 +0200
                                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-17 13:18 +0300
                                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-15 17:58 +0200
                                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-15 22:37 +0000
                                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-16 16:55 +0200
                                        Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-06-16 16:48 -0700
                                          Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-17 11:42 +0200
                                            Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-06-17 17:19 -0700
                                              Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-18 04:19 +0000
                                                Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-06-17 22:39 -0700
                                              Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-18 15:54 +0200
                                                Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-06-18 15:00 -0700
                                                  Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-19 09:37 +0200
                                                    Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2024-06-19 10:17 +0000
                                                      Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-19 13:44 +0300
                                                        Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-19 11:57 +0100
                                                        Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-06-19 13:46 +0000
                                                          Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-19 18:02 +0300
                                                Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-19 07:25 +0000
                                                  Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-19 10:49 +0200
                                                    Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-21 07:13 +0000
                                                      Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-21 13:06 +0200
                                                        Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-21 22:48 +0000
                                                          Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-22 13:40 +0200
                                                      Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2024-06-21 10:15 -0400
                                                  Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-06-19 02:32 -0700
                                            Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-18 04:19 +0000
                                          Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2024-06-17 11:41 +0100
                                            Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2024-06-17 14:57 +0100
                                            Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-06-17 18:57 -0700
                                              Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-18 08:12 +0000
                                              Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2024-06-18 16:14 +0100
                                          Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-17 14:21 +0100
                                            Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-06-17 19:20 -0700
                                            Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-06-17 22:39 -0700
                                              Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-18 12:39 +0300
                                                Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-18 11:28 +0100
                                                  Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-06-18 11:12 -0700
                                                Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-18 17:20 +0200
                                                Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-06-18 11:04 -0700
                                                Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-20 06:51 +0000
                                            Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2024-06-18 09:50 +0000
                                              Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-06-18 13:56 +0000
                                                Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-18 17:21 +0200
                                                  Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Richard Harnden <richard.nospam@gmail.invalid> - 2024-06-18 19:25 +0100
                                                    Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Richard Harnden <richard.nospam@gmail.invalid> - 2024-06-18 19:38 +0100
                                                    Re: Hex string literals (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-21 22:49 +0000
                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-05-28 00:20 +0000
                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-27 17:59 -0700
                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-05-28 15:42 +0000
                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-28 13:44 -0700
                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-05-28 05:36 +0100
                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-05-28 15:53 +0000
                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-05-27 00:44 +0000
                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-27 01:55 +0100
                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-05-27 02:48 +0000
                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-27 14:03 +0100
                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-05-28 02:45 +0000
                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-28 11:30 +0100
                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-05-29 04:17 +0000
                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-05-29 06:00 +0100
                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2024-05-29 13:58 +0200
                                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-05-29 17:20 +0100
                                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-05-30 02:32 +0000
                                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-30 11:09 +0300
                                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-30 13:43 +0200
                                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-01 01:45 +0000
                                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-30 14:34 +0100
                                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-30 17:08 +0300
                                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-30 15:48 +0100
                                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-30 18:03 +0300
                                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-31 13:55 +0100
                                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-31 16:19 +0300
                                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-31 16:28 +0300
                                                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-31 16:48 +0300
                                                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-31 15:04 +0100
                                                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-31 17:34 +0300
                                                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-31 19:03 +0100
                                                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-05-31 18:36 +0000
                                                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-31 22:15 +0100
                                                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-06-01 01:25 +0000
                                                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-01 11:24 +0100
                                                                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-06-01 05:17 -0700
                                                                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-06-01 15:08 +0000
                                                                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-06-01 17:22 -0700
                                                                              objcopy -I binary etc... Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-06 14:56 +0300
                                                                                Re: objcopy -I binary etc... Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-06-06 07:44 -0700
                                                                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-01 22:51 +0300
                                                                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-01 15:24 +0200
                                                                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-01 19:59 +0100
                                                                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-04 04:00 +0000
                                                                        Re: Correct objcopy Usage (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions) Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-04 04:33 +0000
                                                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions jak <nospam@please.ty> - 2024-06-01 03:37 +0200
                                                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-01 11:09 +0100
                                                                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions jak <nospam@please.ty> - 2024-06-01 13:59 +0200
                                                                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-06-01 17:26 -0700
                                                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-02 01:11 +0300
                                                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-02 00:39 +0100
                                                                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-02 03:06 +0300
                                                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-06 14:43 +0300
                                                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions jak <nospam@please.ty> - 2024-05-31 21:42 +0200
                                                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-05-31 21:11 +0000
                                                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions BGB-Alt <bohannonindustriesllc@gmail.com> - 2024-06-06 15:38 -0500
                                                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-06-06 21:38 +0000
                                                                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2024-06-07 00:51 -0500
                                                                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-07 09:04 +0000
                                                                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2024-06-07 10:20 -0500
                                                                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2024-06-07 10:22 -0500
                                                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-07 00:53 +0000
                                                                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions BGB-Alt <bohannonindustriesllc@gmail.com> - 2024-06-07 16:58 -0500
                                                                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-08 03:08 +0000
                                                                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2024-06-08 00:04 -0500
                                                                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-08 08:27 +0000
                                                                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2024-06-13 14:14 +0200
                                                                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2024-06-13 14:07 -0500
                                                                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2024-06-14 08:53 +0200
                                                                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2024-06-14 03:13 -0500
                                                                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2024-06-14 10:26 +0200
                                                                                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2024-06-14 03:38 -0500
                                                                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-15 22:42 +0000
                                                                                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2024-06-15 20:42 -0500
                                                                                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-16 03:15 +0000
                                                                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-06-08 13:09 +0000
                                                                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-09 00:46 +0000
                                                                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-09 11:19 +0300
                                                                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-06-08 19:28 +0100
                                                                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2024-06-08 14:52 -0500
                                                                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-09 12:40 +0300
                                                                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-09 11:20 +0100
                                                                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-09 14:12 +0300
                                                                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-09 14:44 +0300
                                                                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-09 17:32 +0100
                                                                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-09 20:00 +0300
                                                                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-09 21:06 +0100
                                                                                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-09 23:40 +0300
                                                                                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-09 22:49 +0100
                                                                                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-10 01:06 +0300
                                                                                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-10 01:26 +0100
                                                                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-11 08:33 +0000
                                                                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2024-06-09 21:12 -0500
                                                                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-09 00:45 +0000
                                                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-31 22:17 +0100
                                                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-01 21:11 +0300
                                                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-06-01 17:47 -0700
                                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-31 15:03 +0100
                                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2024-05-31 15:34 +0000
                                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-05-31 20:31 +0100
                                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-06-01 01:53 +0100
                                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-01 11:53 +0100
                                                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-06-01 16:51 +0100
                                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-31 09:24 +0200
                                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-31 13:39 +0300
                                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-31 13:31 +0200
                                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-30 17:51 +0300
                                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-01 01:39 +0000
                                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-01 11:37 +0100
                                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-02 03:27 +0000
                                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-02 10:37 +0100
                                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-03 01:16 +0000
                                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-03 11:16 +0300
                                                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-04 02:10 +0000
                                                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-04 12:28 +0100
                                                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-05 01:51 +0000
                                                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-06-04 19:45 -0700
                                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-03 11:13 +0100
                                                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-04 02:12 +0000
                                                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-04 12:35 +0100
                                                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-05 01:50 +0000
                                                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-05 09:10 +0100
                                                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2024-06-05 09:23 -0300
                                                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-05 15:09 +0200
                                                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-06 02:12 +0000
                                                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-06 19:38 +0100
                                                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-07 00:55 +0000
                                                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-07 22:23 +0100
                                                                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2024-06-08 00:39 +0000
                                                                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-08 02:14 +0100
                                                                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2024-06-08 03:55 +0000
                                                                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-08 11:14 +0100
                                                                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-06-07 22:36 -0700
                          xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-28 14:41 +0300
                            Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-28 15:06 +0100
                              Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-28 17:42 +0200
                              Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-28 18:56 +0300
                                Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-28 18:14 +0200
                                  Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-28 19:20 +0300
                                Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-28 19:57 +0100
                                  Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-28 23:23 +0300
                                    Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-29 00:45 +0300
                                      Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-29 01:29 +0100
                                        Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-29 09:21 +0300
                                          Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-29 12:44 +0300
                                    Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-28 23:08 +0100
                                      Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-29 01:24 +0300
                                        Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-05-30 02:35 +0000
                                        Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2024-05-30 00:40 -0400
                                          Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-30 10:40 +0300
                                            Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2024-05-30 14:04 -0400
                                              Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-30 22:31 +0300
                                                Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2024-05-31 15:20 -0400
                                              Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-05-30 19:47 +0000
                                          Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-03 03:15 +0000
                                            Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-03 08:57 +0200
                                              Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-03 07:59 +0000
                                            Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-03 11:02 +0300
                                              Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2024-06-03 14:41 -0400
                                              Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-04 02:07 +0000
                                        Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-30 14:41 +0300
                                    Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-29 00:54 +0100
                                      Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-29 10:32 +0200
                                        Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-29 13:08 +0300
                                          Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-29 14:10 +0200
                                            Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-29 15:27 +0300
                                              Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-29 15:19 +0200
                                            Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2024-05-29 14:38 +0200
                                              Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-29 15:43 +0300
                                                Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2024-05-29 14:57 +0200
                                              Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-03 07:54 +0000
                                            Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-05-29 17:27 +0100
                                              Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-29 19:27 +0200
                                              Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2024-05-29 14:07 -0400
                                                Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-29 22:59 +0300
                                                  Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-05-29 22:46 +0100
                                                    Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-30 01:18 +0100
                                                      Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-05-30 02:31 +0100
                                                        Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-30 12:23 +0100
                                                          Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2024-05-30 14:40 +0200
                                                            Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-05-30 14:21 -0700
                                                          Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-05-30 16:41 +0100
                                                          Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-03 08:31 +0000
                                                      Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2024-05-30 00:06 -0400
                                                      Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-30 13:31 +0200
                                                        Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-30 15:15 +0300
                                                          Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-30 16:09 +0200
                                                            Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-03 08:29 +0000
                                                        Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-05-30 16:50 +0100
                                                          Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Lew Pitcher <lew.pitcher@digitalfreehold.ca> - 2024-05-30 16:00 +0000
                                                            Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-05-30 18:28 +0100
                                                    Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-03 03:10 +0000
                                                  Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-30 10:01 +0200
                                                    Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-30 11:33 +0300
                                                      Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-30 12:13 +0100
                                                        Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-30 14:14 +0200
                                                          Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-03 07:51 +0000
                                                    Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-03 03:12 +0000
                                                      Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-03 10:57 +0300
                                      Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-29 12:38 +0300
                                        Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-29 12:23 +0100
                                          Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-29 15:23 +0300
                                            Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-29 15:16 +0100
                                              Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-29 18:32 +0300
                                                Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-29 18:41 +0100
                                                  Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-29 21:31 +0100
                                                    Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-03 07:49 +0000
                                                      Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-03 13:01 +0300
                                    Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-29 10:18 +0200
                            Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-28 17:34 +0200
                              Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-29 22:08 +0100
                                Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-30 15:05 +0200
                                  Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2024-05-30 14:20 -0400
                                    Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-05-30 12:27 -0700
                                    Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-31 09:55 +0200
                                      Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-31 13:45 +0300
                                        Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-31 13:33 +0200
                                      Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-02 04:19 +0000
                                        Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-02 13:40 +0200
                                    Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-02 04:16 +0000
                            Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2024-06-03 18:39 +0200
                              Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-04 02:07 +0000
                                Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2024-06-04 04:46 +0200
                                  Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-04 03:58 +0000
                                    Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-04 09:52 +0200
                                Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-04 11:01 +0300
                                  Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2024-06-04 10:34 +0200
                              Re: xxd -i vs DIY Was: C23 thoughts and opinions Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2024-06-03 22:46 -0400
                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-28 13:54 -0700
                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-05-29 01:03 +0100
                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2024-06-12 20:32 +0200
          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2024-05-22 22:23 -0300
            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-05-23 02:59 +0000
              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-22 21:08 -0700
                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-05-23 04:20 +0000
                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-05-23 04:47 +0000
                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-22 21:30 -0700
                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-05-23 07:29 +0100
          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-23 14:32 +0200
            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-23 13:37 -0700
        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-23 15:31 +0200
          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2024-05-23 20:23 +0000
            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-24 16:25 +0200
        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-23 20:31 +0300
          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-23 14:28 -0700
        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-05-23 17:10 +0000
        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-23 15:43 +0300
      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-05-23 02:49 +0000
        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-05-23 16:40 +0000
        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-23 15:36 +0300
    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-05-22 14:24 -0700
      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-23 15:35 +0200
        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-05-23 16:05 -0700
          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-05-23 16:17 -0700
          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-24 16:50 +0200
            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-05-24 11:08 -0700
              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-05-24 11:21 -0700
              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-25 13:22 +0200
            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-05-24 23:51 +0000
    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-05-23 03:13 +0000
      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-23 15:42 +0200
    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative? James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2024-05-23 14:35 -0400
    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-23 09:40 -0700
      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-24 17:10 +0200
        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-24 12:29 -0700
          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-25 13:29 +0200
            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-25 16:21 -0700
              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-26 16:15 +0200
    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-23 15:02 +0300
      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-23 15:56 +0200
      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions BGB-Alt <bohannonindustriesllc@gmail.com> - 2024-05-23 17:15 -0500
      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-05-23 17:37 -0700
        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-24 12:05 +0300
          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-05-24 06:54 -0700
            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-24 18:46 +0300
              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-05-25 03:01 -0700
    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative? Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-23 17:19 +0300
      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-23 22:10 +0200
        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative? Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-24 00:34 +0300
          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-05-24 01:06 +0000
            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative? Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-05-24 07:47 +0100
              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-05-25 00:31 +0000
            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative? Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-05-24 06:38 +0100
              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-05-24 05:42 +0000
              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative? Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-24 11:42 +0300
          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative? Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-05-23 18:35 -0700
            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative? Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-23 19:42 -0700
              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative? Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-05-23 20:28 -0700
          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-24 17:57 +0200
            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative? scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-05-24 16:16 +0000
              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-25 16:41 +0200
            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative? Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-24 19:22 +0300
              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative? bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-24 19:38 +0100
                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative? Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-24 13:06 -0700
                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative? bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-05-24 21:20 +0100
              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative? Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-05-25 00:32 +0000
              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-25 17:28 +0200
            Re: errno (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative?) Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-05-25 00:40 +0000
              Re: errno (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative?) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-25 17:47 +0200
                Re: errno (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative?) Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-25 16:45 -0700
                  Re: errno (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative?) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-26 16:18 +0200
                    Re: errno (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative?) BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2024-05-26 09:48 -0500
                      Re: errno (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative?) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-26 18:12 +0200
                        Re: errno (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative?) Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-05-28 02:48 +0000
                          Re: errno (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative?) BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2024-05-28 01:31 -0500
                            Re: errno (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative?) James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2024-05-29 11:27 -0400
                              Re: errno (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative?) BGB-Alt <bohannonindustriesllc@gmail.com> - 2024-05-30 14:18 -0500
                          Re: errno (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative?) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-28 13:56 +0200
                        Re: errno (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative?) "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-05-27 20:26 -0700
                      Re: errno (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative?) James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2024-05-26 18:59 -0400
              Re: errno (was Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative?) BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2024-05-25 15:23 -0500
      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative? Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-23 14:38 -0700
        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions - why so conservative? Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-24 00:48 +0300
    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2024-05-23 21:25 +0200
      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2024-05-23 16:49 -0300
        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2024-05-24 07:36 +0200
          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions jak <nospam@please.ty> - 2024-05-24 09:32 +0200
            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2024-05-24 18:34 +0200
              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions jak <nospam@please.ty> - 2024-05-26 09:13 +0200
                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2024-05-26 13:23 +0200
                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-05-27 00:55 +0000
                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2024-05-31 18:34 -0500
                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-06-01 01:27 +0000
                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-02 11:02 +0300
                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-02 14:03 +0200
                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-02 16:29 +0300
                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-06-02 19:23 +0000
                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-02 21:44 +0200
                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-03 12:00 +0300
                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-03 18:34 +0200
                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-06-03 16:50 +0000
                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-03 21:05 +0200
                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-06-03 19:38 +0000
                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-03 22:58 +0300
                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-06-03 21:22 +0000
                                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2024-06-04 05:17 +0000
                                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-04 11:23 +0300
                                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-04 10:25 +0200
                                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-06-04 13:30 +0000
                                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2024-06-04 12:48 -0500
                                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-06-04 19:17 +0000
                                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions BGB-Alt <bohannonindustriesllc@gmail.com> - 2024-06-04 17:32 -0500
                                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-05 07:22 +0000
                                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-05 07:14 +0000
                                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2024-06-05 04:01 -0500
                                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-07 00:57 +0000
                                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2024-06-07 02:52 -0500
                                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-14 03:20 +0000
                                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-05 07:15 +0000
                                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-06-05 13:32 +0000
                                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2024-06-05 13:59 +0000
                                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-07 00:59 +0000
                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2024-06-04 05:12 +0000
                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-04 06:55 +0000
                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-06-02 19:15 +0000
                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-06-02 12:46 -0700
                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-03 03:21 +0000
                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-06-03 14:16 +0000
                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-06-03 13:23 -0700
                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2024-06-04 13:46 -0500
                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-06-04 19:21 +0000
                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2024-06-04 20:44 -0500
                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2024-06-04 23:59 -0400
                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2024-06-05 00:44 -0500
                                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2024-06-05 13:29 +0000
                                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2024-06-05 13:49 -0500
                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-03 21:14 +0200
                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-01 15:28 +0200
                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2024-06-01 16:33 +0100
                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-02 03:28 +0000
            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2024-05-25 21:24 +0000
              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions jak <nospam@please.ty> - 2024-05-26 08:32 +0200
                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-26 02:48 -0700
                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions jak <nospam@please.ty> - 2024-05-26 13:44 +0200
                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-26 15:39 +0300
                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions jak <nospam@please.ty> - 2024-05-26 15:46 +0200
                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-26 17:20 +0300
                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-26 16:29 +0200
                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-26 18:05 +0300
                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-26 18:26 +0200
                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-26 19:50 +0300
                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-05-28 05:41 +0000
                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-28 10:46 +0300
                          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions jak <nospam@please.ty> - 2024-05-26 17:10 +0200
                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-05-26 18:23 +0300
                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions jak <nospam@please.ty> - 2024-05-26 19:23 +0200
                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-26 18:36 +0200
                              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions jak <nospam@please.ty> - 2024-05-26 19:11 +0200
                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-26 16:30 -0700
                                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-05-27 10:45 +0200
                                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-05-28 05:45 +0000
                            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-05-26 13:53 -0700
                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2024-05-26 21:16 +0000
                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions jak <nospam@please.ty> - 2024-05-27 07:14 +0200
                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-05-27 00:53 +0000
                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2024-05-26 21:03 +0000
              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions jak <nospam@please.ty> - 2024-05-26 08:44 +0200
      Don't let the door hit you... (Was: C23 thoughts and opinions) gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2024-05-23 19:58 +0000
        Re: Don't let the door hit you... (Was: C23 thoughts and opinions) Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2024-05-24 18:35 +0200
      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> - 2024-05-31 17:55 -0500
        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-01 15:30 +0200
        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-02 03:29 +0000
          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-06-01 23:31 -0700
          Re: C23 thoughts and opinions gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2024-06-02 13:24 +0000
            Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lew Pitcher <lew.pitcher@digitalfreehold.ca> - 2024-06-02 16:51 +0000
              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2024-06-02 19:52 +0000
                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2024-06-03 12:01 +0300
                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-06-03 13:31 -0700
                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-06-03 14:02 -0700
                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2024-06-03 21:48 +0000
                      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-04 10:36 +0200
                        Re: C23 thoughts and opinions "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2024-06-04 14:47 -0700
                Re: C23 thoughts and opinions bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2024-06-03 23:43 +0100
                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2024-06-03 16:23 -0700
                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-04 10:47 +0200
                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-04 02:20 +0000
                    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2024-06-04 10:47 +0200
                  Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Kaz Kylheku <643-408-1753@kylheku.com> - 2024-06-04 05:25 +0000
              Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2024-06-03 13:29 -0700
    Re: C23 thoughts and opinions Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> - 2024-05-24 21:35 -0300
      Re: C23 thoughts and opinions BGB <cr88192@gmail.com> - 2024-05-25 16:05 -0500

Page 1 of 28  [1] 2 3 … 28  Next page →


#384794 — C23 thoughts and opinions

FromDavid Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no>
Date2024-05-22 18:55 +0200
SubjectC23 thoughts and opinions
Message-ID<v2l828$18v7f$1@dont-email.me>
In an attempt to bring some topicality to the group, has anyone started 
using, or considering, C23 ?  There's quite a lot of change in it, 
especially compared to the minor changes in C17.

<https://open-std.org/JTC1/SC22/WG14/www/docs/n3220.pdf>
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C23_(C_standard_revision)>
<https://en.cppreference.com/w/c/23>

I like that it tidies up a lot of old stuff - it is neater to have 
things like "bool", "static_assert", etc., as part of the language 
rather than needing a half-dozen includes for such basic stuff.

I like that it standardises a several useful extensions that have been 
in gcc and clang (and possibly other compilers) for many years.

I'm not sure it will make a big difference to my own programming - when 
I want "typeof" or "chk_add()", I already use them in gcc.  But for 
people restricted to standard C, there's more new to enjoy.  And I 
prefer to use standard syntax when possible.

"constexpr" is something I think I will find helpful, in at least some 
circumstances.

[toc] | [next] | [standalone]


#384797

FromThiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com>
Date2024-05-22 14:42 -0300
Message-ID<00297443-2fee-48d4-81a0-9ff6ae6481e4@gmail.com>
In reply to#384794
On 22/05/2024 13:55, David Brown wrote:
> In an attempt to bring some topicality to the group, has anyone started 
> using, or considering, C23 ?  There's quite a lot of change in it, 
> especially compared to the minor changes in C17.
> 
> <https://open-std.org/JTC1/SC22/WG14/www/docs/n3220.pdf>
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C23_(C_standard_revision)>
> <https://en.cppreference.com/w/c/23>
> 
> I like that it tidies up a lot of old stuff - it is neater to have 
> things like "bool", "static_assert", etc., as part of the language 
> rather than needing a half-dozen includes for such basic stuff.
> 
> I like that it standardises a several useful extensions that have been 
> in gcc and clang (and possibly other compilers) for many years.
> 
> I'm not sure it will make a big difference to my own programming - when 
> I want "typeof" or "chk_add()", I already use them in gcc.  But for 
> people restricted to standard C, there's more new to enjoy.  And I 
> prefer to use standard syntax when possible.
> 
> "constexpr" is something I think I will find helpful, in at least some 
> circumstances.

I am waiting MSVC support. There are a lot of simple features MSVC could 
implement and deliver in small increments. But it is very slow.

I am would use today if I had.

  - #warning
  - [[nodiscard]]
  - typeof
  - digit separators
  - bool true, false

I am not planning to use:

  - enum with specific types.
  - #elifdef
  - nullptr
  - auto
  - constexpr

Not sure
  - empty initializer





[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#384830

FromDavid Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no>
Date2024-05-22 22:11 +0200
Message-ID<v2lji1$1bbcp$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#384797
On 22/05/2024 19:42, Thiago Adams wrote:
> On 22/05/2024 13:55, David Brown wrote:
>> In an attempt to bring some topicality to the group, has anyone 
>> started using, or considering, C23 ?  There's quite a lot of change in 
>> it, especially compared to the minor changes in C17.
>>
>> <https://open-std.org/JTC1/SC22/WG14/www/docs/n3220.pdf>
>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C23_(C_standard_revision)>
>> <https://en.cppreference.com/w/c/23>
>>
>> I like that it tidies up a lot of old stuff - it is neater to have 
>> things like "bool", "static_assert", etc., as part of the language 
>> rather than needing a half-dozen includes for such basic stuff.
>>
>> I like that it standardises a several useful extensions that have been 
>> in gcc and clang (and possibly other compilers) for many years.
>>
>> I'm not sure it will make a big difference to my own programming - 
>> when I want "typeof" or "chk_add()", I already use them in gcc.  But 
>> for people restricted to standard C, there's more new to enjoy.  And I 
>> prefer to use standard syntax when possible.
>>
>> "constexpr" is something I think I will find helpful, in at least some 
>> circumstances.
> 
> I am waiting MSVC support. There are a lot of simple features MSVC could 
> implement and deliver in small increments. But it is very slow.

MSVC is primarily a C++ compiler - the C support is more of a leftover 
from the previous century, with a few post-C90 features as an 
afterthought.  Surely for C development on Windows, rather than C++, 
you'd look for something better?

> 
> I am would use today if I had.
> 
>   - #warning
>   - [[nodiscard]]
>   - typeof
>   - digit separators
>   - bool true, false
> 

I use these today in C, except the digit separators (I use them in C++). 
  But as I say, it's nice to see them as standard rather than just 
common extensions.

> I am not planning to use:
> 
>   - enum with specific types.

I haven't found a use for these in C++, and I'm not sure I'll need them 
in C either.  I sometimes have ordinary enum types in bitfields for 
specific sizes.

>   - #elifdef

The will slightly neaten some of my pre-processor handling.  My strong 
preference for preprocessor symbols for conditional compilation and the 
like is to have symbols that are always defined, but to different 
values, and use "#if" checks rather than "#ifdef" - when combined with 
gcc warnings, it makes it far easier to catch spelling mistakes, and it 
makes it easy to jump in the code to where the symbol is defined.  But 
#ifdef checks do turn up, and this will give marginally neater code.

>   - nullptr

I am fond of nullptr in C++, and will use it in C.  Like most of the C23 
changes, it's not a big issue - after all, you get a lot of the same 
effect with "#define nullptr (void*)(0)" or similar.  But it means your 
code has a visual distinction between the integer 0 and a null pointer, 
and also lets the compiler or other static checking system check better 
than using NULL would.  (And I don't like NULL - I dislike all-caps 
identifiers in general.)

>   - auto

I use that occasionally in gcc, as __auto_type.  It can be helpful in 
macros.  I might use it more when it is standardised.  (I use auto in 
C++ a bit more often.)

>   - constexpr

I will definitely use that.  Sometimes I want a constant expression for 
things like array sizes or static initialisers, and want to calculate 
it.  constexpr gives you that without having to resort to macros.  (I'd 
perhaps be even happier if I could just use const, as I can in C++.)

> 
> Not sure
>   - empty initializer
> 

I don't see that one being a big hit, at least for me.  But I see little 
benefit in /not/ allowing it in the language, so it seems a sensible 
addition.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#384832

FromThiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com>
Date2024-05-22 17:26 -0300
Message-ID<9be0c55c-38f8-496c-b335-84ad281e1753@gmail.com>
In reply to#384830
On 22/05/2024 17:11, David Brown wrote:
> On 22/05/2024 19:42, Thiago Adams wrote:
>> On 22/05/2024 13:55, David Brown wrote:
>>> In an attempt to bring some topicality to the group, has anyone 
>>> started using, or considering, C23 ?  There's quite a lot of change 
>>> in it, especially compared to the minor changes in C17.
>>>
>>> <https://open-std.org/JTC1/SC22/WG14/www/docs/n3220.pdf>
>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C23_(C_standard_revision)>
>>> <https://en.cppreference.com/w/c/23>
>>>
>>> I like that it tidies up a lot of old stuff - it is neater to have 
>>> things like "bool", "static_assert", etc., as part of the language 
>>> rather than needing a half-dozen includes for such basic stuff.
>>>
>>> I like that it standardises a several useful extensions that have 
>>> been in gcc and clang (and possibly other compilers) for many years.
>>>
>>> I'm not sure it will make a big difference to my own programming - 
>>> when I want "typeof" or "chk_add()", I already use them in gcc.  But 
>>> for people restricted to standard C, there's more new to enjoy.  And 
>>> I prefer to use standard syntax when possible.
>>>
>>> "constexpr" is something I think I will find helpful, in at least 
>>> some circumstances.
>>
>> I am waiting MSVC support. There are a lot of simple features MSVC 
>> could implement and deliver in small increments. But it is very slow.
> 
> MSVC is primarily a C++ compiler - the C support is more of a leftover 
> from the previous century, with a few post-C90 features as an 
> afterthought.  Surely for C development on Windows, rather than C++, 
> you'd look for something better?

MSVC has support for C11 features like _Generic etc.. even threads.
I am used to MSVC. For some type of programs that needs resources or a 
lot of windows api I think MSVC is a good choice.



>>
>> I am would use today if I had.
>>
>>   - #warning
>>   - [[nodiscard]]
>>   - typeof
>>   - digit separators
>>   - bool true, false
>>
> 
> I use these today in C, except the digit separators (I use them in C++). 
>   But as I say, it's nice to see them as standard rather than just 
> common extensions.
> 
>> I am not planning to use:
>>
>>   - enum with specific types.
> 
> I haven't found a use for these in C++, and I'm not sure I'll need them 
> in C either.  I sometimes have ordinary enum types in bitfields for 
> specific sizes.
> 
>>   - #elifdef
> 
> The will slightly neaten some of my pre-processor handling.  My strong 
> preference for preprocessor symbols for conditional compilation and the 
> like is to have symbols that are always defined, but to different 
> values, and use "#if" checks rather than "#ifdef" - when combined with 
> gcc warnings, it makes it far easier to catch spelling mistakes, and it 
> makes it easy to jump in the code to where the symbol is defined.  But 
> #ifdef checks do turn up, and this will give marginally neater code.
> 
>>   - nullptr
> 
> I am fond of nullptr in C++, and will use it in C.  Like most of the C23 
> changes, it's not a big issue - after all, you get a lot of the same 
> effect with "#define nullptr (void*)(0)" or similar.  But it means your 
> code has a visual distinction between the integer 0 and a null pointer, 
> and also lets the compiler or other static checking system check better 
> than using NULL would.  (And I don't like NULL - I dislike all-caps 
> identifiers in general.)
> 
>>   - auto
> 
> I use that occasionally in gcc, as __auto_type.  It can be helpful in 
> macros.  I might use it more when it is standardised.  (I use auto in 
> C++ a bit more often.)
> 
>>   - constexpr
> 
> I will definitely use that.  Sometimes I want a constant expression for 
> things like array sizes or static initialisers, and want to calculate 
> it.  constexpr gives you that without having to resort to macros.  (I'd 
> perhaps be even happier if I could just use const, as I can in C++.)

I am curious for that. Do you have a sample?



>>
>> Not sure
>>   - empty initializer
>>
> 
> I don't see that one being a big hit, at least for me.  But I see little 
> benefit in /not/ allowing it in the language, so it seems a sensible 
> addition.

This is what I use
struct X x = {0};
But I can do a find-replace and change everything to {}

When I create samples, I use new feature like nullptr and {}.
The problem I see is to use these features in real code, and create a 
mess of styles.






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#384861

FromDavid Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no>
Date2024-05-23 14:17 +0200
Message-ID<v2nc5h$1oban$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#384832
On 22/05/2024 22:26, Thiago Adams wrote:
> On 22/05/2024 17:11, David Brown wrote:
>> On 22/05/2024 19:42, Thiago Adams wrote:
>>> On 22/05/2024 13:55, David Brown wrote:
>>>> In an attempt to bring some topicality to the group, has anyone 
>>>> started using, or considering, C23 ?  There's quite a lot of change 
>>>> in it, especially compared to the minor changes in C17.
>>>>
>>>> <https://open-std.org/JTC1/SC22/WG14/www/docs/n3220.pdf>
>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C23_(C_standard_revision)>
>>>> <https://en.cppreference.com/w/c/23>
>>>>

>>
>>>   - constexpr
>>
>> I will definitely use that.  Sometimes I want a constant expression 
>> for things like array sizes or static initialisers, and want to 
>> calculate it.  constexpr gives you that without having to resort to 
>> macros.  (I'd perhaps be even happier if I could just use const, as I 
>> can in C++.)
> 
> I am curious for that. Do you have a sample?
> 

If I try to be precise about the terms "constant expression", "integer 
constant expression", etc., I suspect I will get the details wrong 
unless I spend a lot of time checking carefully.  So I hope it is good 
enough for me to be a bit lazy and quote the error messages from gcc 
(with "-std=c23 -Wpedantic").


With this code, compilation fails "initialiser element is not a 
constant" for y.

     int x = 100;
     int y = x / 20;
     int zs[y];


With this code, compilation fails because the zs is actually a VLA, and 
"variably modified 'zs' at file scope" is not allowed.

     const int x = 100;
     const int y = x / 20;
     int zs[y];


This code, however, is fine:

     constexpr int x = 100;
     constexpr int y = x / 20;
     int zs[y];


This also works, even for older standards:

     enum { x = 100 };
     enum { y = x / 20 };
     int zs[y];


But constexpr works for other types, not just "int" which is the type of 
all enumeration constants.  (And "enum" constants are a somewhat weird 
way to get this effect - "constexpr" looks neater.)

And in general, I like to be able to say, to the compiler and to people 
reading the code, "this thing is really fixed and constant, and stop 
compiling if you think I am wrong" rather than just "I promise I won't 
change this thing - or if I do, I don't mind the nasal daemons".


> 
> 
>>>
>>> Not sure
>>>   - empty initializer
>>>
>>
>> I don't see that one being a big hit, at least for me.  But I see 
>> little benefit in /not/ allowing it in the language, so it seems a 
>> sensible addition.
> 
> This is what I use
> struct X x = {0};
> But I can do a find-replace and change everything to {}
> 

You could, but I don't really see the point of such a change.  But in 
new code it would be fine to write "= {}" rather than "= { 0 }".

> When I create samples, I use new feature like nullptr and {}.
> The problem I see is to use these features in real code, and create a 
> mess of styles.
> 

I think you need significant motivation to justify changing style in 
existing code, and I don't see anything here that would make me want to 
change existing C17 code to C23 code.  But when writing new code, I'd 
use the new features.

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#384877

FromThiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com>
Date2024-05-23 09:38 -0300
Message-ID<c5866b5a-0314-4e70-af56-a86b63986b0c@gmail.com>
In reply to#384861
On 23/05/2024 09:17, David Brown wrote:
> If I try to be precise about the terms "constant expression", "integer 
> constant expression", etc., I suspect I will get the details wrong 
> unless I spend a lot of time checking carefully.  So I hope it is good 
> enough for me to be a bit lazy and quote the error messages from gcc 
> (with "-std=c23 -Wpedantic").
> 
> 
> With this code, compilation fails "initialiser element is not a 
> constant" for y.
> 
>      int x = 100;
>      int y = x / 20;
>      int zs[y];
> 
> 
> With this code, compilation fails because the zs is actually a VLA, and 
> "variably modified 'zs' at file scope" is not allowed.
> 
>      const int x = 100;
>      const int y = x / 20;
>      int zs[y];
> 
> 
> This code, however, is fine:
> 
>      constexpr int x = 100;
>      constexpr int y = x / 20;
>      int zs[y];
> 
> 
> This also works, even for older standards:
> 
>      enum { x = 100 };
>      enum { y = x / 20 };
>      int zs[y];
> 
> 
> But constexpr works for other types, not just "int" which is the type of 
> all enumeration constants.  (And "enum" constants are a somewhat weird 
> way to get this effect - "constexpr" looks neater.)
> 
> And in general, I like to be able to say, to the compiler and to people 
> reading the code, "this thing is really fixed and constant, and stop 
> compiling if you think I am wrong" rather than just "I promise I won't 
> change this thing - or if I do, I don't mind the nasal daemons".

We can write:

#define X 100
#define Y ((X) / 20)
int zs[Y];

I cannot see a good justification for constexpr.
I already see bad usages of constexpr in C++ code. It was used in cases 
where we know for sure that is NOT compile time. This just make review 
harder "why did someone put this here?" conclusion was it was totally 
unnecessary and ignored by the compiler. The programmer was trying to 
add something extra, like "magic" hoping for something that would never 
happen.








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#384881

Fromscott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal)
Date2024-05-23 17:08 +0000
Message-ID<TJK3O.68591$5dk1.3779@fx10.iad>
In reply to#384877
Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> writes:
>On 23/05/2024 09:17, David Brown wrote:
>> If I try to be precise about the terms "constant expression", "integer 
>> constant expression", etc., I suspect I will get the details wrong 
>> unless I spend a lot of time checking carefully.  So I hope it is good 
>> enough for me to be a bit lazy and quote the error messages from gcc 
>> (with "-std=c23 -Wpedantic").
>> 
>> 
>> With this code, compilation fails "initialiser element is not a 
>> constant" for y.
>> 
>>      int x = 100;
>>      int y = x / 20;
>>      int zs[y];
>> 
>> 
>> With this code, compilation fails because the zs is actually a VLA, and 
>> "variably modified 'zs' at file scope" is not allowed.
>> 
>>      const int x = 100;
>>      const int y = x / 20;
>>      int zs[y];
>> 
>> 
>> This code, however, is fine:
>> 
>>      constexpr int x = 100;
>>      constexpr int y = x / 20;
>>      int zs[y];
>> 
>> 
>> This also works, even for older standards:
>> 
>>      enum { x = 100 };
>>      enum { y = x / 20 };
>>      int zs[y];
>> 
>> 
>> But constexpr works for other types, not just "int" which is the type of 
>> all enumeration constants.  (And "enum" constants are a somewhat weird 
>> way to get this effect - "constexpr" looks neater.)
>> 
>> And in general, I like to be able to say, to the compiler and to people 
>> reading the code, "this thing is really fixed and constant, and stop 
>> compiling if you think I am wrong" rather than just "I promise I won't 
>> change this thing - or if I do, I don't mind the nasal daemons".
>
>We can write:
>
>#define X 100
>#define Y ((X) / 20)

Neither of which convey type information.

>int zs[Y];
>
>I cannot see a good justification for constexpr.

Which does convey type information, and thus would
be superior to untyped macro definitions.

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#384906

FromThiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com>
Date2024-05-23 16:06 -0300
Message-ID<7a312c82-3e91-4245-a132-9187385840c1@gmail.com>
In reply to#384881
On 23/05/2024 14:08, Scott Lurndal wrote:
> Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> writes:
>> On 23/05/2024 09:17, David Brown wrote:
>>> If I try to be precise about the terms "constant expression", "integer
>>> constant expression", etc., I suspect I will get the details wrong
>>> unless I spend a lot of time checking carefully.  So I hope it is good
>>> enough for me to be a bit lazy and quote the error messages from gcc
>>> (with "-std=c23 -Wpedantic").
>>>
>>>
>>> With this code, compilation fails "initialiser element is not a
>>> constant" for y.
>>>
>>>       int x = 100;
>>>       int y = x / 20;
>>>       int zs[y];
>>>
>>>
>>> With this code, compilation fails because the zs is actually a VLA, and
>>> "variably modified 'zs' at file scope" is not allowed.
>>>
>>>       const int x = 100;
>>>       const int y = x / 20;
>>>       int zs[y];
>>>
>>>
>>> This code, however, is fine:
>>>
>>>       constexpr int x = 100;
>>>       constexpr int y = x / 20;
>>>       int zs[y];
>>>
>>>
>>> This also works, even for older standards:
>>>
>>>       enum { x = 100 };
>>>       enum { y = x / 20 };
>>>       int zs[y];
>>>
>>>
>>> But constexpr works for other types, not just "int" which is the type of
>>> all enumeration constants.  (And "enum" constants are a somewhat weird
>>> way to get this effect - "constexpr" looks neater.)
>>>
>>> And in general, I like to be able to say, to the compiler and to people
>>> reading the code, "this thing is really fixed and constant, and stop
>>> compiling if you think I am wrong" rather than just "I promise I won't
>>> change this thing - or if I do, I don't mind the nasal daemons".
>>
>> We can write:
>>
>> #define X 100
>> #define Y ((X) / 20)
> 
> Neither of which convey type information.
> 
>> int zs[Y];
>>
>> I cannot see a good justification for constexpr.
> 
> Which does convey type information, and thus would
> be superior to untyped macro definitions.
> 

If you want a type just but a cast or suffix if applicable.

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#384888

FromDavid Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no>
Date2024-05-23 15:11 +0200
Message-ID<v2nfai$1ougd$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#384877
On 23/05/2024 14:38, Thiago Adams wrote:
> On 23/05/2024 09:17, David Brown wrote:
>> If I try to be precise about the terms "constant expression", "integer 
>> constant expression", etc., I suspect I will get the details wrong 
>> unless I spend a lot of time checking carefully.  So I hope it is good 
>> enough for me to be a bit lazy and quote the error messages from gcc 
>> (with "-std=c23 -Wpedantic").
>>
>>
>> With this code, compilation fails "initialiser element is not a 
>> constant" for y.
>>
>>      int x = 100;
>>      int y = x / 20;
>>      int zs[y];
>>
>>
>> With this code, compilation fails because the zs is actually a VLA, 
>> and "variably modified 'zs' at file scope" is not allowed.
>>
>>      const int x = 100;
>>      const int y = x / 20;
>>      int zs[y];
>>
>>
>> This code, however, is fine:
>>
>>      constexpr int x = 100;
>>      constexpr int y = x / 20;
>>      int zs[y];
>>
>>
>> This also works, even for older standards:
>>
>>      enum { x = 100 };
>>      enum { y = x / 20 };
>>      int zs[y];
>>
>>
>> But constexpr works for other types, not just "int" which is the type 
>> of all enumeration constants.  (And "enum" constants are a somewhat 
>> weird way to get this effect - "constexpr" looks neater.)
>>
>> And in general, I like to be able to say, to the compiler and to 
>> people reading the code, "this thing is really fixed and constant, and 
>> stop compiling if you think I am wrong" rather than just "I promise I 
>> won't change this thing - or if I do, I don't mind the nasal daemons".
> 
> We can write:
> 
> #define X 100
> #define Y ((X) / 20)
> int zs[Y];
> 
> I cannot see a good justification for constexpr.

Clearer code, better checking along the way, better typing.  I don't 
think constexpr lets you do things you couldn't do before, but it lets 
you do those things in a neater way.  (IMHO.)

> I already see bad usages of constexpr in C++ code. It was used in cases 
> where we know for sure that is NOT compile time. This just make review 
> harder "why did someone put this here?" conclusion was it was totally 
> unnecessary and ignored by the compiler. The programmer was trying to 
> add something extra, like "magic" hoping for something that would never 
> happen.
> 

IME poor or confusing uses of "constexpr" are for functions, not 
objects, and C23 does not support "constexpr" for functions.

I think it is better to think of constexpr functions in C++ as "pure" 
functions - confusingly called __attribute__((const)) functions in gcc 
and [[unsequenced] functions in C23.  That is, functions that don't 
affect anything around them, are not affected by anything external, have 
no side effects, always give the same results for the same parameters, 
and can be called more or fewer times without affecting the program's 
observable behaviour.  (It's not exactly like that in C++ - a 
"constexpr" function is implicitly inline and needs a local definition. 
But I think that is how it could have been handled.)

The whole thing - in C and C++ - suffers somewhat from being addons over 
time rather than part of the original design of the language.  But 
that's inevitable as an old language evolves.


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#384896

FromThiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com>
Date2024-05-23 13:21 -0300
Message-ID<cf267279-e9cf-415f-898c-f5830a997529@gmail.com>
In reply to#384888
On 23/05/2024 10:11, David Brown wrote:
> On 23/05/2024 14:38, Thiago Adams wrote:
>> On 23/05/2024 09:17, David Brown wrote:
>>> If I try to be precise about the terms "constant expression", 
>>> "integer constant expression", etc., I suspect I will get the details 
>>> wrong unless I spend a lot of time checking carefully.  So I hope it 
>>> is good enough for me to be a bit lazy and quote the error messages 
>>> from gcc (with "-std=c23 -Wpedantic").
>>>
>>>
>>> With this code, compilation fails "initialiser element is not a 
>>> constant" for y.
>>>
>>>      int x = 100;
>>>      int y = x / 20;
>>>      int zs[y];
>>>
>>>
>>> With this code, compilation fails because the zs is actually a VLA, 
>>> and "variably modified 'zs' at file scope" is not allowed.
>>>
>>>      const int x = 100;
>>>      const int y = x / 20;
>>>      int zs[y];
>>>
>>>
>>> This code, however, is fine:
>>>
>>>      constexpr int x = 100;
>>>      constexpr int y = x / 20;
>>>      int zs[y];
>>>
>>>
>>> This also works, even for older standards:
>>>
>>>      enum { x = 100 };
>>>      enum { y = x / 20 };
>>>      int zs[y];
>>>
>>>
>>> But constexpr works for other types, not just "int" which is the type 
>>> of all enumeration constants.  (And "enum" constants are a somewhat 
>>> weird way to get this effect - "constexpr" looks neater.)
>>>
>>> And in general, I like to be able to say, to the compiler and to 
>>> people reading the code, "this thing is really fixed and constant, 
>>> and stop compiling if you think I am wrong" rather than just "I 
>>> promise I won't change this thing - or if I do, I don't mind the 
>>> nasal daemons".
>>
>> We can write:
>>
>> #define X 100
>> #define Y ((X) / 20)
>> int zs[Y];
>>
>> I cannot see a good justification for constexpr.
> 
> Clearer code, better checking along the way, better typing.  I don't 
> think constexpr lets you do things you couldn't do before, but it lets 
> you do those things in a neater way.  (IMHO.)
> 
>> I already see bad usages of constexpr in C++ code. It was used in 
>> cases where we know for sure that is NOT compile time. This just make 
>> review harder "why did someone put this here?" conclusion was it was 
>> totally unnecessary and ignored by the compiler. The programmer was 
>> trying to add something extra, like "magic" hoping for something that 
>> would never happen.
>>
> 
> IME poor or confusing uses of "constexpr" are for functions, not 
> objects, and C23 does not support "constexpr" for functions.

The sample C++ was something like

constexpr char * s[] = {"a", "b"};
     for (int i = 0; i < sizeof(s); i++)
     {
         //using s[i]
     }

I checked in C, it is an error.

error: 'constexpr' pointer initializer is not null
5 |     constexpr char * s[] = {"a", "b"};


Then we were asking why constexpr was used in that case.

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#384923

FromKeith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com>
Date2024-05-23 14:49 -0700
Message-ID<87ed9s42sb.fsf@nosuchdomain.example.com>
In reply to#384896
Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> writes:
> On 23/05/2024 10:11, David Brown wrote:
>> On 23/05/2024 14:38, Thiago Adams wrote:
[...]
>>> I already see bad usages of constexpr in C++ code. It was used in
>>> cases where we know for sure that is NOT compile time. This just
>>> make review harder "why did someone put this here?" conclusion was
>>> it was totally unnecessary and ignored by the compiler. The
>>> programmer was trying to add something extra, like "magic" hoping
>>> for something that would never happen.
>>>
>> IME poor or confusing uses of "constexpr" are for functions, not 
>> objects, and C23 does not support "constexpr" for functions.
>
> The sample C++ was something like
>
> constexpr char * s[] = {"a", "b"};
>     for (int i = 0; i < sizeof(s); i++)
>     {
>         //using s[i]
>     }
>
> I checked in C, it is an error.

Apparently C23 has stricter rules for constexpr than C++ does.  I can
imagine those rules being relaxed in future editions of the C standard.

> error: 'constexpr' pointer initializer is not null
> 5 |     constexpr char * s[] = {"a", "b"};
>
>
> Then we were asking why constexpr was used in that case.

Why not?

When I compile that with g++ 14.1.0, with -std=c++23, I get:

warning: ISO C++ forbids converting a string constant to ‘char*’ [-Wwrite-strings]

When I replace "char*" by "const char*", that warning goes away.

The initializer *can* be evaluated at compile time.  Using constexpr
catches any changes to the initializer that would require run-time code
execution.

Feel free to redirect to comp.lang.c++ if you want to discuss the C++
aspects further.

-- 
Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com
void Void(void) { Void(); } /* The recursive call of the void */

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#384968

FromDavid Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no>
Date2024-05-24 11:03 +0200
Message-ID<v2pl5g$28ola$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#384923
On 23/05/2024 23:49, Keith Thompson wrote:
> Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> writes:
>> On 23/05/2024 10:11, David Brown wrote:
>>> On 23/05/2024 14:38, Thiago Adams wrote:
> [...]
>>>> I already see bad usages of constexpr in C++ code. It was used in
>>>> cases where we know for sure that is NOT compile time. This just
>>>> make review harder "why did someone put this here?" conclusion was
>>>> it was totally unnecessary and ignored by the compiler. The
>>>> programmer was trying to add something extra, like "magic" hoping
>>>> for something that would never happen.
>>>>
>>> IME poor or confusing uses of "constexpr" are for functions, not
>>> objects, and C23 does not support "constexpr" for functions.
>>
>> The sample C++ was something like
>>
>> constexpr char * s[] = {"a", "b"};
>>      for (int i = 0; i < sizeof(s); i++)
>>      {
>>          //using s[i]
>>      }
>>
>> I checked in C, it is an error.
> 
> Apparently C23 has stricter rules for constexpr than C++ does.  I can
> imagine those rules being relaxed in future editions of the C standard.
> 

 From the proposal for "constexpr" in C23, 
<https://open-std.org/JTC1/SC22/WG14/www/docs/n3018.htm>, it says:

"""
There are some restrictions on the type of an object that can be 
declared with constexpr storage duration. There is a limited number of 
constructs that are not allowed:

pointer types:
     allowing these to use non-trivial addresses would delay the 
deduction of the concrete value from translation to link-time. For most 
of the use cases, such a feature can already be coded by using a static 
and const qualified pointer object, we don’t need constexpr for that. 
Therefore we only allow pointer types if the initializer value is null.
"""


I'm not sure (and haven't looked at all the discussions involved, so I 
could be completely wrong), but I think there is concern that constexpr 
pointers, other than null pointers, might need more features in the 
linker than C currently requires.  C++ already has more demands of 
linkers to handle things like inline variables and statics in templates.

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#385007

FromThiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com>
Date2024-05-24 14:17 -0300
Message-ID<f5774ff3-d2b0-4787-b16c-3b193dc418ef@gmail.com>
In reply to#384923
On 23/05/2024 18:49, Keith Thompson wrote:
>> error: 'constexpr' pointer initializer is not null
>> 5 |     constexpr char * s[] = {"a", "b"};
>>
>>
>> Then we were asking why constexpr was used in that case.
> Why not?

When I see a constexpr I ask if the compiler is able to compute 
everything at compile time. If not immediately it is a bad usage in my view.



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#385019

FromKeith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com>
Date2024-05-24 12:45 -0700
Message-ID<87bk4v2du1.fsf@nosuchdomain.example.com>
In reply to#385007
Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> writes:
> On 23/05/2024 18:49, Keith Thompson wrote:
>>> error: 'constexpr' pointer initializer is not null
>>> 5 |     constexpr char * s[] = {"a", "b"};
>>>
>>>
>>> Then we were asking why constexpr was used in that case.
>> Why not?
>
> When I see a constexpr I ask if the compiler is able to compute
> everything at compile time. If not immediately it is a bad usage in my
> view.

I don't understand.  Do you object because it's not *immediately
obvious* that everthing can be computed at compile time?  If so, why
should it have to be?

If nothing else, the fact that the code compiles should be proof enough.
You said something upthread about the compiler ignoring constexpr if the
expression isn't compile-time evaluable; perhaps you were using a buggy
compiler?

Note that the above code is C++, not C, and that it should be "constexpr
const char *".

-- 
Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com
void Void(void) { Void(); } /* The recursive call of the void */

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#385021

FromThiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com>
Date2024-05-24 17:06 -0300
Message-ID<ec20f752-6132-40f5-a4e8-f884746d2f3a@gmail.com>
In reply to#385019
On 24/05/2024 16:45, Keith Thompson wrote:
> Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> writes:
>> On 23/05/2024 18:49, Keith Thompson wrote:
>>>> error: 'constexpr' pointer initializer is not null
>>>> 5 |     constexpr char * s[] = {"a", "b"};
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Then we were asking why constexpr was used in that case.
>>> Why not?
>>
>> When I see a constexpr I ask if the compiler is able to compute
>> everything at compile time. If not immediately it is a bad usage in my
>> view.
> 
> I don't understand.  Do you object because it's not *immediately
> obvious* that everthing can be computed at compile time?  If so, why
> should it have to be?


My understanding is that constexpr is a tip for the compiler. Does not 
ensure anything. Unless you use where constant expression is required.
So I don't like to see constexpr  where I know it is not a constant 
expression.

C++ has consteval (https://en.cppreference.com/w/cpp/language/consteval) 
. When I first saw it I thought it was a joke.

"every potentially-evaluated call to the function must (directly or 
indirectly) produce a compile time constant expression. "

Also  constinit
https://en.cppreference.com/w/cpp/language/constinit

I never used these features I want never want to use. It is a total mess 
in my opinion.

> If nothing else, the fact that the code compiles should be proof enough.
> You said something upthread about the compiler ignoring constexpr if the
> expression isn't compile-time evaluable; perhaps you were using a buggy
> compiler?
> 
> Note that the above code is C++, not C, and that it should be "constexpr
> const char *".
> 

I may have to implement constexpr in cake... So at some point I will see 
all details.

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#385023

FromKeith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com>
Date2024-05-24 13:19 -0700
Message-ID<87v8330xq3.fsf@nosuchdomain.example.com>
In reply to#385021
Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> writes:
> On 24/05/2024 16:45, Keith Thompson wrote:
>> Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> writes:
>>> On 23/05/2024 18:49, Keith Thompson wrote:
>>>>> error: 'constexpr' pointer initializer is not null
>>>>> 5 |     constexpr char * s[] = {"a", "b"};
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Then we were asking why constexpr was used in that case.
>>>> Why not?
>>>
>>> When I see a constexpr I ask if the compiler is able to compute
>>> everything at compile time. If not immediately it is a bad usage in my
>>> view.
>> I don't understand.  Do you object because it's not *immediately
>> obvious* that everthing can be computed at compile time?  If so, why
>> should it have to be?
>
> My understanding is that constexpr is a tip for the compiler. Does not
> ensure anything. Unless you use where constant expression is required.
> So I don't like to see constexpr  where I know it is not a constant
> expression.

Your understanding is incorrect.  "constexpr" is not a mere hint.

In C23, an object defined with "constexpr" must be initialized with a
constant expression.  C++ has similar rules.  Attempting to initialize
it with a non-constant expression requires a diagnostic.

    int non_const = 42;
    constexpr int bad = non_const; // invalid, must be diagnosed

I'd be surprised to see a C or C++ compiler that failed to diagnose such
an error.  Have you run into this, or are you speculating?

Given that the C++ code

    constexpr const char * s[] = {"a", "b"}; // I added "const"

compiles successfully, you can safely assume that the initializer can be
and is evaluated at compile time.

> C++ has consteval
> (https://en.cppreference.com/w/cpp/language/consteval) . When I first
> saw it I thought it was a joke.

And I know just the newsgroup where it can be discussed.

[...]

-- 
Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com
void Void(void) { Void(); } /* The recursive call of the void */

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#385028

FromThiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com>
Date2024-05-24 21:27 -0300
Message-ID<97c17a49-a940-42ff-83b8-df755fb6e88e@gmail.com>
In reply to#385023
Em 5/24/2024 5:19 PM, Keith Thompson escreveu:
> Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> writes:
>> On 24/05/2024 16:45, Keith Thompson wrote:
>>> Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> writes:
>>>> On 23/05/2024 18:49, Keith Thompson wrote:
>>>>>> error: 'constexpr' pointer initializer is not null
>>>>>> 5 |     constexpr char * s[] = {"a", "b"};
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Then we were asking why constexpr was used in that case.
>>>>> Why not?
>>>>
>>>> When I see a constexpr I ask if the compiler is able to compute
>>>> everything at compile time. If not immediately it is a bad usage in my
>>>> view.
>>> I don't understand.  Do you object because it's not *immediately
>>> obvious* that everthing can be computed at compile time?  If so, why
>>> should it have to be?
>>
>> My understanding is that constexpr is a tip for the compiler. Does not
>> ensure anything. Unless you use where constant expression is required.
>> So I don't like to see constexpr  where I know it is not a constant
>> expression.
> 
> Your understanding is incorrect.  "constexpr" is not a mere hint.
I think I can explain I little better

Let´s consider we have a compile time array of integers and a loop.

https://godbolt.org/z/e8cM1KGWT

#include <stdio.h>
#include <stdlib.h>
int main() {
     constexpr int a[] = {1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8};
     for (int i = 0 ; i < sizeof(a)/sizeof(a[0]); i++)
     {
         printf("%d", a[i]);
     }
}

What the programmer expected using a constant array in a loop?
The loop is in runtime, unless the compiler expanded the loop into 8 
calls using constant expressions. But this is not the case.
This was the usage of constexpr I saw but with literal strings.
So, the array a is not used as constant even if it has constexpr.




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#385033

FromKeith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com>
Date2024-05-24 17:46 -0700
Message-ID<87r0dq1zxf.fsf@nosuchdomain.example.com>
In reply to#385028
Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> writes:
> Em 5/24/2024 5:19 PM, Keith Thompson escreveu:
>> Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> writes:
>>> On 24/05/2024 16:45, Keith Thompson wrote:
>>>> Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>> On 23/05/2024 18:49, Keith Thompson wrote:
>>>>>>> error: 'constexpr' pointer initializer is not null
>>>>>>> 5 |     constexpr char * s[] = {"a", "b"};
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Then we were asking why constexpr was used in that case.
>>>>>> Why not?
>>>>>
>>>>> When I see a constexpr I ask if the compiler is able to compute
>>>>> everything at compile time. If not immediately it is a bad usage in my
>>>>> view.
>>>> I don't understand.  Do you object because it's not *immediately
>>>> obvious* that everthing can be computed at compile time?  If so, why
>>>> should it have to be?
>>>
>>> My understanding is that constexpr is a tip for the compiler. Does not
>>> ensure anything. Unless you use where constant expression is required.
>>> So I don't like to see constexpr  where I know it is not a constant
>>> expression.
>> Your understanding is incorrect.  "constexpr" is not a mere hint.
> I think I can explain I little better
>
> Let´s consider we have a compile time array of integers and a loop.
>
> https://godbolt.org/z/e8cM1KGWT
>
> #include <stdio.h>
> #include <stdlib.h>
> int main() {
>     constexpr int a[] = {1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8};
>     for (int i = 0 ; i < sizeof(a)/sizeof(a[0]); i++)
>     {
>         printf("%d", a[i]);
>     }
> }
>
> What the programmer expected using a constant array in a loop?
> The loop is in runtime, unless the compiler expanded the loop into 8
> calls using constant expressions. But this is not the case.
> This was the usage of constexpr I saw but with literal strings.
> So, the array a is not used as constant even if it has constexpr.

What do you mean by "used as constant"?

The "constexpr" in the above asserts that the initializer for a consists
of constant expressions.  Perhaps there's a reason that's desirable.
Perhaps the initial values come from `#embed`.  a[3] is a constant
expression, as I understand it; a[i] is not.

The code that accesses `a` doesn't depend on the fact that it's constant
-- but the code still works, and the constexpr is harmless.  Reading the
code, you can be certain that, assuming it compiles, the value is
determined at compile time.  You don't necessarily have to make use of
that information.  If you see
    int n = 42;
you know that the value of 42 is determined at compile time, even if you
don't make use of that knowledge.

My preference is to mark declared objects as `const` (read-only)
unless there's a specific reason not to (I need to modify it).
Some more recent languages make the equivalent of `const` the
default, and require a qualifier to make an object modifiable.
I really like that (though adding that to C would be impractical).
I'm thinking that I'll probably have the same preference for
`constexpr`.

-- 
Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com
void Void(void) { Void(); } /* The recursive call of the void */

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#385053

FromThiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com>
Date2024-05-25 08:33 -0300
Message-ID<b7704352-e11c-49b7-9fe5-3435e5f7e2bc@gmail.com>
In reply to#385033
Em 5/24/2024 9:46 PM, Keith Thompson escreveu:
> Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> writes:
>> Em 5/24/2024 5:19 PM, Keith Thompson escreveu:
>>> Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> writes:
>>>> On 24/05/2024 16:45, Keith Thompson wrote:
>>>>> Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>>> On 23/05/2024 18:49, Keith Thompson wrote:
>>>>>>>> error: 'constexpr' pointer initializer is not null
>>>>>>>> 5 |     constexpr char * s[] = {"a", "b"};
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Then we were asking why constexpr was used in that case.
>>>>>>> Why not?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> When I see a constexpr I ask if the compiler is able to compute
>>>>>> everything at compile time. If not immediately it is a bad usage in my
>>>>>> view.
>>>>> I don't understand.  Do you object because it's not *immediately
>>>>> obvious* that everthing can be computed at compile time?  If so, why
>>>>> should it have to be?
>>>>
>>>> My understanding is that constexpr is a tip for the compiler. Does not
>>>> ensure anything. Unless you use where constant expression is required.
>>>> So I don't like to see constexpr  where I know it is not a constant
>>>> expression.
>>> Your understanding is incorrect.  "constexpr" is not a mere hint.
>> I think I can explain I little better
>>
>> Let´s consider we have a compile time array of integers and a loop.
>>
>> https://godbolt.org/z/e8cM1KGWT
>>
>> #include <stdio.h>
>> #include <stdlib.h>
>> int main() {
>>      constexpr int a[] = {1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8};
>>      for (int i = 0 ; i < sizeof(a)/sizeof(a[0]); i++)
>>      {
>>          printf("%d", a[i]);
>>      }
>> }
>>
>> What the programmer expected using a constant array in a loop?
>> The loop is in runtime, unless the compiler expanded the loop into 8
>> calls using constant expressions. But this is not the case.
>> This was the usage of constexpr I saw but with literal strings.
>> So, the array a is not used as constant even if it has constexpr.
> 
> What do you mean by "used as constant"?
> 

Something used to produce a constant expression.
In the loop the compiler would have to get the value in runtime from 
array, or unroll the loop.

I just checked, trying to extract an constant value from the array


https://godbolt.org/z/v33Pqd7W8

#include <stdio.h>
#include <stdlib.h>
int main() {
     constexpr int a[] = {1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8};
     static_assert(a[0] ==1 );

}

I was expecting this to work!

But gcc says

<source>:5:24: error: expression in static assertion is not constant
     5 |     static_assert(a[0] ==1 );
       |

The mess is even bigger than I thought.

In c++ it works
https://godbolt.org/z/qG6vGhEMj

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#385057

FromDavid Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no>
Date2024-05-25 16:51 +0200
Message-ID<v2stuf$2tphj$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#385053
On 25/05/2024 13:33, Thiago Adams wrote:
> Em 5/24/2024 9:46 PM, Keith Thompson escreveu:
>> Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> writes:
>>> Em 5/24/2024 5:19 PM, Keith Thompson escreveu:
>>>> Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>> On 24/05/2024 16:45, Keith Thompson wrote:
>>>>>> Thiago Adams <thiago.adams@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>>>> On 23/05/2024 18:49, Keith Thompson wrote:
>>>>>>>>> error: 'constexpr' pointer initializer is not null
>>>>>>>>> 5 |     constexpr char * s[] = {"a", "b"};
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Then we were asking why constexpr was used in that case.
>>>>>>>> Why not?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> When I see a constexpr I ask if the compiler is able to compute
>>>>>>> everything at compile time. If not immediately it is a bad usage 
>>>>>>> in my
>>>>>>> view.
>>>>>> I don't understand.  Do you object because it's not *immediately
>>>>>> obvious* that everthing can be computed at compile time?  If so, why
>>>>>> should it have to be?
>>>>>
>>>>> My understanding is that constexpr is a tip for the compiler. Does not
>>>>> ensure anything. Unless you use where constant expression is required.
>>>>> So I don't like to see constexpr  where I know it is not a constant
>>>>> expression.
>>>> Your understanding is incorrect.  "constexpr" is not a mere hint.
>>> I think I can explain I little better
>>>
>>> Let´s consider we have a compile time array of integers and a loop.
>>>
>>> https://godbolt.org/z/e8cM1KGWT
>>>
>>> #include <stdio.h>
>>> #include <stdlib.h>
>>> int main() {
>>>      constexpr int a[] = {1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8};
>>>      for (int i = 0 ; i < sizeof(a)/sizeof(a[0]); i++)
>>>      {
>>>          printf("%d", a[i]);
>>>      }
>>> }
>>>
>>> What the programmer expected using a constant array in a loop?
>>> The loop is in runtime, unless the compiler expanded the loop into 8
>>> calls using constant expressions. But this is not the case.
>>> This was the usage of constexpr I saw but with literal strings.
>>> So, the array a is not used as constant even if it has constexpr.
>>
>> What do you mean by "used as constant"?
>>
> 
> Something used to produce a constant expression.
> In the loop the compiler would have to get the value in runtime from 
> array, or unroll the loop.
> 
> I just checked, trying to extract an constant value from the array
> 
> 
> https://godbolt.org/z/v33Pqd7W8
> 
> #include <stdio.h>
> #include <stdlib.h>
> int main() {
>      constexpr int a[] = {1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8};
>      static_assert(a[0] ==1 );
> 
> }
> 
> I was expecting this to work!
> 
> But gcc says
> 
> <source>:5:24: error: expression in static assertion is not constant
>      5 |     static_assert(a[0] ==1 );
>        |
> 

That is disappointing.  I too would have expected that to work in C23. 
My guess is that it is the implicit pointer dereference that is the 
problem.  But I hope this is something that gets fixed shortly.

> The mess is even bigger than I thought.
> 
> In c++ it works
> https://godbolt.org/z/qG6vGhEMj
> 
> 

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